The Gang of Five

Beyond the Mysterious Beyond => The Arts => The Written Word => Topic started by: WeirdRaptor on October 05, 2009, 04:44:25 PM

Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 05, 2009, 04:44:25 PM
Yo, this is a long paper I've been writing for quite some time in the midst of all the fan wank and fan dumb going on between Peter Jackson fans and Ralph Bakshi fans concerning who made the better Lord of the Rings films. This isn't creative per say, but I didn't see anywhere else to put this. Anyway, this is my attempt to shut the debate down by definitively proving who did it best. The paper is very, very long and I'm still not done going over the Jackson films.
So, I will be posting the paper in sections.

Oh, and please leave feedback.

So without any further adu...

Best Adapter of Tolkien's The Lord of the RIngs: Jackson, Rankin-Bass or Bakshi?
By
MidgardRaptor

Background
First, before one can decide who made the better Lord of the Rings movie(s), we must first discuss Tolkien, his values, his works, and all the above of the filmmakers in question. This section is going to go on for quite a few pages, but don’t worry, the focus of this paper will not be lost. It’s just that with Tolkien, in order to fully make sure everyone understands the material, there’s A LOT to go over. So take a break, go to the bathroom, or grab a snack before diving into this.

Tolkien’s Biography: J.R.R. was born John Ronald Reuel Tolkien on January 3rd, 1892 in Bloemfontien, Orange Free State in South Africa to Arthur Reuel and Mabel Tolkien.

Tolkien only lived there for the first three years of his life. In that time, however, he was bitten by a bamboo spider and was stricken with illness. This incident would be echoed later in his works through the giant spiders of Mirkwood Forest and Shelob in the secret entrance to Mordor.

Later, he went to England with his mother and brother. His father stayed behind because of his work. This trip was intended only to be a family visit, but his father died of disease and that landed the remainder of the family with no income to return. So, they made a few new homes in England, first at Stirling Road, Birmingham, then at Sarehole, then in a Worcestershire village.
Growing up, Tolkien loved to explore the woods and the various villages and towns in the area where he lived. The sights would also be echoed in his works as the Shire, Hobbiton, Bree, and various other Middle Earth locations. Another example: his aunt’s farm was called Bag End. Yes, really.

Growing up, Tolkien developed a keen liking of botany, but became even more fond of studies involving language.

In 1900, the Tolkiens became a part of the Roman Catholic Church, despite the staunch protests of Protestant relatives, who then cut his mother Mabel Tolkien, off all financial support. She died four years later of complications due to diabetes while John and his brother were still only boys. The boys were adopted by Fr. Francis Xavier Morgan, who raised them up as good Catholics. Protestants vs. Catholics were a big issue back then, although that does not justify his heartless relatives' actions. "Peace on earth and good will to all men," was a message these people obviously overlooked when they did this.

Under his care, the Tolkien brothers attended King Edward’s School, Birmingham. It was here that Tolkien met three friends, Robert Gilson, Geoffrey Smith, and Christopher Wiseman. Together they formed a quasi-secret society known as “the T.C.B.S”, AKA “Tea Club and Barrovian Society”. The club was based around their mutual love of drinking tea in Barrow’s Stores, which were close to the school, and in the school library. They also shared a love of epic tales, folklore, and fairy tales.
After they graduated, the group stayed in touch and even had a reunion “council” in London on December 1914. This meeting resulted in Tolkien developing a strong dedication to writing poetry.

October, 1911, Tolkien attended Exeter College, Oxford, and studied English Language. He graduated in 1915.

To change topics to another matter briefly, Tolkien’s first and only romantic interest was Edith Mary Bratt, whom he met in 1908. He was 16. He began to become acquainted with her and they became fast friends and more. However, she was Protestant and his guardian forbade that he have anything to do with her until he was 21. Tolkien followed this condition with only one exception. Upon reaching the age of 21, he wrote Edith a letter proclaiming his love for her. She wrote a letter in response that she was engaged to someone else, because she thought that he had forgotten her. However, they met and rekindled their love for each other. Edith returned her engagement ring and announced she was marrying Tolkien, instead. They were formally engaged in 1913 and married in 1916. She converted to Catholicism.

Shortly, thereafter, though, Tolkien volunteered his services to the British military as a Second Lieutenant in the Lanchashire Fudiliers. He went to fight this with his old friends from the T.C.B.S. (four friends leave their home on a dangerous journey, also mirrored later in his works via Frodo, Sam, Merry, and Pippin).
Tolkien was in the 13th Battalionn at Cannock Chase, Staffordshire, for eleven months then transferred to the 11th Service Battalion with the British Expeditionary Force. They arrived in France on June 4th, 1916.
He served at the battle of the Somme, and following that the Assault on the Schwaben Redoubt. During this time, he came down with Trench Fever (very common in that time), which was carried by some lice which had gotten into the barracks.

Two of Tolkien’s friends and former T.C.B.S. members, Gilson and Smith, were killed in World War I. Note: Gilson's first name was Christopher, a name one of one Tolkien's sons would eventually be given.

This tragic news reached Tolkien when he was in one of the many hospitals he alternated from whilst still weak and emaciated. Eventually, it was decided he was physically unfit for service. Tolkien spent the rest of his recovery in a cottage in great Haywood, Staffordshire, England. It was here that he began to write “The Book of Lost Tales”, which was the prototype on which the rest of Middle Earth's mythos was built. This began with “The Fall of Gondolin”.

From 1917 to 1918, his illness would continue to reoccur, but he recovered enough to do home service at various camps. He was promoted to First Lieutenant. In this time, Edith birthed their first son, John Francis Reuel Tolkien (this family has an obsession with long names even to this day). It was also in this time that he became especially critical of the First World War and concluded that the whole thing was just stupid. This conclusion as well as his experiences in this war would also leave a marked effect on his works, later.

After leaving the British Military after the War, Tolkien found his first civilian job at Oxford English Dictionary. He mostly worked on the history and etymology of words of Germanic origin that started with the letter W. Unsurprisingly, he quickly quit this mind-numbing job and went to work as Reader in English Language at the University of Leeds and landed the job of professor there in 1920.

While working, he and another professor, E.V. Gordon, produced “A Middle English Vocabulary”. He also did work by himself, such as a definitive edition of Sir Gewain and the Green knight. Both of these became academic works for many decades. He also translated works titled “Pearl” and “Sir Orfeo”.

In 1925, he returned to Oxford and became Rawlinson and Bosworth Professor of Anglo-Saxon (if nothing else, his resume was never lacking in impressive titles). He also held a fellowship at Pembroke College. Particular note should be made of Pembroke, because it was during his time there that he wrote “The Hobbit” AND the first two-thirds of “The Lord of the Rings”. The Hobbit was published and released in 1936. He finished The Lord of the Rings at Merton College, Oxford and published it through 1954 and 1955.

Tolkien retired in 1959 and lived happily with his wife until his death in September, 2nd, 1973 at age 81.

Rest in Peace, John Ronald Reuel Tolkien (1892-1973)

Thoughts: The first thing that one needs to know about Tolkien is that he was an old-fashioned kind of man in many senses of the world. He was a staunch Roman Catholic and just as much a staunch conservative in some respects. As such preferring conventions and traditions over innovations and changes were his way. To quote a remark he made in 1943, “My political opinions lean more and more to Anarchy (this is commonly understood to abolition of control, not the Joker)-or to “unconstitutional” Monarchy.” It should be noted that Tolkien was an early example of a non-racist white, who had a large distaste for the mistreatment of any ethnic group, period.

All this being said, the Industrial Revolution was very much the bane of Tolkien’s existence, as while many good things came from it, but it was done with such little care for the woods and other natural resources that it is left with little wonder he was so horrified by it. Industry devoured the English countryside and spit it back as monotonous telephone poles and such. This was mirrored infamously in the Scourging of the Shire, which was the last official battle in The Lord of the Rings books.

It is because of blatant examples that reflected Tolkien’s attitudes towards the world such as the Scourging of the Shire, or the four friends leaving home together to face danger and death that many have tried to make potential allegorical or real life connections where there are actually none to be found. As a matter of fact, Tolkien hated allegory “in all of its manifestations ever sense I was old and weary enough to be aware of its presence”, as he put it. paraphrased, anyway. This was a mentality that Tolkien fought tooth and nail, which led to a forward in the second edition of the novel where he tells the readers what’s what. That being said, the forward did nothing to silence the debates thanks to Fan Dumb and Fan Wank (courtesy of TVTropes).

So, despite a few Author on Board (see the reference in TVTropes.com) moments through his otherwise brilliant works, Tolkien employed something called “Applicability”. Basically, he left the entire story of The Lord of the Rings without a specific message in mind and included universals that have a different meaning to everyone. The readers take from their own life experiences and fill in the meaning using that. It is because of this brilliant method of writing that The Lord of the Rings continues to have relevance today, because everyone will ALWAYS be able to take something from the books. Even people who aren't particular fond of Lord of the Rings have a grudging respect for the man.
He also did not view The Lord of the Rings or any of his other works as escapism. He actually viewed mythos as a thematic form of reality where real issues and tackled and overcome. He found that these themes were consistent and external, and he commented that Christianity followed the same pattern of Devine Truth.
In terms of politics, Tolkien could be referred to as a Conservative Democrat or Liberal Republic, as some of his views came from both kinds of mindsets. (Will go over in more detail later.)

His Works:
See Wikipedia’s article “Bibliography of J.R.R. Tolkien” for a complete list. Once you’re seen it, you’ll know why I didn’t want to type the whole thing up.

His most notable works are “The Hobbit”, “The Lord of the Rings”, and “The Silmarillion”. In order to fully understand what Jackson, Bakshi, and Rankin-Bass were tackling, we must analyze The Lord of the Rings deeply.
(Potentially expand on this section later.)

Themes and Values of The Lord of the Rings:
The Lord of the Rings was completed via a long paved and repaved path. Tolkien would reach a point in the writing, find a problem, and then start over on a typewriter without trying to salvage anything. The project, itself, was developed through Tolkien’s own personal exploration into his interests, which included philosophy, religion (i.e., Roman Catholicism), fairy tales, Norse and general Germanic mythology, and also some Celtic and Finnish mythos with a few original inventions of his own. There was also some verified influence from the poem Beowulf, written by an unknown author.

Although The Lord of the Rings is largely without a particular moral message, one cannot deny that Tolkien’s own beliefs made their way into his writings. It’s impossible for it to be any other way. A little piece of the author goes into each and every one of his or hers’ writing, however subconsciously. That being said, Catholic theology and moral philosophy played a big part in The Lord of the Rings. They were just not explicit. It is the themes of these things that show up in The Lord of the Rings. Tolkien did not intend for this to be a religious or Catholic work, but he ended up acknowledging that he could not get away from the two and made his book so deliberately in the revision stage.

As stated before, some of the locations from Tolkien’s youth made their way into his stories. The Shire was largely based on the rural English countryside and Bad End got its name from the home of a relative. The darker parts of the book, which included images of battles were lifted right from his experiences in World War I. For example, the Dead Marshes were based on an experience of seeing flooded trenches with dead soldiers still in them. Sleep well on that thought.

There are also a large number of universal themes that go into The Lord of the Rings, such as Friendship, loyalty, love, self-sacrifice, selflessness, courage against over-whelming odds, finding the strength to move past your own limits, and hope. These are universal themes which anyone of any ethnic group, belief, or location can relate to.

Other Details: The Lord of the Rings is 1,000+ pages long, and that’s not counting the Appendix. Even for Peter Jackson’s three to three and a half hour long movies (three and a half to four hours for the Extended Editions), that’s a heck of a lot of material to squeeze in.

Because of the applicable nature of the books, each filmmaker to attempt a film adaptation is going on their own biases on what the book seems to tell them. Hence, one should remember that each adaptation is the filmmaker’s own vision.

End of Part One.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 05, 2009, 07:11:20 PM
A Very interesting reading.  I found it interesting & Informative and look forward to the rest.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 06, 2009, 10:47:34 PM
Thanks. This paper in a standard format on Windows Vista is about 60 pages thus far, so I hope this doesn't become too boring, so...here we go: (and don't forget, feedback)

Part Two:[/i] The Men Who Have Tried Their Hand at The Lord of the Rings: Meet Peter Jackson, Ralph Bakshi, and Rankin-Bass. This paper will go through each of their bios up to the project before they made their adaptation of Tolkien’s most famous work.

Jackson: Jackson was born on October 31st, 1961 Pukerua Bay, New Zealand, to William and Joan Jackson. As a child, Jackson was not too different than Tolkien in some ways. Much like the man whose work he would someday adapt to film, Jackson loved to roam and explore the untainted New Zealand countryside, on some grand adventure or another. Jackson was also an avid film fan. He grew up admiring the works of Ray Harryhausen in particular. One of his favorite films was King Kong, no less. Another work he would someday adapt.
One day, young Jackson was given a Super-8 cine-camera by his father. Soon, Jackson was making his own short films with the help of his friends and was soon trying to recreate the Stop-Motion effects of King Kong, with Stop-Motion models that he, himself, made. It is unknown how successful he was.

Now, the first thing one should know about Jackson is that despite his recent immense success as a filmmaker is that he had no formal training in the field. His filmmaking skills are largely learned through his own trial and error. He also learned from any and all instruction manuals he could get his hands on that showed how to cut and edit a film, build sculptures, paint make-up prosthetics, construct models to take the place of full size buildings or monsters, and render sophisticated Special Effects.

Anyway, at age eighteen, Jackson went on a long train ride and his father gave him a big book, titled The Lord of the Rings, to keep him busy. Jackson was immediately hooked and thought that it would make for a great movie. He just never imagined he would be the man to make it, as he has admitted.
He worked as a part time filmmaker in his early career as he had a full time job in another field as a photo engraver. He treated filmmaking more as a hobby than a profession in these years.

His Career: In 1983, despite his lack of both funds and time, Jackson undertook an ambitious task. He decided to make his own full-length feature film AND maintain his current job.

He titled his Full-Length feature Roast of the Day, which was eventually renamed Bad Taste. The film was in production for four years due to being shot only over weekends and it was entirely funded by whatever Jackson could make from his other job. Jackson brought a film camera, but built the rest of the necessities of filmmaking, himself. His crew was comprised of his old friend, Ken Hammon. His cast was coworkers from his other workspace. They had originally signed on for laughs, but then ended on set for weekends years later. The film was what we call a Splatter Film, which is a comedy with excessive amounts of blood as well as some shades of the horror genre. In other words: very British.

Despite the above restrictions, the film made good progress weekend after weekend. However, more problems would eventually come about, as per the laws of chaos. Firstly, a common day job is frankly not up to funding a feature film. Secondly, a core member of the cast dropped out after his marriage. His deeply religious wife forbade him from shooting. These are problems that probably would have sunk any other filmmaker, but Jackson was in luck. A few members of the New Zealand film industry had (somehow) heard of the insane indie film project involving flying brains and exploding sheep. Jackson’s brazen and stubborn inability to quit despite all that went against him impressed them. So Jim Booth, an NZ Film Commission CEO funded the rest of the production.

The cast member’s staunchly religious bride also broke up with him and he returned to the set. Bad Taste was ready to soldier on. It was in this time that Jackson’s former interest and hobby and bloomed into a fulltime profession.
Sometime in May, 1987, Bad Taste was released at the Cannes Film Festival. It was met with success and appraisal from critics and horror film fans. The film was released in 12 different countries.

After some traveling to various screenings around the world, Jackson quickly returned home and began to work on various film scripts collaborating with people such as Stephen Sinclair and Fran Walsh (the latter of whom would become his partner and mother to his children). I won’t go into detail about the ones have never seen the light of day, but two of the scripts he worked on in this period were early drafts of Meet the Feebles and Brain Dead, which would be Jackson’s second and third full-length features. He was also optioned several Hollywood jobs that would have required him to leave New Zealand in this time, but he loved living in his homeland so much that he refused to leave. This set back his career from reaching the mainstream for a long time, but overall, the decision was well worth it.

Jackson’s next film was an ensemble musical splatter comedy which starred Muppet-esque puppets (the whole was an affectionate black comedy parody of Jim Henson’s The Muppet Show). The project exploded into production due to some unexpected enthusiasm from Japanese investors. It had a small budget and production went weeks past the assigned schedule. This was also the first film which he worked with Richard Taylor, the future head of Weta Workshop, and his go-to guy for Special Effects from that day forward, and Fran Walsh, the business and marital partner. The film was released 1989.

The third film to grace Jackson’s resume was another Splatter comedy, Brain Dead, released in 1992. This is film is about a man who accidentally turns his mother into a zombie and keeps her locked down in his basement, because he’s afraid of what the neighbors will think. All the while he retains a facade of normality. This whole premise was a reversal of the zombie plot, wherein most zombie film feature people trying to keep zombies out, this one features one man trying to keep them in. In terms of production values and actor performances, the film is considered a landmark for the genre and won Jackson much, much more success and praise than the previous two films. He was beginning to come into his own as a filmmaker.

After three consecutive blood splatter comedies, Jackson was done with the genre and decided to move on to other kinds of projects. His next film would be a film adaptation of a real life incident, the Parker-Hulme murder. This film was titled, Heavenly Creatures. This was the event of two mentally ill teenage girls who murdered the mother of one of them. The purpose of the murder was to prevent the two, who were close friends, from being separated, though that’s exactly what ended up happening as part of their punishment as decided by the case’s judge.
The film was a giant leap forward for Jackson’s career, as his style and tone changed dramatically during this project and the film garnered an Oscar nomination for Best Original Screenplay, and made the top ten lists of several tears lists such as Time, The Guardian, The Sydney Morning Herald, and The New Zealand Herald. Heavenly Creatures’ success put Jackson in the sights of Miramax Films. They even promoted the film in America with tenacity and signed its director on for a first look deal. This agreement would later lead to the creation of The Frighteneers and The Lord of the Rings. One last thing that made this film a landmark in Jackson’s career: through the necessity to create sophisticated Special Effects for the film, Weta Workshop was born.

This being said, many New Zealanders had been a little apprehensive about how Jackson would handle the material in Heavenly Creatures. He was only known as the “Bad Taste” guy at the time. Their worries were soon enough put when they realized that Jackson and company all treated the event with the seriousness that it warranted.

Before Jackson went onto his later Hollywood projects, though, he collaborated with a Wellington filmmaker, Costa Botes, to make Forgotten Silver. The film was a ëmockumentary’ or ëmock doc’, about an inventive and ambitious filmmaker named Colin McKenzie. In the film, he was the creator of’talkies’ and color film, and made an epic called Salome before being forgotten entirely by the world. Of course, this was all false. Not that anyone who saw the film at the time knew that. Jackson, Botes, and company gave no indication that the following was fiction and it aired on TV in a slot usually reserved for dramas. The piece was so well-made that many were actually shocked and even angered to discover that McKenzie was never real. This example has been used as a testimony to Jackson and Botes’ skill as filmmakers that such an improbable tale was successfully passed off as real and that they briefly got away with it.

Around this time, Jackson and Walsh’s children were born. Their names are Billy and Katie.

Following the broadcast of Forgotten Silver, filmmaker Robert Zemeckis, (the director of the Back to the Future trilogy, Who Framed Roger Rabbit, and Forrest Gump) contacted Jackson about writing an episode for Tales of the Crypt. Jackson agreed to this but it eventually became a script for the feature film, The Frighteneers, which Zemeckis produced with Universal Pictures. Jackson and his company were put at the helm to make the film, but their terms were that they get to make the movie partially comedy, and that they get to film in New Zealand. Zemeckis talked the Universal CEOs into agreeing to the proposition and production was soon underway.

This project saw another change in the status quo at Jackson’s company. Weta Workship underwent substantial growth in order to create the CGI ghost effects required in the film. It was also the first film in which Jackson worked with a big name celebrity, Michael J. Fox.

Despite the steps that Wingnut Pictures (Jackson’s company) and Weta Workshop made to deliver the film, it had disappointing boxoffice results. A large number of factors went into this result, but overall, it is still an interesting and good film. It is just not a great one.

Following The Frighteneers, Jackson attempted to get a remake of King Kong, off of the ground, but the project was shelved by Universal, partly due to the results of The Frighteneers lackluster boxoffice take and partly due to Disney’s upcoming Mighty Joe Young. So, Jackson turned his attentions to adapting another favorite of his, The Lord of the Rings. But that will be covered in “The Game Attempts” section of this paper.

Thoughts: Very little is known about Jackson’s political views, as he keeps such things to himself, preferring to speak about his works or interests while on-camera. What is known about Jackson are mostly personal details pertaining to other areas of his life.

It’s known that he is a staunch perfectionist with a near inhuman eye for detail and thus high demands on his employees at Weta Workshop. He’s also known for doing multiple takes on all scenes while trying to find the right tone for the scene, as well as shooting scenes from many angles. The multiple angle coverage is so that the editors will have more options to work with during Post-Production.
He also possesses a macabre sense of humor and a general playfulness, which is noted with varying degrees of amusement or annoyance by everyone else on set.
It should also be noted that unlike some other film directors, Jackson has not moved out of New Zealand to film his movies, insisting on staying close to his beloved home and where he is most comfortable filming. Some might call this a bad call, as Hollywood is where the majority of the world’s biggest films are made. So that’s where most of the work is. This might be a problem if Jackson were the kind of filmmaker who waited around for other people to come to him for work. However, everything ever made that has Peter Jackson’s name on it has had him involved from day one. He and his coworkers develop their own film concepts, for the most part, and work on their own initiative.

As the result of Wingnut Pictures and Weta Workshop staying close to their roots, other New Zealand filmmakers and companies are often temporarily employed during film projects. There have also been whole production and support companies because of this. He also helped restored Wellington’s iconic Embassy Theatre, where he held the opening night of The Return of the King. He even has most of his assets on the Miramar Peninsula, where he does most of his shooting.
Many have asked him what his secret is, but it is no secret. Instead of making films that he thinks the audience wants to see, he makes films that he wants to see. His passion for filmmaking to this day is unrivaled.

Ralph Bakshi: He was born on October 29th, 1938, in Haifa, British Mandate of Palestine. The Mandate has sense then been reestablished as Israel. When he was one year old, his family relocated to New York City, New York State, in order to escape any involvement in World War II.

Bakshi grew up in the Brownsville neighborhood of Brooklyn, and had an eclectic variety of interests. He enjoyed comic books, classic artwork, and the work of Picasso. Later, he took up boxing in High School, and later attended the School of Industrial Art. He graduated in 1957 with an award in cartooning.

His Career: Instead of continuing onto college, at the age of 18, Bakshi applied to the animation studio Terrytoons, where he became a cel painter, an inker, and eventually, an animator, but that wasn’t until years later. He proved to be something of a prodigy, as he was directing programs starring classic characters like Mighty Mouse, Heckle and Jeckle, Deputy Dawg, and Foofle by age 25. Most animator filmmakers are in their late 30s-somein their 40s before they make anything of note.

At age 28, in the year 1966, Bakshi proposed a superhero cartoon parody titled The Mighty Heroes. It was to run on CBS, but there was a problem. All of Terrytoon’s proposals were rejected, and Bakshi was under-prepared. Believe it or not, though, the pitch was approved, and Bakshi was brought on as the director as production started. But the series was not a success, for unknown reasons.
In the late 1960s, the political climate of the United States changed and animation was sanitized and made more innocent than it was before. It was also made more cheaply, with the a few exceptions, such as Johnny Quest, by Hanna-Barabara. However, bakshi felt that he could no longer make the kind of cartoons that he enjoyed doing. He referred to the state of animation at the time as “…grown men sitting in cubicles drawing butterflies floating over a field of flowers, while the idea of American planes are dropping bombs in Vietnam and kids are marching in the streets, is ludicrous”. This was of course in reference to the fact that he thought animation should be tackling these issues. Agree with disagree with him, his frustration with the bowdlerization of American Animation is understandable.
Bakshi was made the head of the animation division of Paramount Pictures in 1967, filling the position when Shamus Culhane left. He made two shorts in his time at Paramount. They were The Opera Caper and Marvin Digs. Interestingly, Bakshi called the latter short a “flower child picture”, while a man named Michael Barrier called it “an offensively bad picture, the kind of movie that makes people who love animation get up and leave the theatre in disgust”. Ironically, the film was nowhere near as dirty as Bakshi intended.

At the end of 1967, Paramount closed its animation division and Bakshi found work at Grantray-Lawrence Animation, after being hired on by Steve Krantz. He worked on a Canadian science fiction series called Rocket Robin Hood. Bakshi hired two comic artists, Gray Morrow and Jim Steranko, to work on the series as layout and storyboard artists to make the series look more cinematic. It is said that Bakshi as pleased with the results and held the animators and designers to high expectations in terms of drawing quality.

The Grantray-Lawrence Animation company went bankrupt in the spring of 1968. This man is either a curse to the animation studios who hire him on, or he has a knack for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Either way, he returned to New York, where he and his old employer from grantray-Lawrence founded a new animation studio, which they called Ralph’s Spot. They paid animators higher wages than other studios did and gave opportunities to women and minority animators. Ralph’s Spot completed the unfinished Rocket Robin Hood and began work on another series titled Spider-Man, which was an animated adaptation of the popular comic book series. Unforunately, Bakshi had a habit of reusing animation sequences to lower the cost of production. Bakshi and Krantz later produced a lot of commercials and a series of educational films titled Max the Mouse after the two series ended.

Come 1970, Bakshi decided to take a huge step in his career. A full length animated feature. Together he and his partner, Krantz began on Fritz the Cat, based on the popular underground comic book by Robert Crumb. Initially, Bakshi was reluctant to make the film, due to having spent years making animation with animal character, and wanted to focus on human characters. Of course, he got over this and he used whatever animation techniques were at his disposal, given his limited budget. He made heavy use of rotoscoping, where live-action footage is filmed, then draw over, frame by frame. Its very time consuming, but it’s also very cheap.

Fritz the Cat would go on to have the dubious honor of being the first animated film to receive an X-Rating. In the United States. Released to the public April 12th, 1972, it had its opening day in Hollywood and Washington, D.C. (?!). However, the film was an unexpected success, and it kick-started Bakshi’s animated film producing career.

The film received mixed responses. While older people tended to hate it, the youths of the time loved it. That being said, it caused a huge uproar. Those who liked it liked it. The others, well, Bakshi received a few death threats. Also, the creator of the original comic book, Robert Crumb, disowned the film.
The following year of 1973, Bakshi started production of Heavy Traffic, which was a film reflecting life in the inner-city. Bakshi’s animation methods stayed the same. The film was as successful as Fritz the Cat. This made Bakshi the first animation film director since Disney to make two successful animated films in a row.

He also produced a film titled, Coonskin, which was loosely based on the Uncle Remus story books. He produced this film with Albert S. Ruddy, who Bakshi’s partner, Krantz hated for some reason. He even locked Bakshi out of the studio once when he found out Ruddy would be on-board. Coonskin was never widely released on the grounds that many found it to be racist. In truth, though, the film was actually an attack on racial stereotyping, but it was advertised as an exploitation film and soon disappeared from the silver screen. Controversy seems to be both Bakshi’s bane and bread-and-butter.

After Coonskin, Bakshi produced and finished a rough version of a work titled Hey Good Lookin’. The film’s story is set in the 1950’s, in Brooklyn, New York City. The whole story is a commentary about life on the streets, which rehashed ideas previously explored in Fritz the Cat and Heavy Traffic, though some say that an interesting scene in which a gangster starts hallucinating while in the middle of a shoot-out on a roof almost makes up for old ideas reused. Production of the film began in 1974, and it was finished and set for released in 1982, due to various technical difficulties. The film was supposed to be one-part animation and one-part live-action, originally. Though putting together proved to be too difficult and the whole concept was eventually scrubbed because they didn’t have the budget.
During the remainder of the 70s, while Hey Good Lookin’ remained in its long production, there was a shift in Bakshi’s career. After the frustrations of Coonskin and during the ones of Hey Good Lookin’, Bakshi decided to try his hand at other genres. More specifically, he was about to try his hand at the fantasy genre. His first attempt to take his career in another direction was with the film War Wizards, which was later shortened to Wizards in its final version. This was an “after mankind has finally blown itself off of the face of the planet” story, which contained allegorical commentary about moral neutrality of technology, and the destructive powers of propaganda. He also had the film deal with the creation of Israel, the Holocaust, and the rise of fascism. In terms of becoming one of the men who would try his hand at The Lord of the Rings, by this point there is an obvious problem with his mentality. Tolkien hated all allegory and made The Lord of the Rings strictly applicable instead. By contrast, all of Bakshi’s works up this point had been commentaries and allegorical in nature, which puts him in the wrong mindset for Middle Earth right from the get go. There will be more on this later.

Moving on, after all the humans are gone (blown themselves up), all the fantasy creatures like dragons, fairies, wizards, and such reemerged from their hiding place now that they could exist freely without “those silly humans” messing things up, which is what forced them into hiding in the first place. The film was met with mixed reviews, but has built up a cult following.

Thoughts: This is a difficult one to describe, but I think a series of personal quotes that I found will speak for themselves.

Oh, there is one thing I will say. The guys who created the Simpsons used to work for them. They based The Comic Book Guy off of him. Take from that what you will.

:I think it's impossible to do J.R.R. Tolkien. It's impossible to get the brilliance of what he wrote about -- just the medium, the book, the novel gives you other areas of imagination [that] film can't allow. Film has to describe and show. With the brilliance of his words and his scenes, you imagine whatever you want. I'm sure various people imagine different things.”

“Sweetheart, I'm the biggest ripped-off cartoonist in the history of the world, and that's all I'm going to say.”

“John and a bunch of guys were working for me in my studio on storyboards before Mighty Mouse. Bobby's Girl was the project, Tri-Star bought the movie. John and a bunch of other artists designed it [the same guys who went to work on Mighty Mouse]. I was the producer/director. The studio would then have sequence directors, designers etc. as usual. The president of Tri-Star, Jeff Sagansky, got fired. The project was canceled by Tri-Star. In panic I sold Mighty Mouse and decided to make John a director to train him on a TV series. Roughly speaking, after that, John really wanted his own studio to produce and direct himself and never really felt comfortable working for anyone else. Even his giant friend Ralph.”
On directing The Rolling Stones music video of "The Harlem Shuffle": “I cast everyone and hired everyone - but my main concentration was taking care of the Stones. It was a lot of work choreographing . . . it was also a blizzard in New York the night we were shooting, and after I returned that night at 4 or 5 am they thought I had checked out without paying, so I spent the night in the lobby. The rest was a blur. Oh yes, there were about 350 groupies on the sound stage and various hangers around - and someone delivered three cases of Scotch or bourbon to Keith Richard's room. I do remember that. Never saw them again! Oh yeah, Keith Richards loved the zoot suit he wore. I had to buy the suits from the costume department because he took them back to England. I loved that. Mick Jagger had his purple suit tailored especially for him, so he owned that.”

“Louise Zingarelli walked into my studio from Chicago and said to me that the guys that she worked with on the newspapers in Chicago told her that she should work for me. She was an extraordinary illustrator and a real tough lady. I thought her best work was Hey Good Lookin' (1982) and American Pop (1981).”
On working with My Life with the Thrill Kill Cult on the Cool World (1992) "Sex on Wheelz": "They were very professional, very tired from all the years they were doing punk rock--and very, very funny. The band that consisted of women and men used the bathroom as a dressing and make-up room. Hysterical studio employees walked out shaking their heads. I shot 8mm home movies of that. It's in a box somewhere - I'll look for it. It was a one-day shoot - fast and furious.”
About Cool World (1992): “The original concept, way back when I sold the film, was that a live-action cartoonist would go to bed with a cartoon woman in the cartoon world. They had a child immediately that was a strange combination of live action and animation in one character. This son of the underground cartoonist hates himself for what he is and isn't and goes back to the real world to track his father down. The picture was originally an R-rated horror film. Slash and the rest of the characters in "Cool World" were just friends of Holli and looked nothing like their child.”

“When I had my own company on Heavy Traffic (1973) and Coonskin (1975), all metaphors were able to get to the screen clearly. In Cool World (1992), with the producer and Paramount watching me carefully to make sure I was in good taste, I instinctively poured stuff into the picture that I wanted to talk about. But when you force stuff, it's not really very clear. But, I have a great love for Max Fleischer, especially some of his black-and-white Betty Boops with their strange Cab Calloway and Louis Armstrong black folk tale jazz hipness that part of "Cool World" was a homage in style to those films and that style of cartooning. The Grim Reaper is right out of a Max Fleischer cartoon or old Terrytoons, which is why I hired and love Milton Knight the artist. He understands totally the Uncle Remus fable-like qualities behind Fleischer and Terrytoons. Milton Knight is probably the purest artist of that style in the business. He has a hard time because studios think he is old-fashioned . . . but that's the point.”

“The art of cartooning is vulgarity. The only reason for cartooning to exist is to be on the edge. If you only take apart what they allow you to take apart, you're Disney. Cartooning is a low-class, for-the-public art, just like graffiti art and rap music. Vulgar but believable, that's the line I kept walking.”
(One thing I will add to this quote is that Bakshi is just dead wrong. Animation is just one of many mediums through which to express art. Its people like him that have led to the adult comedy end of Western Animation that now plagues [adult swim] on Cartoon Network's night time slot. He has much to answer for.)

“None of my pictures were anything I could ever take my mother to see. You know it's working if you're making movies you don't want to your mother to see.”

“You can't be a cartoonist, I don't care what kind of cartoonist you are, without having passed through this thing of loving fantasy.”

“I never learned to animate. And I'm not trying to be cute, either. The minute you think you learned it, you're through. I've seen a lot of young animators coming up sensations. They get so good, so fast, so young, they never got any better, it's extraordinary to see. They never worked hard, so they don't get better. If you're an artist, you learn, you keep learning, you keep working.”
“When you have a high budget, people are looking at you. Low budgets can be godsends for directors. Plus, with the number of people starving on this planet, it's just wrong to spend that kind of money on films. When you have no money, no one's looking at you, no one cares. No one cared when I was doing 'Fritz the Cat' (1972). Big budget films are filled with terror, filled with community consultations on all levels. But it's too much money for one man to handle and I'm not a great believer in collaboration. I believe in a directed film, and the vision of a director.”
On Richard William's The Thief and the Cobbler: “Over the years Richard would show me various magnificently animated sequences from the picture. Richard was very much like DeKooning, the painter, where he kept changing the finished product. It was fine when he was working for himself and I told him when he sold the film to WB that unless he met a delivery date there would be trouble. There was, and I never got to see the original cut, so I can't compare to what I saw in the theatre. I know when they took the film away from Richard and gave it to some hack animator to finish, it was like killing Richard's baby. It had a lot to do with him leaving the industry. When I had a fight on Heavy Traffic with the producer, half way through the film it was offered to Chuck Jones to finish. Chuck turned them down, saying it was Bakshi's film and only Bakshi's film. I didn't even know him at the time. Richard didn't have the same luck I had. But that's showbiz.”

Rankin-Bass: The Rankin-Bass company was started by entrepreneur filmmakers Arthur Rankin, Jr. and Jules Bass. These two men are mostly known for their names and their works, as not much of their personal lives are known.
Arthur Rankin, Jr. was born July 19th, 1924 in New York City, New York. He is the son of actor Arthur Rankin, Sr.

In the early 60s Rankin, Jr. formed a partnership with a fellow filmmaker, Jules Bass, and they founded Videocraft International, later renamed Rankin-Bass. The two worked closely for several decades, co-director and producing many stop motion features and traditional hand drawn animation. They are perhaps, best known for their holiday specials such as Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer, Frosty the Snow Man, Twas the Night Before Christmas, Santa Claus is Coming to Town, The Nutcracker, The Little Drummer Boy, and Pinocchio’s Christmas. They were also known for other TV specials like The Wind in the Willows, The Flight of Dragons, Treasure Island, Oliver Twist, and such.

They were also responsible for many animated TV series such as Silverhawks and The ThunderCats.

Jules Bass was born on September 16th, 1935, in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. He went to college at the New York University, and first worked at an advertising agency in the same city until the early 1960s, when he quit his job and co-founded Videocraft International with Arthur Rankin, Jr. He is known for the exact same works as Rankin, Jr., as they worked together on virtually all of their works, right up until their retirements.

Their Career: As stated, VideoCraft/Rankin-Bass was founded in the early 1960s by Arthur Rankin, Jr. and Jules Bass as an independent animated film company. One of the first projects the company ever worked on was a series based on the character, Pinocchio. It was created using “Animagic”, a stop motion animation technique that uses figurines. Following it was another series titled Tales of the Wizard of Oz, in 1961.

In 1964, NBC and a sponsor, General Electric, commissioned the company to produce to a Christmas Special based on the Johnny Marks song Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer. It was finished and broadcast Christmas 1964, and became one of the most popular and lasting TV specials ever.

After the unprecedented success of Rudolph, the company was hired on to create more specials. They were The Cricket on the Hearth, in 1967. They also created a Thanksgiving special, The Mouse on the Mayflower, in 1968. In 1969, VideoCraft had its first feature film on Halloween, Mad Monster Party (which featured Boris Karloff’s last performance before he passed away).

They would go on to many other works throughout their long careers, both in TV holiday specials and otherwise. (Will potentially expand, later, maybe… It’s a long resume to go over.)

Thoughts: Rankin-Bass has always made films for the family, providing clean entertainment that people of all ages can enjoy and yet has a dramatic side when it is needed. This is a trait that should have made them ideal for dealing with The Lord of the Rings. However, they were forced to make their attempt of Return of the King for TV and make it an hour and half, which cut their abilities to make their try at Tolkien’s masterpiece short.

End of Part Two.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 06, 2009, 10:51:24 PM
Part Three Adaptation vs. Original Film

Before this paper can move onto evaluating each of the adaptations made of Tolkien’s work, this section will serve as a quick reminder of what an adaptation and an original work are.

An adaptation is a film based on an earlier work, usually literary. Of course, depending on how well know known the work being adapted is, the demand for faithfulness to the source will be greater. So in the case of The Lord of the Rings, which is a book cherished and loved the world over, most people will want to see the characters, places, and themes which they so love reproduced onto film faithfully.

However, it is impossible to adapt a work of literary fiction word for word, so it is mandatory that changes and omissions be made to the content. Scenes will be removed or condensed, or perhaps even conjoined with other scenes. This will also happen with characters.

There is also the matter of interpretation. For example, in a work like The Lord of the Rings which relies on the perceptions of its readers to fill in the blanks to make the story meaningful to them, specifically, how the filmmaker perceives the book and what it says to him will greatly impact how he films it. Some have argued that films must be viewed as films, and the same goes for books, that they should be judged on their own merits. Others argue that while it is impossible for film adaptation to be completely accurate, that the core themes and elements of the story must be sustained. In either case, what the audience wants from the adaptation of a beloved work is key, in which case a fair amount of fidelity should be exercised during production.

Now, as for an original work, it is a venture that the filmmakers, themselves, have come up with and they have free reign to do with it what they will as they have no commitment to remain faithful to any prior source.

End of part three.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 06, 2009, 11:03:41 PM
Part Four: The Game Attempts-Part One

In this section, each individual attempt to adapt Tolkien’s The Lord of the Rings will be gone over in detail and compared to book to see how each and every one holds to the highest selling work of fiction of the 20th century.

Ralph Bakshi’s The Lord of the Rings-Part One will be the first covered, because it was the first, released 1978. The work covers roughly the first two-thirds of the book, in which the all of the events of The Fellowship of the Ring and part of The Two Towers are covered. The film ends immediately at the end of the Siege of Helm’s Deep and before Frodo and Sam encounter Faramir or enter Shelob’s Lair.
Before the film can be covered, the history behind its conception and Pre-Production must be covered. In the late 1950s, the Tolkien family had financial problems and the rights to make a movie out of the book were sold to the Walt Disney Company for a large sum.

It was around this time that Bakshi became acquainted with the work during his time at Terrytoons and thought it would make for an excellent animated TV series. However, Walt Disney had a firm hand on the rights and still in the conception stage for his attempt at handling Tolkien’s work. The project never left this stage of production, though, and the Disney company eventually sold the rights to United Artists Entertainment LCC. This film was handed over to Stanley Kubrick and John Boorman to try to adapt…as a single film…starring The Beatles as Frodo, Sam, Merry, and Pippin. This thankfully did not get made, either.

It was in the Mid-1970s, after Bakshi had achieved box office success that he approached the studio for the rights to make the film. He got them and it ended up costing $3 million. Bakshi’s original proposition was to create a three-part animated adaptation, each film covering a volume. However, the deal was changed after one of the producers brought on board was fired and a new one was brought in and had Bakshi redo the deal to two films.

During Pre-Production, the film was given a budget of $8 million (boxofficemojo.com will say its currently $4 million, but it keep changing to be less and less. Take from that what you will.). Chris Conkling and book author Peter S. Beagle (author of The Last Unicorn) were brought on board to write the screenplay, several college students (including a young Tim Burton) were hired on as animators, and Leonard Rosenman was hired to compose the music. Soon, with a limited budget, and a greatly condensed story, production was underway. The following is the result of Bakshi and company’s attempt to adapt Tolkien’s most beloved book. This ended up being two hours and eighteen minutes long and it covers all of The Fellowship of the Rings and the majority of The Two Towers.

Note: Bakshi actually met with Tolkien’s sons and daughters to properly discuss how to make the film and promised them to stay as close to the films as possible. Keep this in mind at all times.

Originally, the entire film was supposed to be fully animated via rotoscoping. As explained before, rotoscoping is essentially Motion-Capture’s traditional animation distant ancestor. Live-action actors and sequences are filmed then drawn over frame by frame. However, because of the limited budget, Bakshi soon ran out of money to make the film fully animated and made due with shooting the film at High Contrast to give it a more animated look. This was met with little success. The first signs of production decay are actually evident during the first scene of the film.

That being said, the opening scene is a narration about the history of the One Ring of Power. According to the film, the Rings of Power were first forged by elves and divided amongst the other races of Middle Earth, then sometime afterwards the Dark Lord Sauron learned the secret of art of ring-making and made his own ring to conquer all the other rings. Within the first few minutes, it’s shown that evidently reading the book and speaking with Tolkien’s children is not enough to stay true to the book for Bakshi. This change has baffled several people who have seen the film. Would it have taken longer to explain that Sauron, using trickery, fooled the elves into creating the Rings so that he could use the Master Ring to rule all the other ones? What was this change’s purpose?

Moving on, the opening scene only gets worse. The scene is not animated. It is filmed behind a red window shade with live-action actors dressed in cheap costumes who perform like amateur stage actors with throughout the scenes of the Ring making and battles. Stage lights shine behind the action so shadows on a red screen are all the audience can make out.

As for that battle scene, it appears as if about a dozen or so men are having a random fight somewhere, rather than the epic battle of The Last Alliance of men and elves that joined forces against Sauron, which, according to the opening narration “feel beneath [Sauron’s] power”. Also in this rendering, instead of facing Sauron head on and breaking his father’s sword Narsil in the process of separating the Dark Lord from his Ring, Isildor is described as “a heroic shadow who slipped in” and cut the Ring from Sauron’s hand while he wasn’t looking. The action of this being done is even less impressive. The anonymous silhouette that was supposed to be Isildor weakly hits the other silhouette that was supposed to be Sauron with a sword that visibly wobbles while the latter clutches his hand as if his school teacher had just smacked his wrist with a ruler. “Sauron Harold Darkside, have you been trying to conquer the world again?!” “No, ma’am!” Narsil, by the way, looks like it survived this, intact. So, deviation number 3 in which three minutes.

Moving on, Sauron is so underplayed that he leaves no lasting impression. He’s not intimidating or mysterious at all as portrayed in the books or the Jackson films. He’s just some figure with a horned Viking helmet no more or less vague or mysterious than anyone else in this scene.

Moving on, the rest of the narration continues on and explains that because Isildor did not destroy the Ring, Sauron’s spirit endeared and he went into hiding to recover his strength (though why it works this way is left out). Isildor was eventually ambushed by orcs near a river and the Ring lays forgotten and hidden there for two and a half thousand years.

The rest of the narration is word for word true to what happened in the books, though Gollum looks like the Grinch for some reason.

End of Part 4.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 07, 2009, 11:01:34 AM
a very interesting read so far WR. once it is completely finished then i will put up my two cents. I have seen all 3 of these films..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 07, 2009, 04:08:41 PM
Thanks. I know I've been begging for feedback, and I have a reason. I tried posting this in parts on another chatroom. Thus far, the people there have been as silent as the dead on this and its kind of ackward, because it either means I'm doin a good job or I've totally botched it beyond redemption. Anyway, we now move onto...

Part Five: The Game Attempts-Part Two:

After the opening narration, the audience is greeted with the first actual animation in the movie as of yet in the entire film, and it is actual animation. For the next hour, the film actually follows the book reasonably well with a few noticeable discrepancies, which will be covered as they come along. For example, the filmmakers completely neglect to call Gandalf “Gandalf the Grey”, and have him in bright blue. It should also be noted that the animation while present is hideous. The extra hobbits look like deformed garden gnomes, Frodo has an odd resemblance to Alvin the chipmunk with big 70s hair on his head, and Bilbo looks like he suffers from Down Syndrome.

Cosmetics aside, the followings play out as they did in the books. Gandalf arrives in Hobbiton to celebrate the 111th Birthday of Bilbo, his old friend. Although it is greatly condensed, the filmmakers still managed to keep Bilbo’s infamous speech and even manage a humorous moment with Mr. Proudfoot which would later be reflected in Jackson’s take. However, as for the speech itself, instead of being played out endearingly and cleverly, it comes off drunken and almost incoherent. Bilbo tells the Hobbits at the party about how he “must” leave the Shire, though the audience is never told why, giving one reason to surmise that Bakshi and company just assumed everyone who would see the film had already read the books AND had recently reread them or had a really good memory of everything that happens in the 1,000+ page book.

In the books, Bilbo’s reasons for leaving the Shire were a combination of his adventurous side which first manifested itself in his journey with Gandalf and the dwarves taking hold again and the Ring having an effect on him to try to use him to get back to its master. For the most part, though, his adventurous side is the main cause and still gets the better of him when he leaves the Ring behind because of his growing boredom and weariness of the Shire via a “late”-life crisis (“I need a holiday, a long holiday…”, Bilbo Baggins) and he revisits the places of his younger days before settling down in Rivendell. All of this is completely left out in this film, leaving Bilbo without a real motive for doing any of the things he did at his 111th birthday. Namely, slipping on the Ring and disappearing right in front of his relatives leaving poor Gandalf to take the blame for “spiriting him away”, which is what the other hobbits assumed happened in the books. We also never hear of this.

The other thing of note in this scene is that instead of merely disappearing, the action of putting on the Ring causes Bilbo to go up an in explosion of bright sparkles. In the book, Gandalf was responsible for the flashy part, but here it appears that the old guardian spirit had no idea Bilbo would do this and is furious.

Bilbo reappears at Bag End to pick up his things, but before he can do so, Gandalf also appears and begins badgering him on how dangerous using the Ring can be, all the while wagging his finger at the hobbit as if he were his mother.

In response to this, Bilbo throws a fit, waving his arms around in the air as if he had gone into a seizure and claims that Gandalf just wants to get his hands on “his precious” and this is passed off as horrifying. Well, it is, but not for the reasons Bakshi intended.

Since the filmmakers omitted why Bilbo suddenly calling the Ring his “precious” is a bad thing its to any audience member who is unfamiliar with Tolkien's works to guess why. In the books, this was to show that he was becoming obsessed and exhibiting the same symptoms Gollum had. The Jackson films even took this a step further than the books by having Isildor do the same thing. “The Ring is ëprecious’ to me.” –The memoires of Isildor from the Jackson adaptation of The Fellowship of the Ring.

Nevertheless, Gandalf shakes his fist roaring for Bilbo to not repeat that phrase. Bilbo quickly changes his tone, leaves the Ring behind as Gandalf suggests, and the scene fades to Bilbo waddling away from the Shire in a fashion similar to a penguin with a contented smile on his face as he leads a donkey bearing his luggage along. Remember, although the filmmakers do not state this directly, but the Ring keeps its wearers from aging, so Bilbo in the same physical condition as he was when he faced Smaug.

Then the scene cuts to a wide shot of Hobbiton with the caption “seventeen years pass sleepily in the Shire”, and the scenes begins to fade between the four seasons of the year. Alright, simple enough, but then suddenly the powers that be decided to jump cut through nine more seasons for 1 ? seconds. Neurological seizures were probably abound in the theater back in 1978. So, a caption that read, “17 years later”, then simply fading to Frodo in Bag End just wouldn’t have sufficed, huh, Bakshi and company?

Frodo is sleeping in a chair when he awakened by someone knocking at the door. He lazily stretches and answers the door. Gandalf is, of course, there. Frodo does a little dance while he exclaims that he’s happy to see the wizard. Gandalf states the painfully obvious for those still suffering from the seasonal jump cuts earlier and barges in without invitation.

He begins telling Frodo about how the Ring of Invisibility that Bilbo passed down to him might by the One Ring of Power. He sits down by the fireplace as he did in the book, and asks Frodo for the Ring. Frodo reluctantly hands it over and Gandalf takes the Ring into the hands whereas in the books he refused to even touch it. Then Gandalf asks him if he can see anything on it. Of course, it looks like a plain old Ring. So Gandalf casually throws it into the fireplace. Frodo is horrified and tries to retrieve the Ring.

Gandalf tells him that he already desires the Ring too much, which Frodo denies. Gandalf then stands up and the lecture begins. Of course, his hands wave around, milking the giant cow, and his eyes bulge as he speaks. No, really. He also hilariously over-pronounces everything in ways that would make William Shatner jealous. Gandalf tells Frodo about Sauron, the Ring’s effect on its users, and tells the young Hobbit that the responsibility of the Ring has fallen on his shoulders.

Gandalf then reaches into the fire with his bare hands and pulls the Ring out. He hands it back to Frodo who notes that it isn’t even hot. Then Gandalf begins reciting the famous poem. He is clearly doing this from memory, because he does not read the inscription on the Ring as none shows and declares it is the One Ring. Based on what? Because it stays cool in fire? Wouldn’t all the Rings of Power do that? Yes, Bakshi and company introduced the plot point of throwing the Ring into the fire from the book and then failed to follow up on it. After being directly exposed to flame, the incantation on both the inside and outside of the Ring was supposed to become visible and the filmmakers completely skip and ignore this!

The scene gets worse as Gandalf madly gestures while reciting the poem as he practically chases poor Frodo around the room then his rant by spinning on one of his heels like a ballerina and as he says the words, “…and in the darkness bind them”, suddenly stops, facing forward, and dramatically wraps his arms around himself. He then tells Frodo that Sauron has returned, he is looking for the Ring, and if he ever finds it, he will return to full power and conquer the world.

Next, instead of having Frodo and Gandalf discuss their plans quietly while sitting by the hobbit’s fireplace like in the book and like two individuals trying to keep things under wraps would do, anyway, the Bakshi film moves the remainder of the scene outdoors so the two can loudly announce their secret plans to the entire neighborhood. Here, Gandalf informs Frodo that Sauron has learned the name ëBaggins’ via Gollum. Frodo of course makes his infamous claim about how Bilbo should have killed him, but the wizard makes his assertion about how “even the very wise cannot see all ends” and that Bilbo was moved by “pity and mercy” to spare Gollum. In this instance, the Bakshi Gandalf actually carried the line fairly well and one almost gets a sense of the real Gandalf here.

They decide that they must figure out what to do with the Ring, and Frodo immediately tries to give it to Gandalf who has a momentary spasm at the gesture, proclaiming that he can’t take the Ring.

Following this display, Gandalf casually wanders over to a rustling bush and pulls out…Sam. First of all, one of the unfortunate results of having Gandalf and Frodo go for a walk in the middle of the night (it wasn't even night to begin with in the book, it was the middle of the day while the two sat at Frodo's fireplace), is that when Gandalf discovers Samwise eavesdropping, it is not under a window where Sam had the excuse of gardening. In the Bakshi film, they instead find him hiding out in a lone bush where Gandalf and Frodo justhappened to be. Secondly, what was Sam doing even there? Or do I really want to know? Third, we are never told who Sam is. This is the first time the audience is introduced to him. That Sam is both Frodo’s gardener and an old friend are not established. Yeah, s single sentence that could have been delivered over the course of five seconds was just too difficult for Bakshi to fit in  <_<  . Anyone who hadn’t read the books or had not done so recently would not know or might not remember at all. Last, this is where the film takes a turn for the worse.

Tolkien’s Samwise Gamgee was a dynamic, honest, pure-hearted, strong-willed, courageous, and loyal character who is the embodiment of the best friend anyone, anywhere, could ever have. He overcomes his own shortcomings to support Frodo through hellfire and brimstone. He becomes an essential player in the grand scheme of things and the quest to destroy the Ring would have failed without him. By contrast, this Samwise Gamgee is a short, squat midget, even among hobbits, and he is an odious moron with a goofy sounding voice and a voice actor who either sleep talks his through lines or carries on inanely. He's also been designated to comic relief in a Eisner-style "artistic" decision. If I remember correctly, Bakshi once said that he wouldn't leave Disney to be like Disney. Yet here he is, making the exact same choice one of the most reviled figures (Eisner) in animation would have in the same situation.
Also at absolutely no point does Sam ever play an important role in this movie or do anything useful.

Anyway, upon being pulled out of the bush, Sam begins goose-stepping around babbling about he’s afraid that Gandalf will turn him into “something unnatural”. He isn’t already? Frodo and Gandalf look on with indulgent smiles, telling the viewer that this is somehow supposed to be endearing. It is not.

Then Sam utters the line that has sparked many a “Sam the Mind-Reader” joke in several reviews of this film: “Well, I heard a deal that I didn’t rightly understand, about an enemy and rings, and about elves, sir!” There is a discrepancy here. At no point in their conversation did Frodo or Gandalf mention elves. Either this was the result of poor editing in which the parts of the conversation concerning elves from the book were actually recorded and animated, then ended up on the cutting room floor, or someone made an equally huge mistake during the writing process. No matter what happened behind the scenes, this is a blatant display of ill-care for the project and many have stated how that they couldn’t believe Bakshi, the writers, the editors, the producers, and anyone else who saw the film during screenings let slip by them.

Sam exclaims that he’d “love to go see elves”, and unfortunately, Gandalf takes this cue to send him along with Frodo on his journey. Of all the times Bakshi picked to stick to the books, it was the time most audiences wished he hadn’t. Take note that the Bakshi Sam’s behavior exhibits a far more perverse reason for wanting to see the elves than many have been comfortable with as opposed to the Tolkien Sam’s innocent wonderment towards them.

At this point, Gandalf announces that he must go and consult the head of his order…Arumon. In the books, the Head of the Order of Wizards was named Sarumon. To explain this, test audiences were confused by the names Sauron and Sarumon. So, the producers made Bakshi change the White Wizard’s name via removing the ëS’, part of the time. Unfortunately, as many have pointed out Bakshi was not consistent with this change and the characters revert to calling him Sarumon the other half of the time.

Gandalf takes his leave after giving Frodo instructions to meet him at the Prancing Pony Inn in Bree. After the wizard leaves Samwise does a little chicken dance and struts way like a wind-up toy loudly raving about he’s going to go “see the elves” with a tone reminiscent of Lenny from Of Mice and Men.

End of Part Five.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 07, 2009, 05:18:18 PM
Part Six: The Game Attempts-Part Three:

Next, cut to Gandalf’s journey to Isengard, or at least cut to Gandalf riding around on his horse in front of a poorly done Matte painting. Gandalf marches into (s)Aruman’s tower and begins attempting to order the head of the order of wizards around. As for (S)Aruman, as it has been noticed by most viewers, he has the appearance of an Evil Santa Claus dressed in red robes with huge 70s hair and a voice about as smooth and charismatic as Yosemite Sam’s. Yet he is still referred to “(S)Arumon the White” for whatever reason. Also, remember, in the books, Sarumon had an enchanting voice that could persuade many over to his side.

(S)Aruman, who will be called Santaman from this point hence, says nothing for most of this scene, but when he does, he manages to out ham Gandalf at every turn. Then, after revealing that he has changed alliances, he raises his arms in the air, opens his robe at Gandalf  :blink:  , and Gandalf and the audience are assaulted with an overblown light-show. This show of all manner of flashing lights and other weird things must have been inspired by a drug trip the filmmakers went on during production. Subtly, thy name is Bakshi.

The walls begin to fade, although the floor stays exactly the same, and suddenly the two are on the roof. Santaman leaves (to where?), leaving Gandalf just staying frozen in position for whatever reason and Gandalf roars the traitor’s name as full volume. Santaman laughs evilly and the camera pans out to reveal how huge the tower is in comparison to Gandalf. Also, there’s a giant disco ball encompassing the entire sky. It’s out of focus, but to anyone who has ever seen an old John Travolta movie, there’s no mistaking one when you see it.

Now, the scene is not clear about this, but Santaman put Gandalf up there to trap him and force him to switch sides as well. Also, in the books, Gandalf’s staff was taken from him to give him a handicap in escaping as a wizard’s power is channeled or at least enhanced through his staff. Gandalf’s staff remains firmly in his grasp throughout this scene.

Fade back to the hobbits, Frodo and Sam. They are already leaving the Shire for Bree under the deception of Frodo moving to a home in By Water, and have been joined by Merry and Pippin. The problem, though, is that we never learn which one is which for many scenes to come.

The viewer is taken through a montage of their travels, including one point where one of them has a guitar (?!) and the other three are merrily dancing to the music. By music, I mean tuneless “tra-la-la”.

There’s also some dialogue passed between them about how they need to use the name “Underhill” when referring to Frodo. However, before they can talk too much more, they hear something coming towards them on the road and they hide under some tree roots protruding out from the side of the steep hill that neighbors the road. This sequence is mirrored later in the Jackson version, which took a few cues from Bakshi’s rendering.

As for the approaching visitor, it is of course one of the Nazgul, referred to as the Black Riders at this point in the saga. Now, where to begin? First of all, the rider is not wearing black. The rider is wearing brownish-gray. Secondly, instead of the swift and merciless killing machines they were in the books, this thing moves like one would expect a zombie or retiree to. It also makes a terrible wailing sound. No. Not a terrifying wailing sound, just a terrible one. The wraith leaves without checking the area properly. Jackson’s version had a remedy for this. Merry distracts the wraith via throwing his pack and once it quickly rushes over to the noise the hobbits make a break for it. Here, it’s a wonder that version’s Sauron was ever able to make ëThe Last Alliance fall beneath his power’ at all.

Once the ëdanger’ is gone, Frodo and his cousins have an argument. Anyone who has read the books knows that Merry, Pippin, Samwise, and a fourth hobbit named Fatty were all part of a conspiracy to uncover the truth about Bilbo and his disappearing act when the old hobbit once put the ring on while Merry was watching unnoticed. Bakshi actually keeps this detail but it comes out right here in the woods for any random passerby to overhear, instead of in the privacy of Frodo’s ënew home’, like in the books. Actually, come to think of it, it’s no wonder Sauron was ever to threat to this Middle Earth. Everyone here is an idiot.

Frodo is angry at them for this, initially, before giving in after the two declare that they’ll stick with Frodo all the way (oh, joy!). Then they once again begin discussing their plans out in the open, just in case there were a few people who hadn't listened in yet.

The film skips over Farmer Maggot, the Old Forest, Old Man Willow, Tom Bombadil, and the Barrow Wights, so the hobbits are in Bree upon the very next scene. Although via their time at Farmer Maggot’s, the hobbits learn that the Black Riders are searching for them, most of these chapters have absolutely nothing to do with the primary plot.

Now, at the Prancing Pony, the next hint of just what a small budget Bakshi was working with is shown. There are a grand total of six animated characters in this scene, the four hobbits, Aragorn, and Butterbur the bartender. The rest…the rest are live-action actors with a visible effect put over them to try to make them look more like illustrations. This attempt, however, fails miserably. At least Aragorn still sits rather inconspicuously in the corner smoking his pipe like one would expect of a ranger. We also catch hint of some other characters from the books who whisper to each other as if they suspect who the hobbits really are. In the books, these three were Tom Ferny and his two cohorts who slipped off to contact the wraiths.

As per the books, Merry decides to go for a stroll in which he encounters the wraiths. Before he leaves he loudly reminds Frodo and the others to keep the secret. You know, just in case any of the other patrons of the Prancing Pony couldn’t hear them. My reaction? This:  :slap  .

I also only know this is Merry because I read the books. If the film is anything to go on here, it could be either Merry or Pippin.

Moving on, Frodo soon finds himself at the center of attention and is called to sing a song. Unlike in the book in which he was inspired to do so to halt Pippin when his tongue was getting a little too loose, here, Frodo just kind of does it. At least it’s the same song from the books, though. Also, if you ever get a chance to watch this film (and I wouldn't) closely observe the people who clap and cheer to Frodo’s song. One of them is a midget dressed like John Wayne sitting next to what looks like Ronnie Dio dressed as a pirate.

Meanwhile, back with Merry on his stroll, the Raingwraiths sneak up on him and burp blue mist in his face, causing him to lose consciousness and then they just wonder off. More amazingly, they don’t kill Merry or just stab him to turn him into a Wraith. In the books, they put Merry under the fear which paralyzes mortals in the Nazgul's presence right when they were probably about to search or interrogate him when they were caught by one of Butterbur’s employees, Bob. They quickly ran off to avoid their presence being exposed. It would seem Bakshi just stuck this in here for bragging rights that he kept all the scenes from the book. No never mind that these scenes all had to serve some purpose.

Back in the tavern, everyone is still dancing and cheering to Frodo’s table dance, when he suddenly trips, falls over, and disappears via slipping the Ring on. This little scene makes sense, because Frodo, like in the books, was playing with the Ring in his pocket (he is visibly doing this while dancing here) and it accidentally slipped onto his finger when he fell.

Howver, instead of slinking away to reappear while no one is looking, as per the books, Frodo stupidly reappears while everyone is still watching. I repeat:  :slap  . Butterbur orders the hobbits upstairs to their room, and they comply. Anyone who has read the books will know Aragorn accompanies them.
Also, the hobbits have heavy pounding footsteps while walking down the hallway. As opposed to, you know, the quick and quiet hobbits from the books.

Aragorn, thus far, has gotten the worse of the deal here. While some people attempt to advocate his appearance here by saying things “What would you expect from a guy who roughs in the wilderness all the time. He isn’t going to be a pretty boy like Mortensen.” Actually, he would be. Aragorn isn’t just your typical ranger roughing it in the wood. He was raised by the elves, has a little elvish blood in him, and is of the high human race of the Numenoreans. No, there is no excuse for Aragorn to still not look handsome and almost beautiful as Tolkien states he is. Of course, people who advocate Bakshi was backing up Bakshi, not Tolkien, the person they should be defending. In this film, though, Aragorn looks like the half-bit superhero Apache Chief, from the Superfriends, in a sleeveless tunic and a mini-skirt witha dark drown cape and yellow boots. He is voiced by John Hurt, whom you would know as the guy who got his chest-burst in the original Alien, Hellboy’s adoptive father, and as The Elephant Man.

Unfortunately, the one thing Bakshi chose to stick to from the books is that he runs around with the broken sword, but no other weapon. This worked in Tolkien’s original work, but here, it just looks ridiculous. Jackson’s version also took care of this by giving Aragorn as full sword. Another problem with Aragorn’s sword here is that Bakshi never explains its importance, nor is Gondor even given identity. I repeat, it didn't even look like Narsil even broke in the opening narration when it cut the Ring from Sauron's hand.

In the book, Aragorn’s sword Narsil belonged to Isildor, the King of Gondor, who was the man who cut the Ring from Sauron’s hand. The sword was broken in the encounter. It is the heirloom of Isildor’s bloodline and is passed down to his heir’s. Aragorn is the only living descentant of the line as of the present, though. Gondor is the kingdom of the Numenors who have since then fallen from grace and are in need of their king, but only after Sauron is defeated can Aragorn be their king because Sauron will raze Gondor to the ground before he’ll see their king returned to the throne. He’s kind of a jerk that way.

The first thing Aragorn does is start lecturing the hobbits on their mistakes. This is very, VERY justified as Bakshi was portrayed all the hobbits as having not even half the intelligence they did from the books. The problem is that he makes Aragorn come across as a prick while he does this. While he’s still lecturing them, Butterbur comes in Merry, who was sedated earlier, and Aragorn yells at him (Butterbur), too. Samwise doesn’t think they should trust Aragorn. You know, when the idiot starts making sense, the end must truly be near.

In response to this, Aragorn declares himself a friend to Gandalf. Take note that the letter Gandalf sent them in the books detailing who would come to meet them in Bree if he could not is left out altogether. So, long story short, Aragorn has absolutely no proof that he ever even met Gandalf and the hobbits are left with only his ëcharismatic’ personality to go on. However, the hobbits still decide to trust him. The Jackson film also had this problem, but they justified it by making the situation tense enough that the hobbits just didn’t have a choice in the matter.

Later, the wraiths enter Bree and somehow teleport into the hobbits’ room. The beds appear to be occupied, so they begin stabbing the lumps under the sheets. Of course, the beds turn out to be empty and the wraiths tear the room apart before throwing off their robes (?!) and revealing their true forms, which should actually be invisible to the naked eye. The whole reason for the robes was to give them corporal form so that they could journey across the land to search for the Ring. They could not act otherwise.

Cut to the room Aragorn moved the hobbits to the thwart the wraiths’ attack. They are safe and sound while the wraiths think that the hobbits have taken to the woods again, and leave town to find them. For once, Bakshi actually stuck to the books in a way that was both understandable and it doable without explanation.

The following day, Aragorn and the foursome leave Bree and make their way to Rivendell. Cue another montage of travel and one confusing scene in which they are visibly see the wraiths chasing them, but nothing comes of this. At the end of the traveling sequence, the scene fades to Aragorn telling the hobbits the moving love story of Beren and Luthien, a couple that mirrors Aragorn and Arwen. Or would, had Arwen the elf maiden actually been featured in this version at all. While he tells them the story, Frodo and Sam snuggle up and get a little too friendly with each other. This is potentially the source of all the “Frodo and Sam are gay” theories. They are all dead wrong, of course, as Sam ends up with about fifteen children that he has with Rosie Cotton (another love interest not featured in this movie) and Frodo is mostly asexual in the books.

Fortunately, the moment is interrupted before anything too unnatural can happen* when the group is attacked by the wraiths. The ringwraiths approach looking transparent and brown for some reason. Frodo is tempted to put the Ring and does so. Of course, the wraiths find him quickly because he did so and he is soon stabbed in the shoulder. On an interesting note, the one who stabbed him grabs him as he falls and sets him down on the ground gently. So much for the ruthless ringwraiths.

Aragorn pounces at the wraiths all the while waving two flaming sticks in the air, scaring them off. Another thing not explained by Bakshi: the ringwraiths fear fire and those who wield it.

Anyone who has read the books will know that the blade was enchanted with dark magics that will turn Frodo into a wraith before long and that he must be rushed to Rivendell for treatment. Fortunately, Bakshi is uncharacteristically clear about this.

Soon after this attack, the group is met on the road by another horseback visitor. Unlike in the books, it is not Glorfindel. Jackson’s version has the same deviation, but they, at least, made it work. Here, Bakshi just simply displaces another one of Tolkien’s characters for the sake of saving time and not having to introduce anymore new characters than necessary.

The rider is this rendering is Legolas, who is reduced from being the Prince of the Mirkwood elves to being Elrond’s servant. His clothes look suspiciously identical to Luke Skywalker’s wardrobe from the majority of the first Star Wars film. Legolas also has a flat face with a big nose that sticks out, and big Bambi eyes. He’s also voiced by Anthony Daniels, who played C3-P0 in all the Star Wars films. Needless to say, this is the worse Legolas EVER!

Samwise is very enthusiastic about finally being able to see an elf up close. He grins widely, showing the audience the worse teeth since Steve Bescemi. Then giggles like a girl while hopping around excitedly like a child. The horrors never cease, do they, Bakshi?

After some talk about the wound inflicted on Frodo from the Morgol blade the group arrives at a riverbank. Here, they are attacked by the wraiths once again, and the background becomes live-action clouds colored purple, for some reason. Frodo is bid to go ahead on horseback and the infamous chase scene from the books begins. Not before Aragorn gets tripped up by the wraiths after he proclaims that he will try to slow them down, though. This is not the last moment of complete incompetence on this Aragorn’s part, I am afraid.

Frodo finally arrives at the border of Rivendell after a long and confusing chase scene in which his horse seems to die and be resurrected.  Yes, really. The wraiths bid him to go to back to Mordor with them, but Frodo pathetically resists, pulling out his sword and waving it around in the air like an old man might wave a cane at children playing on his lawn.

The wraiths, all nine of them now gathered at the riverbank, start to head towards Frodo when they’re overtaken by Elrond’s tidal wave that takes the form of horses. Frodo passes out.

End of Part Six.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 08, 2009, 03:17:59 PM
Part Seven: The Game Attempts-Part Four:

Cut to Frodo waking up in a bed in Rivendell. Gandalf is sitting by his bedside, as per the books and other adaptations, but here, it comes off as really creepy. It’s almost as if Gandalf were looming over Frodo as he has a nightmare. Finally, Frodo shoots straight up in bed, yelling, “No! Never!”

Much to the audience’s chagrin, instead of light-heartedly chiding Frodo on how thoroughly he botched his venture before moving onto other topics of discussion as in the original work, Gandalf begins lecturing him again. Oh, and what Bakshi-Gandalf lecture would be complete if he weren’t pacing back and forth around the room with his arms flapping like a bird trying to take off into the sky? He’s kind of like a child on espresso here. Frodo watches this with a pained expression. Evidently, he’s channeling the audience.

After being as condescending as possible once more, Gandalf tells Frodo about his encounter with Evil Santaman, then leans over and tells Frodo to rest. I won’t comment on this because it sticks with what’s written in the text this time, although in the flashback the Lord of the Eagles looks like a sparrow. Then, Frodo turns away from Gandalf and looks directly at the audience with tortured eyes, as if begging us to rescue him.

Fade to a short and pointless scene in which Frodo and Bilbo reunite. The scene is mostly based directly on what Tolkien wrote, but it takes Frodo’s temptation to hit his uncle to the extreme by actually having Frodo pull back his fist in preparation to do just that (!?). Also, Bilbo’s newly reemerged temptation of the Ring is portrayed so horribly that one cannot take it seriously. Unlike the moment in which Ian Holm’s Bilbo from Jackson’s trilogy turns downright feral for an instant, which scared millions in the audience everywhere, the effect is just not there.

Fade to the Council of Elrond and the dinner that was held the night before combined into one scene. Not necessarily a bad choice of deviation, but it is done so abruptly that any audience members out of loop will feel something is missing. Now, Tolkien knew how important it was to make sure his readers were up to date with the current events of Middle Earth, so the first part of the council was just putting together the pieces of the world view puzzle to properly establish what Sauron was up to. Of course, no film could ever deliver this, and it has thus been shortened in all other versions.

As stated, the main purpose of the council is to track Sauron’s recent movements via testimonies given by all invited to the council who came from all over Middle-Eart to figure him out, discuss what to do with the Ring, and then chose the people who will carry out the course of action they decide upon. Tolkien took thirty-two pages in what was essentially a whole chapter out of his work to do this. Jackson’s version is roughly six-ten minutes long, forgoes on the information sharing and focuses more on deciding what to do with the Ring and getting the group together. Bakshi’s is…three and a half minutes and forgoes on just about everything aside from picking the Fellowship members. There is no discussion. Elrond, the Half-Elf Lord of Rivendell calls all the shots without question with the exception of Boromir’s. Take notice that the Council is the only scene in which Boromir’s infatuation with the Ring will be prevalent for the longest time. This flaw for which the character is so famous does not reemerge until much, much later, whereas in the book, this was an on-going thing with Boromir.

Elrond tells the council what they will do with the Ring and he picks who will do it. He did chose the Fellowship members in the books, but it doesn’t change that the Ring’s fate was first discussed by the entire council, instead of one holding absolute control. Isn't that the kind of mentality what they were battling against?

It is understandable why such a long scene would be shortened and refined into a shorter scene, but The Council of Elrond is a mile stone and a crossroads which lays down the foundations of the rest of the plot for approximately 800 or so more pages. Any filmmaker would have to properly pace himself to do this right. Bakshi…does not. He rushes the scene and practically thrusts the Fellowship right into the mountain range where they were stopped by a storm at breakneck speed without even stopping to properly explain why they need to go Mount Doom to destroy the Ring. By rushing this scene, Bakshi created a disjointed mess that he failed to pick up.

By the way, the Ring can only be destroyed in the pits of doom from which it was made because that pit is the only one that boils hotly enough to destroy it. The pit is located in Mount Doom, which as at the exact geographical center of Sauron’s territory. Just in case there's anyone in the world reading this who doesn't know.

The scene in which Bilbo gives Frodo the mithril vest and String plays out, but is very short and ineffective, though textually true to the book.

The scene in which Elrond picks who will be the Fellowship is skipped over and done in narration which is spoken over the nine trying to make their way past the mountain range.

Now, about Elrond, Gimli, and Boromir: Elrond bears a striking resemblance to old timey actor John Carradine, father of the late David Carradine (Bill from “Kill Bill”), Keith Carradine (Lizzie Maguire’s dad and former "Young Rider". I weep for the state of his career.), and a few others, all of whom have film careers. One look at him and its likely no one will ever complain about Hugo Weaving getting miscast ever again.

As for Boromir, well… He’s a Viking in this adaptation. Not only that, but he appears to be wearing the very same helmet Sauron was in the opening narration. As people who have read the books will know, Boromir is from the line of the Stewarts of Gondor and also of the line of Numenoreans. They mind the kingdom while the kings are away. So Gondor’s Stewarts have been ruling for a very long time (for over 3,000 years, actually). Boromir is the elder son of the current Stewart, Denethur. Of course, this connection to Aragorn, Isildor’s Heir to Gondor’s throne, is never established. Another thing the audience will notice is that he is also without pants, and he's nobility! Hate to see the state of the common man's attire in Gondor...

Now, last and certainly least, Gimli, who has not even been introduced formally in the film as of yet. Although he is called a dwarf, he is actually a merely a normal sized human who is a little on the short side, wears plain clothing as opposed to the original’s battle armor, and his beard hangs unkempt from his face. Nope, not braided and well-taken care of the way the pride of joy of a dwarf’s appearance would be in Tolkien’s books.

Back to the film, after the failed attempted to cross over the mountains, the Fellowship stops to discuss what they should do next. Gandalf and Aragorn are viciously arguing about which direction that they should take. Aragorn wants to go to the Gap of Rohan and Gandalf wants to go to Moria.

Throughout the fight, they do not treat each other very friendly, although Aragorn and Gandalf had a great respect for each other in the book. Also the disagreements between the two were kept at mere respectful suggestions on each other’s part. Here in Bakshi’s film, the whole Fellowship just acts abrasively towards each other.

In the end, Frodo ends up having to decide, although he votes knowing nothing about either way, unlike in the books when the pros and cons of each direction were calmly laid out by all parties involved. For those haven’t read the books or are without recent memory, here they are: The Gap of Rohan was thought to be safer road, overall, by Aragorn, because it doesn’t take venturing parties through goblin and Balrog infested caves. What’s a Balrog? They are ancient demons of smoke and flame that are essentially of equal power and rank as Sauron, the main villain of the story. That’s all.

However, the Gap of Rohan would take them dangerously close to Isengard, where Evil Santaman lives. This is where the Mines of Moria come in. They are far from Saruman’s sights, but they take venturing parties through goblin and Balrog infested caves. It’s very much a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation. This is also why they were trying to pass over the mountains which housed the Mines of Moria so they wouldn't have to take either of those roads. However, they were stopped by the blizzard which was actually powered by the malevalent spirit of the mountain, itself. Of course, none of this information is coherently explained at all by this film.

Anyway, Frodo votes on Moria and the course is set. Yes, Frodo is flying blind, entirely dependent of Gandalf’s wisdom, and he doesn’t bother to ask what they’re in for like in the books.
By the way, they didn't actually know that it was a Balrgo, specifically, in Moria, but they know something dark slept in the depths of Moria before entering. Aragorn was able to confirm this as he'd actually been there once before, and hence why he didn't want to go back. The orcs helped with that decision, but he still saw something else other than them down there on his first visit that gave him the creeps.

Cut to the entrance to Moria. The group is sitting around the entrance, and Gandalf is starting in front of the sealed door trying to open it. Here Legolas and Gimli momentarily bicker about the door’s purpose and actually manage to give the audience a little background on it. Only one problem, Legolas complains about how silly the door is, although it was made by elves. Yes, Bakshi did not even bother to keep up the research concerning the current scene. Oh well, at least the audience is actually clued in on the basics this scene around.

Frodo comments on how the lake frightens him. Actually, in the books, it was just a feeling of unease, which was shared by the rest of the fellowship. Boromir stupidly throws a rock at the lake in the original version of the scene, which is likely the cause of a later effect. Here, no one throws anything at the water.
Meanwhile on Gandalf’s end he is busily repeating the same word over and over again, trying to open the door. Boromir, channeling the audience, thinks that the wizard is useless. Cue Gandalf figuring out that the word is ëmellon’, the elvish word for ëfriend’. The doors open and the group starts to enter. Oh Bakshi, you card!

The film does not mention this (man, that is starting to become a real reoccurring problem here), but above the door is a riddle written in elvish, “Speak 'Friend', and enter.” This throws anybody trying to come through this entrance after it’s been sealed off if they don’t know the password, or just don’t know elvish to even read the riddle. Also, the riddle is engraved with a special material that only reflects moonlight, so you must arrive in the darkness and on a clear night. Lastly, the riddle is obviously a play on words for those who have been reading this, read the books, or seen the Jackson films.

Anyone who have seen the Jackson films and/or read the books, know what’s coming. The Cthulhu or Kraken-esque Watcher in the water grabs Frodo by the foot and lifts him into the air. Frodo screams for Gandalf’s help, and everyone who isn’t a wizard rushes to help Frodo via graphically (too graphically for the mere PG rating this film got) slicing off the creature’s tentacles.

Take notice that Aragorn’s sword is no longer broken. The film does not explain this, but in the books when it was decided that Aragorn would accompany as a member of the fellowship, that his heirloom sword would be reforged so he would have it when he went to the capital city of Gondor, Minas Tirath, to reclaim his throne. Yes, once again, any real detail of Aragorn’s backstory, which is not at all important to the main plot, is left out entirely.

Anyway, the group rescues Frodo from the thing’s clutches and they run into the Mine entrance. The Watcher then closes the doors behind them. It also did this in the books, but Tolkien’s description actually succeeded in making that action sound menacing and malicious. When it’s shown, it just looks like the Watcher is a grumpy doorman who was going through Frodo's pockets for some I.D. Not only that, but somehow the tentacles reach in as if from around the corner on both sides like there were two watchers doing this. Yes, logic be damned!

The Jackson films also had an answer for door-closing problem: the Watcher instead tries to bring down the whole cave on top of the offending intruders by tearing the hell out of the roof above the Fellowship’s heads as they ran into the mines, thus trapping them inside behind a pile of rubble.

Back to the film, the Fellowship is now inside of Moria, the crowning achieve of dwarven architecture, the pentacle of their skill, and the remains of the ultimate dwarven kingdom’s palace. So, how did Bakshi deliver this? Simple, Moria in this film doesn’t look like a palace at all. Instead, it looks like the lair of Dracula or something, because they are frightening stone gargoyles and hideous faces carved into the walls. This place was supposed to showcase the dwarf’s abilities are builders and it was supposed to be beautiful. The film also neglects to the mention that one Bilbo’s companions and a father figure to Gimli, Balin, had entered the mines with a band of dwarves many years before to try to reclaim them. However, the outside world had lost contact with them after a certain point. This is of particular note, considering that Balin is one of the more favored characters from The Hobbit. This also really strange considering this is one time they could have made some passing mention of this character without much information behind him, since the animated adaptation of The Hobbit was released in 1977, just the year before.

Gandalf, as in the books, is using his staff of a light to show them the way. Cue yet another montage of them traveling. Eventually, they stop to sleep for what they guess is the night.

Frodo awakens to find two glowing eyes watching him in the dark. It is, of course, Gollum. This begs the question: how did he find them? Well, in the books, he was already in the mountains on his mad quest to recover the Ring and overheard the struggle. He lucked out, big time.

In the next scene the fellowship comes to the guardroom, where they decide to spent the night (again). The only thing of note in this scene is that Pippin drops a rock down a well in the middle of the room, and Gandalf gives him a stern talking to about this. The dialogue is identical to the book’s but Gandalf just comes off as insane as he waves his arms around in the air like he swatting flies. He stops when they hear a quiet tapping coming from the bottom of the well. The film never explains this, but that’s a Moria orc alerting its companions that they have “visitors”.

After some more scenes of the Fellowship journeying through Moria, they finally come to the Tomb of Balin, although the Tomb is left out altogether. Instead, they only find the Journal of Balin, which chronicled the dwarfs’ venture to retake the mountain. Of course, they were eventually overtaken by the orcs and were all slaughtered. In the books, there is a renewed urgency to exit the caves that comes of this, but here, it carries on the same monotonous pace that the film has been stuck in ever since the group entered Moria.

Then suddenly, what should happen but a huge horde of terrifying orcs come charging into the room where the Fellowship is! Actually, there only about six or seven of them to the Fellowship’s nine. They are also live-action actors in really bad costumes. Basically, they wear the same kind of helmet that Boromir does, dress in raggedy clothes, and have poorly inserted red eyes and green, glowing teeth (?!).

For reasons that further make the scene beyond suspension of belief, the group acts as if they are mortal danger, despite not even being outnumbered. In the books they were actually were attacked by a huge horde of terrifying and quick footed orcs. The fight carries out with the fellowship actually having trouble dealing with the orcs. It only gets worse from there on to the end of the scene. In a sequence which Bakshi must was taken directly from a football movie, a lone and slow-moving orc runs at Frodo, overpowers Aragorn and Boromir, and then throws a spear at Frodo. However, Frodo’s wearing the already established mithril vest, and survives, as per the book. However, in the book, the orc was actually an orc captain who swiftly dodged Aragorn and Boromir’s first attacks before specifically throwing the spear at Frodo before being dispatched.

The group dispatches the orc and makes a break for it. Suddenly, they are pursued by ten orcs now, although it’s obvious that it’s the same three-five actors which imposed into the scene two or three times over. In the books, they were pursued by a sizable mob which would overpower and utterly destroy them if they tried to fight them. Also, the audience is not let in on where the Fellowship is specifically escaping to, other than the exit. In the books, it’s quite plainly explained that they are running to a narrow bridge which is just before the exit on the other side.

Also take note of one orc that looks exactly like cousin It from The Adams Family in some upcoming close-ups and a wide shot of the orcs.

Suddenly, there’s a loud roaring sound. At first, savvy audience members will wonder if the Fellowship is being attacked by a troll now, because the orcs and trolls are the only creatures native to Moria which have the ability to vocalize. However, this is unfortunately not the case. The loud creature they are hearing is the Balrog, the before mentioned fire demon of equal power to Sauron. The thing that was also a part of the reason the dwarves were wiped out. It had been sleeping under the mountain for a very long time, when the dwarves’ mining woke it up. Sounds very intimidating, doesn’t it?One would think that even Bakshi couldn’t botch such a sure thing. …Then it appears.

In the books, the Balrog is described as a great cloud of smoke and fire with the form of a man which could not be clearly seen in the middle of it, other than its fiery eyes. This left a lot left to the imagination and the creature was all the more frightening to the reader that way. That, and it carried a flaming sword and a flaming whip in its hands. It also did not make any sound. It also moved with frightening speed which inspired the Fellowship to run for all their worth away from it.

The menace of the Balrog is its mystery. It goes something like this. Let’s say, that there is a frightening urban tale about a man named Bob in your neighborhood known for his evil deeds, but no one knows what he looks like and no one wants to go visit him. But they say he lives in an abandoned house where nasty things tend to happen Unfortunately, in order to achieve your goal, you have to pass through his property. The menace of the Balrog is a lot like that, only magnified several times over. It is that fear of the unknown that gets to the reader and it’s a stroke of genius on Tolkien’s part that he utilized it the way he did.

In Bakshi’s film, however…well, it has big red and black wings like a Monarche Butterfly, the head of a papier-m‚chÈ lion, feet that look like black fluffy bedtime slippers, it growls and carries on like an orc in heat, and moves extremely slowly. Also, the Balrog in Tolkien’s original book could not fly. Here, it can, which makes an event which is about to come to pass very confusing. Also, the orcs disappear into thin air somewhere between the frames when the Balrog somehow scared them off.

The Fellowship runs the rest of the way to the bridge with the Balrog trailing about a mile behind them. The books, they couldn’t seem to get across the bridge quickly enough, as Gandalf has to stop and turn to face the Balrog just to stop it from following them right across. Here, Gandalf has to stop and wait for the blasted thing to catch up to them! The other heroes try to get Gandalf to come with them, or at least help him, despite the lack of haste or intensity in this situation. Gandalf bids them to go on with him, because they cannot aid him against this foe. In the books, Gandalf taking the stand against the evil demonic monster was a heart-warming, suspenseful, frightening, and gripping moment all at once. It worked because the Balrog had been hyped up enough and well-enough that the reader actually feared for Gandalf the Wizard’s life. Here, thanks to the poor rendering of the Balrog, the poor acting of Gandalf’s voice actor, and the bad pacing of the scene all around, the emotions that should have swept over the viewer had the experience been anything like the book are just not there.

Back to the film, the Fellowship clears out, having been moved by Gandalf’s words (somehow), leaving the wizard to have his infamous stand-off with the Balrog. He utters his famous “You shall not pass” line, which sounded great coming from Ian McKellan, but not so much from this guy. Then he and the Balrog actually duke it out on the narrow bridge for a bit and Gandalf’s sword is actually destroyed, which did not happen in the books and the sword still reemerges later in the film. This was probably done to demonstrate how powerful the Balrog was, but it doesn’t really work, considering that Gandalf can apparently just repair the damn sword! Finally, Gandalf uses his magic to break the bridge and send the Balrog plummeting down into the pit below. As the Balrog falls down a space big enough for it spread its wings and fly, it instead snares Gandalf by his feet and pulls him down with it. The Fellowship rush to the edge of the pit, but Gandalf orders them to retreat.

In the books, there was no swordplay between Gandalf and the Balrog. Gandalf knew he could not fight the Balrog under such conditions, and instead lured it out onto the bridge before breaking it, sending the wingless and flightless creature down into the depths below. Yes, Gandalf’s brilliant strategy is downplayed to a last minute act of desperation in Bakshi’s film. The Balrog did snare Gandalf by the leg with its whip in the book, though.
The Jackson films also gave their Balrog wings, but they made up for it before having the fall space be narrow enough that the thing really couldn't get them spread before picking up too much momentum to use them.

About Gandalf’s death: in the original work, this was a sudden death of a character who was already beloved by readers everywhere because of his presence in The Hobbit early in Fellowship. Usually, character deaths up to the time of The Lord of the Rings’s release were treated the same as Shakespeare’s character deaths, which were usually accompanied by long goodbyes and the soon-to-be diseased making his final peace with the world. Here, the loss of Gandalf was sudden and ruthless. He was there, and then he was gone. Just like that. Kind of like what could happen to fellow soldier on the battlefield. This moment of brilliant piece of storytelling was done via Tolkien channeling his old emotions from losing friends on the battlefield. The end there does not come with flowery goodbyes, but at the violent, terrible and sudden end of a person you had forged a bond with.

In the Bakshi film, the audience can only look on with apathy, as no bond between viewer and Gandalf was forged. An unfortunate thing to happen, but it was mostly Bakshi’s fault, as the film was just too short. In fact, the film had gone on for precisely one hour and five minutes by this point. In this time, none of Gandalf’s personality was allowed to shine through while he was delivering the bulk of the important dialogue. Three books. Three films, Bakshi.

End of Part Seven.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 08, 2009, 03:36:44 PM
Part Eight: The Game Attempts-Part Five:

Aragorn now takes up the charge of leadership and orders the group out of the mines. From there, they head to Lothlorien. The journey there starts of fine, but then the group begins complaining and arguing again. Eventually, the decide to get moving again, and then the scene cuts right to Lord Celeborn and Lady Galadriel skipping over the whole sequence when the Fellowship was captured by Haldir (that elf who gets the drop of them in the Jackson films right when Gimli is bragging about how finely tuned his senses are, for those unfamiliar with the original book), then led along blind-folded to the home of the Lothlorien elves. In Bakshi’s film, it’s like they just walked right in without need for invitation. Immediately when the characters open their mouths, there’s yet another problem. Bakshi and company screwed up the pronunciation of Celeborn’s name. It is Kell-e-born. Here, its pronounced “Sell-a-born”. There is no excuse for this! The pronunciation of his name is the very first note of Appendix E! Yes, how to pronounce every name and the information of each and every character is right there in the manual found at the end of Return of the King, the manual that Bakshi should have been using making this film.

Moving on, Galadriel already knows of Gandalf’s demise at the Balrog’s hands and mourns his death. Savvy audience members, however, mourn for the loss of his character development. Also in this scene, the audience is assaulted by more drug-trip inspired graphics, as Lothlorien’s architecture is decorated with fairy-lighting and is made up of oil-paintings that look like they were done by school children.

Following this scene, after the Fellowship has been invited to stay a while, the elves begin to sing their Lamentation of Gandalf, which actually sounds like a light-hearted song sung by smurfs. Evidently, Gandalf’s passing did not warrant a truly sad tune in the Bakshiverse. This song plays over the Fellowship members enjoying themselves in Lothlorien.  :unsure:  For example, Aragorn and Boromir practice their sword-fighting, Legolas showing Gimli how to fire an arrow (“Heh, heh, sucker! When I master this art, you better start runnin’ ya pancy elf!”).

The audience is also presented a scene of Samwise picking a bunch of flowers. He starts picking off the rose peddles of one of them in a “She loves me, she loves me not” fashion. More disturbingly, since Rosy Cotton was been excluded entirely, that Samwise is a horrible abomination in this film, and the tender moment between Frodo and Sam earlier, one can only assume he’s doing this over Frodo’s feelings. Then he suddenly throws the flowers he picked up into the air for absolutely no reason. I could only shake my head at this.

Then bringing up the rear in this horrible montage is an utterly absurd shot of Boromir sharpening his sword on a rock. They’re called whetstones, but one can assume they haven’t heard of those in Gondor yet. By contrast, behind the scenes of Jackson’s trilogy, Viggo Mortensen (Aragorn) actually requested a whetstone and various other tools to make Aragorn’s appearance of a nature-hardened ranger more convincing.

Fading away from the nauseatingly bad smurf music and absurd lapses in sword caretaking research, the film shifts to the famous Mirror of Galadriel scene, in which Frodo and Sam see “things that were, things that are, and some things that have not yet come to pass”. Only, one problem (and I am fully aware of how often I have said that), Bakshi apparently thought that the elves were hippies, because the mirror looks like it’s full of dye, like the elves were going to make tie-dye T-Shirts later. This is followed by another discrepancy. What is shown in the mirror is supposed to be as clear as day as distinctly described in the books, but the mirror’s surface stays exactly the same throughout the scene, and the hobbits describe what they see, instead of it just being shown to the viewer, like the books and Jackson’s later adaptation did.

Then Frodo looks into the mirror once again, and sees a kaleidoscope effect in it. He reaches for it, but Galadriel yells at him not to and then states that the effect is the Eye of Sauron (What?!!). So, Bakshi could afford to create a kaleidoscope effect, but not to draw a cat’s eye and then paste it into the scene? Or alternatively, he could have just snapped a picture of an actual cat’s eye, and then inserted that, and it would still look better if only for actually being an eye of any sort.

She then announces that Sauron is looking for Frodo and that the Ringwraiths had to return to Mordor after being washed away by Elrond’s defensive spell, but will return. In the books, Frodo already knew all of this as this piece of dialogue was presented much, much earlier. So they couldn’t just have Gandalf mention this when he was by Frodo’s bedside, which would be much more akin to the books. Instead they wait about a hour after the wraiths are gone to bring it up? Oh, the fact that anyone defends this film makes my head hurt.

Back to the film, Galalriel then holds up her hand and shows Frodo and Sam Nenya, the Ring of Adamant, and just like every other show of magic in this film, it is an overdone effect. The Ring actually begins shooting streams of rainbow colors that brings the Care Bear’s “Care Bear stare” to one’s mind. In the books, the Ring glows once. Then she continues to tell Frodo the obvious, that Sauron will use the Ring to destroy Lothlorien (yeah, I think Frodo caught the gist of that when he was first told that Sauron would “destroy and reform all of Middle Earth to suit his purposes”). So, Frodo offers her the Ring  :blink:  . Yeah, he did this in the book, too, but it was for more well-explained reasons.

Then Galadriel, instead of laughing pleasantly as per the books, laughs patronizingly, telling about how terrible she, a figure of power, would be with the Ring’s power. She does so while spinning around like a performer in Swan Lake, before announcing that she passed the test. What test? Bakshi doesn’t say, but the test was whether or not she could resist the Ring’s effects.

Fade to a short scene of the Fellowship out on three boats before the film quickly cuts to them on the river bank, arguing (again), and this time about whether they will go Gondor or straight to Mordor. Nothing of too much note happens here, other than that the filmmakers skipped a ton.

In the books, Galadriel gave the Fellowship each a gift before leaving. Some of them were vital to the plot, later on. Jackson’s trilogy also largely skipped over this, but Frodo at least still received the Veil of Galadriel, which will be used later. Also, Jackson’s trilogy reinserted most of the gifts in the Extended Editions. Then there’s the fact that the boat ride was actually quit lengthy and took them within Gondor’s boundaries after the group passed between Argonath (those two huge statues).

The group asks Frodo what he wants to do, and he answers that he wants an hour to think it over. For a second time, Bakshi sticks with the books in a clear way that actually works, because the audience has been let in on just enough to know that the Fellowship is, in fact, at a crossroads here.
Samwise also gets a rare moment of actually sounding like Samwise when he proclaims that he’s going wherever Frodo is. Don’t let that fool you, the film is actually about to get worse.

So, Frodo goes to think it over, and just about everyone knows what’s coming. Boromir shows up, although by this time the audience will probably have forgotten that he even had an infatuation with the Ring to begin with, as any build up or development to this moment has been nonexistent, whereas people reading the original books or viewing Jackson’s trilogy could practically see the time bomb that is Boromir slowly ticking down to this moment. He suggests to Frodo that they take the Ring to Minas Tirith, so that he could use it to defend his people. He begins ranting about the great things he could do with it.

Frodo reminds him that the Ring will corrupt him and tells him that Gandalf and Elrond have refused to even touch the thing. Boromir scoffs this off and demands the Ring, and then essentially attacks Frodo to get it when the hobbit refuses again.

Frodo slips on the Ring and makes his escape. Boromir yells more curses, but then trips. This brings him out of his frenzy and he begs Frodo to come back.

This scene almost worked, but as stated, any build up or development towards this was forsaken and the whole thing just seems abrupt and out-of-place to viewers not familiar with Tolkien’s story. Another problem was the pacing. It doesn’t even build anything up while here, either. Not the climax of Boromir’s madness and Frodo’s escape, or even on the action taking place. The scene just kind of is. That is a really bad thing, because like the Council of Elrond, this is the scene that sets off a chain of events that dictates the rest of the story and takes it in a whole new direction that the reader honestly didn’t completely see coming. This was supposed to be a very powerful moment, but instead of triumphant, like when the Fellowship got together, it was intended to invoke an entirely different set of emotions. Emotions like apprehension, fear, intensity, and perhaps a little despair in the knowledge that the side of good has just taken a hit. The reader was sucked right in by this in the book and couldn’t wait to see what happens next to remedy this situation. What they don’t know is things are actually about to get much, much worse. None of this is conveyed in this film.

After Frodo disappears and does not come back, Boromir returns to the others and tells them what happened, though he leaves the part out where he tried outright to take the Ring from Frodo. Merry and Pippin run off, looking for Frodo, immediately. Aragorn orders Legolas and Gimli to start searching, too, and then he grabs Boromir, pulls the other man to his feet and demands he helps too, before running off with Samwise following him.

Samwise, however, is unable to keep up and bemoans that he’ll never find Frodo in time just using his legs. He declares that he’ll have to use his head, instead.   :rolleyes: Up to this point, Samwise had been portrayed as an complete idiot, so audience suspension of belief that he could think of such a thing is just not there. Had Bakshi just portrayed Samwise as he was in the books, this would not have been a problem. So Samwise runs back to the shore and he finds a boat heading into the water without anyone inside of it. Then Samwise goes the unimaginable. He jumps into the water and swims to the boat. Anyone familiar with Tolkien’s works or seen Jackson's trilogy will know [B[Sam can’t swim[/B] and is actually terrified to get into boats. This was supposed to show that he was even willing to get himself drowned to go after Frodo. Frodo and Sam have their well-known exchange about whether Frodo is going on alone, Sam wins the argument, and the two take off for Mordor, together. In this film, that sounds almost suggestive. Also, we see Gollum following them on the river before the scene ends.

Back with Merry and Pippin. Oh dear, Merry and Pippin. You would actually have to see the film to believe this one. The duo is currently tearing through the woods supposedly looking for Frodo loudly calling his name. Then, this is where one reviewer justified calling them the ëIdiot Cousins’ in this version. They run right into a camp of orcs in a clearing, who were in plain view, by the way. Yes, Merry and Pippin were searching for Frodo, running madly through the flora and without looking ahead of them. Had this been like in the original book where the orcs sought them out and attacked them, this would have worked. Also, these are not supposed to be orcs. These are Uruk-Hai, half-goblin-half-human hybrids that Sarumon bred up through magic so that they could cover great distance quickly and could in sun light, whereas the typical orc would be sensitive to its rays. Yet, here are the exact same bad orc costumes that were in Moria.

This is where the film also starts to fall apart. There is no animation in this scene at all. The entire cast featured in this shot are live-action actors with outlines, and they are red tinted.

The orcs are about to kill the two, despite that in the books, Saruman wanted the hobbits alive so that he could extract any information he can from them, or perhaps take the Ring from them. Of course, none of this is known, because the audience is never let in on the fact that this particular lot of minions work for this film’s Santaman.

Boromir shows up and easily outdoes the orcs with a grace that was not present in Moria for some reason, then heads off with the two in tow. Before they can get far they run right up to a group of orcs armed with arrows whom, of course, shoot Boromir. Yes, although the audience just now saw the orcs, the trio here must have seen them from a quite a distance away as they had been running right at them for some time.

Boromir pulls the arrows out and charges the orcs, only to get shot again. Merry and Pippin are taken away by the orcs, and Boromir finally realizes he needs help and pulls out the Horn of Gondor, which has not been featured at all yet. In the books, he makes the group aware of its presence before they even set out from Rivendell. Here in this film, although the thing has been hanging from his belt the entire film, nothing has ever drawn the viewer’s attention to it. And when he blows it…apparently there were no stock horn-blowing sounds left over the huge amounts of medieval epics from the old days of cinema for Bakshi to use, because…he used the sound of either a kazoo or a party favor for the horn.

Oddly, the orcs allow him to blow into it a few more times before shooting him again and then taking off. Soon enough, Aragorn finds the dying Boromir who confesses that he tried to take the Ring from Frodo. He then begs Aragorn to save Minas Tirith, and tells him that Merry and Pippin were taken prisoner before dying.

Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli put Boromir’s remains in a boat and send him down the river, where he eventually drifts back towards Minas Tirith. From here they decide to follow the orcs and become the Three Hunters. From here the books enters the territory of the second volume of Tolkien’s work, The Lord of the Ring: The Two Towers, having just wrapped up the parts that cover The Fellowship of the Ring. Oh, and the film is an hour and a half over. The film is two hours and fifteen minutes long. Forty-five minutes left. Sadly, Bakshi decided to try to tell most The Two Towers in the remaining time, which means that crucial middle chapter of the book will be bare bones.

End of Part Five.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 08, 2009, 04:10:42 PM
Very Very good so far.. :) keep it up..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 12, 2009, 05:10:12 PM
Part Nine: The Game Attempts-Part Six:

Picking where we left off with Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli chasing after the Uruk-Kai, watch the sequences in which the three are literally jogging after the orcs. Aragorn actually trips over his own sword while still fully animated. Yes, the live-action actor who was rotoscoped over later did this, then an animator saw fit to copy this action frame by frame, and Bakshi, then actually put it in the finished film. The film only gets worse and more headache-inducing from here.

For example, back with Merry and Pippin: the audience finally finds out that the orcs are heading to Isengard, and for some reason are arguing unintelligibly with each other before they take off again. Then the scene cuts the trio finding orcs’ footprints and following them. Back with the orcs, they are being attacked by the Riders of Rohan, though the viewer does not know that yet, or that they have even reached the Gap of Rohan. Or even what the Gap of Rohan even is which I touched on before about Aragorn’s lack of description for it. It is a kingdom of opens plains and horseback warriors that neighbors Sarumon’s lair Isengard, by the way.

Then shortly later this is how the battle between the orcs and the Riders of Rohan proceeds. The two sides stand in two long lines facing one another. This goes on for about a five minutes before one rider suddenly kills an orc with an arrow while the remainder of the orcs continue to just stand there and even seem to be cheering the rider. This leaves one to guess that the orc he killed was the group Gomer (“Well, golly!”), or something of the sort. Then something even more strange happens, about three orcs try to kill the rider in return, but an orc captain stops them (?!). This goes on for quite a while before Bakshi decided he didn’t know what else to do with the scene shifts over to the three hunters again briefly.

Suddenly, Merry and Pippin are escaping during an indefinite pause in the battle despite not being given an obvious opportunity to do so while the orcs and Rohirrim continue their ultimate game of a staring contest. The orcs manage to kill one rider who got too close and this drives the rest of the riders into frenzy and they slaughter the orcs.

This is what actually happened in the books. Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli pursued the orcs, running at full speed to do so for several days and without tripping before entering the Gap of Rohan. The Isengard Uruk-Hai were taking Merry and Pippin to Isengard because they thought that they had an elvish weapon, which Sarumon wanted to get his hands on. They meet with some Moria orcs who wanted to make the hobbits pay for what happened in the Mines, but the leader of Uruk-Hai forbade it and the group continued onto Isengard. This was the reason fo rthe argument earlier.
Then orcs and Uruk-Hai were swiftly ambushed by the Riders of Rohan in the dead of night. Merry and Pippin took this opportunity to escape after being dragged away from the group after “bribing” one of the Moria orcs with a promise that he will get the Ring. Then the orc was dispatched by a rider in the chaos and the two escaped into a nearby forest, which is called Fangorn Forest and it lies within the territories of both Rohan and Isengard.

Back to the film, now Merry and Pippin are wandering through Fangorn, without a clue where they are. They comment on how beautiful the forest is, and Treebeard agrees with them. Who’s Treebeard? Oh, just the next character introduced in the saga who literally sneaks right up on the two hobbits and into the scene. He picks them up in his arms. Now, for those unfamiliar with Tolkien’s mythos altogether, Treebeard is an Ent, which is a living, walking, talking tree, and a shepherd of the forest. Literally, he is a shepherd of the forest. They tend to the other trees that have been brought to life, but retain their entirely tree forms. The hobbits have a discussion with their new friend and he carries them right out the movie. Merry, Pippin, and newly introduced Treebeard are not seen again in the film. Also take notice, that Treebeard was actually a tree in the original work. In this film, he looks like a giant, brown carrot with broccoli-like green top. He looks nothing like a tree. It’s difficult to imagine that Bakshi somehow botched this unintentionally.

In Volume Two of the saga, The Two Towers, Treebeard actually played a fairly big role in story, because by speaking to Merry and Pippin, he learns all that Sauron and Sarumon have been up to up to date and is then driven to rally all the remaining Ents to storm Isengard, where they defeat Sarumon while the Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli aid the Rohirrim are defeating the forces that the former white wizard sent out to wipe out Rohan. Essentially, the Ents end up flooding Isengard by breaking a dam that Sarumon had constructed and that floods the entire area, further trapping the wizard inside, and the Ents stand guard over the tower for a long time, preventing his escape. Also, not explained in the film, Sarumon had been using trees from Fangorn to fuel the fires of the machines that produced the orc-man-hybrids Urak-Hai.

Meanwhile, back with Frodo and Sam, they are currently climbing down the rope that Samwise attained from Lothlorien in the books, but was left out altogether here. Frodo even takes a moment to explain away the rope as a hand wave. Even more strange, is that two are seen using the rope later, but are not seen retrieving it or it even retrieving itself as it did in the book.

The two journey on for a while longer before Samwise realizes that someone is following them. Frodo confirms that it is Gollum and the two decide to ambush him, or, would have, if Sam didn’t rush off ahead of Frodo and try to tackle Gollum himself. In the books, Samwise was intelligent enough to stick with the plan.

Here the audience finally gets their first good look at Gollum, and he still looks like the Grinch. Samwise tackles him to the ground and the two wrestle with each other until Frodo puts Sting to Gollum’s throat, threatening to cut his grinchy throat if he doesn’t stop. Gollum complies just long for Frodo to put Sting away before making a run for it. Samwise tackles the retreating Grinch again and they wrestle in ways that are more than a little disturbing before Frodo helps Sam just tie him up with the rope that they used to descend the steep cliff earlier, but did not retrieve yet is somehow still with them. Gollum then goes into convulsions about how the rope burns him, although unlike as it was in the books, it is not established how elven made rope could burn a creature so exposed to darkness. Frodo agrees to let him go if he will guide them into Mordor. Gollum agrees, they release him, and then the three take off with Gollum leading the way. More or less true to what happened in the original, but again, without nearly enough information to understand everything that just happened.

Meanwhile, Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli are shown following the trek of Merry and Pippin, when suddenly…they see a man with a bedsheet draped over his head. He looks kind of like a member of the KKK who forgot to wash his hood. Unfortunate Implications abound! The three think its Evil Santamon and attack him when he leaps onto a rock in front of them after disappearing for an instant, and he causes their weapons to catch fire and they promptly drop them. In the books, the figure just dodged their attacked and causes Aragorn’s sword to heat up just enough that he dropped it, instead of rendering the weapons useless via destroying them. Yet somehow, the weapons come out of this alright. See, he does have the ability to repair weapons at will!

Then, with dramatic flair, the figure pulls his cloak off and…it gets wrapped around his head before he finally manages to tear the thing off. What was intended to be a dramatic and powerful moment now looks like something that would appear in a Mel Brooks film in which drama in built up then deliberated killed with physical comedy. Why was this not corrected during the animation stage, and why did Bakshi keep this in the finished film, just like when Aragorn tripped over his own sword? Did he only have enough film for one take per scene left?

After a happy reunion between the former Fellowship members, Gandalf explains what happened to him and the flashback is down via showing a painting of Gandalf battling the Balrog. Neither Gandalf nor the Balrog look anything like they do in this film. Bakshi just took any image of the scene he could get his hands on. Sadly, the painting shown is a vast improvement over anything seen in this film as of yet.

Then, without any explanation, Gandalf orders the group to Edoras, the Capital City of Rohan. Gandalf tells them that the old king of Rohan, Theoden, is now entirely dependent on his advisor, Grima Wormtongue. In the book, and I am fully aware of just how many times I have said that by now, this was foreshadowed as far back as the Council of Elrond when Gandalf tells how he had trouble getting aid from the Rohirrim and ended up having to take what they thought was a untrainable horse, but was revealed to Shadowfax, Lord of All Horses. Rohan’s allegiance was even put into question during that scene.

Cue a short scene of Evil Santaman giving his Uruk-Hai army a morale boosting speech and gives them their orders. Grima Wormtongue is visibly by this side, which was never the case in the books. Evidently, Bakshi didn’t think that the audience could figure out that Grima was secretly working with Evil Santamon on their own. Then again, given his likely souring experience with the people who made him change Sarumon to Arumon, this may actually be somewhat justified.

Back with Gandalf and company, they are all riding horses that came out of nowhere. In the books, Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli had a near confrontation with Theoden’s nephew, Eomer, while he was out on patrol. In an act of faith in face of growing danger and suspicion, he gave the two horses has who lost their riders and bid them look for their friends. He was also the man in charge of ambushing the Uruk-Hai that were taking Merry and Pippin to Isengard, so he was also able to tell Aragorn the way to the sight of the battle, which is how the trio even ended up back on the trail of the hobbits so quickly. Not that this film lets the audience in on any of this like the books did. Also, after fulfilling these tasks, Eomer is arrested and imprisoned. In this version, Eomer is simply banished, but continues to aid Rohan in a fashion similar to Robin Hood by ambushing any orcs armies that pass through. This is established in some dialogue Gandalf gives out. Also in the books, Eomer is quickly released from his bondage and joins Theoden from the point when Grima Wormtongue is expelled from Rohan on.

Anyway, the whole point of freeing Theoden from Grima’s grip in the books is that the fight against Sauron needed more allies to join Gondor and the other kingdoms that oppose him aside from it being the right thing to do, and now that Gandalf was figured out what is happening in Rohan, he will remedy the situation. Well, the book’s explanation, anyway. Here, it just looks like Gandalf is simply trying to save Rohan from Evil Santamon without any mention of the game of chess Gandalf is playing with Sauron. As explained in the Appendix at the end of The Return of the King, Gandalf even went as far as mobilizing Bilbo and the dwarves 67 years earlier to retake the Lonely Mountain so there would be a powerful Strongehold in that region when Sauron began his invasion once again. Yes, the events of The Hobbit were all a part of Gandalf’s gambit. Of course, he only exacts these gambits if it helps the individuals aside from the grander scheme as well. The people of Lake Town, which was near to the Lonely Mountain, were freed of the fear of Smaug the dragon, Bilbo and the dwarves grew as individuals, and everyone ended up better for it, so Gandalf’s moves are not only just to get the job done at any cost. Not that any of this comes through in Bakshi’s vision.

Anyway, the group now enters Edoras and barge into Theoden’s throne room where Theoden is. No Captain Hama at the front entrance or anything that would make sense like that. No, no. Gandalf frees Theoden of Grima’s grip and the little Jawa is chased away. Yes, Grima looks like one of the Jawas from the original Star Wars. Too bad he couldn’t also be dealt with by Stormtroopers.

Also of note, Eowyn, Theoden’s niece and younger sister of Eomer, is not given any lines despite her prominent presence in the books as the one who kept the women and children safe from the invading Uruk-Hai whenthe 10 thousand Sarumon sent out were unleashed. She also defeats the leader of the Nazgul after saving her uncle from becoming a Fell Beast’s dinner. Oh well, at least the latter was restored in Rankin-Bass’s The Return of the King.

Theoden immediately agrees with Gandalf and the Riders head out right away to Helm’s Deep, a fortress where they will be able to fend off the invading Uruk-Hai. Gandalf takes his leave to go find Eomer, leaving the three hunters and Theoden to their own devices. In the books, Gandalf was riding off to find the lords in other areas of Rohan to get them to render aid because Eomor was already with them. The Jackson films also had this unfortunate deviation, but more on that at a later time.

Meanwhile, back with Frodo, Sam, and Gollum the Grinch, this trio are currently heading through what is supposed to pass for the swamps of the dead, which was a secret path that only Gollum knew. As expected a Ringwraith with an upgraded steed, which flies, circles overhead, having momentarily sensed the Ring before continuing on its way to its current task. Of course, it just looks like the wraith did a shoddy job of searching the area here, as there is no explanation that the wraith as on an errand, as Tolkien helpfully explained in the books. The three hide until the wraith disappears and quickly continue on their way.

Later, as the two hobbits sleep, Gollum tosses and turns as the two sides of his personality fight over what they should do with the hobbits. Eventually, the two warring sides decide to call a compromise, and instead of outright killing them or not killing, Gollum will lead the two hobbits to “her”. “She” is never shown or detailed in this version, but as most will know, the “her” in question is Shelob, the Great Spider.

Back with Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli. Who are already at Helm’s Deep. The trio observes a pack of dogs that Bakshi tries to pass off as wargs, the giant wolves the orcs ride. Then the sky turns blood red, bringing imagery of the apocalypse from the book of Revelation to mind, and the orcs march over a hill in a big group, though nowhere near the promised ten thousand.

The Battle of Helm’s Deep breaks out and from here on out, aside from a few animated characters mixed in the middle every now and then, the film is entirely live-action, but filmed through various odds colors and other odd effects. Bakshi also lifts the battle footage of a film titled Aleksandr Nevskiy for this scene. Arrows are fired, people of both sides die, ladders are lifted, then knocked down, swords are swung. The scene plays out like any other battle scene only more incoherent. I won’t comment on how the battle actually might have looked in its original film, because Bakshi probably had to cut and paste it all straight to hell to make it work, but it does look terrible here. In fact, the only thing of interest is that the orcs begin using a battering ram on a wall when the gate is right next to them. Then, the unimaginable happens, from where he’s standing in Isengard, Evil Santamon fires blue rays of energy with blue or orange scribbly lines dancing around inside of them at Helm’s Deep. This blows the wall. In the books, the orcs just used gunpowder, which Sarumon invented for this battle.

The Rohirrim and the trio retreat into the caves and are soon cornered there by the orcs, but Theoden announces that he will not be “caught like some badger in a hole”, and decides to make a last stand. Aragorn agrees to go along with this, although it will likely result in their deaths. In the books, again, this was a powerful moment of the side of good facing overwhelming darkness because they refuse to give into it, but here…here, the audience can only react with apathy once more.

The film fades back to Frodo and Sam, Sam is concerning himself with the food supply, and asks how they’ll keep it up after reaching Mount Doom. The way figures he it, they have just enough to get there. To this, Frodo replies that they shouldn’t worry about it, and just concentrate on getting there. Then Frodo bemoans how heavy the Ring is weighing on his spirit, with his eyes downcast as if actually feeling heavy. A moment of ackward silence follows before Samwise actually gets up and walks away, whistling to himself!

Anyway, Gollum reappears in all his grinchy glory, and bids the hobbits to follow him to the secret stairs, although this passage he speaks of has yet to be identified. Perhaps it’s time for Samwise to use his mind-reading abilities again. The three of them get a move on again, and that was the last scene of Frodo, Sam, or the Grinch…er, Gollum, in this film. As stated, Bakshi tried to tell all of Two Towers, but didn't quite get it done. Oh well, this was only supposed to encompass one part of the story, anyway, but now would be a good time to mention that the posters of this film only ever head The Lord of the Rings, which had most who came to see this thinking that the entire story would be told in this film. The audiences were in for a jarring disappointment within a few minutes from this point.

Also, although Bakshi might have been intending to do this in Part Two, in the books Frodo, Sam, and Gollum encounter a party of Gondor soldiers and rangers from the same order as Aragorn around this time. They are led by Faramir, the younger brother of Boromir, who aids them on their journey, instead of doing as his father, Denethur wished, which would require him bringing back the Ring to Gondor. After this encounter once they have entered the secret passgae into Mordor, Gollum springs his trap on the hobbits in Shelob’s Lair, where Frodo is poisoned and sent into a coma, then captured by orcs. Samwise took the Ring and all of Frodo’s other important belongings, thinking his master to be dead and that he would have to carry on the quest, alone. However, upon discovering that Shelob’s only knocks her victims out by listening to the orcs talk, he decides to instead sneak into the fortress where they take himand save his master. The book leaves off on that cliffhanger.

Meanwhile, back at this film's Helm’s Deep: Theoden and company make their last stand by riding out and meeting the invading Uruk-Hai who have taken the fortress. Although who exactly is winning at this point is still, somehow, unclear. Thankfully, a bunch of orcs materialize around the heroes to clarify the situation and their slowly tighten the circle. For some reason or another, the music is playing heroically, contradicting the hopelessness of the situation at hand for Aragorn and co. Also, Theoden smiles at an approaching orc (?!).

Just then, Gandalf, followed by Eomer and his men arrive riding down the hill and single-handedly save the day. Then, despite the PG rating, Gandalf begins hacking Uruk-Hai, who bleed quite graphically as Gandalf cuts them all down.

The advance on the Uruk-Hai continues until they retreat, and that moment of before mentioned jarring disappointment comes about. The narrator from the beginning of the film says this as it shows Gandalf riding side by side with Theoden, Aragorn, and the rest:

“The forces of Darkness were driven forever from the face of Middle Earth by the valiant friends of Frodo! As their gallant battle ended, so too ends the first great tale of... The Lord of the Rings!”

The End.  :blink:  Yes, really. The film ends right there. The Ents do not defeat Evil Santamon, they do not imprison him in his own power, Gandalf, Aragorn and co do not go to the tower to confront Sarumon and end up leaving with his Palintir (a crystal-like device no introduced in this adaptation), and with Merry and Pippin now rescued and in tow. That. Is. It.

Also, the line, “The Forces of Darkness were driver forever from the face of Middle Earth…” is just inaccurate so entirely that...that...it-It Burns! It freezes ussss!!!! I would love to see how the siege of Gondor by said Forces of Darkness was going to be justified in Part Two if they were forever driven from its face. Or heck, how does one victory in a far off kingdom suddenly make Sauron and his HQ for the Forces of Darkness, Mordor, cease to exist.

End of Part Nine.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 12, 2009, 05:15:31 PM
Part Ten: Bakshi's The Lord of the Rings Conclusion:

How does Ralph Bakshi’s rendering of The Lord of the Rings hold up and how well did it adapt the epic work to the big screen? It doesn’t hold up well by today’s standards, and it doubtful that even held up during 1978, in which much better animated films had been released. It also does not do a very good job of adapting Tolkien’s books to the big screen, at all.

When the film was first released, it came with much advertising and publicity in which a lot of interesting facts about the film was publicized for audiences to see to try to get them excited about it. As stated, one fact that was not made public knowledge was that this was supposed to be Part One of Two. It was simple titled, The Lord of the Rings. While some advocate for Bakshi in that he argued with the studio over this, he still had some cards in play in-film to tip the audience off, like slipping the “Part One” into the titled when it firsts appears in the credits. That would still not have fixed the situation entirely, but it would still have been something.

The first part of the film was reasonable enough, it was mostly animated, with only a few hinted of the low budget sneaking through, and it followed the book...basically, anyway. However, all the charm and personality of all the characters is sacrificed, most of their backstories are entirely left out, as are important plot details, or if their stories aren't changed completely (Legolas being reduced from the being the frikkin prince of frikkin Mirkwood to being frikkin Elrond's frikkin servant), making the film overall very confusing.

Then about an hour and half in the budget finally must have started to run dry and on top of that, the filmmakers just gave up on trying to adequately tell the story, and then the whole disjointed mess ends with an abrupt and nonsensical closinging narration and the closing credits roll. The music is monotonous and rarely matches the relevant scene, and the backgrounds, instead of using the highly sophisticated techniques of the multi-laired camera, they are simply Matte paintings with surreal colors inserted.

In any case, Bakshi was not allowed to finish this work and it was given over to Rankin-Bass to complete as a TV movie, simply titled The Return of the King.

End of Part Ten.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 12, 2009, 05:24:30 PM
Part Eleven: The Game Attempts-Part Eight:

Rankin-Bass’ The Return of the King: In 1980, The Return of the King was intended to be the third and final part of the animated Tolkien saga that Rankin-Bass began with their release of The Hobbit. It aired on ABC, and as such, was the standard ABC hour-and-a-half in terms of running time. Given that the Bakshi version left out Faramir, Sarumon’s final humiliation at Gandalf’s hands, attaining of Sarumon’s Palintir, Gandalf and Pippin’s trek to Gondor, and the lair of Shelob, this meant that Rankin-Bass had much to do with this limited time slot. So, how did they actually go about this? Let’s dive right in.

The film actually begins at the beginning of the third book, so Rankin-Bass did not address any of the missing scenes from the second half of both the Two Towers books. The duo most famous for their Christmas Specials must have taken the notion that they were only adapting The Return of the King very literally.

This leaves a few problems, but the adaptation only becomes more problematic from there in what I would have to guess was Executive Meddling. You see, the film actually begins at Bilbo’s 129th Birthday after an opening narration by Gandalf in which they seem to be trying to get him to speak cryptically, but fail. Example: "Hear you know, a story about dragons and emperors. Of armies and fields of horrendous carnage. Listen as we speak, for the tale you about to unfold is about the fall of a lord of darknnes, and the return of a king of light. A tale that ends at a beginning, and a begins at an end. An epic, in which all the evil the world could muster is carried one's shoulders. But what warrior or lord could bear such a burden, you may ask? Why, no lord at all..." That's as close as I can remember without writing the whole thing as Gandalf drones on relentlessly, and I don't have subtitles to help me, because I only have this on VHS. Ah man, the Bakshi version's narration had a quiet dignity next to this!

Although Gandalf did say one thing I rather liked. “This is a tale of the fall of a Lord of Darkness and the Return of a King of light.” When he says this, it shows the Eye of Sauron, which fades out and Aragorn fades in. Yeah, not exactly subte, but I still think the moment's effective. By the way, Rankin-Pass also use a kaleidoscope effect for the Eye, though they do it a bit better than Bakshi did.

At Bilbo’s made up 129th Birthday: Frodo, Sam, Merry, Pippin, Bilbo, Gandalf, and Elrond attend. This party was never in the books, and oddly, only six people attend at Elrond’s dinner table. To make matters worse, in a moment that Jackson may have unfortunately been inspired by, Bilbo is portrayed a senile old retiree who can’t even keep his eyes open. He also does not seem to remember how dangerous and evil the Ring was. Also, Merry and Pippin act as if they were still those young hobbits that set out with Frodo from the Shire impatiently waiting for Bilbo to cut the cake and making a fuss over it, instead of the battle-hardened veterans that most audiences would know them to be by the end. Even worse, Bilbo then openly argues with Frodo about the nature of the Ring, advocating for it as it helped him defeat Smaug. So, Gandalf takes this opportunity to introduce someone called The Minstrel of Gondor, who sings the backstory to the audience, referring to it as “The Tale of Frodo of the Nine Fingers and Ring of Doom” while inserting false information that Bilbo found “that shiny Ring” two ages past, instead of just 68 years ago, sadly put over footage from The Hobbit, reminding viewers are better done adaptations. Take note, the Minstrel looks stupid. He looks like a cross between Shaggy from Scooby-Doo and a rooster with a huge vulture-beak of a nose that’d make Jim Henson’s Gonzo the Great jealous.

By the way, Frodo tells Bilbo that if he didn’t keep the Ring on his mantlepiece as a trophy that the Ring’s growing power and evil would have eventually overtaken him. So, what’s the problem? Simple: Bilbo didn’t keep the Ring as a trophy like that. He couldn’t stand to be parted with it that long because of paranoia brought on by the Ring that someone might steal it from him. And it did almost take him over in the end, as witnessed even in the previous film, Ralph Bakhi’s The Lord of the Rings, so there is no excuse why Rankin-Bass made this mistake.

Why did the powers that be on the film decide to portray Bilbo as knowing absolutely nothing about that quest when he was one of the first people to know and even sat in on the council (in the books)! Why are they doing this to poor Bilbo? Hasn’t he suffered enough without being turned into a stereotypical old coot?!

The film then spends the next ten or so minutes recapping what happened from Bilbo’s finding of the Ring up the end of Two Towers. The film also tells the audience that Frodo left the Shire with only Samwise and that the two had many adventures with just the two of them. If by “many adventures”, the narrator means a confrontation with Gollum, a trek through some swamps, a run in with an ally, and then a battle with a giant spider, then sure, “many adventures”, rather than a relatively tame journey as compared to the adventures of Aragorn and company which involved tracking armies of Uruk-Hai and fort sieges.

It also tells the audience that Aragorn, minus Legolas and Gimli who will never be seen or heard of in this film, has been off having unrelated adventures with a small band of men, though it at least makes sure to tell the audience what Gondor is and that he is the heir to the throne, but cannot claim the before Sauron is defeated and the war ends. Although why is again left out. Why is that fact that Sauron will destroy it if Aragorn tries to take the throne while the lord dark is still lives just too hard to explain? There, I just did. Why can't any filmmakers outside of Peter Jackson be bothered to state this? Its not like that pidbit of info even needs more than one line of dialogue to explain it. Observe:

Frodo: "Gandalf, why does Aragorn not claim the throne of Gondor if he is the heir?"
Gandalf: "Because Sauron will crush Gondor if Aragorn tries while he still lives."

Reason solidified. It'd take no more than six seconds to get this said, tops. Did Bakshi and Rankin-Bass think they'd have to go into extravagant detail about this?

Also of note, when the narration comes around to when Frodo is captured by the orcs, he is seen waving his sword around in the air at nothing, then it cuts to a shot of Sam holding himself back from aiding his master. Yes, Frodo appears to have gone insane before being captured, instead of battling Shelob. What happened in the book (at the end of Two Towers, actually) was that Frodo and Sam followed Gollum into a secret path that led into Mordor where he set them up to be attacked by the great spider, herself. Here, Frodo was stung by her and seemingly died. Samwise, thinking his master to be dead, took the Ring and hid himself before the orcs showed up and took they Frodo away. Only then did Samwise manage to overhear that Frodo’s actually just been rendered temporarily comatose. From there, Sam vowed to rescue Frodo, return to the Ring to its rightful bearer, and continue the quest.

The third and final volume, The Return of the King, picks right Sam and Frodo’s story right where it left off with Sam trying to find a way into Mordor and the fortress Cirith Ungol, where Frodo was taken.

Over the course of the narration, the story gets tossed back and forth between Gandalf talking and the Minstrel singing without any rhymn or reason for the switches. Its like Rankin-Bass couldn’t decide on a style and tried to work both in, instead of just picking one and sticking with it. This is more than a little annoying. Also, calling the song “Frodo of the Nine-Fingers…”, plus Bilbo’s fuss over it at the party just kind of ruins the story. Seriously, Bilbo says: “You not only lost my Ring, but you lost the finger on which it roamed?” That gives the ending away! Were they concerned that kiddies would get too scared if the story wasn’t told in flashback to remind them that Frodo and Sam make it out okay? Also in the narration, Gandalf overdoses on the use of the word “Malignency” when referring to the Ring. Evil, malice, darkness, and trickery are just few other choice terms they could have used to add a little more variety.

Back to the film, the highly inaccurate prologue ends and the story finally begins with Samwise actually pounding on the front gate of Cirith Ungol, while yelling at the top of his lungs. In the books, he did try to force the door open, but he had the wits to stay quiet and try to sneak in unnoticed. Here, Gandalf also overdoes describing Samwise’s determination to rescue Frodo with such terms as “he burned with a magnificent madness” along with several other fancy ways of saying “Samwise was really determined to rescue Frodo” to get the point across. Its called subtly, Rankin-Bass. Try it sometime.

While he tries to force the gate open, he comes across Frodo’s Lothlorien cloak, his sword, Sting, and…the Ring, somehow. How and why did the orcs allow these things to drop is the bafflement of many an audience member. In the books, Samwise took Sting along with the Ring and the veil before the orcs found Frodo and before they left they rounded up everything they could find at the site in order to conduct a proper investigation of this prisoner. But here, the viewer is expected to believe that the orcs allowed the enemy’s weapon, attire, and THE RING to drop! I have no words for this. This single-handedly tops any insanity the Bakshi version came up with.

Anyway, Samewise pockets all the stuff and continues to shout at the top of his lungs for a bit, before commencing in excessively talking to himself. He begins to explore the area surrounding Cirith Ungol, and eventually finds a crack that leads him in. As he travels through the opening, the audience may notice that webs line the walls, though nothing ever comes of them. This is what is called a Continuity Nod. The filmmakers hint at Shelob’s presence, but she is never to appear.

Back to the film, Samwise soon finds himself inside of Mordor, as per the books, via the passage. Here, he observes two orcs fighting each other through a window and decides that it would be the perfect distraction. However, the Rings somehow holds him back. Samwise, for whatever reason, agrees with the object of absolute evil without seeing any obvious ploy being played here. He reconsiders sneaking into Cirith Ungol, and instead decides to try to destroy the Ring, himself and then runs off leaving Frodo behind in the tower as a song about the evil of the Ring plays over this. Also, the Ring is played as a strictly outside force that must be resisted by pure will. In the books, the Ring boths inside and out. It plays on its victems weaknesses AND it’s a malevalent outside force that must be resisted. This guarantees that no one can be trusted with the Ring, hence why Gandalf and Elrond even refused to touch even once. Rankin-Bass only decided to play one side of it, because it guess the full explanation would have just been too complex. Although that’s better than Bakshi did, who barely explains the Ring at all.

Samwise comes to a ledge that overlooks Mount Doom, and maliciously cocks an eyebrow at it. Then, the unthinkable happens, Sam is overtaken by the Ring and announces loudly to the world that he “could claim [the] Ring, and [he] would be Samwise, the Strong”. Then, more music about the evil of the Ring plays over this as Samwise has a fantasy about using the Ring to lead an army that showers him in worshipful praises as they lay siege to Mordor and transforming it into a “garden of [his] delight”. In the fantasy, Sam even goes as far as transforming the orcs into animals (?!). Then he rants “All could be mine, if I claim thee Ring!” Then he prepares to put the thing on his finger when he suddenly comes to his sense, then…

Ladies and gentlemen, this film actually had the nerve to give Samwise a big and over-dramatic “No” at this moment. He even throws his arms into the air that he does in a moment reminiscent of Bakshi’s version, or William Shatner, or BRIAN BLESSED!

Then the audience hears some internal dialogue from Sam wondering what brought him back to his sense. He decides on “plain hobbit sense” before heading back towards Cirith Ungol. As he continues walking, another song starts to play while Sam has yet another vision, though a pleasant sounding one this time as opposed to the dramatic chanting of “The power is a power never known” and “beware the power of the Ring”. This time the vision of Sam sitting in a rocking chair as Rosie and his children play around. The song intones such themes “the things I can’t do without are the things that life are all about”.

Even if the scene proceeding this was over doing something that was only a minimal moment in the books in which Sam was just briefly tempted by the Ring but overcame it without much struggle, I actually liked this part. Sam thinking of home, the showing of his heart’s true desires, and the picturing of a peaceful and loving future with his love Rosie is SO much more in tune with Sam’s character than anything else seen in the animated adaptations up to this point. Anyway, the moment is unfortunately interrupted by Sam reaffirming the obvious (“Only Frodo can bear the Ring to Mount Doom.”) before heading off to save his master.

Then the film suddenly turns its attention over to another one of the many subplots of the story, the Siege of Gondor. Now, it is not so much that it decided to move away from the story concerning Frodo and Sam at this point, but the way it does it is so abrupt and disjointed that it’s actually confusing. This kind of sudden shift in from one part in the tale to the next is continual throughout the entire film, I am sorry to say, but I will try to keep with the original format in which this film was told and keep it coherent where the film falls flat.

Anyway, Gandalf takes over narrating again as the camera pans and fades away from Cirith Ungol over to Minas Tirith where he tells the audience that there’s a siege going on at Gondor. No, really. He just states the obvious that Sauron is laying siege to it while the narration is helped by some convenient shots of charging orcs without going into any of the real details about it.The elephants that Saruon’s armies use look more like mammoths in this version, by the way.

Yeah, that Sauron thought that the Ring was in Gondor, that he wanted to destroy it before Aragorn could claim either and both, and that it was the nearest strong outpost and obstacle for him to overcome are all left out. Gandalf instead makes do with saying "[Gondor] is the last stronghold of good". Get used to these over-exaggerations from him in this version, people.

Also, Gandalf describes what the city looks like and does quite an accurate job of doing it. The Matte Painting they used for Minas Tirith, by the way, is gorgeous. Unlike Bakshi, Rankin-Bass took the description of the city from the book and had someone paint an intricate illustration of it using that guideline and I mean it, it is truly a sight to behold. He also identifies Cirith Ungol, guardian of Mordor’s front gate and Barad-dur, home of the Sauron.

Moving on, after some shots of the battle, which shows some black-armored skeletons riding black pegasi which are what passes for Nazgul and Fell Beasts in this movie (I never thought I would miss the Bakshi-Nazgul). The scene switches over to Denethur, the Stewart of Gondor, who is holding his head in a pained manner in the throne room. The audience gets their first good look at the man, and it is not a pretty sight…or even a sight befitting the proud, iron-fisted, and shrewd Denethur from the books. He is a decrepit old man with three teeth, total, and a bald head with long hair coming from wherever he’s still got it, walks hunched over on a cane and has a nose that would also make Jim Henson’s Gonzo jealous. He also starts ranting and raving like a lunatic as Gandalf helpfully explains that he is “caught in the fires of his own madness”. Then he orders his own execution and speaks while excessively using the words “thee” and “thou”, which only sound cool or ominous when well-used, by the way. Here, they are not and they just sound stupid. Now, the casual viewer may be wondering why Denethur is going mad, as that little detail is left out entirely. One: he’s the father of Boromir, the warrior from Gondor who was a member of the Fellowship. You know: the guy who ended up an Uruk-Hai bolt pin cushion. Two: his other son, Faramir, by this point, was dying from a suicide mission Denethus sent him on earier and the old Stewart already thought him dead and was despairing completely by this point. No sons, no one Ring to use as a weapon, which is why he sent Boromir to Rivendell in the first place. Nothing. He gives into his own madness. Unfortunately, none of these little plot points make it into this film because I suppose Rankin and Bass thought them to be unimportant.

Anyway, Pippin is here. As readers of the original book will know, he had been brought by Gandalf to Minas Tirith by this point after the incident concerning his temporary obsession with Sarumon’s Palantir shortly it was retrieved from him and had sworn allegiance to Denethur upon their arrival. From here, he spends a lot of time with Denethur in the throne room and soon finds his decision to serve the Stewart to have been as hastily acted as his theft of the seeing orb. Hence his presence is in this scene. He declares that the Stewart can’t kill himself. A nearby guard, however, who is the third and only other person in an oddly vacant throne room, says that Denethur’s word is law and thus can do whatever he wants. So, Pippin states that he’ll go get Gandalf and runs off to find the wizard.

On a side note, if the audience just happens to be watching the film while reading this, the voice of Pippin sounds awfully familiar, doesn’t it? Well, it’s Casey Kasem, radio personality and the original voice of Shaggy from Scooby-Doo and Robin on Superfriends. Let the randomness continue!

From there we move onto Gandalf who narrates that he is in council with Gondor’s generals in the tower-like battement, although such council is never shown. Gandalf is instead first seen in this segment staring out a window overlooking the battle below, watching and waiting, for…their salvation. Then he talks about how the situation is grim (no kidding there, Gandy! Also going to point out that Sauron is evil while you’re at it?) and he is losing hope. Gandalf may have waned a little in the books, but the sheer level of despair presented here and throughout the remainder of he film is not shared in the source material.

Who is this “salvation” he’s waiting for, though? The destruction of the Ring, Aragorn and his band of merry men, Superman, Dirty Harry…? None of the above as it turns out, although the latter two would have been awesome. It is Theoden who he’s waiting for to save their hides, fore “only he can win the day”. Uh-huh. Gandalf is in for one very big disappoint if he’s hinging everything on the horse lords and their really old king. Also, in this version it shows Merry having been dispatched from Gondor in order to call on the aid of Theoden. Nope, Merry wasn’t left behind IN Rohan with the riders like he was in the books. He was evidently taken along with Gandalf and thus never got a chance to bond with Eowyn and the others. I’d love to know how Gandalf carried two hobbits on just one horse. Maybe he just dragged Merry along by a rope. Anyway, Theoden draws his weapon and decides to ride to the aid of Gondor and he, Merry and the Riders take off, full speed. Also, Theoden looks like battle-hardened Santa Claus in this version.

I should also mention that it was a series of beacons from Gondor to Rohan that was used to signal the Riders to come hither. Apparently, that just would have been too cool for this film.

Back to the subplot involving Pippin and Denethur the Senile. Pippin runs up to Gandalf and whispers to Gandalf was has just happened with the Stewart. “What?!” Gandalf melodramatically exclaims. Then Pippin reaffirms what he just told Gandalf with the statement, “He’s gone loony, I tell you!”

Rant time. “Loony”?! “Loony”!! Jinkies, zoinks, and holy bad writing, Batman! Why, by Thor’s Hammer, did they use that word in an adaptation of a work by Tolkien? Couldn’t they have made due with “He’s gone mad, I tell you!” or “He has taken leave of his good senses, I tell you!” “Madness has taken Denethur, Gandalf!” “Denethur’s mind has become aflame with insanity, Gandalf!” Anything! Anything but what they actually had Pippin say right here! This is anarchy, especially considering how many other adequate or maybe even eloquent ways this could have been stated very simply rather than the insipid wording they picked. I blame the 70s, the 80s, and the studio executives representative of said decades for this one, folks. Rankin-Bass already proved they can and are willing to use Tolkien’s dialogue or something close to it via their wonderful rendering of The Hobbit. So there’s no excuse or even a reason why they botched this up so royally here. End of rant.

Gandalf rushes over to the palace where he confronts Denethur and tells him that he cannot have himself executed. Then Denethur begins a muddled tirade about how doomed they are. Then Denethur pulls out his own palandir which shows the Black Sailed ships arriving by river to back up the dark armies with more reinforcements. Then flames suddenly are super-imposed over Denethur before the scene fades back to the tower Gandalf was in. Gandalf was since returned to his moping spot at the window and Pippin is now with him.

Here, savvy audience members are greeted with more inaccuracies. Gandalf was given completely into despair and again makes the absurd claim that only Theoden can win the way.  Then Pippin has to ask what a palantir is. No, really. The one hobbit to have an up close encounter with one asks this. Then Pippin asks if the palantirs are ever wrong or lie. Gandalf answers “Never.” Actually they do in the books if the one using a seeing stones is influencing what images can be seen by someone else using one of the other orbs. Think of it like a biased news network, only with magic. It’s established that Sauron had been doing this and was partially what caused Denethur’s madness and Sarumon’s corruption. Tolkien states this very clearly in the books. Pippin asks about Aragorn’s return, to which Gandalf glumly answers: “If Aragorn returns.” Enough said.

From here, the film again switches over to tell a different part of the story: Samwise at Cirith Ungol.

End of Part Eleven.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 15, 2009, 07:53:03 PM
Ok I think I have pretty good idea of where you will rank the 3 films.. ironicallt Tom Bombidal isn't in any of the films..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 19, 2009, 05:44:02 AM
Part Eleven: The Game Attempts-Part Nine:

Samwise has made it back to the fortress in order to rescue Frodo.

Ah, so over-blowing Sam’s momentary infatuation with the Ring did have a purpose to serve Rankin and Bass. It allowed them to invent a place to break away from Frodo and Sam’s subplot in order to go over the Gandalf and Pippin’s end of things.

Aside from that, what follows for the next scene is actually fairly true to the book, believe it or not. Firstly, Sam is frightened of the large three headed vulture-esque statutes that stand of either side of the gate, but he sucks up his courage and decides to just pass through quickly. So he walks up the gate of Cirith Ungol and discovers that it only appears to be open and actually it has an invisible wall bars his way. Gandalf narrates that some devilry was on the statues to allow them to do this. So while Sam puzzles on how to overcome this obstacle something begins to burn in his pocket. It is the Veil of Galadriel, not featured in Bakshi’s work, and not explained in this one, so anyone who is not familiar (or not recently so) with Tolkien’s writings will have no idea what is it or what it does. All they will know is that the Veil is making annoying and cheesy B-Grrade movie futuristic technology noises. Well, the Veil repels evil. It repelled and blinded Shelob, weakening her, and it breaks the enchantment of the Gate of Cirith Ungol.

Well, once the invisible gate is dispelled, Samwise passes on through after making a glib remark and calling the statues “old boys”. Then, the Watchers sound an alarm by shrieking like a monstrous creature and a goblin rings a bell somewhere. Sam panics and gets a move on but only finds a bunch of dead orcs rather than the army of live ones he was expecting to come bearing down on him. He wonders what happened and then finally concludes that they killed each other. He mutters a ëgood riddance’ to them as he passes the corpses and heads inside. There are no painful deviantions throughout this sequence. This soon ends, however.

As of Sam entering the Cirith Ungol, we’re thirty minutes into the hour and a half film at this point, by the way.

Sam has entered the tower and notes that it climbs “backwards like”, although none of the architecture seen looks even remotely confusing. He has no idea where to go like in the books so he just decides to start climbing stairs. The scene fades away to Sam sweating and exhausted from so much climbing and trying to convince himself that he’s near the top and just needs to keep going. Alright, this was kind of funny and not in an inappropriate way.

Sam suddenly hears footsteps and correctly concludes that “oh, they’re not all dead!” The Bakshi Sam would probably have been wondering who the oncoming person was, but let’s not go too far back in that direction. Anyway, its, of course, an orc, who stops when he spots Sam and then loudly declares: “Burn ëem! Boil ëem! Smash ëem! Split ëem in two! Skin ëem alive! Cut to ëem to bits!” He does this before he even pulls out his sword to attack and thus gives the hobbit ample time to prepare himself for the oncoming attack.

So Sam, of course, successfully parries his sword with one hand and grabs hold of the Ring in order to prevent the orc from getting it. Then…then things get really weird. Sam grabs the Ring and suddenly begins glowing green and looking angry and about a hundred times scarier than before. HULK SMASH! This freaks the orc out who drops his sword while gasping “No… No!” in horror before running off.

Sam lets go of the Ring and wonders why the orc reacted that way, then gives chase babbling about how he’s a great elf warrior and how he’s loose in Cirith Ungol. The orc, meanwhile, is still running away full speed still with his hands covering his head shouting “No! No!” The spectacle is even more hilarious than I’m letting on.

Finally, Sam orders the orc to stop and the thing obeys and pleads for mercy. Sam answers that “[he’ll] have to think about it.” Then he starts grilling the orc for answers when…things take a turn for the stupid. The orc captains made their men fight over Frodo’s stuff, which they think he hid, which actually just dropped off him when they hailed him into Cirith Ungol while he was very unconscious. Lost yet? Well, this is the insanity that came out of the orc’s mouth when Sam asked what had happened there. No, really. This takes us back the fact that these morons let Frodo's stuff fall to the ground without noticing at the beginning of the film. Now to make the whole thing more batshit the orcs somehow got into their heads that he hid his stuff while he was still unconscious. Why couldn’t they have just tortured all of the answers out of Frodo first? That was their goal, anyway. Get the prisoner to talk. Then they could have decided on who got the spoils. Seriously! What. The. Hell?!

In the books, this situation happened under very different circumstances and it wasn’t Frodo’s Lothlorien cloak that was the prize to be won. It was the mithril vest that Bilbo passed onto him. Alright, the orc captain Gorbag and an Uruk-Hai captain were going through Frodo’s stuff when the hybrid decided he wanted Frodo’s belongings for himself, to sell or auction off. But Gorbag was loyal to Sauron and insisted that all the stuff goes to the Great Eye. So the orcs THEN did battle over this conflict of loyalties. That being said, Sam did chase a couple of orcs, but he did not catch either of them.

Back to Sam interrogating the orc: The orc finally turns around realizes that Sam is the same kind of small creature the prisoner is and attacks. Sam slashes his sword at him and yelling for him to get back then grabs the Ring again and takes on the scary look again. The orc freaks once more and runs right off the edge of a platform to his death. The new, improved Evil Lackeysô, now self-defeating.

Fade to a repeat of a tired Sam climbing the insanely tall power when he reaches a ladder leading up to one final door. He hears some low moaning coming from there and recognizes the voice as Frodo’s. He climbs the ladder and enters the room, which is revealed to be torture chamber. An orc is whipping Frodo, no less. Sam intervenes and the orc attacks him but trips and falls through the trapdoor to his death. Man, the Storm Troopers from Star Wars had more dignified deaths than this! Yes, I am aware that this is how this orc died in the book as well, but like the Watcher closing the doors behind the Fellowship at Moria and Aragorn running around with a broken sword through the countryside it doesn’t work for film too well.

Anyway, Sam has now rescued Frodo. The film is now 35 minutes out of an hour and a half over. Between this and the subplot with Gandalf and Gondor, Frodo has less than 55 minutes left to develop as a character. Sam tries to bring his master to consciousness although once he does the audience will wish he hadn’t

Basically, Frodo gushes how happy he is to see Sam and that the torture at the orc’s hands is over. Then he begins recalling his experience. Alright, fair enough, but then he begins babbling about setting sail on the White Ships when he should just be concentrating on the quest. While Frodo imagines parting from Middle Earth standing next to Gandalf and Elrond another song plays over it about how one should “leave tomorrow ëtil it comes.”

Anyway, he thinks the quest has failed but it turns out that Sam has the Ring and the Veil. Here things remain more or less true to the books, but what comes next is not.

Sam pulls out the Veil and asks about it, but Frodo answers that he is only at liberty to say “It is the Veil of Galadriel”. He makes the claim that there’s some secret of the Veil and that its power will die if he tells it, which is bullshit. This explanation is lazy and completely fabricated so that Rankin-Bass can avoid the subject altogether. Not that they’d have too for the sake of screen time if Bakshi had just kept the damn thing in his rendering. Seeing what a mess they had to try to salvage in just an hour and a half yet?

Sam suggests he hang onto the Ring a while longer because he thinks Frodo is too weak to handle it. Frodo, at first, agrees, but then the Ring makes him go crazy and he orders Sam to give to him. Then, Rankin-Bass felt the need to reassert their idea that they need to over blow all of the Ring’s effects on people by having Frodo hallucinate that Sam is an orc before beginning a tirade that “[he] has the power now!” Oh, and he’s also glowing green when he goes this. HULK SMASH!

Sam successfully manages to talk Frodo out of his paranoia and the Ring-Bearer promptly apologizes and then the two get a move on. On a final note, the Ring makes an annoying humming sound all throughout the scene. This was likely to show it was at works, but really it just makes one wonder how anyone can be entranced by it if they have to put with the most wretched sounds ever recorded for film. Seems to me like that’d be more incentive to get rid of it.

Later, in the courtyard of the fortress, Sam and Frodo dress in orc garb to disguise themselves and then try to pass through the Invisible Gate. Of course, its erected again. Sam tries to use the Veil, but it doesn’t work. Frodo explains that the Watchers were expecting it this time and that their will is strong. So he also grabs the Veil Sam is holding to help him. Alright, this was an interesting idea, but…to anyone who has ever seen an episode of Superfriends, it’s hard not to picture the Wonder Twins joining their Rings in the exact same manner Frodo and Sam are holding the Veil. The friend I was watching this with and I both knew to shout “Wonder Twin Power: Activate!”

This somehow causes the Watchers to cave in and the hobbits have to rush past as the Gate collapses. Hmm. I wonder how Sauron is going to use this fortress as his front lines when Aragorn and company arrive at this very gate later if Frodo and Sam already trashed the place. Not to mention a huge front stone gate completely caving in going to make one hell of a racket which will attract all kinds of trouble, so, so much for stealth.

Sure enough, a Nazgul comes to investigate and lands on a platform atop the tower. Yeah, this was int he books, but the Nazgul only arrived because the alarm from earlier rang out, not because of something powerful enough to cause the front gates of Cirith Ungol to cave in.

Sam wants to hurry the heck out of there, but Frodo is tired. Sam actually has to remind Frodo way they need to get as far away from the nasty Black Rider as possible. Frodo finally gets moving and they are on their way again.

Cue a traveling montage, but the scenes remain just long before fading to something else that we get to hear Frodo and Sam get turns whining. I am not making this up. First in one scene, Frodo is moaning about what a wretched place Mordor is and Sam has to console him. Then in the next fade in, Sam’s the one whining, and so on and so forth for about five or six fade-ins and outs. I understand that the filmmakers did this to show what a horrible place Mordor, in fact, is, but the whole thing just degrades to The Trail of Moaners and Bitchers.

Anyway, Sam finally can’t go on anymore and wants to rest, then Frodo, oh dear, Frodo. He announces that a Black Rider has been directly overhead of them for quite some time now and he just didn’t want to say anything. That you just heard was my head banging against a desk. WHAT?! A frikkin Black Rider, Ring Wraith, a Nazgul was overhead of them and Frodo didn’t tell Sam this little tidbit until the gardener was about to collapse from exhaustion?! I’m amazed that Sam, in a moment of fury, didn’t just wring Frodo’s little neck for this. So they run like hell to get away from the thing. At this point, since Sam was so tried that his eyes were closing by themselves, he must be running on pure adrenaline which means once they lose the thing he’s going to have a complete system crash because Frodo didn’t warn him earlier which means he couldn't make preparations to pace himself for this moment. Do I even need to say this never happened in the books?

Following this moment of pure...no, I have nothing that can describe what just happened. Frodo and Sam in the next scene appear to be just fine while walking in a gorge AWAY FROM MOUNT DOOM. Fade to another scene of them reaching the Vale, which is the final stretch of open land between them and Mount Doom once they got past the fortresses and canyons and such. They bemoan having to cross all the open country crawling with enemies, even though if they already knew about the Vale, then they already knew what was awaiting them. Argh! All this whining is driving me insane!

Then, another song begins to play about Mount Doom. Yes, a song about Mount Doom.

“Doom!
The Crack of Doom!
Chambers of Fire!
The Fire of Doom!”


I am very sorry to tell you readers that the lyrics seen above are mostly what the song is comprised of while being chanted in deep, dramatic voices. There were a few other lines of lyrics, but I couldn’t make them out. Again, I only have this on VHS, so no subtitles to help me.

Then in the next scene, Frodo and Sam are traveling in Mordor, under moonlight, while they complain about how it makes crossing the Vale at night as bad as it is by day. Yeah, moonlight in Mordor, the Land of Shadows and Darkness. Suuuuuure. I guess having the scene in which Sam sees one shining star in the endless blackness that was the hellish black sky above them and regaining some of his hope for their success from that light in the darkness just would have been too subtle and elegant, huh, Rankin-Bass. Yep, a black canvas with one white dot would have been all that was needed.

Anyway, the two pass out on a nearby rock. The following morning a troop of orcs passes them by just on the other side of the rock. This also happened in the original, but here the orcs are, unfortunately, singing.

Actually, they voices aren’t too bad. They have nice deep manly voices for singing a whining song about how they don’t want to go to war and would rather stay home in peace. Uh-huh. Apparently, they forgot they were murderous abominations that blighted the land wherever they went with bloodthirsty glee.

A small snippet from the song:

“Where there’s a whip,
There’s a way!
Left, right, left, right!
A Clap on the back says,
We’re gonna march,
All day, all day,
Where there’s a whip,
There’s a way!
We don’t want to go to war today,
But the lord of the lash says
Nay, nay, nay!
We’re gonna march,
All day, all day, all day!
We are slaves of the Dark Lord’s war!”


Truly moving, boys. So much that it almost makes me forget that you hate the rest of all creation and have a deeply rooted love of cruel torture in store for anyone unfortunate enough to cross your path, however physical or psychological. For instance, what you’ve done to Frodo earlier in this film. Oh, and chopping off the heads of the dead Gondor soldiers and then using them for catapult ammo, or their help in murdering thousands of innocence in the Gap of Rohan. Yeah, I feel SO sorry for any of you. Ugh, this is too surreal. This is just anarchy Also, why did it have to a song that bores down to whining?! Haven’t Frodo and Sam filled that quota yet? It couldn’t at least have been a song about what they love to do? Seriously, if the orcs were this flamboyant and sissy, then I’m glad their vile kind is gone!

Come to think of it, forget the army, you singing orcs (did I really just type that last part?). Form a singing troupe. I can guarantee an entry into just about any of New York City or England’s major Concert Halls. I think Carnegie Hall is accepting applications right now. Just make sure to look your…er, best.

Back to the film, Frodo and Sam are discovered by an orc captain with a whip and are forced along for the ride until they reach a fork in the road which some human dark army forces also want to use. The human captain brags that men get to go first then pushes the orc captain down. This guy obviously has a death wish. Surprisingly, the orc captain just takes this (?!) and allows the human army to go pass by. Sam sees this as a golden opportunity and goads the orc captain into attacking the human forces, which results in the orcs doing a weird foot stomping dance then attacking the humans. Frodo and Sam make their escape. As one can imagine, in the books the orc captain just did this all on his own accord when the human captain tried to bully him and Frodo and Sam made their escape that way. Either way works, but the way it plays out here is hilarious. This was one of the better moments in the film. Seriously, Roddy McDowell as Samwise Gamgee delivering such lines as “You're going to take that from one of those filthy man creatures, and you call yourself an orc! Smash them, burn them, cut them to bits! Skin them alive!” is golden!

Of course, as per the rules of animated Tolkien adaptations, the best moments of the rendering also has to be followed by another moment of complete inanity. Frodo randomly walks off a cliff. I am not kidding. He’s walking along, and walks right off of an edge that neither him nor Sam see coming and is knocked out by the landing. Sam climbs down the cliff face, cradles Frodo, and then prays to God or as he puts it “to whatever force of good be out there, help us!”

Rankin-Bass take this cue to switche back over the Gandalf’s end of things.

End of Part Nine.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 19, 2009, 06:06:23 AM
Part Twelve: The Game Attempts-Part Ten:[/i]

Rankin-Bass take this cue to switch back over the Gandalf’s end of things. Gandalf narrates again, and take a guess what he’s going. Whining, of course! Oh, of course! He proclaims that all good seems to left Middle Earth and that the growing darkness is about overtake them permanently. You know what? Screw you, movie! It’s bad enough that Frodo and Sam have been deduced to being bellyachers on the filmmakers’ whims, but now they’ve got Gandalf going into full carp mode! Now they’ve got me doing carping on about all the complaining! It’s contagious!

Anyway, this is the scene in which Grond (that gargantuan battering ram with a wolf’s head) breaks down the front gate of Gondor. Although that Grond is the last resort that’s reserved for when ordinary battering rams just won’t cut it is omitted. Also, Grond looks more like a generic monster than a wolf here.

Gandalf proclaims that he will meet the front gate and thus part from this life in the coming onslaught forever. Yes, instead of valiantly helping Prince Imrahil (a character omitted from Jackson's trilogy as well, but he was the one who actually lead Gondor's troops when Denethur's sanity went by-by) lead the armies of Gondor to give Aragorn and the Riders enough time to get there, Gandalf’s just throwing up his arms and saying “I give up.” Well, if he’s going to, then Pippin decides that there’s no reason for him to stick around, either and offers to up a sided hobbit to the wizard fillet.

So they go to the front gates, it breaks, and the lord of the Nazgul rides through first. Gandalf orders him to retreat and that he cannot enter Gondor. The Witch King throws off his hood, revealing a crown free-floating above a flame where a person’s head would normally go. Hey, so far the Lich King looks right. The film might be taking a turn for the better. I can’t wait for the coming exchange between the White Wizard and the Lich King. Then the wraith talks… Unfortunately, the voice the powers that be chose the voice of Jackle-Man from Thundercats to be his voice over. For those unfamiliar with that show, it’s within the same irritating vocal range as the original Starscream from Transformers. And if you don’t know that sounds like then let’s just say it falls somewhere between a roaster and a pig being castrated.

Gandalf and the Lich King’s conversation is the same as it was in the book, but nowhere near as good because of the lame high-pitched voice of the lord of the Nazgul. Anyway, Theoden’s troops finally arrive and the head Ringwraith pulls his hood back up and retreats from Gondor’s front gate to deal with this new menace to Sauron’s plans.

Then the film in a rather jolting manner switches back to Frodo and Sam as the Ring Bearer regains consciousness with renewed vigor. This is treated like Sam’s prayer actually worked and that Sauron was somehow weakened. Yeah, sure, right. For one, this never happened in the books. Secondly, Sauron’s power is not impacted by reinforcements for a battle being fought a decently good distance away from his home, or some hobbit waking up. Because, you know, Sauron's a frikkin demigod.

Sam gives Frodo some water and Frodo proceeds to guzzle a ton of it before spilling the last of it. Man, they turned Frodo into an inconsiderate douchebag. And of course, Frodo says “[he] can feel Sauron is weakening” and that they have to get moving because “[Frodo] has more of a chance now”. Sam insists “tomorrow” and that Frodo get more rest before lying down, himself.

So, Frodo lies back down and falls asleep. Then another song plays, because we hadn’t had one of those for five minutes now, which plays to a dream Frodo has. In this dream, Mordor is a grassy paradise in which Frodo and Sam casually walk into the Mount Doom, where Frodo flips the Ring over his shoulder, and into the pit. Then the duo happily skips through the grassy fields (of Mordor) where they meet a happy orc which waves to them as he passes by. I feel like I’m watching a version of The Lord of the Rings Norman Rockwell would have made. Later, they meet Gandalf and they tell him the good news about the Ring. Then Gandalf and Sam morph into orcs and eat Frodo.

Frodo bolts upright, awaking from the nightmare sees Sam peacefully napping next to him and then lies back down and falls asleep. Then the film cuts back to the Siege of Gondor. The humans are winning, Gandalf is showering their rescuers in praises, and all is well.

Back with Frodo and Sam (well, that little trip back to Gondor was pointless and short, wasn’t it?) are now scaling Mount Doom! “The Crack of Doom” reprises and Gandalf asks such philosophical questions “Who turns the day into the ever dark night” and things like that. To which, he answers ëSauron’. I’m not making this up. Also, Kaleidoscope-Sauron shows up as Gandalf talks about how Sauron has an acute paranoia of spies slipping into his lair. This is completely inaccurate, because Sauron was actually quite the smug snake in the book.

Then, it shows the eye moving like a spotlight over the land of Mordor and it comes pretty close to spotting Frodo and Sam. Why both the Rankin-Bass AND Jackson versions went with this weird idea has baffled many. Of course, Sam is convinced that the Eye spotted them and that all hope is up. Frodo reassures that him it’s not over yet. So Samwise starts pumping his hands in the air yelling things like “Give me the strength to try once more” in ways that I’m almost certain had to be rotoscoped over Shatner.

So later, the two near the door into the volcano. Yes, Sauron had a door constructed into the mountain in the book. On top of being evil, it seems he was also just weird in some ways.

As anyone who has seen the Jackson films or read the books will know, this is the part when Gollum shows up for the first time since he left the hobbits for dead in the Lair of Shelob. Not that this film explained that at all. Anyway, one would think he’d be very intimidating, since the Gollum from the Rankin-Bass The Hobbit pulled his antagonistic rule off quite effectively. However, they made some alterations to his design for this film and…he looks like someone just took the ugly stick to Kermit the Frog. He also rasps the words “wicket master”. So, Frodo has a knack for setting up Crochet games? Yes, I know he’s actually saying “wicked master”, but it sounds like “wicket master”, for crying out loud!

So, one moment of garbled insanity must be followed by another, as Gollum lifts a boulder bigger than himself over his head and tosses it at the hobbits, who somehow manage to survive a direct hit from the thing with getting a single part of the bodies crushed and with no broken bones! Wow, I guess hobbits hides are really are made out of mithril! Not only that, but Gollum must be the Mr. T of Middle Earth, fools! “We’s pity the fool! Yesss, precioussss!”

Gollum, giggling like a girl, climbs down from the ledge he threw the boulder from, and rushes Frodo. He jumps on the hobbit’s shoulders and tries to take from the Ring from him. Sam tries to aim a stab at Gollum, but hesitates because he might hit Frodo.

Frodo finally manages to knock Gollum off and grabs the Ring. Take a wild guess. Frodo starts glowing green and turns psycho on Gollum’s ass, right? Close. He glows red instead of green this time. Is he gonna go Shag Fu on him? Nope. Frodo threatens Gollum with being tossed into the pit of fire, himself, if he ever touches him again. Whoa, Frodo, tone it down a bit!

Inevitably, Frodo lets go of the Ring returns to normal. Gollum turns on him to attack again. Sam takes the initiative and bids Frodo to run on ahead while he holds Gollum off. From here, Sam and Gollum’s exchange from the book in which Sam spares him plays out exactly as it was. And guess what, it’s actually a very effective and powerful scene. This is a glimpse of what this film could have been had Rankin-Bass been allowed to just make Return of the King right and didn’t have to try to salvage Bakshi’s mess while dealing with studio executives all the while. I mean it, I love this scene.

Gollum is played spot on. The way he begs is perfect. His lines are near word for word from the book, and it works. “Let us live, yesss. Let it live, just a little longer. Lost! We are lost! And when preciousss diesss, all of usss, diesss, into the dust! Into the…dussst!” To which Sam responds: “How could I kill such a pitiful creature, enslaved to the Ring for years. Oh, be with you! I couldn’t trust you as far as I could kick you! Be off, I say, or I will hurt you with nasty, cruel steel, yes!”

With that, Gollum scurries away as fast as his scrawny legs will carry him. Sam goes to find Frodo again. Nothing fancy happens here, just nice and subtle without Rankin-Bass or their scriptwriter Romeo Miller over-doing any of the character traits. Why couldn’t the rest of their film have been more like this one scene? Sam soon finds the door into the Mount Doom and enters. The screen fades to black with dramatic music playing it. I guess this was where a commercial break came in.

Anyway, the film decides to cut back to Gondor promptly. Why were none of these transitions ever smooth? On the field on battle, Merry is seen fighting a orc which is clearly a better swordsman than him. The orc takes an arrow to back and its revealed that Pippin is the ones who shot it. The two reunite and praise each other. Okay, this is not how Merry and Pippin reunited in the books. It was after the battle and Merry had fallen under the Black Breath, which is a curse put on any mortal who slays a Ringwraith.

The scene cuts over to Theoden, and…Jason’s theme from Friday the 13th starts playing. Not really, but what is playing sounds very close. Gandalf helpfully explains that the darkness suddenly grew heavier and that things were about to take a turn for the worse. No kidding. Seeing as this is a scene with Theoden at the Pelennor Fields, it’s to anyone’s guess what’s about to happen.

Anyway, the Lord of the Nazgul kills Theoden. Well... No, he doesn’t actually. Snowmane, Theoden’s horse just panics and bucks him off before running away. Theoden hits the ground hard enough that it kills him. That’s it. No Fell Beast swoops down and pins him under his horse to trap then eat him. Nothing. Something just scares his horse, he falls off, and dies. That. Is. It. For whatever reason, this is blamed on Sauron, directly. How they think he had anything to do with it is beyond me.

Oh, yeah, and Merry refers to Theoden as his lord even though he was dispatched from Gondor and thus did not actually serve Theoden. Yeah, I don’t get it, either.

Then, the film turns away from the battlefield again and back to Frodo and Sam. I was getting dizzy while watching this.

Continuing from when we last saw Sam, who was entering Mount Doom, he’s now found Frodo. The Ring Bearer is standing at the edge of the Crack of Doom and Sam bids him to throw the Ring in. Then Frodo, of course, saws that he will and claims the Ring, laughing maniacally all the way. No, really. Then Sam falls onto his knees, throws his arms up in the air, and begs Frodo not to be conqured by the Ring at FULL VOLUME. Stop it, both of you! We don’t need two large hams in one scene! Subtly, thy name is Rankin-Bass.

Then, the single most piece of madness this film could muster comes up. Its implied that Frodo being taken over by the Ring and Theoden’s demise are connected, as they happened simultaneously in this version. ?!?! ?!?!?!?!?! ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! WHAT?! First of all: No! Just no. Theoden’s death and Frodo finally giving completely into the Ring happened ten days apart from each other in the books! They were not connected events! Rankin-Bass were so hellbent on playing up the “Hand of Fate” angle that they felt the need to make Theoden’s passing Frodo’s fault. Oh, yeah, apart from the psychological damage that the Ring put on poor Frodo’s mind and spirit, let’s dump the guilt of killing Theoden on the pile! Are we also going to blame something else on Frodo? Shall we also blame him for happened to Lake Town when Smaug rampaged while we're at it?!

Cutting back the Siege of Gondor, I think the dizziness has turned into whiplash at this point. The Lord of the Nazgul shows up now to feed his steed with Theoden’s corpse, which is inexplicably been left where it fell even though more than a few able bodied people saw him crash land. Even the Jackson Theoden’s corpse vanished as quickly as they could get him off screen, implying someone took him away from the field of battle. Here, it just looks like his mortal coil has been abandoned by everyone. Well, so much for the mighty King of Rohan who as respected and loved by all of his citizens.

Anyway, the Witch King’s steed lands and Eowyn appears out of nowhere. She has not been featured AT ALL in this film as of yet. No foreshadowing. No prior screentime. Nothing. Yet here she is. She also uses the long-winded dialogue from the original book, in this case unfortunately. Don’t look at me that way! The dialogue worked for the book, but here it just seems like she’s talking on and on while the cruel and evil Witch King just lets her without trying to kill her. Using the word for word diaogue in the Gollum-Sam scene worked, but here its a much more tense situation.

Seriously, let’s compare Jackson’s version and this one.
Tolkien and Rankin-Bass Eowyn:

“Begone, foul dwimmerlaik, lord of carrion! Leave the dead in peace."
"But no living man am I. You look upon a woman. Eowyn, am I."
"You stand between me and my lord and kin. Begone [if you be not deathless]; for living or dark Undead, I will SMITE you if you touch him."


Jackson’s version:

“I will kill you if you touch him!”
“I am no man.”


Yeah, the dialogue Tolkien used sounds prettier, but when actually looking at it on a screen, you just don’t buy that the honor-less Witch King would just patiently let her babble on like this. The Jackson films had a remedy for this. Simply have her state the facts quickly and in their simplest terms as one would do if they stopped to say anything to anyone on the field of battle. Yeah, yeah, Shakespeare did this all the time, but Tolkien was all about deconstructing him. For example, as a young boy, J.R.R. felt cheated that the forest wasn’t actually coming to get Macbeth and he also felt that Shakespeare was taking the easy way out by having Macduff simply be a C-Section baby.

Anyway, Eowyn kills the Fell beast, and Merry helps her kill the Witch King. He dies then deflates like a balloon. I am not kidding. Eowyn then announces that she was avenged her uncle, although in order to do that in this version she’d have to turn Snowmane into glue.

The scene fades to Theoden’s body being carried off of the field as Gandalf narrates that they all wondered if a similar fate awaited Aragorn upon his return. Yeah, Rankin-Bass in one half and thirty minutes found the time to show that Theoden’s body was carried off of the field, but Jackson with three and a half hours couldn’t. Seriously, this was all he needed to do. Just one quick shot of Theoden being taken off of the field, then a fade to something else. More on why he has no excuse later.

Anyway, Gandalf inserts that the forces of Mordor’s spirits were broken with the death of the Lord of the Nazgul and they made show their defeat. It helpfully shows some orcs going the way of Lemmings and all committing suicide off of a cliff into the waters below.

Then the tide of battle turns again, as the Black sailed ships arrive and the orcs’ vigor is revived. Gandalf announced their doom as at hand…but what it this? The banner of the King of Gondor is born high and it turns out to be Aragorn, who Gandalf notes, “He who will be our king!” Hold it right there! ëOur’ king, Gandalf? He’s of a station above you, ages old guardian spirit of Middle Earth? I’m supposed to believe that Gandalf is going to pledge fealty and obedience to him. Yeah, right.

Now with Aragorn’s help, Gandalf and the rest of the forces of good are able to drive off the attacking army of orcs and trolls and finally end the battle. Afterwards, it shows Aragorn, the generals of Gondor, and Gandalf in council in a tent outside of Minas Tirith. In the books, it was held here because Aragorn could not enter the city yet. That is not explained, though implied since it distinctly says Sauron must be defeated first in this film. Eomer is also supposedly here, but if he is, he has no lines.

The first thing you might notice about Aragorn int his scene is that he’s an arrogant and dim-witted prick. Yet somehow still a step up from Bakshi’s rendering… In this version, he thinks he’s all that, speaks to Gandalf with contempt, and actually believes he can defeat Sauron by marching up to his lair’s front gate and picking a fight.

Where do I even begin? First of all, the whole idea of marching to Sauron’s lair to do battle was a distraction so get Sauron to empty his land of orcs so that Frodo and Sam could make their way through it more easily and buy them some more time. Aragorn even used the Palantir they got from Saruman to trick Sauron into thinking that he had the Ring. Secondly, as I stated before the Bakshi section, Gandalf and Aragorn are old friends and have nothing but respect for each other. Thirdly, Aragorn is supposed to be a humble, gentle soul who would treat others with respect, even if they were of lower station than him even if he simply disagreed with them. Rankin-Bass’s depiction of the uncrowned king is just so against everything that Aragorn is that it’s just offensive! How could they do this to him?! Oh well, at least he looks like Aragorn, which is one thing I can say for this guy that I can’t say for the Bakshi one.

Fade to them marching to the Black Gate. Another song kicks in, because we hadn’t had one of those for three minutes, plays over them arriving at the gate. Gandalf narrates that the song is supposedly to match his spirit. The lyrics go something like, “You are standing underneath, the towers of the teeth and beyond…”; “Win the battle, lose the war, A choice of evils lies before your feet. Retreat! Retreat! Retreat!” To this Aragorn whips out his sword and roars in a manner similar to Kevin Spacey’s famous “WRONG!” from Superman Returns, “Silence!” The orcs actually comply. Well, thank you, Aragorn! I take back everything I just said about you! Thank you so much for stopping the ghastly music!

Then Aragorn starts shouting more commands. “Let the lord of the Black Land come forth and repent of this evil! Come forth!” The line delivery is filled with so much ham and cheese, it's almost unbearably humorous.

The Black Gate opens and a very unimpressive Mouth of Sauron emerges. I mean it. This guy actually reminds of the High Priest played by from the 60s Alfred Pennyworht in The Mole People, which was a bad Sci-Fi film starring John Agar. So, that’s what happened to him. After the cave dwelling civilization collapsed after the mole people rebelled, he found a new position serving as Sauron’s emissary. Think of him as kind of an evil Alfred the Butler. He and Aragorn have their famous exchange, though its greatly trimmed down and proven to be mostly pointless. The Mouth of Sauron goes back into Mordor and the battle is implied to about to begin, though unlike in the books it doesn’t even get under way as you will soon see.

From here, the film cuts back to Frodo and Sam’s end of things. Sam crawls up to the Crack of Doom and mourns Frodo giving into the Ring. This should not even be happening, because if Frodo put the Ring on this far ahead of the Battle at the Gate, then Sauron would have sensed the Ring in his lair and have sent the Nazgul to retrieve the Ring long before this moment, thus making Aragorn and Gandalf’s efforts at the gate even more utterly useless than this version is trying to pass them off as being. Ugh, this film hurts.

Then Sam hears Gollum cry and sees the vile thing fighting with nothing! Sam even has to ponder for this a minute before he realizes its Frodo. Congrats, Sam, you win a free trip to Hawaii! Going to make a wild guess that Gollum’s come for the Ring next? Back to the fight, Gollum bites Frodo’s finger off and he at last in reunited with his “precious”.

Sam runs over to Frodo and be mourns the missing finger. Take note that the stump where Frodo’s Ring finger used to be is strangely not bleeding. Frodo tries to buck up and say that a missing finger is better than the madness brought on by the Ring. Then the two take notice of Gollum doing a wild dance shortly before he trips and falls into the Crack of Doom, Ring with him. Frodo happily announces that Gollum has completed their quest for them. More or less true to what happened in the books and the scene is all the more effective for it. Of course, this is the point in which the destruction of the Ring causes the volcano to go off and Frodo and Sam have to flee the coming lava.

Back with Aragorn, Gandalf, and company: Aragorn actually wonders out loud what’s happening. Gandalf replies rather patronizingly: “Need you ask? The Ring Bearer was fulfilled his guest.” Does this Aragorn know anything about anything in this version? On top of that, the unthinkable happens. The great eagles come and airlift EVERYONE away from the collapsing land of Mordor, leaving Shadowfax to die. That never happened in the books. Also, Frodo and Sam bid each other to die well as they try to outrun the lava flow before being rescued by the eagles. The latter was the only eagle rescue in the book.

The film then cuts quite a bit more and shoots straight ahead to Aragorn’s crowning, ignoring Arwen’s existence (again), Frodo and Sam’s reunion with Gandalf, whom they had thought to be dead, and eight remaining Fellowship members catching up with each other. Now, can anyone guess what kind of musical score plays over this scene? Is it: A) A song. B) A song. Or, C) A song. If you guessed ëA Song’, then you are unfortunately correct. Note the lyrics: “He will rule with a healing hand!” Where did these people get that idea from? Eowyn and Merry didn’t need healing because the Black Breath would have been too scary for the kddies and Faramir doesn’t exist in this version. So goodbye House of Healing, the random soldiers just had to make do with their own immune systems.

Oh, wait, I guess I was wrong. Faramir does exist in this one. He’s on a horse next to Eowyn, who suddenly has a broken arm that’s in a sling. Never mind. The film also depicts Frodo, Sam, Merry, Pippin, and Gandalf up on a parapet, watching from above, instead of riding along with Aragorn. They’re smiling as they watch, instead of feeling cheated out of the honor of riding with the first king this country has known for three thousand years! The camera zooms in close to Frodo’s hand, the one missing a finger and the film fades back to the present at Bilbo’s birthday party as the Minstrel finishes his song. Oh yes, I had almost forgotten this insipid banality.

Gandalf announces, “And now we all know, and knowing is half the battle!” G.I. Joe!!!! Just kidding, but he does say the first line of that. Instead of the second part, he finishes with, “Weel, almost all of us.” He points to Bilbo who has fallen again. The group laughs merrily at this, telling the audience that this is somehow endearing. It’s not. This awakens Bilbo who insists that he’s just resting his eyes. Oh, no! That’s what he said before! Is the film going to start over?! Are we caught in a time loop like in Ground Hog’s Day?! Nooo!!! You can’t do this to be me, movie! I have my rights! I have my rights!!!!!!!! It was Miller! The script writer! He did this to me! AAAAAAAAAAUGH!!!!!!!!![/b]

Thankfully, no, the film is not starting over. Frodo instead tells Bilbo that they return to Hobbiton (?) where he will be able to sleep all he wants. What? Bilbo staged an elaborate Birthday Party in order to completely disappear in front of the entire Shire to get away from there! Why would he ever want to go back? Did Rankin-Bass and Miller not read the book at all? Why even put in this in and why doesn’t Frodo know that Bilbo will be departing from Middle Earth to the West? Anyway, Bilbo announces he’s leaving with Gandalf and Elrond. Frodo actually has to ask why. Gandalf answers, “We’re old”. Eh? Frodo asks if he can go along, instead, you know, having that be a part of the plan from the beginning. Gandalf answers without having to, you know, discuss this with Elrond and/or Galadriel.

Thus Frodo hands the Red Book, which recounts Bilbo’s adventure with the dwarves and Frodo’s journey with the Ring, to Sam, saying the keeping up the Book of the Hobbits is now up to him. Sam says he will, but then wonders if this new world of men will have a place for hobbits.

Here…here things once more take yet another turn for the weird and out of left field. Gandalf answers that he thinks hobbits will have a place in the future world of man and then he comes up with a really dumb evolutionary theory that hobbits will be the same as men one day. He even says that Sam, who younger than Frodo, is larger than the Ring Bearer and that Merry and Pippin, even younger, are larger still. He intones that each successful generation will get closer to man in size.  :bang  I did not mention this earlier, but if you get a chance to catch the beginning again, take a good at the shot in which it shows all four hobbits sitting at the table for Bilbo’s birthday. Merry and Pippin ARE NOT LARGER here. Gandalf continues, “And if you cherish book of the hobbits, your stories will be told centuries from now, and people will look back and wonder," From here, he looks warmly directly into the camera, "ëDo I have any hobbit in me?’” Oh, what a bloody brilliant Hallmark moment there, Gandalf. Way to take all the wonderment out of the hobbits' fate! Argh! This little speech is SO stupid on so many levels that it just hurts, deeply! Deep hurting! Deep hurting! Rankin-Bass made this up that they wouldn’t have to touch on the fact that hobbits didn’t even want to be a part of man’s world in the first place and would rather remain unnoticed, as Tolkien implied they actually ended up doing. As Tolkien tells it, hobbits are still around, we just don’t know about them. What was so hard about that?

Moving on, now that we’re in the home stretch, the scene fades to Frodo’s departing to the Undying Lands in the West. Sam is seen sobbing and is the last to leave. I have to say, this last wordless scene actually worked, assuming you’re not still recovering from the crap spouted off in the previous scene. Then it ends. The end.

Conclusion: How does Rankin-Bass’s adaptation of The Return of the King hold up and how well did it adapt Tolkien’s vision to the screen? It doesn’t and it didn’t, respectively. As much as it hurts to say this but they did a worse job than Bakshi if it’s looked at objectively. The animation may have been a huge step up from what horrible art style and cheap techniques Bakshi used and their Samwise may have been a stronger character, but overall this thing is just a travesty. It shouldn’t even have been made to begin with.

When Bakshi was kicked off of the project after the disastrous box office results of The Lord of the Rings-Part One, it left behind a partially finished and compromised vision of Tolkien’s grand and detailed world. Essentially, it was a mess that couldn’t be picked up in an hour and a half as proven by Rankin-Bass's attempt. Some may note that I’m being a lot more lenient on Rankin-Bass than Bakshi, but that’s because Bakshi had more say in what ultimately happened to his version than they did and he's the one who gave in without a fight over the having it be a trilogy. Not only that, but they had to pick up the pieces left by him while trying to tell the finale of the saga.

A few parts of the film are really, really good. These are the few parts when Rankin-Bass were allowed to just tell the story as it was, but each time the film got even close to Tolkien, the good scenes were always preceded and succeeded by utter drivel that the filmmakers made up in place of the actual story. Most of the characters are erased from the story, most of the important plot details are omitted, yet certain things happen pertaining to the cut material leaving events that just happen without any logic to them, and the story structure was just a jumbled mess, cutting from Frodo and Sam to Gondor seemingly at random and then back in the most jarring ways imaginable!

In any case, this was the end of the animated Tolkien saga, as of 1980, and the world would not see another try at the professor’s text until 1996, when Peter Jackson took up the charge.

End of part twelve.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 19, 2009, 10:35:26 PM
a very interesting take WR.. so I have it as Return of thr kIng is worse than Bashiki..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 17, 2009, 10:23:29 PM
Update: I haven't forgotten about this project or gotten lazy, but work's been keeping my busier than usual, so I've had to drop any projects not related to my survival. I will be picking this again soon, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 18, 2009, 12:12:19 AM
Understood Wr. pick it up whenever you can..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 11, 2009, 01:04:25 AM
hopefully WR you'll be able to pick this back up after the holidays.. I'm looking forward to your take on Jackson's trilogy.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Paradise Bird on December 11, 2009, 01:34:06 AM
We await your written art :DD
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 24, 2009, 05:27:09 PM
The next part should be up early January.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 24, 2009, 06:51:22 PM
No hurry.  You've been doing a great job so far.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: aabicus (LettuceBacon&Tomato) on December 24, 2009, 08:03:42 PM
Have you seen the Nostalgia Critic's (http://www.thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/thatguywiththeglasses/nostalgia-critic/9754-lotr) review on this topic? it might be useful as research.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 24, 2009, 08:56:20 PM
I've seen it. Funny review, but it's too short to be of any real help for the minute by minute recap I'm doing of the films as the video is only twenty-thirty minutes long. For the most part, I'm just rewatching the relevant scenes in the film while writing.
Thank you for the help, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 28, 2009, 01:23:21 AM
No hurry Wr.. Looking forward to your next installment
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 03, 2010, 05:07:47 PM
Update! A month late and a dolloar short, but here at last nontheless.

Part Thirteen: The Game Attempts-Part Eleven: Peter Jackson’s The Lord of the Rings: Ah, we have come to it at last, the latest adaptation of Tolkien’s beloved book to date. The Pre-Production section of this is going to be much longer along with the film sections simply because I was able to learn the most about how Jackson and company made their adaptation than I was able to concerning Bakshi and Rankin-Bass’s, in which I was hard-pressed to find any solid information at all for the former. Also, I will be using the Extended Editions as my point of reference, as they are considered to be the definitive versions of the films by both the cast and crew and their fans.

Well, to start things off, while not a whole lot is known about Jackson’s activities in trying to get Lord of the Rings adapted prior to when his company officially took up the project in 1996, but on the Special Extended Edition DVDs, where is a short video of Jackson and company scouting the location that would become where they built Hobbiton in the eventual films. A look at the date on the video, which is visible on the upper left side of the screen, clearly shows the year, 1991. Jackson had been considering taking on the project before his third film, Brain Dead, was even released. However, nothing more than successfully finding a location to shoot Hobbit at came of this.

   Now, time to move onto the actual production. In the year 1996, Jackson had been trying to get the rights to remake King Kong after finishing The Frighteneers. However, after negotiations for this fell through, Jackson decided instead to adapt The Lord of the Rings as a live-action film. He has said that he found it strange that no one was trying to do so despite the technological advances that Steven Spielberg’s Jurassic Park and other films had brought about by that time. Well, Jackson was confident that his company could do it through the numerous expansions he and Richard Taylor had made on the effects branch, Weta Workshop.

   Before he was going to get around to adapting Tolkien’s most famous work, though, he wanted to adapt The Hobbit, first. So, he and his partner, Fran Walsh, entered into dealings with Miramax and went to Saul Zaentz, who held the rights at the time, to discuss the matter. They pitched the idea of a live-action Hobbit and two Lord of the Rings films to him. Alas, this deal as far as matters concerning The  Hobbit are concerned, did not happen. The business proceedings soon became stalled, and it was revealed the United Artists had bought the rights to distribute The Hobbit. In other words, Zaentz could give them the rights to produce the film, but they’d have to have United Artists’s cooperation to release it in theaters.

   Jackson, Walsh, and Miramax did their best to resolve this issue, but well…the issue to this day, is still not resolved as no Hobbit movie has not even been officially green lit yet. It also doesn’t help that the distribution rights has jumped owners a few more times since then. So, Jackson and company essentially said “screw this” and decided to just go ahead with Lord of the Rings.

In 1997, when all the business arrangements had been set in place, Jackson and company began a six week process of setting up a sales pitch, a synopsis, and a full treatment. They presented their screenplays and the pitch to the Weinstein brothers and a $75 million budget was decided upon. The Jackson films were originally to be disturbingly similar to Bakshi’s in that the first film was going to be a Fellowship/Two Towers conjoined, but ending with the beginning part of the Return of the King with Gandalf and Pippin arriving at Minas Tirith. The second film was going to be straightforwardly just The Return of the King. The films were also going to be two hours, each. In mid-1997, Phillipa Boyens joined the writing team after she read their treatment when the job was offered to her. It took the writing team a full year to make the scripts for the two films.

In this time, the changes to the story that Sam is caught eavesdropping and forced to go on Frodo’s jounrey was included, instead of the conspiracy between Sam, Merry, Pippin, and Fatty. Also, Lothlorien was omitted, Galadriel’s scenes were transferred to Rivendell, Denethor attends the council with Boromir, and Arwen was going to kill the Witch King. Wow. This makes me appreciate that Jackson actually did end up doing all the more.

Unfortunately, in order to make the films, the budget was going to have to be doubled to $150 million, which Miramax did not have the finances to do. For one thing, $15 million had already been spent on a huge model of Helm’s Deep and few other things. So they proposed a single two hour film. Jackson and company fought this, but alas, all of their work belonged to Miramax. So, the Weinstein gave Jackson a window of opportunity to find another that could finance the two films. Jackson agreed to this. He met up with an executive from New Line Cinema named Mark Ordesky, who set up a meeting with the Bob Shaye, one of the heads of the company.

For this meeting, Jackson and company set up one of the most elaborate sales pitches for a one film ever recorded in the history of film. At the end of the video they showed as a part of their presentation, Shaye asked why they would want to do this in two films when the book was released in three volumes. This made everyone from both Jackson’s film studio or Weta Workshop nervous because they didn’t know what he meant. To clarify, he then said “This is three films.”

“Well, thank God for that decision.” –Christopher Lee, on the subject.

With this, Jackson, Walsh, and Boyons now had to write three completely new scripts. This allowed for a lot more creative freedom and the ability to stay much, much closer to the books for them. The three-part adaptation did not end up corresponding directly to the book, given that Jackson decided to tell the story in chronological order. Frodo’s quest was made top priority and Aragorn’s story was made the primary sub-plot. Many sequences such as the entirety of the chapters concerning Tom Bombadil, the wolf attack on the Fellowship when they set out, the dinner held before Elrond’s council, and the Scourging of the Shire among other things were all deleted. Dialogue was shifted between characters, new sequences were added, characters were altered for increased drama, whether for better or worse, and other changes were made as well.

Bob Anderson, Hollywood’s go-to guy for excellent sword-fighting choreography, was hired on to develop the fight sequences and other such stunts for the trilogy. Anderson has been everything from Ol' Flynn’s stunt double to having a long standing career as a fight coordinator. For those interesting in Anderson’s work, he choreographed the fight scenes in The Princess Bride and wore the Darth vader suit for Vader and Obi-Wan’s infamous dual in the original Star Wars film released in 1977. He also trained the actors in the Pirates of the Caribbean series, the Antonio Bonderas Zorro films, and in the 1998 Parent Trap remake. His resume reaches about as far back as a lot of old time actor’s.

The next step in the production was visualizing the epic and then putting it into tangible forms. Technically, this next step had began a while back, but it wasn’t until New Line took the financial reigns that it the production design really took off.
Christian Rivers was hired to do the storyboards. John Howe and Alan Lee, two famous artists who specialize in doing illustrations of characters and locations from Tolkien’s universe, were hired on the conception artists, from which all the designs would be based on their work. Jackson would even go as far as recreating moments from Howe and Lee’s artist works as a nod. Other concept artists, though these ones were Weta Workshop regulars, were Daniel Falconer, Warren Mahy, Jamie Deswarick, Mike Asquith, and Ben Wooten. Falconer liked designing forces of good. Mahy enjoys designing villains. Deswarick and Asquith did the masquettes, and Wooten mostly helped design creatures, due to his extensive knowledge of zoology.

Speaking of Weta Workshop, Jackson of course went to his usual go-to, Richard Taylor, who is the primary head of Weta Workshop, for the armor, weapons, prosthetic make-up, standard make-up, creatures, and miniatures. Many, many people were employed in various fields to create the one of the most elaborate and extensive productions in film history up to this point. Which included tons and tons of the most elaborate costumes ever made for film (they even found a way to replicate the look of genuine chainmail whereas other films made due with “yarn mail”) ,full body costumes for monster and creature characters, authentic armor suits, ridiculous amounts of prosthetics, models the size of entire sound stages to actually use in-film, and gargantuan sets built on-locations.
While the creation of everything seen in the films was being done, another task was the casting. Jackson and co sent out a worldwide casting call for actors and ended up with a mostly satisfactory result.

Once brought on board the cast was put through very vigorous training sessions and dialect lessons, as well as extensive make-up tests to see what look best suited the actor and character. When they started, the primary cast was Elijah Wood, Ian McKellan, Stuart Townsend, Liv Tyler, Sean Astin, Dominic Monaghan, Billy Boyd, John Rhys-Davies, Orlando Bloom, and many others. Wait, though? Doesn’t one of those names seem a little out of place? Well, Stuart Townsend was intended to Aragorn, but it didn’t work out and Viggo Mortensen had to be brought in after they were already filming and he had to be tossed into character and preparations at near breakneck speed. There have been many reasons stated for why Townsend didn’t work out, and often they conflict with other theories. It was involved with the fact that Townsend did not want to do any of his sword-fighting (I think, and if so: Wimp) and he was let go. Yeah, a near no name tried to get out of doing any of his own stunt work and ended up getting fired off of the single most successful trilogy of the decade because of it. Anyway, Mortensen was brought in ended up doing all of his sword fighting and stunt work, among various other things, throughout the entire trilogy. Townsend’s complete opposite. Makes one wonder why Mortensen, who had been considered for the rule before during casting, was passed up to begin with.

Moving on, the principal photography for the films began in the second half of 1999 and ended in December 2000. The primary reshoots were done through the years of 2001, 2002, and 2003. A final pick-up shot was conducted in 2004, after the release of the theatrical version of The Return of the King to be custom made for the Extended Edition DVD.

The films were made and filmed in New Zealand, as per Jackson’s agreement with anyone he works with. The country sports a highly remote and untouched feel to it that made it ideal for making it the backdrop of the Rings films.

The films were shot using seven different units shooting simultaneously at over 150 locations over the course of the production. Yes, Peter Jackson was the only primary director for the entire shoot. There were 2nd and 3rd unit directors, but they only shoot what the head director tells them to and they do it how he tells them to. These other unit directors included Alun Bollinger, John Mahaffie, Geoff Murphy, Fran Walsh (who only briefly held the position due to an error in which she allowed unsharpened weapons to be seen a up close shot), Barrie Osbourne, and Rick Porras.

To top the enormous amount of pressure just keeping all of these units well-organized, the script was literally being rewritten everyday because of some factor or another. For example, real life practically wrote the script in which there was going to be a river rapids scene while the Fellowship was traveling by river after Lothlorien. However, the set-up for the scene was destroyed by a flood and the crew did not have the time to reset it, so it was omitted from the films entirely.
In 1999, most of the focus of filming was on Fellowship, but some sequences from Towers were shot, too. For the first part of production, Jackson and co tried their hardest to shoot in chronological order, but could only do so much what with McKellan not available off of X-Men yet. He arrived after 1999’s Christmas break in January 2000 to begin his part of the long shoot.

After finishing the bulk of Fellowship’s primary footage, the production altered to filming many sequences out of order out of necessity. For example, Wood and Astin had to film in scene in which Frodo sends Sam home from the last film right after their final scenes in Fellowship were shot. Principal production was done by the end of the year.

End of Part Thirteen.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 03, 2010, 05:11:11 PM
Part Fourteen: The Game Attempts: Part Twelve:

Other things of note: camping gear, survival kits, and foot supplies were brought along to many locations, because of the remote nature of many of New Zealand’s filming locations. This was in case the helicopter would not come to retrieve the units immediately. On more than one occasion, the cast and a crew were left stranded in a specific location, just waiting to be air-lifted out.

While several of the sets were built full-sized on location, the crew had to abide by very strict conduct codes enforced by the law concerning the impact their equipment the buildings they had set up would have on the environment. For example, the capital city of the Gap of Rohan: they actually freakin’ built it and they had to tear it down and leave the area unaffected as if they were never there.

Post-Production: From January to early December, Jackson and company would spend the entire year editing the appropriate footage together, going on reshoots, inserting extensive visual effects, among other things before each film was released around the 10th of each Christmas season. I’m getting more brief in detail here at this point, because chances are, you readers each know someone who owns the Extended Editions DVDs which has three-four hours of making of Special Features each which can tell you all what these people did behind the scenes better than I can.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 03, 2010, 09:41:47 PM
Very informative read.  Thanks for posting this here.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 04, 2010, 07:17:45 AM
You're welcome, and the next part begins recapping the film, itself.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 04, 2010, 12:03:46 PM
Sounds good.  Think you'll do this for the hobbit movies once they come out?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 04, 2010, 03:40:01 PM
i would hope so. this is fascinating stuff Wr. nice work..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 04, 2010, 06:12:23 PM
Oh yes I will. Problem is, the new Hobbit movie just keeps getting pushed back and I'm beginning to think that it's just not going to happen.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 04, 2010, 07:25:43 PM
the first part is scheduled yo come in 2011  the second part in 2012
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 04, 2010, 07:26:38 PM
If it ever is you would have to compare both parts to the 70's hobbit animated movie.  No idea when it'll come out I guess.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 05, 2010, 05:02:30 AM
Actually, I think it's been pushed back 2013, which means the world will end before we see it. Dang!

Yep, that's right, Kor. I was fully intending to compare it to the 70s version, which is actually pretty good as far hour and a half TV Specials go.

Anyway, I've finished the rough draft of the Opening Prologue of Fellowship. Now I just need to edit it and clean it up, since upon retrospect I notice I've made a ton of grammar errors throughout the whole essay.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 05, 2010, 09:29:37 PM
the world is not going to end in 2012.. so we'll get to see it. I doubt Christopher Lee will be in it, since He'll be 91 by then, and Saruman doesn't appear in the hobbit anyway..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 05, 2010, 11:49:12 PM
The 2012 comment was a joke, man.

Actually, Lee will appear. Jackson and Del Toro are going to include The White Council and take the focus away from Bilbo.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 06, 2010, 12:13:26 AM
i know Wr
and i imagine that will appear in part 2 of the book, while bilbo was struggling through mirkwood.
So the question we be how will they put Lee in it? he has stated hes not in favor of flying to nEw zealand again.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 06, 2010, 01:08:35 AM
Maybe motion capture, or film those scenes in Lee's home.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 06, 2010, 01:09:35 AM
very good idea kor
 that is quite possible..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 06, 2010, 02:25:24 AM
It is possible. not sure how they'll do that.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 06, 2010, 03:54:38 AM
Well, time will tell. Anyway, here's the next part:

Part Fifteen: The Game Attempts: Part Thirteen:

Part One: The Fellowship of the Ring: Going into the theater, I was sure that the films would begin with loud orchestral music that would bombast the audience with drums and trumpets right from the beginning. That’s always been the established way of opening an epic going on back in the days of Cecil B. De Mille. Although the epic film did die after a while, it was still reestablished by the Star Wars films what with their infamous opening crawls and the official Star Wars theme music. On top of that Bakshi and Rankin-Bass both followed a similar pattern of using either very loud or very magnificent music at the opening part of their renderings.

So to hear more low-key music mostly involving a softly chanting female choir backed up by flutes and various spring instruments for a change was a nice break from the norm. Make no mistake, the loud bombastic style film scores are fine and will always have their place in cinema and stage, but that style of First Act Opening was so overused by the time of Fellowship’s release that it was time for a change.

As credits fade in and out over a black screen Cate Blanchett as Lady Gladriel of Lothlorien begins narrating. This is another break from the norm as most fantasy film narrations have used deep voiced elder men like Christopher Lee, James Earl Jones, Charlton Heston, or Sean Connery voice acting it as melodramatically as possible while the orchestra plays behind them. This is also another common tool both the Bakshi and Rankin-Bass adaptations utilized as if checking off a list of common story-telling devices for epics. In fact, I think both actually used their respective voice actors for Gandalf.

Blanchett’s narration is played as low-key as the music and it works. She cryptically talks about how the how times have changed in Middle Earth (or perhaps she’s even speaking directly to the audience as if she has returned to tell us about Sauron and the Ring of Power) “because none now live who remember it.” With that, title of the series The Lord of the Rings, appears over a haunting melody, successfully setting the tone and pace.

The film fades to the forging of the Rings in which the narration makes the correct assertion that Sauron tricked the other races into the creating them for him to be distributed amongst the leaders of each of the three Free Peoples. Three for the elf lords, seven for the dwarves (Hi hoe! Hi hoe! It’s off to work we go…), and nine for human kings, "who above all else, desire power".

Sauron returned to his home base to craft the One Ring. I timed it how long it took her to say that, by the way. It took Jackson and co. 1 minute 12 seconds to state that it was all Sauron’s idea and Bakhi’s incorrect claim about Sauron learning from the elves took 50 seconds. Thus, the difference is so insignificant that Bakshi might as well have not altered it. I suppose Bakshi’s rationale might have been to make Sauron look more craven and less magnificent or something, but it only serves to diminish his menace. Consider this: a villain who is clever enough to fool the elves into making the Rings which will allow him to take control of the other races' leaders, or a villain who stole the idea from the elves and tried to make his own Ring to rule all others. The latter just isn't as menacing, is he? In Jackson’s Fellowship, though, the audience knows Sauron is someone you don’t want to have in the same universe as them, because he was able to follow the former's actions.

Cutting away from the Rings’ creation, a map of Middle Earth is seen (and looking identical to the ones seen in the books) with a red shaded circle originating from Mordor and spreading outwards forms like a festering malignancy. Footage of villagers running in terror from orc armies torching their village half faded in. Then the scene cuts away to the Battle of the Last Alliance. The audience actually gets to see the armies march at each other and in huge numbers to fight out for the sake of Middle Earth. We're see quite clearly Elendil leading the humans armies, who are the closest to the screen in the shot.
We see some orcs snarling nastily and rushing forward in their own charge.

Arrows are fired, taking a good bit of the orcs’ side before the two sides clash and it shows the Last Alliance on the verge of winning before Sauron shows in person to take care of the invading army himself. Again, this was how it was in the books. No, the Last Alliance did not “fall beneath [Sauron’s] power” and then luck out when Isildur snuck up on Sauron and dispatched him from behind. Here, the Alliance would have won, if not only for one problem: Sauron himself, and his Ring, which was the point. The armies of the men and elves could defeat orcs all day,but it wouldn't change the fact that it was the Ring that was keeping them from victory. The Bakshi film missed so many of book's nuances that it’s a wonder anyone defends him.

Lo, The Dark Lord then appears in all of his terrifying glory and begins using his power to blast the Allied armies with a wave of his arms, several soldiers at a time. This is what Sauron is implied to be just like in the books. Not some average sized guy in a Viking Helmet who can be taken out be a back-stabbing sneak, but a great and terrible force that’s nigh untouchable in battle. Try to get close, he’ll just let use a dose of dark power and kill you instantly. This is, in fact, what he does to Elendil when the Gondorian King tries to do just that. Isildur runs over to his father and takes up his sword. Before he can rise to his feet, though, he is greeted by Sauron’s foot, which smashed down on the sword, Narsil, breaking it. Not exactly how it happened in the book, but that's all right. At least it's shown getting broken. Then instead of just using his magic to blast Isildur into oblivion, Sauron reaches down to grab him likely in some fit of arrogance and Isildur responses by slashing wildly at his hand and cutting off Sauron’s fingers, including the one bearing the Ring. Having been deprived of the the center of his power Sauron’s physical form collapses and explodes, knocking the orcs and Alliance all off of their feet.

Then Isildur takes the Ring for himself, allowing Sauron's continued existance. Galadriel narrates that although Isildur had the chance to destroy it, the Ring is sentient and will corrupt its bearers, and that “The hearts of men are easily corrupted”. The film fades from the climax of the battle to Isildur leading some men on a road when they’re ambushed by orcs. Isildur slips the Ring on and escapes into the river, but “It betrayed [him]”. The Ring slips off of his finger and two orcish archers put arrows into his back. All of this is spot on with the books, the production values couldn’t be better if they tried, and the timing, editing, and writing is perfect, and it just sucks the viewer in without obstacle or catch.

From here, the narration follows the Ring as it is swept along the bottom of the river and it is explained that over the course of two and a half thousand years, the thing was forgotten until it was found by Deagol. The narration skips the scene between Smeagol and Deagol, unfortunately, and it just shows a hand retrieving the Ring from the bottom of the river and then the film switches over to the Misty Mountains, where it exclaims Gollum took the Ring and where it completely took him over.

To this day, I do not understand why Jackson and company didn’t just put the scene with Smeagol and his cousin in right here and just start The Return of the King with Frodo and Sam. According to Jackson, they didn’t do it because they didn’t want to paint Gollum as an unsympathetic character, which is just bullshit. For one thing, the way they tell the scene, the two cousins end up just about killing each other over the dumb thing, making their rendering of Deagol every bit as much at fault for what happened (though that is not what happened in the book in which Deagol didn’t even leave where he sitting on a log while looking at it when Smeagol strangled him), so I frankly believe the whole reason for the reveal of Smeagol’s part of the story was just stupid and should have been restored to the Fellowship Extended Edition’s opening narration. This is one round I am sorry to say that Bakshi wins…somewhat. He still gets points taken off for having the scene shot behind a red curtain, giving both Deagol and SmÈagol the exact same voice and actor, and making them as over the top as everyone else in his version.

Anyway, onto the Misty Mountains, the audience gets a scene in which Gollum is only visible by a small bit of sunlight shining in through the ceiling of the cave as the now vile thing rants about how he loves his precious. Then Gollum suddenly hears something and clasps the Ring to his chest while giving the direction the noise came from a good, long stare before returning to staring at the Ring. This scene did an excellent job of showing Gollum’s obsession with it and thus his need for the accursed thing is established for the audience long before his first official appearance. The scene itself is probably not even a minute long, but it sums the character so perfectly.

The narration lets out that the Ring brought Gollum a lifespan longer than intended for his race (five hundred years, actually). Then Galadriel continues to inform us that Sauron eventually returned to the world, but remained mostly anonymous as a “whisper of a shadow” and “nameless fear”. The Ring detects that it’s time to move onto a new bearer, but unfortunately for it, it’s found by Bilbo Bagginse. Unfortunately, just what Bilbo is even doing in the cave is not established, though parts of his journey are implied throughout the films. It only tells us who he and what he is. Another round that Bakshi wins is right here since his opening narration at least briefly summarizes that Bilbo was on an adventure with some dwarves and the wizard Gandalf before getting lost. Of course, Bakshi also still gets points deducted for Gollum looking like the Grinch. Yes, I’m spiteful and will take anything I can get to mock Bakshiës version. Not that it needs my help, of  course.

Returning to the relevant subject, the underlying problem here is that any audience members of Jackson’s films not familiar with either The Hobbit or The Lord of the Rings will have no idea what Bilbo is even doing in Gollum’s cave. Also, it depicts Bilbo finding the Ring then having Gollum cry out for the lost precious right then and there whereas Gollum didn’t discover his precious Ring was missing until a good while after Bilbo found it.

I understand this was done for brevity’s sake, but how on earth are they going to justify this for the upcoming Hobbit adaptation? If the Ring was right under Bilbo and Gollum’s feet while they were in the riddling contest as depicted here, then how did Gollum miss it? Or, how did Bilbo come up with the question (technically not a riddle) “What do I have in my pocket?“ to thwart Gollum? In the book, it dropped off of the scuttler’s finger when his attention was otherwise occupied whilst wandering the caverns. Then Bilbo found the Ring long before he encountered itës previous owner. I can buy that Gollum didnët notice it laying in a tunnel far from his own lair, but right there where he dwelled the whole time? Also, just what will the be riddle or question that thwarts Gollum in Jackson and Del Toro’s The Hobbit? Oh well, at least Gollum doesn’t look like the Grinch. Again, this is but a minor annoyance in an otherwise great adaptation of Tolkien’s work.
Note: The reason I’m being kind here instead of going off on another rant like I would be if this were Bakshi’s or Rankin-Bass’s is because The Good about this prologue and the rest of the adaptation overall so overwhelms The Bad that there’s really no point to getting bent out of shape over it.

In fact, this opening narration here could be used to sum up the quality of Jackson’s rendering altogether: Really, really good, but flawed.
Moving on, the narration comes to close with Galadriel saying, “For the time will soon come when hobbits will shape the fortunes of all.” Nicely put.

Oh, by the way, the young Bilbo we see here is actually played by Ian Holm, who plays Bilbo in the rest of the trilogy. The Make-Up Department used some sort of clips to pull his skin back so he wouldn’t look like the wrinkle faced seventy-year-old that he was at the time. You might also note that he looks just a ever so slightly like Billy Boyd as Pippin Took here. Well, Bilbo’s mother was a Took. It would not be surprising if Jackson went so far in the casting as to find two actors who can be made to look distantly related. That, ladies and gentlemen, is just a taste of the attention to detail that this adaptation gives us.

End of part Fifteen.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 06, 2010, 04:06:49 AM
& fun read, thanks for posting it, and gives one things to think about also.  Odd how they didn't want to put Gollum in a bad light when he is pretty evil, though a victim of the ring, he was corrupt.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 06, 2010, 05:15:31 PM
Thank you. I don't know whenthe next part is coming, fair warning. I'm tryig to be detailed, but there's so much detail int he Extended Edition's concerning hobbits prologue that I'm wondering if I shouldn't gloss over some things for brevity's sake.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 06, 2010, 11:24:45 PM
thats fine. even the most detailed story is going to miss things, as there is no such thing as a perfect movie..  being a lotr nut myself   i saw where they missed things, but as you said the good so overwhelms the bad that to  harp on it is imo nitpicking
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 06, 2010, 11:52:46 PM
I wonder what the extended edition of the hobbit will have and cut out.  

With the lotr if they wanted to do a complete type of thing they'd have to have done it as an annual mini series, not as an annual movie.  Since the books are pretty thick.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 09, 2010, 04:07:21 PM
both films will likely be lengthy.. but the book "the Hobbit' is shorter than any book in the trilogy..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 11, 2010, 06:59:17 PM
I hate to cut in like this, but I have an update. I think I will be able to get the rest part in on Feb. 15th.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 11, 2010, 10:58:34 PM
No hurry.  Do it when you have time and are happy with it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 11, 2010, 11:52:24 PM
I'm not hurrying myself. The next part just covers Bilbo's Concerning Hobbits Narration, Frodo and Gandalf's talk while riding the wagon, and Bilbo's subsequent scene with Gandalf in Bag End when he talks about how he needs a "long holiday".

Then the part after that will cover everything from Gandalf and Bilbo smoking their pipes while over-looking the party to when Gandalf takes off to investigate the Ring.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 12, 2010, 12:07:03 AM
Sounds interesting.  I look forward to reading it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 12, 2010, 03:54:07 AM
sounds really interesting WR, you're doing a fantastic job..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 12, 2010, 03:00:53 PM
Thanks.

Actually, I've already completed the rough draft of this next part. I'm just taking the weekend to edit and rewatch and the relevant portions of the film to make sure I'm getting the details right.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 12, 2010, 03:08:13 PM
Sounds like quite a bit of work  you are doing.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 12, 2010, 07:50:47 PM
Yes it is, but it is worth it if the paper he produces is really really good...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 12, 2010, 07:51:31 PM
Not really. I rewatch the relevant bits, fix any wrong observations I made, then run through again spell and grammar checking. The hard part was getting it typed up to begin with. Watching a film going play by play with the laptop at hand can take a lot of fun out of it sometimes. ...Or, in the case of the Bakshi and Rankin-Bass films, make a misery experience more painful by having to pay more attention.

Edit: sorry I got my edit in after you guys replied.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 12, 2010, 07:53:30 PM
well said. as filmmaking, there is no question the Jackson's films were better. as far as getting things right, well no film gets every little thing right..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 16, 2010, 11:37:48 PM
Hey, guys. Sorry about the lateness of the update, but my internet access went straight to Hades on Sunday and Monday.

The next part will be up tomorrow, because I don't feel like touching up the next part to make it more readable in Chatroom form.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 16, 2010, 11:46:57 PM
It's ok.  Glad you can get back online.  No hurry, post it when you have time and feel happy with what you have.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 18, 2010, 07:26:16 PM
:cry  And lo, after endless amounts of bad luck and broken promises on posting dates, WeirdRaptor was triumphant in getting the latest part of his paper to it's destination.

 Part Sixteen: The Game Attempts-Part Fourteen:

The scene fades to the interior of Bilbo’s house and then he hear Ian Holm voice over as the camera moves through Bag End's scenery, which looks exactly like it stepped right out of our imaginations. I pictured the very same image when reading the book.

Eventually, the creeping point of point of view finally finds Bilbo at his writing desk. Again, the interior of Bad End is phenomenal, to say the least. Jackson and co spared no expense in creating it, twice. One set Hobbit sized, and one set of it full human sized. Not only that, but it really does look exactly the way Tolkien described it.

Moving on, Bilbo is attempting to start writing his book, which covers his adventures with Gandalf and the thirteen dwarves to the recovery the Lonely Mountain (Erebor) from the dragon Smaug. He see Bilbo from the back view as he considers where to begin while smoking a pipe. He decides to start by “concerning hobbits”. Holm, being a master actor and having all the charm and ability that comes with it, delivers a spot on Bilbo here. His mannerisms, voice, and attitude all match the audience’s expectations perfectly.
Note" Jackson thought he was going to have to fight to keep the pipe smoking in the films, because it's not politically correct. However, no such attempts executive meddling ever came.

Now, more about this scene: this second narration that appears on the extended edition in which Bilbo talks about the hobbits was an alternate opening to the film that Jackson considered and then reluctantly abandoned in favor of the more exciting Forging of the Great Rings and Last Alliance scenario. Originally, this and this alone was supposed to be how the film opened. Frankly, I think it could have worked, but both would, really. Retrospect, I think I prefer this one since all the backstory with the Rings and the Last Alliance are explained at Frodo's fireplace, later, anyway. Well, once the film crew had decided to go with opening the film with the history of the Ring, it was with great reluctance that Jackson cut what we are about to see, and it really is a shame. Thankfully, we have it restored to the extended version.

Moving on, cut to several scenes of hobbits going about their daily lives in Hobbiton as Ian Holm delivers a near perfect rendering of Tolkien’s own “Concerning Hobbits” Prologue which was at the beginning of the Fellowship volume. A lot of wit is in Tolkien’s dialogue while describing his creation and their culture and Jackson and co are quick to supply appropriate visuals to it. Such as when Bilbo intones that some say that a hobbit’s greatest love is for food. It shows a hobbit man on his knees before a hobbit woman as the guy gives her some flowers. She closes her eyes and readies for a kiss. However, the guy takes notice of a passing pedestrian with a plate full of muffins. He grabs one and starts eating it while she still waits for her kiss. Humorous things of that sort are followed up by plenty more in this sequence. The next part of shows that their love of food is just part of it, for they also love brewing and drinking ales (cue the hobbits doing just that) and smoking pipes (take a guess).

We also get a short shot of Samwise gardening while Bilbo continues on that they have a love “of things that grow“. Enjoy it, folks. This is the only time you will ever see Sam going about his daily job in any Tolkien adaptation that can be both watched AND listened to up to date. Heads up, there was a radio drama which was almost word for word from the books. A bit more on that, later.

Then Bilbo states that things rarely change  in the hobbits’ homeland, The Shire, and that there has always been a Baggins at Bag End. Cut to a side view of Bilbo as he looks and softly utters, “And there always will be”, with a great amount of relief and satisfied contentment in his voice. In the original book, Bilbo was very choosey over who he let inherit his house, because most of his relatives, well…I will be ginger: left much to be desired, especially the Sacksville-Bagginses. Thankfully, these films imply this several times so both savvy and new audiences will get the message. However, the Extended version here makes it even more abundantly clear in an upcoming scene at the party I still canët believe they cut.

We will cover that later, so moving on: Bilbo hears a knocking at the door, and calls for Frodo to answer it. However, it seems the young heir is not in the house  and the audience is treated to a humorous moment where a Bilbo frustrated wonders where his nephew has gone off to while the door rapping becomes louder and more annoying.

Then the scene cuts away to Frodo sitting against the base of a tree reading with Bilboës voice calling him added to the scene. In the theatrical version, we pick up right here after the history of the Ring sans Bilbo’s narration with the caption “50 years later” shown. I have to say, even if what we're just seen was second narration following another one, it is still an improvement, traditional story telling structure be damned. Here’s the thing with anything concerning Tolkien, whether it be his original writings or an adaptation: do not try to apply the norms of story writing and drama to it. You’ll just fall short. I believe our friends Bakshi and Rankin & Bass have already made that immeasurably clear. Jackson and co apply this as much as they can while keeping the films in watch-able lengths. Hence why I hope for a Lord of the Rings TV series someday.

The audience sees Frodo about three-fourths turned away from the camera, resting against the tree. Suddenly, he hears a distant voice half-humming-half-singing a pleasant song (“The Road Goes Ever On and On”, which was intrroduced in The Hobbit), and recognizes the person as Gandalf. Frodo jumps to his feet and turns towards the sound, conveniently located so that he can mug for the camera. Frodo wears an overjoyed expression, so also enjoy this while it lasts, folks, this is the happiest he gets. It is all downhill from here. The young hobbit rushes towards the familiar voice.

The film cuts over to Gandalf, who is seen from behind while riding on horse-pulled wagon. That makes this the third over-the-shoulder-view introduction of a major character in a row. It works well. It is also the last as Jackson opts for traditional frontal or big reveals styles of visual introductions from here on out.

Frodo ascends to the top of a bluff just to the left of the road as Gandalf is riding past and tells Gandalf that’s “[he’s] late” in a mock scolding manner. Gandalf shoots back with, “A wizard is never late, Frodo Baggins. Nor is he early. He arrives precisely when he means to.” The two hold the uppity expressions for a beat before bursting into laughter. Frodo leaps from the bluff to Gandalf and the two embrace. Gandalf light heartedly chides that Frodo couldn’t really think that he'd miss Bilbo’s birthday.

The two talk about the upcoming party, it’s ridiculous scale, and have a good laugh. All the while, Ian McKellen’s Gandalf is soft spoken, friendly, polite, witty, quick, and visibly having a good time. In other words, he has a personality. And not just any personality, mind you. This is THE Gandalf we know and love from the books.

Meanwhile, during the wagon ride, Gandalf and Frodo pass by the party grounds where the locals are preparing for Bilbo’s 111th Birthday. In the original book, Bilbo and Frodo shared the same birthday and this party was for both of them. Frodo was turning thirty-three, which is a hobbit's Coming Of Age. Jackson and co cut it because they were concerned about confusing the audience, but I think they were giving us far too little credit on this one since a single line of dialogue and a good look at the sign the other hobbits are setting up at the party grounds saying “Happy Birthday Bilbo and Frodo Baggins” would have remedied any confusion. However, the loss is not lamentable, as the detail impacts the central plot in no way, shape, or form.

Moving on, now Elijah Wood gets to show us what he’s made of as Frodo gets to show some of the cunning he is known for from the books as well. It turns out that the younger Baggins is well aware that Bilbo is up to something, what with the older Baggins locking himself in his study and taking up reading maps and books of adventurous nature lately. After Gandalf remains tight lipped about the affair, Frodo cracks a smile and announces that Gandalf can keep his secrets, letting the wizard know he knows that he and Bilbo in cahoots. But younger Baggins isnët done yet. He cuts loose with some inoffensive teasing about Gandalf’s title as “Disturber of the Peace”. The wizard insists upon his innocence concerning the events of the Hobbit other than nudging Bilbo out of his front door.

While this talk goes on, the two pass by a grumpy looking hobbit, who I think is supposed to be Mr. Proudfoot, who is sweeping his front doorstep. He glares up at the Istari spirit as he and Frodo pass by one his wagon. Case in point, I suppose. Then some hobbit children run up to the wagon begging for some of the wizard’s fireworks. Gandalf pretends to ignore them, then cuts loose with a minor display that shoots out of the back of the wagon where the rest of the fireworks are stored to appease them. Mr. Proudfoot is even laughing, but Mrs. Proudfoot, who came out between shots, gives him “The Look” and he clamps up and goes back to glaring. Oh, I rarely hear audiences crack up as much as they did in the theater when I first saw this.

 Frodo tells Gandalf that he’s glad the wizard is back genuinely before hopping off the wagon. Give it to Elijah Wood, ladies and gentlemen! He put a lot of genuine emotion and humor into his introduction scene here. He shifts between innocence, mock snobbishness, and to more intellectual and clever manners smoothly, all the while practically reeking of the essence of Frodo. Gandalf quietly answers the feeling in mutual.

Gandalf’s wagon pulls up to Bag End in one final breath taking wide shot that zooms in as the old spirit pulls up to it. He looks lovingly at Bag End and even chuckles at the sign posted at Bilbo’s fence: “No Attendance Except Party Business.” He precedes up to the front door and knocks with his staff, a characteristic right out of the book yet the only rendition to ever feature it is Jackson's. Yes, Jackson even had the actors adapting the character mannerisms described in the book. Name me one other director who has ever gone that far for any other book-to-film adaptation.

Back to the film, after Gandalf gives the door a good rapping, Bilbo’s voice calls out from the other side. “No thank you! We don’t want anymore visitors, well wishes, or distant relations!” - “And what about very old friends?” Gandalf calls back.

In an instant, Bilbo at his opened front door, looking breathless. Ian Holm’s performance is really great for the duration of all his scenes. Bilbo’s over-whelming emotions at seeing his old friend for the time in a long time before running up and hugging him is a Crowning Moment of Heartwarming in it’s own right.

Gandalf conversationally comments on how Bilbo’s respectable age. Immediately afterwards, Gandalf takes a good look at Bilbo and seems a little concerned at how well preserved the elderly hobbit still is. Then he shrugs it off and is welcomed into the abode by his host.

The only problem with this scene is that when Bilbo was shown in the prologue earlier he still had with his trademark red hair and an unwrinkled face. Here, some wrinkles are starting to show, but not by much, and all his hair has gone gray. In the book he was supposed to have been kept perfectly unravaged by time by the Ring. Here, though, he's aged a bit. Well, on the other hand, he doesn’t look too much older. This decision the crew apparently decided on really doesn’t bother me or any others I’ve talked to at all, but I just have to ask why. I guess the angle that Jackson and co were going for is that the Ring will keep it's users in relatively good condition, but some negative changes (looking older) will will come to pass, in keeping with what happened to Gollum. So there is some justifiable logic behind this one.

Gandalf enters Bag End stooping in order to get through the doorway, which is yet another thing that you would think should not be difficult to demonstrate but alas only Jackson seems to bother with. Never in Bakshi’s or Rankin-Bass’s is the fact that humans are cramped in hobbit homes ever touched on or even just shown. In fact, operating under less information, one might even conclude that Jackson was deliberating trying to make up for the other two with the coming sequence.

After allowing Bilbo to take his hat and staff, Gandalf wanders the halls of Bag End for a bit while Bilbo calls out various foods and beverages he can get Gandalf in the background, merrily and energetically going here and there. While looking around, Gandalf backs right into a chandelier, which is level with his head, stops to settle it, and then bumps his head on a room portal. This is actually just Ian McKellen bungling his way through a set far smaller than heës used to, but the camera keeps rolling and he stays in-character and finishes the scene. You will find many other examples of the actors in this series soldiering on in spite of disruptions including actual-honest-to-God injuries, including, but not limited to, broken bones, to finish a take.

Anyway, Gandalf enters Bilbo’s study and finds all manner of document, map, and book laying about confirming Frodo’s earlier claim that the elder Baggins has been pouring over them. Finally Gandalf comes to Bilbo’s writing desk and finds the Map to Erebor/The Lonely Mountain laying atop. It looks exactly, up to the last detail, like it did in the books. Though it seems Bilbo has scribbled the formerly hidden moon letters onto it with visible ink.
          Note: Moon letters, for those unfamiliar, in this setting, are just words written using a special ink that turn invisible unless held up so that the moon shines behind them. It also has to be the same moon that shined the night they were written. So if the messages was written on a full moon, it would be a full moon on which they were next visible. As such Tolkien also stated that it was common in Middle-earth to find multiple messages scrolled just by holding up any work that was tooled with said ink on different nights.

Bilbo also then enters the study expecting to find Gandalf there. He offers to make up some eggs, but Gandalf is gone from the study and instead appears right the hobbit. The wizard states that tea will do. This causes Bilbo to jump, spin around, and have a chuckle at Gandalf’s teleporting antics. Suddenly, there’s a banging at the door as the Sacksville-Bagginses yell and demand to talk to Bilbo.

Bilbo stealthily sneaks up a window and looks out. He confirms that it’s the Sackvilles. He exclaims that they’re after the house and have “never forgiven [him] for living this long!” Then Bilbo begins a short rant about how he has to get away from his relatives who just keep bothering all day, and how he longs to see the things of his youth (The Misty Mountains, Rivendell, Erebor the Lonely Mountain, Lake Town, and such). Then he also wishes to finish writing his book. Gandalf puts in that Frodo suspects something and dearly loves his uncle. Here, you can tell the Istari is just trying to get Bilbo to think about his actions before doing anything. As such, the elder Bagginse respones that he knows, but still intends to go through with his plan and will leave Frodo behind because the younger Baggins is still to in-love with the Shire to leave happily just yet. Bilbo then goes on to explain that lately he's been restless and weary. He sits and continues: "I need a Holiday. A long Holiday, and I expect I shall not return. In fact I mean not to."
      Final Note: both the Sir Ians' acting here is top notch, and you really get a fell for both characters and immediately start to connect with them. Of course, that the productions values on this series were so great that you believe what you're seeing also helps. To quote McKellen: "The Lord of the Rings is a mythology, it is a fairy tale, it is an adventure story. It never happened, except somewhere in our hearts. And yet, there it was, in three-dimensions."

End of Part Sixteen.

Next part, we pick up at Bilbo and Gandalf's talk over-looking the party, and ending with Gandalf taking off to investigate the origins of his old friend's magic Ring.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 18, 2010, 09:02:03 PM
A very interesting read.  I had forgotten about the audio play.  I think I listened to it once.  Interesting as I recall.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 19, 2010, 01:02:56 AM
very well stated weird raptor, as usual. i have a feeling that you have about 30 more parts to cover before reaching your final summation..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 24, 2010, 08:26:14 PM
Thank you both. This weekend, I should be able to get a bunch of work done this. If I'm lucky, we may have another update by the beginning of next week.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 25, 2010, 02:52:06 AM
I look forward to reading it.  Good luck with it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 25, 2010, 04:03:17 PM
I am looking forward to it as well...No rush Wk take your time..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 28, 2010, 05:13:54 PM
It ain't happening this this Monday, I'm sorry to say. I got work done, but I got called in for weekend work unexpectedly.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 28, 2010, 10:47:18 PM
It's ok.  Take your time, there's no hurry.  Thanks for the update.  Only post when you are happy with it, good luck.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 10, 2010, 12:30:32 PM
take your time WR, theres no hurry.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 10, 2010, 03:07:57 PM
Thanks again for the patience.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 10, 2010, 03:08:51 PM
its not a problem Wr.. whenever you get around to it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 10, 2010, 07:01:53 PM
Better to wait and have time to work on it then to rush along to fast.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 11, 2010, 05:17:46 PM
Thanks again. By the way, while I'm working on my LotR paper, I've started a side project that I'll work on whenever I burn myself out on this and I will be posting it also on Written Word.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 11, 2010, 08:30:35 PM
That could be interesting.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 12, 2010, 12:21:26 AM
I hope it is. It's a review of an old cheesy fantasy film I liked as a child. It doesn't hold up too well now, and some it is just laughable. It's only redeeming value is that it has Christopher Lee for about ten minutes.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 12, 2010, 01:08:50 AM
Was it the Last Unicorn? If so I remember watching it..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 12, 2010, 11:26:14 AM
I have the animated version of that movie (the last unicorn) on dvd.  I read the book, a while back.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 12, 2010, 04:18:17 PM
Nope. It's titled The Land of FarAway, as small Swedish production film that rips off so many fantasy cliches that it passes infinity, curves back, and returns as something completely original. It stars Empire of the Son era Christian Bale, George W. from That's My Bush and Crocodile Hunter: Collision Course, Superman's mom Susanna York, Christiopher Lee, and some kid named Nicholas Pickard who went onto absolutely nothing.
The film features giant floating disembodied heads which will transport people from one location to another...by having the person cling to the heads' beards all way...fortune telling wells, apples that randomly turn gold, magical Inner City mailboxes that mail stuff to distant fantasy universes, and winds that suddenly blow harshly at the mention of the villain's name. I am not making any of this stuff up.

The best thing about the entire movie is a song titled Mio My Mio, which is actually quite good. Here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2dAUPGrp5c (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2dAUPGrp5c) The fan video features footage from the film, itself.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 12, 2010, 09:54:57 PM
Sounds like someone was smoking, drinking or sniffing something they should not have been.  Though also imaginative too sounds like.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 13, 2010, 01:51:29 AM
Some of it was imaginative, but over-whelmingly it was By-The-Numbers when it came down to the actual story-telling, but in an amusing way. There are also numerable plot contrivances and holes that trucks could be driven through. You'll just to have see the review. It won't be anywhere near as long as the LotR review, because frankly, it's only an hour and a half long. So it shouldn't take me long to do when I'm not working on my LotR paper.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 20, 2010, 03:50:27 AM
Head's up. New part coming this next week. I've finally gotten some time to work on it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 21, 2010, 09:01:32 PM
looking forward to it WR...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 21, 2010, 11:08:44 PM
Good luck with doing it and being happy with it on the first draft.  No need to overly hurry.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 22, 2010, 02:49:12 AM
It is near completion. I should be able to get it posted by Tuesday night, but we'll see. Ive not exactly had good luck with the deadlines I make for myself.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 22, 2010, 10:20:54 PM
How about a deadline someone else sets for you?  

No hurry, take your time and move at your own speed.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 27, 2010, 10:29:12 PM
no rush Weirdraptor, whenever you are ready..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 13, 2010, 11:52:20 PM
had time to finish it yet WR?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 15, 2010, 06:43:41 AM
Yeah, I just keep forgetting, but I'll get it up soon.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 15, 2010, 10:02:21 AM
No hurry.  Best to wait till you have plenty of time and are happy with it before uploading it here.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 15, 2010, 03:01:38 PM
I know, it's just that work kind of had me tuckered out at the moment. Working consisantly on this paper usually gets pushed back to the far recesses of my mind under "need...sleep..."
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 15, 2010, 03:31:23 PM
I can understand that.  Basic real life stuff does have to come first.  No need to hurry.  You can do that when you have enough time, good luck.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 25, 2010, 02:57:36 PM
take your time, no rush..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on May 11, 2010, 03:38:16 AM
Update, of sorts: Thank you for the support, guys. I'm not giving up on this project, and I hope you will continue to be interested. It may be delayed a bit longer, as I just got a better job as a tech guy in the power plant my mom also works at, but I have to go back to school for a while to get fully qualified. So...I'm off to get registered at the designated University tomorrow and then I'm off to scrape up enough cash for Text books. Oh joy. In the meantime, they've given me a privsionary position...as the janitor. Which sadly still is paying better than either of my other former jobs.
Oh well, soon, I'll be employed fulltime and only have to have one job. I know it seems like I'm bragging, but I'm just psyched. Life finally threw me a bone!
I will update whenever I can, but please continue to be patient. This might be a while.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on May 11, 2010, 09:50:10 AM
That is ok, no hurry.  Good news on your getting a job.  I'm sure you'll do well in the university classes.   :goodluck
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on May 11, 2010, 04:31:32 PM
No Rush Wr, thats great news that you got a job!
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on June 04, 2010, 09:56:55 PM
when will we see another update on this?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 05, 2010, 02:03:11 AM
I'm not sure, to be frankly honest, but it will come. I won't ask for anymore patience, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on June 05, 2010, 08:55:10 AM
No biggie.  I hope things are going ok for you in general.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on June 12, 2010, 12:35:06 AM
take your time then wr.. i'm sure it will be a good one..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 28, 2010, 04:58:34 PM
Work will now continue on this. The next part will be up soon. Thank you for the patient wait.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 28, 2010, 06:16:04 PM
well its good to see you back working on this..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 28, 2010, 09:32:11 PM
No hurry.  We'd rather wait & have you do it as you have time and come out with a article you are happy with rather then a rushed one that you are not happy with.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 29, 2010, 05:01:14 AM
Thank you, but I've got a lot of free time right now, so I should be able to produce material I'm happy with and put it here.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 29, 2010, 02:51:32 PM
Sounds good.  Good luck to that, and remember not to rush, take your time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 30, 2010, 12:22:32 AM
Here we go, just got finished with it this section. Let's get this thing completed!

Part Seventeen: The Game Attempts-Part Fifteen:

From Bilbo’s final words in the previous scene, we make the transition to sundown. Gandalf and Bilbo are overlooking the near complete party grounds while sitting on a bench.
   “Old Tobey! The best weed in the south farthing!” Bilbo exclaims happily as he puffs out a smoke ring. In return, Gandalf takes a smoke and puffs out some smoke shaped like a ship and guides it to pass right through the ring. This is a reference to a scene described in The Hobbit near the beginning. As the dwarves’ unexpected party played out in Bilbo’s living room after many meals, Gandalf and Thorin had a little contest in which Thorin would try to blow out a smoke ring that Gandalf couldn’t guide a smoke ship through. Although this is material from a different book in Tolkien's mythos, it’s still a nice, small moment and unobtrusive to the film. In fact, it’s a nice little moment of Bilbo and Gandalf just enjoying themselves like the old friends they are. Little moments like these are every bit as important as the iconic ones like the Siege of Helm’s Deep. Normal interactions between the characters help further develop them and the audience or reader will grow more attached. I repeat, interactions like these are part of the build-up to later scenes in which audience empathy will be at a height thanks to earlier scenes like this as well as the more important bits. This is something aspiring writers need to learn quickly and also a part of what held the Bakshi and Rankin-Bass films back. There was no time for little bits between characters like this in those earlier adaptations. Two people just enjoying themselves may be less memorable, but are still key as it shows how they relate to one another in general.

Moving on, both of the Sir Ians are so natural in this scene you completely believe this is two olds friends having a nice chat before the night’s festivities. The scene finished with Bilbo telling Gandalf that “this will be a night to remember,” with mischievous gleam in his eyes. The film then promptly cuts to some of the Gandalf’s fireworks exploding in the shape of a tree. The camera follows as bits of light float slowly downwards almost like leaves and finally stops on the partying hobbits below. Some of the hobbits even try to catch the pieces. A nice touch that adds some weight to what would have been otherwise just an effects shot and shows what a simple folk the hobbits, as they've probably not seen anything like this in a quite a while. This is part of what makes the Jackson trilogy so good. No effect is ever just eye candy. It all serves some purpose and it impacts what’s going on in some way.

The hobbits are doing a appropriately folksy dance put to good old fashioned flutes and fiddles. The dance itself is likely inspired by the kind of festivities rural middle class English people which the hobbits are based off of once performed. I honestly did try to track down any direct examples for the inspiration for the dance seen here. I came up with about a few hundred examples of old fashioned British-born festive music just like this, and that was just on YouTube!

Also, take note of Frodo’s dancing. He holds his hands in front of him kind of like a squirrel, ducks down low, and then comes back up using just his legs to nimbly do so. John Belushi did a dance identical to this in National Lampoon’s Animal House. What relevance does that have? Good question. It could be coincidence, since Jackson and co don’t seem like the types to be familiar with the antics of a former SNL member, so I’m guessing Elijah Wood must have just done this impromptu and it was kept in the film. Either way, it fits, surprisingly. Thankfully, this is the first and last time the LotR films will take a cue from anything related to SNL. Of course, it could be argued that Merry and Pippin are two wild and crazy guys.

Meanwhile, we see Samwise shyly looking over his shoulder at Rosie Cotton, who is oh so subtly trying to get him to dance with her. He faces forward and exhales nervously, trying to gather his wits and courage. Frodo plops down at the table next to him and also tries to prompt him into dancing with Rosie. Sam declines, claiming he’ll just have another ale, but Frodo will have none and that shoves Sam right into Rosie’s arms, so the two dance away as Frodo laughs good-heartedly.

See what I meant about smaller moments of character interaction, folks? This set-up of Sam’s love life hardly has anything to do with the quest to stop Sauron, destroy the Ring, and rid Middle-earth of the festering malignancy of the Ring. This bit also only lasts for just eight seconds. Yet, in this scene alone we learn that Sam has a crush on Rosie, is a very innocent and shy individual, and in matters of romance: clumsy and clueless. He’s also just too danged cautious in stepping up for his own good. On top of that, Sean Astin’s acting and the concise writing of the scene carries it all so well that that it’s established perfectly. Within the eight seconds in which this little bit plays out, we already understand a number of things about Sam and have already begun the form a bond with the character, so any further scenes that richen our love of the character will just be icing on the cake from this point on. To anyone thinking of ever writing a story, remember this. Include many moments between characters, both big and small.

On Sean Astin’s Samwise, there are many debates raging on various forums about which actor in this series did their role the best and did their character the most justice. In the depths of all those debates, though, pretty much everyone will agree that Sean Astin did a great job as Samwise to such an extent that he could qualify as the series ensemble darkhorse.

 Back to the film, we cut over to Bilbo telling some hobbit children about his ordeal with the three trolls. What makes this scene work is that Ian Holm was just sat in front of some kids and told to be story teller if he were babysitting. Being the high class actor that he is, as well as being a grandpa, Holm, of course, carries the scene withou flaw. He plays the scene out akin that war veteran relative everyone seems to have recounting his wartime days to the little ones. By the by, the children’s reactions are genuine. Other than Holm memorizing the story, there was no forward practices, so the kids really did get as into the story as it seems. At the closing of the tale, the children’s mother gathers them up. Bilbo inquires if all of them are the mother’s. Upon confirmation he makes a quip about how “productive” she’s been. I would make a comment about getting crap past the radar, but the theatrical version was already PG-13.

Now, this is the part I mentioned earlier that I said I couldn’t believe Jack and co cut from the theater release. Suddenly Bilbo hears the Sacksville-Bagginses calling him and his ear stands twitching. He warns Frodo, who just happened to be passing by and the two hide as the unwelcome relatives attempt to find the old hobbit in a short, comedic scene.

Now what comes is why I can’t believe they cut this. This, before Rivendell, is the only scene where Frodo and Bilbo have any physical contact with each other aside from Frodo knocking Bilbo to the ground during what he thinks is a dragon attack later, despite the two being so close. Anyway, after the Sacksvilles move on without spotting them, Bilbo solemnly turns to Frodo and attempts to try to tell him what he intends to do that night. In what I think was an attempt to both stall and work up the courage, Bilbo tells Frodo why he really adapted him after his parents died. Out of all of Bilbo’s various relatives, Frodo is the one only who showed any real wits and courage. Frodo then asks if his uncle has been into the Old Gaffer’s (Sam’s father) home brewed ale. This unfortunately ruins the moment and Bilbo loses his nerve, ending it with “Youëll be alright“. This short sequence established the close relationship uncle and nephew share concretely in the Extended Version. In the orignal, we are kind of forced to take the film's word for it until Rivendell. Yes, it could argued that the film hyped up the bond they shared effectively, but the term "show, don't tell" comes to mind in response to that.

Meanwhile, on Gandalf’s end, he sets off some smaller fireworks that turn into butterfly shapes and fly away for the children to chase. Gandalf is laughing merrily as the hobbitlings try to catch them. Again, this is what Bakshi and Rankin-Bass’s Gandalf was missing: the ability to lighten up. Also, the children’s reactions to…well, nothing, CGI, actually, is surprisingly good. But then again, if you watch the Extended Edition 'Making Of' features, you see behind the scenes how Jackson played up on the children’s ability to pretend and imagine and got them worked up for the take. Why other filmmakers seem to have a problem grasping this when working with children is beyond me. For that matter, why is Jackson the only filmmaker who seems to get a lot of things?

Moments later Gandalf gets more fireworks from his wagon and leaves it unattended, chuckling as his goes. Merry and Pippin make their entrance. As you all know, they steal one of the fireworks and make off with it.

Here’s the interesting thing, while Bakshi downplayed Merry and Pippin, Jackson plays them and their antics up. Ah, completely different filmmaking philosophies on dealing with these two. Both have their finer and flawed points, but overall, Jackson did a much, much better job playing them up because in Bakshi’s, as I’ve said before, I couldn’t tell them apart. Of course, it didn’t help that they looked almost as alike as Huey, Dewey, and Louie. The only time I ever could tell Bakshi-Merry or Bakshi-Pippin apart were in scenes like in Bree in the Prancing Pony when Merry goes for a walk and almost ends up Wraith food. I say again, I only knew that was Merry because it was Merry this happened to in the book.
Fortunately for Jacksonës version, the characters are much more defined, Dominic Monaghan and Billy Boyd are very distinct individuals, are very lively, and have vibrant on-screen personalities in and of themselves. There is NO mistaking them.

Now, some may point out that the Jackson’s films had more time to develop their personalities in Bakshi’s defense. I say: So? One simple, but well-written line can speak volumes about a character. Or heck, not much needs to said at all. Recall the eight second sequence which introduced Sam's crush on Rosie earlier? Thus a concisely and well written hour and a half film can be very deep and have well defined and developed characters. I have no sympathy for Ralph Bakshiës case.

That being said, the dynamic duo decides to take the explosive into a tent, of all places, to set it off. The audience in the theater I was in were already beginning to laugh at this point. Pippin lights it, but then suddenly the two realize that the firework is neither secured in the ground or outside. They squabble and the thing goes off, taking the tent with it and leaving two blackened hobbits lying on their backs on the ground.

The audience gets a straight down shot overlooking the party from far off the ground as the firework explodes and forms into a dragon shape and it flies right at the camera. It opens its mouth as if to try to eat the audience. There’s a shot that just screams “3D Edition”. The effect looks artificial, but it was deliberate, because Jackson wanted to the effect to look exactly like what it was: an in-story special effect. Anyway, the dragon firework circles around and this is enough to panic the hobbits that begin to flee in terror, falling over tables, chairs, each other, and even themselves. I don’t where Jackson found such good extras that were able to breathe enough life into each and every hobbit that you’d almost swear this party was the genuine deal and he just filmed it using hidden cameras, but kudos to him.

Here is the only contact Frodo and Bilbo had in the theater release before their scenes in Rivendell. Frodo rushes over to Bilbo, warns his uncle of the dragon, and then pushes him to ground when Bilbo shows skepticism and doesn’t react. This is why that little scene the two have after they evade the Sackvilles should have been kept in the theatrical release. It was only a few minutes long and wouldn’t have significantly added to the running time, so I just can’t understand the rationale behind getting rid of it. I cannot reiterate this enough. In fact, I'm scratching my head even as I type.

The party goers look up to see the firework just as it goes off in a display that puts about every big city July 4th celebration I’ve ever seen to shame. The crowd claps and cheers, and completely forgets that they probably trampled dozens of children and elderly in their mad panic.

Cut back to Merry and Pippin, who are patting themselves on the back for the successfully recreating the War of the Worlds Radio Drama panicked mayhem. Excitedly they proclaim need to get another one. Cue Gandalf suddenly appearing and pinching their ears. He calls them each by their full names, Meriadoc Brandybuck and Peregrin Took. Oh yeah, anyone who has ever been in done something really stupid as a child knows what it means when an authority figures calls you by full name afterwards. It means you are in biiiig trouble.

Cut to Gandalf keeping watch on the two as they clean dishes, still with blackened, filthy faces. This gets a chuckle out of me every time. On top of that, Sir Ian finally gets the cute little man servants he’s always wanted. Everyone wins. While Merry is putting another pile of dishes down Bilbo begins his speech at the request of his guests.

“I don’t know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.” Bilbo drops the now infamous bombshell, leaving his guests to figure out the insult or compliment. Holm really knows how to deliver brain breakers well, because here it does come off every bit as clever as it was written. Take heed of this, Bakshi-Bilbo, and your drunken delivery.

Now, Holm’s Bilbo takes out the Ring and puts it behind his back, while trying to find his parting words. After some mild stuttering his says this, “This is the end. I am going now. I wish you all a very fond fair well.” Then he looks fondly directly into Frodo’s eyes, and in a fatherly tone says “Goodbye”. And with that, he vanishes completely. In the book, Frodo was completely in the know of this and was laughing at the guests’ reaction. Here, Frodo wasn’t. I think it adds to the drama of the scene for this film. It impacts the overall plot in no way, shape, or form, so I think we can let this one slide. Bilbo also just disappears, while in the original book Gandalf helped with a flash of magic so no one could ever describe it accurately afterwards. In Bakshi’s version, the Ring itself causes the flashy effect. Here, Bilbo just disappearing was a nice effect, and maybe visually more effective than having Gandalf seemingly make him go up in a firy blaze. Jackson’s philosophy on magic was to keep it subtle and it really works.

Cut to a shot overlooking the party as the party guests search for Bilbo, one guest calling of his name even being faintly heard. The road leading to Bag End is in the lower part of the shot and the camera immediately begins to follow Bilbo’s footsteps as he chuckles to himself about his little trick. The door opens by itself and closes as such. Finally, Bilbo takes off the Ring, flips it in the air triumphantly, and starts readying his things. All the while light-hearted music plays in the background of this quick paced sequence. It’s charming, yet uneasy, because the audience knows Bilbo is playing with fire. We know as we’ve already been shown near countless times in just the less-than-a-hour running time thus far how dangerous the Ring is. So a feeling of apprehension really begins to set in as Bilbo continues to hold onto the evil instrument, and because he’s played so brilliantly by Holmes, we’ve already fallen in love with him.

Suddenly Gandalf arrives out of thin air and startles Bilbo. He reprimands the hobbit for using the Ring so lightly. Bilbo tries to defend himself, but then concedes that Gandalf is probably right. The old spirit inquires about the Ring’s whereabouts and Bilbo tells him that it is in a letter on the mantelpiece. Then Bilbo corrects himself, upon remembering that it is in his pocket. Here, a low dooming rumble in the soundtrack picks up and as Bilbo’s demeanor changes, so does the entire tone of the scene. The way he hesitantly confessed that he kept it in the pocket, as if doing so somehow pains him takes the uneasy feeling up to eleven out of ten.

Then Bilbo begins muttering like a mad man about how he does not want to part with the Ring. Gandalf reaffirms that he thinks Bilbo should leave it behind and inquires if the decision is so difficult. Bilbo at first regains control of himself and looks ready to give it up, but then the audience can literally see the point where the Ring takes control again in his eyes as he hisses “Yes”, it is too difficult. Now the mad muttering has turned into outright ranting before he practically roars, “It’s mine, it came to me!” Gandalf tries to calm Bilbo, but the hobbit will have none of it and the scene culminates with Bilbo calling the Ring his precious. Gandalf, in a concerned tone, points out that Gollum was the one who called it that before and begins advancing towards his old friend.

Then, all hell breask loose with Bilbo growling that what he calls his own things is none of Gandalf’s business. The Istari spirit asks, more forcefully, one more time for the hobbit to give up the Ring, and finally gets accused of wanting it for himself as the result. The wizard, having had enough, cuts loose with a small display of his power by forcing Bilbo against the wall using nothing but his magic as the candles nearly blow out and the floorboards squeak and groan. He roars out that Bilbo should not take him so lightly as a thief and a summoner of cheap tricks. He cools down with a deep breath and the world returns to normal. I liked the handling of this little display. It’s just enough to give the audience a hint of Gandalf’s true supernatural nature, yet subtle enough that it leaves a sense of mystery concerning the old wizard, but isn’t enough to show you how powerful he really is.

Bilbo is finally shocked back to his senses by this and mutters something inaudible before walking up and hugging Gandalf. The wizard says these words with genuine conviction, “All your life, we’ve been friends. Trust me as you once did. Let it go.” Bilbo finally admits, looking deeply disturbed by what just transpired, that the Ring must be passed on. Then, forgetting to get rid of it again, grabs his backpack and walking stick, and starts to head out the door.

Just as he reaches the door however, Gandalf stops him and tells him that the Ring is still in his pocket. Bilbo takes it out and looks apologetic and holds it in the palm of his hand. The camera looks up at him almost at a 90 degree angle as his hand slowly turns over and eventually the Ring drops to the floor. The scene is slow and almost torturous as Bilbo openly struggles with letting it go and looks almost as if he won’t. He does it give it up eventually and the Ring lands with an unnaturally heavy thud. Bilbo hastily steps out his door looking tempted to go back, but just for an instant before returning to his charming self as Gandalf steps into the doorframe behind, perhaps to stop the hobbit if he does try to go back.

Bilbo utters that he thought up the perfect ending for his book and turns to his old friend to say it. “And he lived happily ever after, ëtil the end of his days.” The wizard answers that he’s sure he will, and the two parts ways with Bilbo singing, The Road Goes Ever On and On as he goes.

The sequence takes on yet another bit of well-executed mood whiplash as Gandalf steps back into Bag End, looking down at the Ring. The angling of the camera looks as if the Ring is looking up as Gandalf as he reaches down to pick it up. Just as the wizard’s fingers reach the Ring, a flash of the flaming Eye of Sauron fills the screen briefly and Gandalf withdraws his hand from it at the unsettling vision.

Cut to Gandalf sitting at the fireplace, deep in thought. He recalls Bilbo’s calling the Ring his precious while staring into the flames, perhaps also this also invokes thoughts of the eye he just briefly saw. He begins uttering the word ëprecious’ as he thinks. Frodo enters the house calling for Bilbo. Although he was out of focus, the audience could see as he noticed the Ring and picked up before turning his attention to the Istari sitting by Bilbo’s fireplace.

“He really gone then hasn’t he,” Frodo asked, and Wood’s performance delivers on Frodo's sadness with the prospect that he didn’t even get to say goodbye to his uncle. It’s at this point that Gandalf actually looks at Frodo and smiles friendly before telling his old friend’s nephew what has become of the former master of Bag End. Bilbo has gone to live with the elves, though that Bilbo was actually going to revisit the likes of Lake Town and such are left out for reason I will never fully understand. More on that later.

Anyway, Gandalf announces that Bad Eng, and all of its possessions, Ring of pure evil included, have been left to Frodo. I like McKellan’s acting in this scene. He’s trying to put on a good face, but there’s an underlying concern that Frodo is picking up on, showing the hobbit’s own perceptiveness. Most of Jackson’s films feature such acting that carries subtle implications beyond the surface.

Gandalf holds out an envelope for Frodo to put the Ring in, Frodo wordlessly complies, and then Gandalf seals the letter with the Baggins crest. My only problem here is that I have always thought that Frodo should have been just a might more hesitant about relinquishing the Ring, but I do get that the young hobbit just handing it over is showing us that it’s not affecting him yet.

   It is about this point that McKellan’s Gandalf breaks all pretense of normalcy and instructs the hobbit to never put it on and hide it somewhere safe, all the while readying what belongings he has and heading for the door. Frodo inquires about what is going on and why Gandalf already has to leave. There’s another nice bit of acting as Gandalf stops by the door with a resigned sigh before turning to face Frodo and solemnly announcing that he doesn’t understand yet, either. With one final warning to, “keep it secret. Keep it safe,” Gandalf is out the door. The camera cuts to Frodo and focuses on his face before panning downward towards the envelope containing the Ring, which he is holding. As the pans, Frodo quizzically looks down at the item he’s holding, obviously having figured out that all this fuss is over the Ring of Invisibility, but not knowing why.
   
   Alright, Elijah Wood’s acting in this scene is pretty spot on as you can get a real sense of poor Frodo’s utter confusion mixed with his solemn acceptance of his uncle’s departure. It’s a whole bag of emotions that he had to seamlessly deliver and did so very well. Oh, if only his acting would remain so consistent for the rest of the series. I’ve already commented on McKellan’s acting, and can’t really say much more. He IS Gandalf.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 30, 2010, 06:38:49 PM
very well written as usual.  hopefully your next section won';t take you so long.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 03, 2010, 04:27:53 AM
Thanks. I should be able to get the next bit up in about a week to a week-and-a-half, especially since things aren't going to be as dicey as they were.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 03, 2010, 06:54:52 PM
take your time.. you're doing a great job WR..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 04, 2010, 12:25:30 AM
Just finished reading it.  I had a lot of fun reading it.  Great writing.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 07, 2010, 04:36:11 AM
Thank you, again, Kor and Nick.

You know, it occurs to me that I've never really told anyone online what inspired this little journey of mine, and believe me, when you're going to delve into anything Tolkien related: it's a journey. What follows may very well be the most asinine thing you've ever read. I actually had to think long and hard before daring to press the 'Add Reply' botton.

I suppose this actually started years ago while the Jackson films were still being released and I was rediscovering the story all over again. My interest in previous adaptations was resparked. I liked The Hobbit, by Rankin-Bass, which faithfully retells the story, though simplified. And as I stated before, I absolutely hated The Ralph Bakshi version. I also have little love of the Rankin-Bass Return of the King, which I cannot believe was produced by the same people who made animated Hobbit movie.

Anyway, this venture truly began the Fall before Fellowship's release. The complete Tolkien animated collection came out on DVD, but I only bought the Bakshi version apart from the others, having already owned them on VHS (and the Hobbit on DVD by that point).

I was sixteen, had not yet discovered internet word-of-mouth (I mostly used the net to randomly cruise for sites on stuff I liked at the time), and took that blasted thing home with me and watched it.  :cry ...Suddenly, why the damn abomination had eluded my searches for it back in the days of VHS became very clear. The film was shit and I can't imagine it getting too wide of a video release back in the 90s, in which interest in Tolkien's writings had started to die on a large scale with rise of the 90s Anti-Hero and frikkin death of Superman! Optimistic works like LotR were kind of being left behind.

So, maybe a year and a few months later in early 2003, I made my first Account on any forum ever at Internet Movie Database and found that the film actually had people defending that Godawful mess! And insulted and unfairly criticized the Jackson films to do it!

"Bakshi changed nothing of what he was able to show! Jackson's the one who changed too much!"; "Jackson's films just pretty with SFX! Bakshi's had substance!"; "Jackson has it easy. They gave him three films and a bigger budget. Bakshi's modest little movie still more powerful than that commercial load of crap!"; "It was a different time!"; and (Insert insipid excuse here).

This mindset baffles me, as no Bakshi fan ever comes up with a reasonable argument as to why his version was supposedly better. Yet they insist it was the more powerful adaptation of the two. I can't understand why, frankly. I suppose I may have a case of Opinion Myopia, but really, the matter of the fact is that Bakshi's little film here is poorly made, written, and paced. That's not just values dessonance talking, either. The animation quality is poor, even by 1970s standards. Disney's The Rescuers, was released the year before, and anyone who has seen will attest that the overall quality of the film was infinitely better (and having Don Bluth on board probably helped).

I could understand if its a case of nostalgia or "so bad its good", but genuinely fighting to the death in an argument trying to convince fans of the Jackson adaptation just stuns me, as its clear to anyone who doesn't hold Bakshi dear to their hearts at an obsessive level that the Jackson films are better. No contest. And that's the thing, these people are defending Bakshi over Jackson, and they fail to take one party in this into consideration: Tolkien, himself.. Yeah, they do say Bakshi adapted it more faithfully, but I've never seen one example aside from I've unearthed, myself, while working on this very paper.

So, my reason for writing this can be classified in one word: fanboyism. I'm sick of Bakshi's fans defending the piece of unadulterated crap that is The Lord of the Rings-Part One as if it were the goose that laid the bleedin' golden egg. Had Tolkien lived a few more years and had the misfortunate of seeing what Bakshi did to his legacy, I doubt he would have survived the experience.
So yeah, this is all one big biased steamroller fanboy rant, and I admit that.

Enough ranting, I'll wrap this up on a postive note. Working on this thus far has been a pleasure and great fun all around (though watching and rewatching specific portions of the films with Microsoft Word at the ready can get tedious, especially when it was still the Bakshi film I was writing about). And I've found that research can be fun when the topic is very dear to your heart. I'm a sad, obsessive fanboy, and you guys have even called me on it once or twice. And I'm loving every minute of it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 07, 2010, 05:39:39 AM
Not sure if its alright to post twice in a row, but here goes.
I've fallen enough in love with going through a wok scene by scene and observing what works and what doesn't that I may start doing this with others (shorter) pieces of fiction.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 07, 2010, 04:35:37 PM
i'm looking forward to seeing you compare the 2012 hobbit to the rankin bass version. this assumes of course that the film is made..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 07, 2010, 04:50:41 PM
So you've heard del Toro quit as the director, too? Yeah, that film just runs into one problem after the other. I think if they just let it be one film that there would be little problem in getting it made. There's little point in extending The Hobbit beyond what it was meant to be.
What I'm afraid of that by adding stuff like The White Council and the Necromancer that the focus will no longer be on Bilbo.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 07, 2010, 09:06:34 PM
Jackson is likely going to direct. the White Council will likely come into play in the second film.. after all you should try and explain where Gandalf heads off after he leaves Bilbo and the dwarves in Mirkwood. The problem is MGM is frikking bankrupt to the tune of 5 billion, and they hold the rights to the film..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 07, 2010, 09:38:12 PM
He may cut back & forth, like was done in the Lord of the Rings movie.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2010, 12:24:34 AM
Perhaps... I dunno, I'm still cynical on the direction they're taking Tolkien's first published Middle earth adventure. Maybe I'm just being a old fogey purist complainer here, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2010, 12:58:11 AM
:)  This is what I have done currently. It's not much, but I figured it's better than nothing. So...

Part Eighteen: The Game Attempts-Part Sixteen

Building off of the momentum of the previous cut with Frodo staring at the envelope containing the Ring, the filmmakers are prompt in cutting to a shot of Cirith Ungol, the fort guarding the walls and Gate of Mordor.  This is also where Frodo will eventually come to be held captive after his encounter with Shelob, which actually made it into Jackson’s version, but I’ll tackle that when we come to it.

   The angling of the shot is from above the dark lands of Mordor, looking down, and sweeping across, focusing on one of the topmost watch towers before lowering to a point where it is beneath the various bridges that cross into it. The camera looks up at the tower we get a real good look at it. It’s a dark, mechanical-esque, and evil looking tower, appropriately. It’s similar to camera work we would find when a helicopter employed. Various torch lights can be seen everywhere, giving the impression that there is a lot of activity going on inside. There are also lights on the bridges, signifying the gathering forces. And of course, Howard Shore’s Mordor motif is playing in the background, as the intimidating cherry on top. We also hear a creature cry out in agony before the words “Shire” ; “Baggins”  are shouted at full volume.

   On a side note: That tower? A huge model. Those torch lights? Christmas lights they strung up. Proof that in order to make something good…well, okay, there’s no way Cirith Ungol can ever look good. Er, proof that you don’t have go with super expensive CGI to make your villain’s territory scare the pants off of your audience.

   Cut to the Entrance of Minas Morgol, Lair of the Lord of the Nazgul, as the gates opens and out come the Black Riders. As it opens, an eerie and ominous yet subtle green glow appears as it radiates out of the fort like a poisonous gas. In fact, the green tint seems to have infected the entire landscape around the surrounding area, and it’s rather unsettling to look even look at, let alone think about.

   Anyway, the Ringwraiths ride out as the Ominous Elvish Choir picks up. On black steeds, these creatures each resemble the classic look of the Grim Reaper, which when well done is nightmare fuel incarnate. These are well done. The established gritty, infectious atmosphere, dramatic music, and the well done costuming all combine to make their grand entrance into this film one that had we, the audience, frightened from the first time we saw these…things.

   Cut to Gandalf riding over the Middle earth landscape and stopping at the top of a bluff overlooking both Gondor and even more distantly, Mordor. Once the view following the wizard reaches the top, we see the gathering clouds and lightning over the Dark Lands. We get a close up to Gandalf’s face, which wears a grim expression. He pauses only briefly before getting his horse to get going with great haste to Gondor.

   On Gondor: If you’ve read the books, you know exactly what the ancient Numenorean city is. This is where Jackson’s film here kind of skimps on the details, because I still remember people from almost nine years ago when I first saw the film asking ëwhere in the heck is he’. I suppose a subtitle might have been nice, but overall pointless, because any non-savvy film goers wouldn’t even know what Gondor is yet. The truth is, there is no easy solution for this one, because we can hardly exact the film to go out of its way to explain Gondor before necessary. Besides, the point of the sequence is that Gandalf is going to a city with documentation on the War of the Ring 1 and the magic rings. He’s led into the study by a retainer where he begins thumbing through old Gondorian documents. We get a short montage of him going this, giving the impression of passing time. We even see him drinking some sort of beverage, implying that he really has been here a while.

   At last, his eyes fall on something of interest, and we get a voice over of what I think is Ian McKellan as Gandalf reading, but the actor who played Isildur also has a deep and rough voice, so I can’t tell you for sure. This is what Gandalf reads: “The year 3434 of the Second Age. Here follows the account of Isildur, High King of Gondor and the finding of the Ring of Power. It has come to me. The One Ring. It shall be an heirloom of my kingdom. All those who follow in my bloodline shall be bound to its fate for I will risk no hurt to the Ring. It is precious to me though I buy it with a great pain. The markings on the band begin to fade. (Intercut with a shot of the Ring shrinking to fit Isildur’s hand while the writings fade.) The writing which had been as clear as red flame, has all but disappeared. A secret only fire can tell.” Also interlaced with the dialogue is a full on flash backs from the prologue.

   Alright, on the entire sequence: Starting from Gandalf taking off into the night from Bag End, to the shift to Mordor, Gollum revealing the names ëShire’ and ëBaggins’, to the Ringwraiths exiting Mordor to hunt this 'Baggins' down, and Gandalf researching the Ring, its fast-paced, intense, and it gives a real sense of urgency as the hands governing the world begin to move. I know I was gripped with apprehension as this all picked up. In essence, its a rush.

   Moving on, the unsettling feeling of suspense and incoming terror does not let up as we find the Ringwraiths already in the Shire.  Some random hobbit is chopping firewood when his watchdog begins barking at something approaching him.  The music where is low following the less-is-more philosophy. The camera is now from the wraith’s point of view, sort of. We see the world clearly as if it were from an ordinary person’s perspective, but I won’t split hairs over this, because obviously Jackson and co couldn’t give their audiences a black screen with vague shapes to look at. That's what arthouse films are for.  :lol:

   The hobbit begins backing up towards his house in terror, and it is too little wonder why. The large, black figure of death with nasty pointed armor at its arms and legs sitting atop a black steed is very effectively intimidating and not just to him. To us, the audience as well! The dog backing away in fear into the hobbit hole didn’t help matters.  Then the nightmarish nature of the Nazgul basically reaches corporeal form when it speaks, using a genderless demonic hiss of a voice, inquiring, “Bagginsss. Ssshire.”

   The hobbit hastily replies that no Baggins live in the locale, but as the wraith turns its horse directly at him to starts advancing, he points in the direction it needs to go, telling it to go to Hobbiton to find its target.

   To quote Peter Jackson: “Ringwraiths. They’re the things nightmares are made of.” And yes, I will be using the term ënightmare’ a lot when talking about these guys, because these things still scare me and sometimes still haunt my dreams!
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 08, 2010, 01:26:15 AM
Great fun to read.  Thanks for posting it.  I look forward to the next one.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 08, 2010, 06:57:27 PM
nice work Wr..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 09, 2010, 05:38:31 AM
Thanks, guys.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 09, 2010, 09:12:36 PM
well, the kudos are well-deserved.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 25, 2010, 11:13:08 PM
Next part is coming soon, guys. Hit a bit of a book related snag when it came to a minor character's name. I'm having to basically reread an earlier part the blasted book again looking for his scene.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 26, 2010, 02:34:43 AM
Some character names can be hard to keep track of and remember.  

& I think I read there is at least 1 elf from I think the first age, or from the hidden elf city or kingdom, at least if I remember correctly, who died in the first or second age and appears in the lord of the rings that Tolkein decided was sent back to middle earth either before the istari did or with them.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 26, 2010, 07:59:55 PM
indeed and the characer may only appear in the books briefly...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 27, 2010, 06:45:43 PM
That's exactly the problem...the character in question is the douche hobbit Saruman was bribing to convince the other residents of the Shire that all was well in Middle earth and that there were not any wars brewing.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 27, 2010, 09:30:29 PM
You need his name?  Or something else?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 27, 2010, 10:22:08 PM
That, and I'm double checking the conversation between him, Sam, Frodo, and the Gaffer.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 27, 2010, 10:59:35 PM
Oh lets see, its the hobbit wormtoungue kills.. I think his name is Billl
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 28, 2010, 12:24:08 AM
hmm
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 28, 2010, 07:31:09 PM
I found him (Bill) about the same time I checked back here. Work will now continue. Thank you both, all the same. I've gotta as far as Gandalf discovering Sam at the window. I may post it here as is, because there was a ton to discuss where Gandalf was telling Frodo all.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 01, 2010, 01:09:28 AM
good I got the name right... :) keep up the good work...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 08, 2010, 11:41:34 PM
Slight Update: I've decided that I'm also going to begin posting this on "Essays" section on FictionPress.Net while continuing to post it here, as I've had a friend of who has been coming here to read it as well inform me that the white letters on black is hard on his eyes when reading long term.
So to anybody who agrees with him, "WeirdRaptor's The Lord of the Rings Adaptation Face-Off: Jackson vs Baskhi vs Rankin-Bass" will also be available on FictionPress.Net in the Essay section.

http://www.fictionpress.com/ (http://www.fictionpress.com/)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 09, 2010, 05:11:11 AM
Part Ninteen: The Game Attempts-Part Seventeen:

Cutting away from the wraith practically pulling Jack Bauer tactics on hapless hobbits, the audience finds itself at the Green Dragon, a popular pub among the hobbits as established by Tolkien.

Now, there were two different ways the different cuts did this. In Original Theatrical Edition, it just cuts to the pub where Frodo, Sam, the Old Gaffer, Bill, and some other hobbits are gossiping about current affairs in Middle earth. In the Extended Edition, the sequence begins with Merry and Pippin singing a drinking song at a table (or in Pippin’s case, on the table).

I have to say I that I do lean a bit towards the theatrical edition with this one. While Jackson and company made good use of Mood Whiplash to keep the audience on its toes earlier, the darker atmosphere of going from the wraiths to the hobbits talking about the growing darkness in distant lands keeps the tension on as needed at this point. The reason for this is because we are at the doorstep of the first of many turning points in the story. Cutting from the wraiths search for the Ring and then going to a crowd of hobbits enjoying drink and song is a bit of a tension breaker, though that also has an advantage which I shortly cover. In the end, I will admit that it’s a nice little sequence and Billy and Dom’s classically trained voices mesh well. I can take it or leave it.

Anyway, moving onto the conversation between the hobbits: the old gaffer and some of his chums are shaking their heads at the disturbing rumors of battles and gathering armies in distant lands that they’ve been hearing about even as far as out as the Shire. Both in the book and in this film, this was a good way to show how bad the situation was growing in Middle earth. If even the hobbits in spite of their isolationists ways are getting wind of the greater struggle of good (Gondor; Rohan) and evil (Mordor; Isengard), then it must be bad. AND IT IS, as we soon learn.

As for the actual conversation, it plays much as it did in the book. Bill, the traitorous hobbit Saruman was bribing in the book, tries to insist that nothing is wrong. He brushes off the Gaffer’s talk of gathering armies “far off stories and children’s tales”. I found it odd that they even kept Bill for this scene as Jackson told us from the very beginning the Scourging of the Shire was going to be cut. In fact, it’s kind of charring considering what a negative presence he is here. He rudely brushes off the Old Gaffer and even speaks overly derogatory of Bilbo calling him “cracked” as genuine insult.
However, it’s awesome to see the Gaffer talk his insults and turn them around into light hearted banter to stop his tract, by jokingly stating that Frodo is starting to “crack”, which the Baggins in question further derails by proclaiming his pride in doing so.

   Bill finishes up with that everyone should just mind their own business and they’ll be no trouble from the outside world. So, in the book, he’s a traitor to his own people. Here, I suppose he’s just supposed to represent the worse of the hobbits’ isolationist attitude. The scene works, all in all, but considering the lack of scourging the Shire at the end, it still feels off having this nasty toad of a hobbit talking smack about Bilbo and being dismissive of the Gaffer.
   
   In the midst of the above, we get another small moment with Sam and Rosie as the gardener’s eyes drift over her, and their eyes meet. She gives him a warm look and he shyly looks away. Just like the earlier bit between the two at the party, this moment works as it is unobtrusive and quickly over with.

   After the conversation with the proverbial twit Bill, we cut ahead to later in the evening when the Inn is closing. Frodo and Sam pass by Rosie who bids each of the customers a good night as they pass. A somewhat drunken Sam is able to smile like a smitten school boy at her as he leaves. Sean Astin as Sam is just too adorable is these scenes. His pleasant mood changes when Bill bows and proclaims Rosie “sweet maiden of the golden ale” before stalking off to haunt other victims with his jackassery. Sam mutters that Bill had better ëmind who he’s sweet-talkin’. Frodo reassures that Rosie knows what an idiot he is and was just humoring him with that smile. This was another nice little bit, though more pronounced than any of the others Sam-Rosie moments. That’s probably why this particular bit was cut from the theatrical version, though it would only have added ten seconds to the running time.

   The next short scene also works as the conclusion the sequence Shire-related scenes as well. In the theater released cut, straight from Bill’s ending words, “Keep your nose out of the trouble and no trouble will come to you,”, we skip ahead to Sam and Frodo parting ways at the walk in front of Bag End.

   As Frodo walks up the stone steps to Bag End, the camera suddenly shifts to POV came watching him from one of the darkened windows as low and foreboding music kicks in. Frodo makes no notice of the opened windows as he enters and finds his home darkened with wind bustling in. He looks around with a confused look on his face, implying that he didn’t leave the windows open. Over his shoulder, we see a hand suddenly emerge from the darkness and it grips his shoulder. The moment is well played enough the both Frodo and audience jump from the sudden contact. In fact, I believe my own heart skipped a beat before they revealed that it was Gandalf, at which point relief warms over. Here, we get a more intense echo of Gandalf earlier words, “Is it secret? Is it safe?” Obviously this is in reference to the Ring.
   
   The film cuts to Frodo piling things out of a chest as Gandalf stands watch, even whirling around ready for a fight when he hears something behind him. At last Frodo comes to the envelope which contains the Ring. He exclaims and holds up only to have it snatched from his hand by Gandalf as the hobbit looks on with more confusion. Now, while the dark and ominous set-up here is very different from the book, it works. Like I said, with the fast approaching wraiths, Jackson and crew had the task of keeping the pressure as to keep the audience swept up in the excitement. They succeeded. Cinematically, it certainly works better then them quietly talking about it in the middle of the day by the fire place. Another touch I liked is that he actually had Frodo follow Gandalf’s advise and kept the Ring hidden and having never worn it. In the books, he quite stupidly kept it in his person, though on it’s chain. The deviation here actually appeals this Frodo to me more somewhat.

   The wizard rushes over to the Baggins’s roaring fireplace and tosses it in. Frodo apprehensively asks what on Middle earth the old spirit is doing, but holds himself back from doing anything, obviously showing a great deal of trust for Gandalf. Gandalf cautiously reaches into the fire with tongs rather than his bare hands. Honestly, how could Bakshi screw this up? Anyone with even rudimentary knowledge of fire places knows about tongs! Anyway, he pulls the Ring out and tells the hobbit to hold out his hand. Frodo gives a classic “What?!” look, but the wizard assures him that the Ring will not burn him. So the Baggins reluctantly holds his palm out and even flinches as Gandalf plops onto his opened hand. Let’s face it, if someone had just tossed a metal object into a fire and then told you it was still cool to the touch of bare skin: would you believe them? Gandalf then quickly rushes past the hobbit and keeps his back to the Ring. I love how they’re obviously showing him taking steps not to fall under its power. The performances in these films truly are something else. He asks if Frodo sees anything. Of course, it at first looks plain, and we get another moment of great acting from McKellen as Gandalf starts to look relieved like, “Whew, dodged that bullet”. But then, after a moment, the markings appear, which Frodo confirms to be some form elvish which he can’t read. Gandalf solemnly and resignedly sighs and turns to face the hobbit, and recites what the poem inscribed loosely translates, ëfor he will not utter the black speech here’. “One Ring to rule them all. One Ring to find them. One Ring to bring them and in the darkness bind them!”

   Well, Jackson and company, again you succeed at keeping your audience enthralled and at the edge of their seats. This sequence was and is very effective. Nothing is overblown, it’s all low-key and the subtle implications put into both performances lit up the screen and made us buy what was being told with absolutely success. This is how you do a movie.

Note: Jiminey....my Word program reads this at 53,000 words and 119 pages thus far!
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 09, 2010, 11:54:40 AM
Great job WR, and you're not nearly done even after 119 pages, to do the stories justice, as you have so far will likely take 200-250 pages.. since we havent covered 2-3rds of the story yey :)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on September 09, 2010, 09:41:38 PM
Very Interesting read indeed.  I look forward to more, no hurry.  Post at your own rate of speed & when you can.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 11, 2010, 06:36:12 AM
Thank you both. Again, I greatly appreciate the support.

Hey, here's a bit of an odd update to top this post off. You know how we all thought Bakshi, Rankin-Bass, and Jackson were the only ones who made adaptations you could both watch and listen to? Well, from Finland, allow me to present Hobbit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Koj0V7G46fs&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Koj0V7G46fs&feature=related)

This is part one of the first episode of an just-for-FInnish-TV Mini-Series that's (somewhat) an adaptation of LotR. I said I would recap and compare each movie/TV rendition, so it looks like the scope of the paper just made its way to obscure European TV. I will not be reorganizing what I have so far, though. While I am trying to keep this chronilogical as each successive rendition made by American studios is influenced by its predecessors in some way, this... Honestly, this is completely unconnected to anyone else's try at Tolkien's work. I think I can afford to just add this on after I've covered all three of the Jackson films.
Then I sum up each adaptation's strengths and weaknesses and give a final verdict and then I'll have finished this paper at long last. That's still going to be quite a while, though.

EDIT: Don't miss Samurai Boromir.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on September 11, 2010, 09:42:19 AM
Interesting.  I've never heard of that version and watched the video link you gave.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 11, 2010, 01:30:00 PM
thankfully you're not covering every version of LOTR :)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on September 11, 2010, 03:44:43 PM
Then it would take quite a while I think and be even larger then you can imagine.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 11, 2010, 04:34:15 PM
Absolutely. That's why I'm sticking with just the movies and TV. I can't wait to rip into this one for my paper after I'm Jackson. It looks like a solid so-bad-its-good, which I'm not sure I'm willing to accept from a Tolkien adaptation.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 11, 2010, 06:15:26 PM
exactly, you have enough trouble getting a good adaptation... :)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 17, 2010, 10:33:10 AM
I regret to announce that the internet server in my area is down. In fact, this is the third time in a quarter year this has happened. Yeah, my server sucks.
 I'm posting this from my laptop at a MccDonald's. I'm basicaly on gasoline provision right now, so I won't be leaving unless I have to, so I won't be posting any updates for a while. Just keep an eye on the "Written Word" section because I don't know when it will be back up.

I have quite a bit done. In fact, I'm about to enter Two Towers territory, you can expect some hefty updates when it comes down to it.

EDIT: also, I'm not just posting my updates from here because the flashdrive the paper is on is one of two special drives that contain the creative and other writings I've done on my spare time. They don't leave my house and stay in a desk drawer when not in use. They are precious to me. Yeah, I know that sounds a bit obsessive, but the practice comes from my own God given ability to lose very small things quite often.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on September 17, 2010, 12:04:17 PM
:goodluck I do hope things improve for you and things get back to normal for you soon.  Thanks for keeping us informed.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 17, 2010, 05:29:05 PM
looking forward to seeing the when they are posted.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 25, 2010, 01:26:19 AM
i hear you on that Wr plus well you've been writing this paper for months now...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 27, 2010, 01:30:47 PM
Part Twenty: The Game Attempts-Part Eighteen:

The next scenes begins with Gandalf explaining to Frodo what the relevance of the Ring is. The camera is centered on the Ring laying on Frodo’s table as he speaks. It then cuts to a side view of the two sitting at Bag End’s main dinner. Gandalf speaks with low tones as Frodo wordlessly serves them both up some tea. There is no background music at this point in the scene though it does pick up in just a bit. This scene is entirely reliant of the actor performances and setting to keep audiences interested. A character is played by Ian McKellan is sitting at this table, though, so it’s no problem.
   
Also, this is one of many Forced-Perspective shots. No computer effects were used to create the illusion of Gandalf and Frodo’s difference in size here. It’s just that McKellen is closer to the camera and Wood is more far off. The table is specifically constructed to look like it is one and the same despite being two different scales for the actors involved. The final result looks like a three-four foot tall guy serving tea toan average sized one. The effect is perfect in this scene. The only other angles used in this scene are fairly close shots of both actors.
   
   Frodo tries to find some hope that this isn’t as bad as Gandalf is making it out to be by reaffirming that Sauron was destroyed…right? Right? Well, no, Gandalf is all too aware of the nature of the Ring and he begins explaining what we, the audience, already know in shortened form. They actually filmed the entirety of Gandalf’s version of the opening narration, as in the original cut that screen that went to screenings for the very first time had Bilbo’s “Concerning Hobbits” as the narration and the story of the Ring came out here at Frodo's dinner table in its full form. As previously stated, Jackson and co eventually decided that was too typical and recut the film.

Wood lets his eyes do most of the talking in this scene, as they go from just slightly afraid to dreading to mind terror. The Ring’s Theme slowly and quietly picks up and plays as it goes on, and only serves to add to the foreboding feeling.

When Gandalf finally makes it clear that Sauron will never cease looking for the Ring, Frodo grabs it and marches into his living room announcing that they will hid the vile band and never speak of it again. “Nobody knows it’s here, right?” After there’s no answer, he repeats the question, looking like he’s about one more fright away from a heart attack. Cue the revelation that Gollum knew the name Baggins and that he was from the Shire, and was captured by the enemy. Upon realizing this, Frodo tries to give the Ring to Gandalf, who backs up a few steps and insists that he cannot take it. After the young hobbit tries to pressure him again, he finally yells that he cannot be trusted with it. “I would use this Ring from a desire to do good, but through me, it would wield a power too great and terrible to imagine.” There are several pauses in the dialogue that help stretch out the tension here already unbearably, by the way. Intercut between when Frodo is still trying to give Gandalf the Ring is a short sequence in which a hobbit is beheaded by a wraith passing on horseback. An excellent kick the dog moment to remind us that Frodo will be up against bad, bad people.

Anyway, Frodo finally mans…er, hobbits up and asks what he must do. From here, we cut over to a quick montage of Frodo preparing to leave The Shite altogether as Gandalf instructs him to head to Bree, by way of staying off of the road and leaving the name, Baggins, behind. Gandalf in the meantime will be meeting Saruman, the “wise” and powerful head of the Istari Order. Fortunately, Frodo replies that he knows how to cut across country and that he’ll be able to make no problem. This impresses Gandalf enough to comment on what resilient creature the hobbits are, and yet that it wouldn’t take more than a month to learn all of their ways. He says this with warmly and actually causes Frodo to smile and look calm for the first time in the sequence.

But then the two hear a noise at the oddly opened window. This always bugged in both the films and the book. Why by Gimli’s beard did Gandalf and Frodo leave any windows open?! I can understand why they were open when Younger Baggins returned home to find that Gandalf had broken in earlier in this film, but honestly! I guess both of them might have just got caught up in the momentum of the moment when the Ring’s true nature revealed itself. But it’s nowhere near being the problem it was in Bakhi’s version which had they loudly talking about in the middle of Hobbiton at night and thus interrupting…whatever the hell Sam was doing out there when Gandalf caught him.

That said, what was this version's Sam even doing here? In the original books, he, Merry, and Pippin were all part of a conspiracy that was onto Bilbo’s little disappearing acts and kept up on what the Baggins and Gandalf were up to. Since it was the middle of the day when Frodo and Gandalf made they plans about what to do about the Ring, he pretended to garden while listening in. However, while the film has the sense to keep Frodo and Gandalf in Bag End, the conspiracy never happens. So, why was Sam spying on Frodo in the middle of the night? Well, Jackson and co did have a version of the sequence which had all three of the other hobbits sneak into Frodo’s house and listen to the whole conversation before being discovered and forced along for the journey. Here, though? Well, we saw Sam a bit drunk earlier, so maybe he thought he would go night gardening, because hey, he was drunk and it sounded like a good idea at the time! From there, he overheard Frodo’s panicked raised voice and listened in.

Anyway, Gandalf goes over to investigate the window and jabs Sam with his staff before hauling him into the house. He menacingly demands to know what Samwise was doing spying on them and how he heard. Sam, at first, insists he overheard nothing important, but then confesses that he overheard them and “[he] heard quite a bit about a dark lord, a Ring, and some about the End of the World!” I have to say that Sean Astin’s delivery was always hilarious to listen to right here. Especially the part about the end of the world! Anyway, he begs not to be turned into the Bakshi Samwise/something unnatural, and Gandalf mock-nefariously leans in and announces that he’s found a better purpose for Sam. Cue Sam making a “this isn’t going to hurt, is it?” face before it humorously cuts to the poor gardener trying to keep up with the wizard and his employer somewhere in the woods.

We cut to later with Gandalf warning them to be careful and that Sauron even has birds and beasts that have allied themselves with him. The wizard is leading a horse along while the two hobbits are without equestrian steeds. He turns around and asks if the Ring is safe. Frodo feels for it in his jacket pocket and confirms that it is. The old spirit gets on knee as to at eye level with Frodo and again warns him never to put it on and that all of Sauron’s servants will be drawn to it. Most times, when films get repetitive like this, it gets annoying, fast. Here, it actually works because Jackson and company are hyping up how important it is that Sauron never get his hands on the Ring again and it’s working. With that, Gandalf gets onto his horse and rids off, leaving the two to exchange, “We’ve really stepped into it this time” expressions before they head off in a different direction, towards Bree. Not much to say other than this is another well-done scene.

We are treated to some shots of them traveling before the scene sets on a cornfielf as the two are marching single file. Sam stops at a certain pace and looks around, nervous. He announces that in more step, he’ll be farther from home than ever before. Frodo reassures him with some words of wisdom from Bilbo and the two are off again after Sam takes that first dramatic step. I particularly like how that first one was a big deal for Sam, and its right out of the book. I don’t remember the exact numbers, but in the conversation with the traitorous Bill, the book does mention that Sam had a great wealth of knowledge of the geography both in and surrounding Hobbiton, up a few named precise points. I also like how that what Frodo uses to reassure Sam is a quote from Bilbo, also from the book: “It’s a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you can’t keep your wits, you never know where you might be swept off to,”, showing that it isn’t just distance that makes a journey.

Next up is another scene that was deleted from the Theatrical Cut, and I can see why, though it is a nice scene. You might remember a screenshot of Frodo sitting in the fork of a tree with a pipe relaxing from the promotional material of the first movie? This scene is where it comes from. In fact, after the scene opens with the camera looking up at the sky and then panning down, that’s the first thing we see.

The two hobbits are preparing camp for the night, well, Sam is, anyway, when they hear elvish singing in the distance. Sam looks questioningly up at Frodo as the master of Bag End excitedly, almost like a child, exclaims “wood elves!”

Cut to the two running through the flora of the woods before they stop and kneel behind a log from a spot that looks out on the band of elves traveling to the West. Of yes, how could I forget to harp on this when I was reviewing Bakshi? Yet another plotline he left out entirely was that the elves and their magic were leaving Middle-earth, never to return. This is both largely a bittersweet happening, as the elves were the First Born of the Valor (the gods of Middle-earth) and they were responsible for laying down most of the foundations on which later cultures would be built on originally. Now they leaving the land which they dwelt on for such a long time behind and going to the Gray Havens, the Lands Beyond. The elves are essentially fighting the long defeat as they numbers dwindle and not from death on the battle field, though that happens, too. The elves had taken many a beating throughout the ages of Middle-earth and were passing onto a peaceful land that was exclusively for them to inhabit. Read The Silmarillion, you’ll see why they grew weary of the Middle-earth in its completion. You’ll also see why they have absolutely nothing to be proud of.

In the next scene, we see the two hobbits trying to get some sleep out in the woods as Sam comments that something’s poking into his back no matter where he tries to lie down. Frodo suggests imagining he’s back home, but after a moment, Sam whines that it isn’t working. A short, humorous scene. Shame it was lost, as the theatrical versions never touch on how hard this trip is on the hobbits until much later. The camera also positioned so that it faces Frodo, who is on his side so that his face is facing the camera. He is one the right side of the screen while Sam is further back at he left side, allowing us to see both of them. The two actors then just act out the scene. This kind of filmmaking shows a restraint not scene in any films lately.

Now the film cuts away from the pair and focuses on Gandalf. He is on horseback going at full gallop across the across the Middle-earth countryside. As it shows him doing this, we get a voice over from Christopher Lee, “Smoke rises in the east…” blah blah, “…and Gandalf the Gray reads to Isengard, seeking my council.”

And Isengard looks…well, about as gorgeous as a tower that looks like it was made with the sorrow of others can be. This thing is pure black with nasty jagged edges and all manner of otherworldly designs carved into it. Only a madman would want to live here. The very design of this place, aside from the casting being Christopher Lee as Saruman, probably tipped even the most unfamiliar with Tolkien that this was a bad guy Gandalf was talking to. Back to the tower: I remember marveling at how real it looked in the theaters back in 2001. Then I found out it kinda was. The tower you see in each and every shot? A model added into the scene in Post-Prod.

As for the acting and interaction between Gandalf and Saruman: it is as brilliant as you’d expect what with having two master actors like Ian McKellen and Christopher Lee on screen together. McKellen plays the scene as genuinely as always, being a friend in need of advice about the current situation. With Lee as Saruman, when Gandalf isn’t looking, we catch glimpses of contempt and superiority cracking through the mask of friendship he puts on. Both of these performances are perfectly in-characters for who they are playing. Anyway, the two talk about how the Ring has been found. Gandalf is optimistic that they can still stop Sauron dead in his tracks if they don’t waste any time before acting. Saruman is less positive and asks what time does Gandalf think they still have.

Cut to the interior of Isengard. We see both Gandalf and Saruman have taken to some archives which has papers littering a table Saruman is sitting at while Gandalf stands and listens to the White wizard’s update on what Sauron’s forces are doing. All the information is explained clearly enough that the audiences gets the idea. Plus, Lee is a master enough actor (nicknamed “Mr. One-Take”, for his ability to absolutely nail his dialogue and acting on the first try most of the time) in order to be able make this sound credible. At the end of his update, Gandalf asks how he could possibly know what all Sauron is up to. Saruman turns to the chamber where the palintir is kept, saying, “I have seen it.”

Cue Gandalf rushing into the palintir room, uttering that these things are dangerous. Saruman arrogantly asks why they shouldn’t use them and takes the cloth which had been covering the thing off. Gandalf takes the cloth and covers it again, stating that they’re really playing with fire here while Saruman takes a seat at a throne, also in the chamber. Yeah, a spirit brought to Middle-earth for the sole purpose of protecting it taking up a throne. This was another of Tolkien and Jackson’s ways of showing us how far he has fallen, and it works. Hell, it foreshadows how far he’s fallen and he wasn’t even announced his betrayal yet! It is moments that so greatly and subtly tell the story that make it all the more heartbreaking in moments when the trilogy falls short of greatness.

Saruman then announces that the wraiths have entered the Shire and will kill Frodo and Sam. Gandalf hastens to leave, but is stopped by his superior closing all of the doors in the chamber with his mind. Insert Venture Brothers joke here. Saruman then gloats that Gandalf couldn’t seriously have considered the notion of hobbits resisting the will of Sauron and states that it’s a useless gesture to oppose the dark lord and that they must bow to him. Lee is genuinely creepy with his dark stare and that voice. It gives the air of insanity, arrogance (can never leave that word out when describing Saruman), and superiority. McKellen’s Gandalf shows absolute disgust and disappointment with his rebuke, “Tell me…friends, when did Saruman the Wise abandon wisdom for madness?”

That was evidently enough of a slight to send the tainted robed wizard into a rage as he then uses his staff to send Gandalf against the wall. Also, this is done without a fireworks display like with what Bakshi would have done. Here, a wizard casts magic, and the desired effect just happens. And I tell you, it is a lot more effective cinematically for it. He drops Gandalf who retaliates with his own magic and soon the two wizards are holding no hold barred magic beatdown, but alas. Saruman is the more powerful wizard and wrenches Gandalf’s staff from him and sends him at velocity through the roof (literally).

Note: I decided on a smaller update than promised, because I found a perfect place to leave off that wouldn't leave a mountain of text.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 28, 2010, 01:30:15 AM
nice work Weirdraptor as usual.. :)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on September 28, 2010, 02:33:23 AM
Very interesting, and very detailed, and fun to read.  Thanks for posting it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 28, 2010, 12:52:36 PM
And I spotted some grammatical errors in the last paragraph I missed while editing.

The magic casting scene is wrote of in the last part always reminded of the two old ladies laying smackdown in Willow. Observe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3knLWaa4xGg&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3knLWaa4xGg&feature=related) Its not an exact match, but the mentality of just having the magic spells impacting without much dazzle is the same.
That said, Lucas and Spielberg did try to get their hands on the rights to produce LotR with Ron Howard at the helm as a director, but they couldn't get it done, so they made Willow instead. It would be interest to do a paper on how Willow compares to LotR someday since it's basically a surrofate for it right up a individual from a race of little people leaving his homeland off on some great adventure that turns out to be more than he ever bargained for all the while bearing a MacGuffin.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 28, 2010, 01:58:32 PM
lucas ansd speilberg wouldn't have used much subtlety at all. and lucas isn't know for his ability to write good scripts.. so its better that Jackson did it..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 28, 2010, 03:56:40 PM
Oh, I know that. Plus, they were trying to do in the 1980s, back before the technology to properly adapt had caught up. Jackson, Boyens, and Walsh are much better script writers, and Weta has a lot more creativity than ILM. A Lord of the Rings trilogy produced by Spielberg/Lucas and directed by Howard just wouldn't stand up to Jackson's.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 28, 2010, 04:01:02 PM
It likely would have been better then bakishi but thats not saying much..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 28, 2010, 04:34:29 PM
Anything would have  been better than what Bakshi did... The problem with how adapting LotR has been approached is that everyone seems to think it should be movies. Yes, Jackson's adaptation was great, but far from perfect because of the sheer time constraints for films. As much as I hate to say it, Ralph Bakshi was right when he thought it should be a TV series.

A three season animated series with 20 episodes for each one would be nigh ideal. Put those guys who made Avatar: The Last Airbender and/or Greg Weisman in charge and air it on Cartoon Network's adult swim. I fail to see how that is just too difficult for Hollywood to grasp. It would have a wide viewership, especially now that the Jackson films revitalised it's popularity.

Just to further hammer this in: an animated series episode is 22 minutes long minus commercial breaks and opening and closing sequences. Jackson's Fellowship of the Ring Extended Cut is precisely 198 minutes long, if you include closing credits. That divides into 9 twenty-two minutes episodes. Remember my proposed 20 episode seasons? Think of it.  :D
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 28, 2010, 04:55:05 PM
Who would you have do the voices in your proposed series..?and I agree to a certain extent,. look at the count of Monte Cristo TV films compared to the 2004 effort, the earlier TV films are better and more detailed..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 28, 2010, 08:36:36 PM
There a lot of very talented voice actors and actresses to pick from. Jeff Bennett, Jim Cummings, Cam Clark, Crispin Freeman, Keith David, Tress MacNeille, Kath Soucie, Mark Hamill, Michael Bell, Steve Staley, Jennifer Hale, Grey DeLisle, Cory Burton, Phil LaMarr, Keith Ferguson, Dee Bradley Baker, Frank Welker, John DiMaggio, Kari Wahlgren, Tara Strong, James Arnold Taylor, Neil Ross, George Newbern, Scott Menville, Jess Harnell, and several others.
Plus, I'm sure a few of the previous cast would be willing to return, such as John Rhys-Davies (now no longer having to wear that awful make-up he was allergic to), and Christopher Lee.

If I had to pick:

Frodo - Steve Staley (he voiced Frodo in the PS2 adaptation of Fellowship, and he did just fine there.

Sam - Scott Menville (accent is no issue, but hey, he played a very Samwise-esque character in the English version of Tales of Symphonia, Lloyd Irving, and did a phenomenal job of it.

Gandalf - Ian McKellen has always said he'd play the role again. If not him, then Crispin Freeman or Corey Burton would be nice choices.

Pippin - Cam Clark. is "young man" voice would be perfect for Pippin.

Merry - Jeff Bennett

Aragorn - Cam Clark. He has a more macho sounding voice that be perfect for Aragorn.

Gimli - I don't why John Rhys-Davies wouldn't return if it's just to voice him.

Legolas - Well, Orlando Bloom is out the question, since he has made abundantly clear that he has no intention of returning old roles. So, Steve Staley again. He'd also be good for Leggy. Maybe James Arnold Taylor.

Boromir - Keith Ferguson. No doubt. Yeah, I know that your web search will come up that he was Bloo from House of Imaginery Friends, but he was also the voice of Bosch in Final Fantasy XII, a revelation that made my jaw drop.

Bilbo - Ian Holm

Saruman - Christopher Lee or Corey Burton

Elrond - John DiMaggio o Matt McKensie, perhaps.

Arwen - Kari Wahlgren, full stop.

Galadriel - Kath Soucie would nail this role.

Celeborn - Anyone, really.

Haldir - See Celeborn.

King Theoden - Neil Ross or Mark Hamill would do just fine.

Eomer - Phil LaMarr, Jeff Bennet, Cam Clark, Dee Bradley Baker and others would fit perfectly.

Eowyn - Tress macNeille

Wormtongue - Mark Hamill again.

Denethur - Michael Bell
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 28, 2010, 11:19:46 PM
I would also include Cree summer as a very good voice actress, but you have listed some very good actors there WR.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 29, 2010, 02:13:33 AM
I was just listing whoever I could think of without the help of Wikipedia or whatever. Best yet, I'm sure that if a casting call went out, some of these guys would answer, as these are largely the "go to" people in the animation world.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 29, 2010, 04:13:59 PM
very true.. perhaps at some point we'll see a TV seris made of the LOTR.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on September 29, 2010, 10:47:59 PM
Imagine how many seasons it would last.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 30, 2010, 05:03:19 AM
Probably three. Six seasons, one for each bool within the three volume, would be nice for fans, but the idea would be to make a show with wide appeal. And there are a lot of chapters without any deal excitement that Tolkien's writing can make sound really good, but the idea of anyone trying to portray that in a visual medium would be absord.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 30, 2010, 05:18:54 PM
Inded, theres a lot of walking and running, and people want action, fighting ang stuff like that..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 30, 2010, 11:14:34 PM
That's is why I think an animated series would be the perfect bridge between the two mindsets.

By the way, I'm starting my own website over the Webs. Its Andy's Box 'O' Stuff: http://andysboxostuff.webs.com/ (http://andysboxostuff.webs.com/) There's not much there yet but I just started it a few hours ago, so I'll get a respectable site going here in time. I will also be posting this paper there as well.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on September 30, 2010, 11:41:09 PM
really cool! :D  yeah an animated series would be good. perhaps Rankin bass could do the animation?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 01, 2010, 09:29:25 PM
Uh-huh, that's why I was suggesting it. Since I know New Line Cinema doesn't have an animation studio, I guess they'd have to cooperate with someone. Hopefully not Sony, though. That's the reason why we still haven't seen The Hobbit and why the whole thing dragged out so long that del Toro finally had to get back to work directing.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 01, 2010, 10:46:19 PM
Would you prefer if the animation were the traditional hand drawn cell animation, cgi or a mix of the 2.  Or some other method?

Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 02, 2010, 02:08:11 AM
Oh, good old fashioned traditional. I normally can't stand that cell stuff. Of course, my sole opinion would be over-ruled.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 02, 2010, 12:36:56 PM
Plus I think hand drawn is faster then cgi so you could have more episodes per season, unless computers have advanced to where producing cgi animation is as fast as hand drawn.  and last I saw cgi people didn't quite look fully real in full light situations.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 03, 2010, 09:48:57 PM
i prefer hand drawn to CGI too,
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 03, 2010, 11:25:21 PM
I wonder if most do or if most prefer cgi.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 05, 2010, 02:43:06 AM
There's a big split. Some prefer handdrawn. Some CGI. Some don't care as long as it's good.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 05, 2010, 10:18:56 AM
as long as it is good, most won't care how it is drawn.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 05, 2010, 09:41:57 PM
I don't mind either way.  As long as its' well done and not some of the awful looking drawings I've seen.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 05, 2010, 10:57:55 PM
Bad, like as in having the animation done by the South Park guys?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 06, 2010, 12:01:07 AM
precisely.. we can't have it be a jokem, after all..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 06, 2010, 12:44:19 AM
I don't mind south park style animation for comedies.  There is also what I think is called manga fusion with folks very deformed looking and none of the right proportions of body parts.  It's like taking the worst parts of western and Japanese style animation and combining them.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 13, 2010, 05:38:53 PM
ANNOUNCEMENT: My job is taking me to a different city where I will undergo a week's training. And after that, I will have some online studying to do for this job once I get back. Will not be updating Adaptation Face-Off for at least two weeks. I'm sorry, and I thank everyone who has taken the time to read this for the delay.
EDIT: That said, the reason I'm not posting this on The Fridge is because I don't think I'll have to stop participating GoF altogether in that time frame.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 13, 2010, 11:31:29 PM
That is ok, continue this when you have time.  Good luck.  Hope you have time to visit the forum now and then during that time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 14, 2010, 10:45:46 PM
take your time, real life comes first..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 16, 2010, 01:05:54 AM
Just found out the Hobbit has been green-lit. Production is expected to start in February. Being a LOTR nut, I'm glad that Jackson is returning to direct.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 16, 2010, 01:45:47 AM
Should be a good movie.  Still going to be 2 movies?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 16, 2010, 04:00:52 PM
yes its going to be made in 2 parts...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 16, 2010, 06:38:33 PM
As he wanted it, that is good.  I guess what'shisname will return to play Gandalf?  Not sure if any others will return.  Elrond does appear in the hobbit and is a member of the white council also.  They could bring back Legolas but his part would be much smaller since he could really only appear, maybe, when the dwarves are caught by the elves in mirkwood, maybe a scene or 2 in the elf stronghold, once the elves besiege the lonely mountain (I think it's called) and the battle of 5 armies.  Not a main character.   I assume galadriel may be a member of the white council also, since she is from the first age and older then even Elrond.  She should be among the oldest of the elves still in middle earth I'd think since she did journey to Valinor and then back to middle earth.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 16, 2010, 07:03:43 PM
Mckellan Weaving and Serkis wil be back as Gandalf Elrond and Gollum respectively the White council would likely only appear in the second part as it is not mentioned much in the Hobbit.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 16, 2010, 09:22:01 PM
I'm still less than enthused about The Hobbit being stretched into two parts. I'm still not convinced that Bilbo's one and only story will remain the center of attention, no nevermind that his adventures were what made people fall in love with Middle-earth to begin with even if there was a "grander scheme".
Yeah, I know I keep saying that, but it really just bugs me.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 17, 2010, 10:17:54 PM
You're probably not alone in that WR. If you focused one film being just the hobbit and the second film being the "White Council' or whatever that would be one thing..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 17, 2010, 10:47:30 PM
Did they say it would be like that, or if they'll switch back and forth like in the lord of the ring movies?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 17, 2010, 10:53:55 PM
I'm not sure about that Kor, i'll have to check..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 18, 2010, 12:08:49 AM
No biggie, just curious.  Either would be ok with me.  I'm not super picky.  Though it would be interesting, to me at least,  to see what Gandalf was up to when he kept vanishing in the hobbit.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 19, 2010, 06:28:17 AM
Heh. I think we're only clued in on what he was doing a few times. For instance, I remember that he was missing from the group when they encountered the trolls because he was off scouting. He then rushed back when a couple of elves told him of the trio. Then I don't think he vanished again for any real length of time until their encounter with Beorn. That's when he drops out of the story when Bilbo meets him in the camp Kings Bard and Thranduil set up.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 19, 2010, 12:04:28 PM
I think I read somewhere, forgot if it was in the lord of the rings, the extra info in the return of the king, the hobbit, or elsewhere, that at least part of the time Gandalf was away was to attend a meeting of the white council and then a group of them ousted a necromancer king.  Forgot if he was Sauron or the head of the nazgul in disguise.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 19, 2010, 03:38:37 PM
I think he was attending the Meeting of the White Council after he departed at the edge of Mirkwood. The Necromancer had been exposed and driven out in that time. Then afterwards Gandalf went with the Mirkwood elves to the region of Lake Town and Erebor/The Lonely Mountain.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 19, 2010, 10:29:58 PM
That would make sense, since that was when he was gone for the longest time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 19, 2010, 11:20:14 PM
The Necromancer was really Sauron. Gandalf had faced him while searching for Thrain, Thorin's father, who he found in Dol Guldar's dungeon, and retrieved the map and key. Thrain also held one of the 7 Dwarven rings, but Sauron took it from him before Gandalf could reach him.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 19, 2010, 11:57:47 PM
I thought it may be sauron, though I think the head of the nazgul was called a necromancer also maybe so I wasn't sure.  

The dwarven rings didn't do anything to dwarves but make them more greedy if they wore them.  They could not turn invisible.  Though that is because of who made the dwarves who is superior to Sauron in power.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 20, 2010, 12:05:27 AM
yes the dwarves were created by one of the Valar, while Sauron was a Maiar, though a strong one. The head of the Nazgul was called the "witch-King".
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 20, 2010, 04:13:41 AM
Heh heh. The fact that some of the key details have slipped our minds just shows how much there is to remember when it comes to Tolkien's universe.

One thing that comes to mind is that the elves might have been having a victory feast in the forest when the dwarves and Bilbo saw the torchlights and left the path Gandalf had designated.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 20, 2010, 11:50:26 AM
Or the elves may have been having a party for some other reason.  Who knows.  

And Aule, I think his name is spelled, when he made them they were specifically designed to resist Melkor/Morgoth's power, unlike humans and elves who were not.  So naturally Sauron could not do anything to them with his rings.  

Though I do wonder when he told the other valar if that maybe gave whatshername, the idea to make the ents.  

I read somewhere that Tolkein put Galdalf the white and Sauron on about equal power level since I read he did answer someone's question in a letter if the 2 had fought who would have won and Tolkein said it would have been about 50/50 that Gandolf would win.  And Gandalf the white not just since he was improved in rank from grey to white but when Illuvator sent Gandalf back he removed the restrictions that Manwe put on the istari when they first went to middle earth.  

An interesting thing I read somewhere regarding the those ghost guys, forgot what they were called, that for that guy's curse on them to work Illuvator had to do that since he's the only one who could have kept them there as ghosts.  The valor and maia can extend life, but do anything like that I read.  not sure if it is true or not.  Tolkein likely wasn't thinking about that when he write that.  He may have just thought it would make a cool bit of a story and put it in.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 21, 2010, 09:04:55 PM
very interesting Kor, of course the Maiar are no match for Valar, which is why the wars between Morgoth and the other Valar were so devastating. those ghosts wre cursed by Ilsildur..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 21, 2010, 09:11:30 PM
the elves loved to party that i can recall, so the woodland elves could have been partying for any reason really..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 22, 2010, 01:03:09 AM
Though as the person on the website said, Isildur had no real power to curse them, unless Illuvator was behind it.  Forgot the details of what the person said.    Part of it likely was due to oatbreaking and such since the valar and such put keeping an oath big and making an oath does have some power in middle earth and valinor since Feanor's sons, even that one, forgot his name, regretted making the oath they did, but they could not undo it and were fated to a dark fate.  Since if I recall only Illuvator could have recended or whatever the term is of their oath and to do so I think he'd have to come into the world itself.  Maybe those ghost types made a similar vow, vowing by the valor or something like that.


Maybe the telari were more prone to party, which the woodelves are a part.  maybe a part of how they got their name. So called, if I recall corectly, since when they heard the summons of the valar they tended to terry, and travel slower then the other 2 types.  The Noldor, and the other one, forgot what the first type is called.  They are considered the greatest type of elves.  I guess since they got to Valinor first and only left it at the end of the 1st age to battle with the Valar and Maia against Morgoth and his forces.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 26, 2010, 07:56:46 PM
UPDATE: Well, tomorrow is the final day of the training/torture my job is putting through (just what the hell building a outhouse has to do with working at a Hydroplant is anyone's guess) so after tomorrow I will be free to update this monster of a paper I've created. The next update will come Friday.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 26, 2010, 11:35:17 PM
Hope things like that is over for you soon and you get a chance to rest and have fun.  Good luck.  No hurry on posting.  Do it at your own schedule.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 27, 2010, 12:47:24 AM
Oh, believe me when I say I'm not hurrying. I know exactly what I want to post. Now its just a matter of proofreading before posting.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 27, 2010, 05:25:54 PM
glad to hear it Wr. am looking forward to your next posting.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 29, 2010, 03:11:33 AM
Thanks. Both of you. I should warn you both, upon rereading what I'm going to post, it seems like I go off into perhaps into one side-tandem too many, but yet I'm not sure if I should cut anything.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 29, 2010, 09:36:27 AM
everyone deserves a rant at times, and to date your rants havwe been very entertaining :)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 29, 2010, 12:39:37 PM
Why not rant and talk about what you want if you want to.  At worst you may need to cut the post in half and post each half seperatly if you need or want to.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 29, 2010, 07:01:40 PM
Well, here goes then:

Part Twenty-One: The Game Attempts-Part Ninteen

Straight off from the wizard’s dual, the film gets back to the hobbits. We first see Sam stepping out of a row of corn and onto a narrow lane in the middle of the field. Sam looks both in front and behind and does not see Frodo. He becomes nervous and is soon going at a jog through the lane shouting his master’s name.

Frodo appears from around a corner the lane takes up ahead. Sam stops and breathes a sigh of relief. Sam utters that he thought they’d gotten separated to which Frodo asks what on Middle-earth is the gardener talking about. Sam explains that Gandalf instructed him to stick by Frodo, always, and that he intends to follow that to the letter. Frodo light-heartedly chuckles and asks, “Sam, we’re still in the Shire. What could possibly happen?” Cue Merry and Pippin coming crashing through the corn stocks and into the master and gardener.

   While Sam and Merry climb to their feet, Pippin remains on all fours on top of Frodo for whatever reason and excited exclaims the obvious to Merry, who also greets Young Baggins with equal enthusiasm. Sam pulls Pippin off of Frodo and helps his master to his feet while an explanation is demanded. Frodo and Sam notice the vegetables Merry and Pippin have deduce that the two have been pilfering from Farmer Maggot. I understand that some people have a love-hate relationship with this concept, questioning why Merry and Pippin would bother since they come from high born (by hobbit standards, anyway) families: the Brandybucks and the Tooks. Well, the answer is simple. Merry and Pippin can still be referred as “boys” at this point in time. Boys do stupid things, plain and simple. These actions always later cross into old shame once we're older, but hey, they looked like good ideas at the time. Right? …Right?

   Anyway, cue the vicious guard dogs barking. Merry and Pippin load vegetables into Sam’s arms and position facing the approaching incensed farmer as they and Frodo make off towards the woods. Sam stupidly stands there a minute before realizing that he’d be blamed for the theft and takes off after them. Never fails to make me laugh.

   Merry, meanwhile, has the nerve to ask why Farmer Maggot is so upset, and that hey only took a little bit which he lists off. Pippin then cuts in with a bunch of additions to the list leaving anyone who has to rely on growing things for income with little wonder why Maggot is out for their skins. The three cousins literally reach the end of the line as they come to a steep hill, only to be rammed into by Sam sending them all over the edge. A good bit of slapstick, but as a friend once uttered to me in the theater: “When did this become a Three Stooges sketch?”

   The hobbits take a ride head over heel down until they dog pile at the bottom. We get a funny bit with Pippin landing face down and just shy of a pile of plop, uttering: “Ooh, that was close!” This is followed up by Merry thinking that there’s a bone sticking out of his skin to discover that he just landed on a carrot. Sam mutters sorely about “trust a Bandybuck and Took” to get them into trouble. Merry tries to defend him with, “What? That was just a detour. A shortcut.” Sam: “A shortcut to what?” Pippin: “Mushrooms!” I have to hand to Jackson, Boyens, and Walsh for the clever wordplay of working a chapter title into the dialogue here. Well done.

   The three younger hobbits, ironically played by actors older than Wood, huddle around the mushrooms and begin picking through the nicest ones while Frodo carefully scans the area. Yeah, to those unfamiliar, think of mushrooms as catnip to the hobbits’ cat. Frodo tries to get the three off the road, but is ignored until the supernatural presence of an approaching Ringwraith starts to cause the environment to turn dark and menacing as its cry erupts from ahead on the trail they landed on. A powerful gust of wind (in the middle of the heavily wind-breaking forest) rushes through and swirls some leaves with unnatural force. This is evidently enough to make Frodo freak out and call out the anxious order for them to get off the road. Here, again, Elijah’s acting is really effective with the fear shining through very convincingly. Too bad the consistently good acting from Elijah is about to become slowly more uneven switching back and forth from being absolutely spot on with his character to just looking like he’s either constipated, high, or like a deer in the headlights, with the bad portions of his acting reaching its high by the second movie. Fortunately, Wood gets his act back together again in Return of the King.

   You see, once the hobbits get huddled under the roots just off the steep slope at the edge of the road opposite from where they fell, the wraith shows up and drops off its horse to investigate the presence it senses nearby. In an instant, the thing is hovering over them leaning on the roots hiding them. Whispering noises pick as Frodo’s eyes roll back and his mouth hangs open. Of course, he also pulls the Ring out and extends a finger to accept it, preparing to put it on. I know he’s being influenced by the Ring here, but Wood’s acting just makes it look like he’s a druggie who just had one hell of a fix of his habit. I guess the Ring certainly has elements of drug abuse so the portrayal is somewhat justified, but it’s not really that simple. The Ring itself is the blood of evil that works its wearer over both by being a malevolent force from outside that must be resisted. While its doing that, it plays on your inner weaknesses and bringing them to the surface thus making the individual weaker to its direct outer temptations and manipulations. On top of that, it makes its users physically stronger within the boundaries of the type of being they are and it has the added bonus of making you invisible (actually, it just puts you one foot in the shadow realm basically blanketing you in darkness rather than turning you truly invisible, where you will eventually be drawn in and turned into a wraith yourself after a while. Yeah, this thing is pretty terrifying once you've sat thought about it for while). In other words, there is no successfully warding off the Ring’s temptations for good. I can imagine, maybe, being able to relinquish it if you’re particularly strong-willed and have only had it for a few moments. Long term exposure? Forget it. You might as well just put on a black cloak and get yourself a same-colored horse. You’re going to be playing tenth-fiddle amongst the Witch King’s ranks.

   Witch King? Oh, he’s just the Lord of the Nazgul. The mightiest of the nine Ringwriaths. Yeah, those swift footed killing machines that suck away any light and hope of escape, put you under a supernatural Fear, scourge the earth with their very presence, have blood-curling shrieks that will set your bladder free, and carry weapons that will make you one of them? Yeah, one is far worse than the other eight which at base are exactly what I described. Let that sink in for a while. There’s a reason I said these things are nightmare fuel in its rawest form.

   In fact, just to drive how terrifying just one of these things are, while the hobbits hide under the tree roots all manner of insects begin scurrying out of the ground as it is infected with the wraith’s dark power at full speed. Immediately, the hobbits are put under the Fear as well and the off-putting reaction of the bugs further disconcerts them. Merry allows a spider which crawled onto his shoulder to climb onto the palm of his hand and then setting it on the ground while exchanging a scared and confused look with Samwise. Each one not getting a fix of Ring shares an “ohshitohshitohshitwhatthehell” look as they stay perfectly still, minds clearly reeling on how to get out of this mess.

   Meanwhile, Frodo continues to wear his “whoa men that’s some good shit” expression as his hands tremble while he grapples with Ring’s temptations. Yep, this is the only actor Jackson claims to have given a good reading for the role of Frodo, folks. Yeah, I’ve never completely bought that, either. Anyway, Sam gives Frodo’s shoulder a light jab, bringing his employer out of his drug craze. Then Merry throws his pack which lands with a heavy thud. The wraith just basically pounces like a frikkin cougar off in the direction of the noise giving frightening implications that it bore down onto the pack with full force. Now just imagine if that had just been some poor passing animal or hobbit? Yeah, when did the Bakshiwraiths ever make you think that it'd be in a for very sticky, gooey end if that they did run into a wraith? Never. Jackson’s make the idea of anything unable to defend itself running into them terrifying and pitiable, indeed. These things are dangerous, and Jackson is delivering on that.

   Moving on, once the hobbits have put some distance between them and the wraith, they stop to rest and Pippin inquires about that thing they just encountered. The camera focuses in on Frodo as he pants and then looks down at the Ring which he’s still holding. He wears an expression saying, “Oh wow. This thing really is dangerous! I had to no idea it would be like that!” The good thing about Wood’s performance in the first film is that for every moment of inadequacy he has one of greatness to make up for it.

   So how did the scene work out altogether? Well, aside from Elijah’s less than stellar acting in this scene, it worked perfectly, and the other actors covered enough for the sole weakness of Wood that the scene carried enough weight to get me on the edge of my seat every time.

   From there, the audience is greeted with the dead of night as the hobbits slip through the trees of the forest as the wraiths scour every inch of it looking for them. They do so in a methodical, organized fashion (you can tell if you’re looking), further raising the dread we the audience feel at this point. Back with the hobbits, Pippin asks what is happening, to which Merry replies that the wraiths are obviously looking for someone or something. He questions Frodo about before the hobbits are forced to duck down again. This bit displays Merry’s intelligent and quick mature quite nicely as opposed to Pippin’s more oblivious persuasion. One just has to wonder what Bakshi was thinking with the Huey, Dewey, and Louie approach to this duo.

   Frodo, after apparently stringing these two along for hours, finally fesses up to a point and announces that he and Sam have to reach Bree. Merry nods, and after moment in which Jackson and co. leave for unfamiliar audiences to be unsure of what Merry will do, the Brandybuck begins leading his friends to the Buckleberry Ferry.

   After having taken about three steps, they spring a Ringwraith which proceeds to get between Frodo and the other three long enough for the Baggins to fall behind. This turns out to be in their favor as Sam, Merry, and Pippin rush ahead and are able get the raft ready without being hassled and Frodo is able to get on and take off straight away. This was an excellent way to show how the wraiths aside from the Witch King just couldn’t act outside of their direct orders, and thus had it was imperfect strategy to send them without free thinking guidance. This, in retrospect, just shows what a smug and overconfident fool Sauron can be.

   As such, the trio manage to get the ferry going and start sailing. On one hand, this forces Frodo to make a leap to it, but it prevents the Nazgul from boarding. Admittedly, the ferry was used under much less duress in the book, but the logic of how this scene works is sound, and therefore….well, it doesn’t suck. On top of that, the hobbits truly do have a reprieve from being chased at the moment, since the next bridge is twenty miles away. Again, the entire sequence, with Merry and Pippin’s introductions adding some relief, keeps the tension on.

To be continued...

There'll be another part along shortly, guys.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 30, 2010, 12:13:38 AM
Nice work WR. very well done..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 07, 2010, 08:29:26 PM
looking forward to the next one WR>>
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 07, 2010, 09:37:51 PM
Forgot to post I enjoyed reading the previous post.  No hurry posting the next one. Whenever you have time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 09, 2010, 01:52:42 AM
Thanks. You know, I thought watching and rewatching these films would be more tiring than it is. You'd be amazed what you think come to realize about the books and films when you're looking at them through a magnifying glass.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 09, 2010, 03:34:58 AM
Lots of things you miss just watching it and not doing like you are doing.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 14, 2010, 08:39:00 PM
yes repeated viewing are essential to get three full experience of the films. while i don't like some of the extebded scenes (the Witchking breaking Gandalf's staff for one) but aklll in all the EEs are very very good. hopefully they'll be EEs of both Hobbit films..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 15, 2010, 08:29:13 PM
One can only hope.

By the way, I am still writing this. I promise you. I've also gotten another writing project going, this one fictional. So between my social life, work, Adaptation Face-Off, and my other currently unnamed project, a few weeks may pass between each entry. That said, I've proofread and edited a decent amount to post here already. I know I keep saying stuff like this, but its because I hate to keep you guys waiting.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 15, 2010, 09:37:48 PM
Set yourself a good schedule and remember to have some time to rest and don't spread yourself to thin.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 15, 2010, 11:01:19 PM
I have a rough schedule. I can't have a conclusive one because I do shift work which also tends to get "shifted" a lot due to the nature of the job I have. I can only plan so much. That said, I do have a written schedule...in pencil, so I can erase and rewrite on the fly.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 16, 2010, 12:33:15 AM
Just have to do the best you can, and good luck.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 16, 2010, 02:00:24 AM
whenever you can post updates is fine WR...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 30, 2010, 08:02:57 PM
UPDATE: For whatever reason, the studios in charge of the production of The Hobbit are making Jackson and company drop the all white casting call. Now the floor is being opened all ethnicities despite Middle-earth being prehistoric Europe. Now if you excuse me, I have to go lie down as the stupidity of this news kills my braincells from the inside out.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 30, 2010, 08:09:02 PM
Yeah it is stupid, but  i'm guessing we 'll see mostly white cast..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 30, 2010, 09:38:54 PM
Or he'll hire every ethnic type but white.  I would in protest if I were him.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 30, 2010, 10:12:08 PM
you have to be close to the storyline as possible imo, and having a black hobbit dosen't feel right, as far as i knowe pre-medieveal europe didn't have too many blacks..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 30, 2010, 10:46:09 PM
That is how I'd protest that rule.  And the brothers (I think they were) would be 1 asian and 1 black.  Then, being jackson when the highups protested I'd tall them shut the () up and let me do this my way or I walk.

I guess some folks are to stupid to realize that middle earth is supposed to be Europe.  I'm sure other varieties of humans were in that world, but you'd have to travel a long ways to see them.  like you would in say 400bc.  Instead of just walking around some american cities and seeing a mix.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 30, 2010, 10:59:30 PM
hopefully this will get resolved like that union boycott was..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 30, 2010, 11:39:18 PM
Jackson has enough clout and power, so he may have to use it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 01, 2010, 03:40:46 AM
Amen to that. I swear the production for The Hobbit is just cursed. At this point, its like they're bickering just for the sake of it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 02, 2010, 09:16:54 PM
well if they could ever stop bickering, the film would make tons of money.. probably a billion world wide..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 02, 2010, 11:02:09 PM
Very Likely, both of them.  

Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 02, 2010, 11:21:07 PM
It almost makes one miss the old days when The Hobbit was still just "that film that might get made someday". What's next once this is resolved? An argument over whether Legolas should appear in the Mirkwood sequences resulting in an expansion argument because the studio and actor Orland Bloom?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 02, 2010, 11:28:02 PM
Legolas will not appear, besides Bloom has stated that he has no interest in returning to old roles , in other words no Legolas or will Turner.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 03, 2010, 02:30:21 AM
Wonder how long he'll have to go without a film career before that attitude changes...
Make no mistake, I like Bloom, but I think dropping out of films right after Pirates 3 and for this long is going to bite him in the ass.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 03, 2010, 02:57:20 AM
Likely it may well do that.  Many folks have a short attention span.  

At worst we still have the animated hobbit movie.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 03, 2010, 01:29:15 PM
Thankfully, unlike the Bakshi animated LotR, The Hobbit animated movie is quite enjoyable in my opinion, anyway.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 03, 2010, 10:55:07 PM
I think it is a good film also.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 03, 2010, 11:39:28 PM
the hobbit animated film was quite good. i think they'll get all the kinks worked out, theres too much money at stake for them not too..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 04, 2010, 12:33:22 AM
I liked it as a kid adn bet I'd still like it now.  Different in feel then Jackson's movie I bet, but still a good movie.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 04, 2010, 11:38:49 PM
Well, it's Rankin-Bass at their best, if that helps.

On a side note, Christmas and Thanksgiving have pretty much made progress on Adaptation Face-Off come to crashing halt (as you porbably figured out on your own), but I will try to continue updates after New Year's.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 05, 2010, 12:39:15 AM
thats fine WR...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 05, 2010, 01:55:27 AM
No, hurry, take your time when you have time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 14, 2010, 08:30:03 PM
Well, Mckellan and Blanchett are back to reprise thier roles..not sure how I feel about Bloom playing Legolas again..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 14, 2010, 09:50:48 PM
I guess their adding in his character.  

I also heard on a dr who podcast, not sure if it's true, that Sylvester McCoy himself said, who was the 7th doctor, will be doing Radgast the brown & they expanded his part in the movie.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 14, 2010, 09:57:05 PM
actually legolas was the son of the Elven king who captures the Dwarves so his character is there though not mentioned by name. Bilbo never learned it although Gandalf would have known him..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 15, 2010, 11:55:47 AM
On one hand, there's no word from Tolkien what Legolas was doing at the time the Necromancer was invading Mirkwood and the dwarves were passing through, but he was in there, somewhere. I recall someone suggesting he be the one to capture the dwarves and bring them to his father for the new movie.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 15, 2010, 11:58:36 AM
my guess, and is just that, is that he was staying with his father  Thuandil, he was a relatively young at that point. and that suggestion works. give him a small role but don't foreshadow too much. the hobbit should not become LOTR Part 1 and 2
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 15, 2010, 01:20:31 PM
That can work.  I guess he may be among, or the one, who captures the dwarves in mirkwood, and around when they surround lonely mountain, I think it's called, when Thorin refuses to give the others any share of the treasure that Smaug had hoarded and at the battle of 5 armies.  

I read Galadriel will be in the movie.  She could be a member of the white council since she would be among the oldest elves still in middle earth since she dates way way back to the time of the trees and was actually in Valinor.  With the white council Elrond may have a larger role in the movie.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 15, 2010, 05:31:35 PM
that is true, in the book elrond only had a small role, he discovered the rune letters on the map and let the group stay in rivendell for a few days..and that was it..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 15, 2010, 10:13:17 PM
I wonder if they'll switch between the 2 groups, or if it'll be where the hobbit is part 1 and the white council stuff is part 2.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 15, 2010, 10:59:56 PM
hmm thats a good question, but there may be switches between biblo and the dwarvews in milkwood and the white council in part 1.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 15, 2010, 11:36:01 PM
I guess they can't include any stuff but what is in the hobbit and the lord of the rings.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 16, 2010, 12:18:33 AM
anything that happened before LOTR and in the time frame of the hobbit.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 26, 2010, 05:16:23 PM
hope the film will be good.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 26, 2010, 09:24:09 PM
I'm sure most folks are hoping the 2 films will be as good.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 24, 2011, 12:06:03 PM
I know you guys are going to see this bumped and be excited, so I apologize in advance. Alright, first off, I do still intend to finish off this monster of a paper, but I haven't had time to really work on it lately. Plus, I've been feeling tired a lot and I don't know why. I have a feeling I have a cold coming on, but I don't really have any specific symptons (yet). It wouln't surprise me, though, if I was starting to get sick, my job put me on the roof of a building while it was snowing with icy winds blasting me a few days ago.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on January 24, 2011, 12:41:56 PM
No hurry about doing your next installment, and I hope you don't get sick.  If you feel tired you do need rest, maybe extra rest.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 24, 2011, 03:17:36 PM
health is more important. get healthy then start focusing on the next update.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2011, 04:04:48 AM
Thanks as always, guys. I'm glad you're enjoying the paper.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2011, 06:52:45 AM
"Why does this have an article? Is some fan's review worth noting? I know that there's no such thing as notability, but all this seems to do is promote (this article was written by the author of the piece) what is obviously Fan Dumb, considering that this person is a well-known IM Db troll who is known for claiming that every adaptation of the books is bad, and everyone who enjoys any adaptation is a moron."

-Said by one guy who has a username that's all numbers. -> 128.227.41.55

Yes, I started a TVTropes article for Adaptation Face-Off. I found the article gutted, reedited, and turned into one big insult directed at me calling me things like Troll, Fan Dumb, Too Dumb To live, and that the article only existed to offend anyone who liked adaptations of Tolkien's work. Then they said I know next to nothing about the books or film productions of the adaptations. And there's the above completely false claim. I have no idea where this loser gets his information, but have never done anything warranting that accusation. For one thing, I adore the original Hobbit cartoon and the Peter Jackson renditions. Hell, I spent years as an active member of the IMDb LotR boards fending off trolls. Where did this jackass get his information?!

If you go to TVTropes, you won't find much left, because I basically wiped the article. It was all I could do because when I checked the Edit History I found that none other than a TVTropes moderator, FastEddie, was in on turning it into an attack against me. Yes, really. But that's not the best part. When I went to the forum to confront them about this, I was banhammered without any kind of warning. No Private Message, no reply telling me to back off. In fact, I found out I had been banned while I attempted to reply to a snide response FastEddie had left and this showed up:
"We're sorry, but posting has been turned off for you."  :anger  :anger  :anger  :anger  :anger  :anger Oh yeah, and any trace of the conversation was erased.

FUCK YOU, FASTEDDIE!

Oddly, I can still create and edit articles.  :huh:  I'm not going to do anything, but I do now have a name for a Fool Type character in a story I'm a writing: Eddie.

In closing, the whole redeal if nothing else has made appreciate the staff here at GoF all the more. Thanks for the being upstanding, understanding people, Mods and Admits of Gang of Five. In short, I'm sorry for whining at you guys like a little twelve year old, but I had to get this off my chest!
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 25, 2011, 10:14:15 AM
that guy was a real pain in the rear :bang thats the problem when mods and admins let stuff go to thier heads :rolleyes:  oh well.. i'm a LOTR nut, i know more than is probably healthy about tolkien and his works, but i'm not going to go onto sites like imbd because of mods like him (that and it costs money to sign up there). Just focus on your paper and forget jerks s like Eddie. the world is unfortunately full of them.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2011, 07:16:00 PM
They started charging money to sign up at IMDb?! Alright, now that's a rip-off, right there. It was free back when I first joined, so I don't get their deal.

Yeah, I can't stand mods like Eddie. So I will forget him. I still can't figure why they left my ability to create and alter articles intact, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 25, 2011, 09:45:31 PM
basically you have to have an active amazon .com account to post on thier boards, which i tried to join in order to comment on the latest scooby doo series and the Hobbit films. but Since i don't have an Amazon.com account (need a cedit card) no dice on the posting. which is a pain in the butt..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2011, 10:48:34 PM
Wow. They got greedy since I joined You're not missing much, anyway, believe me. It's full of trolls and hate and I'm downright masochistic for still going back.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 25, 2011, 10:51:23 PM
i really don't care what other people say, and anyway i'm clearly only focusing on a very narrow subsert of tv shows and films..but I'm not missing much..by your comments..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 01, 2011, 12:01:52 AM
well Christopher Lee is officially back as saruman..I'm excited to see him again on screen. hes is getting up there though he'll be in his 90s by the time the film is finished.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 01, 2011, 12:59:17 AM
It'll be nice to have him back in that role.  He's a great actor.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 01, 2011, 04:58:35 PM
yes he is, not sure i like the idea of bringing Elijah Wood back but since the timeline in the films is different i guess bringing him in is ok.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 01, 2011, 10:14:37 PM
They may have had  Elijah Wood return partially since that may bring his fans to the movies also.  Though I'm not sure if he was even born yet during the events of the hobbit.  Unless the time line will be heavily altered or they do a framing device where they are gathered together.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 01, 2011, 10:20:46 PM
frodo was born after the events in the hobbit if i recall correctly from the book. his role is going to be very very small from what I understand..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 04, 2011, 09:35:19 PM
I guess it makes sense to have Frodo narrating The Hobbit, but I'd rather Sean Astin as Sam doing it.

Update time: I'm going back to work on the paper now I have time. I have no idea when it will be done, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 04, 2011, 09:56:53 PM
good to hear WR. take your time, no rush..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 04, 2011, 10:09:13 PM
Yea, no rush.  

I guess he may be used as a framing device.  I guess to try to get as many folks back as they can from the first movie.  

Though to me it would have made more sense to have an older Bilbo as the person doing the narrator, or Sam to some of his kids.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 04, 2011, 10:21:19 PM
Yep yep. I think Ian Holm doing the narrating would be best, since it's Bilbo's story. But Sam reading to his kids would be a decent substitute, since the Red Book was passed onto him by Frodo. However, I know for sure the latter won't happen since relations between Astin and Jackson have been strained by the former becoming a big spokesman for the SAG and his advacating for usage of American shooting locations over New Zealand ones.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 04, 2011, 10:34:50 PM
Sam wasn't going to be in the films anyway..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 04, 2011, 10:57:14 PM
Or one of Sam's daughters.  I forgot which one, but he did pass the book on to one of them before he got on one of the white ships to sail to undying west.  Never can remember what that place is called.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 04, 2011, 11:04:05 PM
that was many decades afterward though kor.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 04, 2011, 11:11:16 PM
Yes, after Sam's wife died I think.  Not sure of the year.  I'd have to look it up.  I'd have an older Bilbo telling the story as the framing device, either have him in Hobbiton or in Elrond's land, whatever that's called.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 04, 2011, 11:14:51 PM
Rivendell..or Imilandris, in the Elvish tongue..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 05, 2011, 11:49:06 AM
Yes, those are the names, thanks.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 06, 2011, 09:40:29 PM
http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2011/01/27...-saoirse-ronan/ (http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2011/01/27/41923-hobbit-castin-director-spills-beans-about-saoirse-ronan/)Check this out. She's playing some elf chick named Itaril or something like that. Now they've stooped to adding token females to the narrative. Well, all hope I had for this just died.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 06, 2011, 09:50:15 PM
lets just hope she is barely in it..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 06, 2011, 10:47:40 PM
If she's playing an elf there's only a few spots she could be in it.  In Rivendell,  Mirkwood, including maybe while the dwarves are prisoners since I seem to recall Bilbo snuck around a while invisible, when the elves are camped around with the folks of Dale wanting some the treasure smaug had that they say is partially theirs, and the battle of the 5 armies.  

Hopefully they won't keep adding in females like changing some of the dwarfs to female ones, or adding in more so they can have female dwarfs.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 07, 2011, 02:39:55 AM
Well, if the first film sticks with Bilbo and the split is at when they enter Mirkwood, they'll have to pad it out. Ten bucks says Itaril or whatever will be the star of the parts they add alongside a lover to completed the Mary Suedom.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 07, 2011, 04:17:53 AM
I guess they may, since they think that will attract some more folks.  Or scriptwriters don't know how to write a script without putting that sort of thing in there.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 07, 2011, 07:17:04 AM
It also shows that Jackson perhaps just shouldn't be adapting The Hobbit at all. I've been jaded on those damn project for months and adding in characters who previously didn't exist in Tolkien's narrative at all is the final nail in the coffin as far as I'm concerned.
The Hobbit is a simple tale and it's held up as is for almost a century despite the changes in our world. The story is Bilbo, Jackson! He's the heart of the tale! Get a clue!
And of all the things they had to add, it was a token Xeno ripoff warrior chick. *sigh* On top of that, we still don't have a Bard, which means the role of killing Smaug has probably been given to Legolas or HER. On top of that, they've also cast young, handsome men as the dwarves (God, why?!).
Ugh, I don't know why they're even bothering with the pretense that this is a Hobbit movie anymore. It's not. I was dubious about the White Council, but the presence of Itaril is just too much. Between the added Itaril and the White Council and how they'll inevitably drag out the campaign against Sauron and the Battle of Five Armies (Helm's Deep was an entire hour of Two Tower's running time, and the siege of Minas Tirith was even longer) I just don't see how Bilbo even fits into his own story anymore.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 07, 2011, 06:32:01 PM
there will be a bard they just haven't cast the part yet. they are still working on the dwarves , who will play smaug etc..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 07, 2011, 08:03:58 PM
I wish I shared your faith.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 07, 2011, 10:11:07 PM
Maybe part of it is he wanted to make it to much like the lord of the rings movies, and bring back as many of the actors that he liked working with.  Though to me The Hobbit has a totally different feel as a book then the lord of the rings.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 08, 2011, 01:41:55 PM
That's exactly what's killing my faith in the film.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 08, 2011, 07:57:51 PM
Given how well the trilogy did, i think some leeway is in order. first the movies haven't even been filmed yet. Most of these roles I suspect will be very minor, and will be in the "blink and you'll miss them category. " the female Elf I suspect will either be at Rivendell or in Thuandril's hall at the wood elves party(what exactly they were celebrating, Tolkien doesn't say). Tolkien ended up rewriting the Hobbit to tie in with the trilogy, and left other details in appendixes.  I don't think this will be as good as the trilogy was, but it won't be the endless void of suck that was Phantom Menace.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 08, 2011, 10:52:06 PM
I guess time will tell.  I do hope it'll be a good movie, but I'll remain open minded till I've heard the reviews about the movie & watch it myself.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 17, 2011, 02:52:37 AM
Work has began again. Your patience with me has paid off.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 17, 2011, 03:36:26 AM
Sounds good, good luck with it going smoothly.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 17, 2011, 01:33:24 PM
thats good WR. When you have time of ccourse..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 21, 2011, 04:44:45 PM
Looking forward to your new entries :)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 21, 2011, 07:28:37 PM
And they're coming. I'm also starting a blog where I will also be posting this since the whole "new website" thing didn't pan out (damn google not putting it on its web search no matter how I bent over backwards for it). It's called Cherub Rants: http://cherubrants.blogspot.com/2011/02/ranting-begins.html (http://cherubrants.blogspot.com/2011/02/ranting-begins.html) I'm Cherub. First thing before I update is that I'm putting everything I've done here on there.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 21, 2011, 07:29:32 PM
thats great WR. hope it works well for you!
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 21, 2011, 07:51:28 PM
Well, thus far, I've had better luck with Blogger than an website. I've got another blog going under a different username and address and that's working out just fine so far. The reason I started this new blog under a new account is because I don't want to the connected. The other one is an Alternate Reality Game in which I'm stalked by The Slender Man.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 21, 2011, 08:18:54 PM
is that a rping game or something..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 21, 2011, 08:48:14 PM
Sort of, my character finds coded clues and the readers have to decode them. My character acts on what they find and/or advice, for better or for worse. My character went missing for two months once after following some particularly bad advice.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 21, 2011, 09:12:29 PM
i see sounds like fun..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 21, 2011, 10:03:55 PM
Yeah... my readers tend to put Ron, my character, through the wringer a lot.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 21, 2011, 10:09:21 PM
yeah I bet. do some try to mislead you intentionally?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 21, 2011, 11:50:22 PM
Nah, its just that the Big Bad is a very powerful and terrible abomination of all the natural laws. Think small scale Cthulhu.

I don't think I could begin to describe what The Slender Man is here. TVTropes has a very comprehensive article on the matter, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 22, 2011, 12:01:04 AM
so its some kind of evil personified. :blink:
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 22, 2011, 04:22:00 AM
:exactly  Though, there is the alternate theory that he's just on a completely different wavelength than us humans. For one thing, masks confuse him.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 22, 2011, 04:31:44 AM
Sounds unusual, or spooky even.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 22, 2011, 06:03:02 AM
Hey, guys. Listen. It's been difficult for me to admit, but... Somehow, back in last year, some of my progress into Fellowship got erased. I'm still not sure how. A part of the reason that this is taking a while that I've been hesitant to speak is that I have to do it over again. It's not your reaction I was afarid of. I just don't want to talk about it. What I had was my best yet, and I now I have to try to react it.  :cry  But it's coming. I do work on this everyday. The updates are coming and this year, I am going to finish this monster of a paper, that Finnish production of The Lord of the Rings, included.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 22, 2011, 01:34:00 PM
Well you did post the sections that were lost on here riight? So all you'd have to do is print of the sections that already posted. or is this sections that you had completed but hadn't posted..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 22, 2011, 03:40:41 PM
Oh yeah, I've taken care in replacing what I lost that's already out on the web, but I also lost stuff further along. I've since then put this paper on a new flashdrive as well. The parts covering what happens in Bree, though, I have to rewrite from scratch, and I managed to get all the way to the hobbits and Aragorn on the road
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 22, 2011, 03:44:19 PM
oh i see..yeah that stinks..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 23, 2011, 01:43:02 AM
That does sound horrible.  I hope it doesn't happen again.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 23, 2011, 01:52:08 AM
Well take your time and try and reconstruct what you wrote down as best you can.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 23, 2011, 02:03:34 AM
yes, diffidently no hurry.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 24, 2011, 03:47:25 AM
I will. I'm trying to let it flow naturally as I did before. Though I do remember almost word for word my description of the overacting the guy who plays Butterbur did.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 24, 2011, 12:46:21 PM
That sounds great, I hope it goes well for you.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 24, 2011, 01:08:40 PM
yueah talkking about chewing the scenery..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 25, 2011, 10:55:11 PM
I swear every inch of that man's face contorted to their capacity... All in just the scene where he greets the hobbits and tells them Gandalf's not been around in six months.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 25, 2011, 10:58:00 PM
yep. trying to squeeze everything out of his brief role..it happens sometimes
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 05, 2011, 03:07:14 AM
Sorry to update without...updating again, but I'm feeling the flow again. I'm hitting the stride once more. I've taking a while because while I've had the opportunity, I just haven't been feeling it until now, so to speak. It's coming, I think I'm back to where I can do steady work on it again.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 05, 2011, 11:27:28 AM
That sounds good, no need to hurry.  I hope things continue to be positive for you, good luck.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 05, 2011, 11:30:25 AM
no problem WR. that just means you'll be able to update your sections of the films pretty soon.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 13, 2011, 09:09:52 AM
Next part coming in about a week. I'm putting on the finished touches to the latest bit and then it's proofreading time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 19, 2011, 12:06:01 AM
thats good Wr ...can't wait..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 19, 2011, 12:29:05 AM
Also I've noticed your very pessismistic about the Hobbit films, not surprising, given your past comments. But as stated before , jackson would have to really work at it to have the prequels suck as bad as the star wars prequels..I don't get the sense that the films will suck..unlike with Say batman and Robin where you knew after the first line of dialogue you were in for a long rollercoaster ride of suckage..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 20, 2011, 02:09:13 AM
Well, it's that The Hobbit was my very first real experience in literature. I'm very picky about how it's handled since it was a huge part of my childhood, more so than LBT or any of the Disney classics. I'm convinced that adding in stuff around the White Council and adding token females like Itaril is not for the best.

It just rubs me the wrong way that a story that has never left the best-seller list and has endured for almost a century now apparently isn't considered good enough to just get adapted without extensive additions to tie it into another story. I'm getting more the impression that Jackson is far more concerned with some larger scheme than he is with Bilbo's story. Yes, The Hobbit is just a part of the mythos... That's the point.
Besides which, do we really need to see what Sauron was doing at the time of Bilbo's journey? I mean, Bilbo finds the Ring. You can't ask for a bigger tie-in than that. That artifact alone is far more important than what Sauron was doing while under the alias of the Necromancer.

I know I've said all this before, but that's really how I feel about all this White Council, Necromancer, and such business. And the inclusion of this female elf warrior, Itaril, just may give me ulcers.
I know Jackson had a ton of bad ideas for LotR that never made it into the film, but that was mostly before filming began. Filming began this week, as far as I can tell and Itaril is still in, Orlando Bloom is back, and The Elven King (can never spell his name correctly, but I do know it) and Bard still aren't cast.

I've just got an all around bad feeling about this one.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 20, 2011, 01:48:59 PM
The Hobbit is a classic no question, and I'm sure that Bard and Thunundul (Legolas's father' will be cast. Remember that Mortensen wasn't the original pick for Aragorn. I think  subplots like Italril will hopefully be kept to filler. Elaborating to a limited degree on what Gandalf and the White council were doing would be interesting, as long as it doesn't overwhelm the other story. I'm looking forward to seeing the great Goblin, the struggle with the Wargs , the spiders, and of course Smaug. All these additions imo will be minor subplots. Given how long it took it get the film greenlit, its only natural to have some misgivings. As long as Jackson keeps to the story of bilbo, i think the films will do very well. He has a lot riding on these films..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 20, 2011, 05:05:14 PM
I hope he does. Bilbo finding the Ring trumps White Council, easily, and I hope Jackson realizes that.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 20, 2011, 07:16:16 PM
i agree, it wasn't until many years later that the ring was even considered important. so making a big deal out of the ring should not be an issue..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 20, 2011, 10:02:11 PM
Yes, it wasn't till Tolkien was working on the lord of the rings that he decided to go back to rewrite part of the hobbit.  I think it was mainly just certain chapters so it fit in with his ideas of the lord of the rings concerning the ring.  I heard the story Bilbo tells the dwarves is the original version or close to the original version.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 07, 2011, 09:14:10 PM
Alright, almost done with the next part which will cover the hobbits' entry into Bree to the wraiths' attack on their room. That took longer than I had anticipated, but I'll have it up soon, promise.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 07, 2011, 09:53:11 PM
oits alright Wr, post when you get the time..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 07, 2011, 10:12:45 PM
No hurry.  It does give us something to look forward to.   :yes
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 12, 2011, 09:24:04 PM
I finally updated! I'm just posting what I have, no more chances taken! I was holding back last time because I wanted to post a big, long update that took us all the way to Weathertop, but then things went wrong.

The Game Attempts: Part Twenty-Two-Part Twenty:
   
Cut to the pouring rain in the middle of the night as the four hobbits crowd around in the flora at the edge of a road, first looking in both directions to see if the way is clear, and then dashing across the muddy path to the Gate of Bree. This leads to a short humorous moment when Frodo knocks on it. First, the crotchety old Gate Keeper (I’m suddenly tempted to do a Spoony Experiment related joke), first slights open one slot, human height, then a second, at hobbit height. I don’t know why, but I find it funny.

   He sees the quartet standing before the Gate and opens it up and inquires what their business in Bree is. Frodo politely declines to answer the question, and the four are allowed in, likely because they’re hobbits and how much damage could they cause. Well, a lot, actually, but would you take them seriously as a threat on sight?

   After he shuts the Gate, the camera tilts up from overlooking it to show us Bree from a distance as the hobbits enter. Here, they’re presented with al kinds of terrors: drunks, hoodlums, and most terrifying of all: the director making his cameo as a guy eating a carrot. The tall, dark, and looming figures are perhaps a bit over the top, but it does a good job in signifying that the hobbits have officially left their comfortable lives and stepped into a much bigger world.

   This portrayal of Bree greatly contrasts the book in which it was a warm and hearty place of laughter and cheer instead of this dark and dreary burg presented here. Jackson falls into the Mos Eisley Space Port “hive of scum and villainy” that was popularized by George Lucas’s Star Wars. While the change to the peaceful town of Bree is an unfortunate one, it does however have its place in the film. Jackson obviously wanted to keep the tension on, so he instead of changed the tone of Bree to fit that need. Oddly, Tom Ferny and his cronies would have been the perfect Greedos for this, but they’re only hinted at much like in the Bakshi version. Another thing, I also miss the Underhills who basically think Frodo's a long lost cousin of theirs'.

   While wondering the streets, the quartet finally spots the Prancing Pony, looking exactly as described by Tolkien. Yeah, I say that a lot. I’m overjoyed to see things look as they did in Tolkien’s books instead of turned in the Bakshi-Sam and the like.

   Anyway, the hobbits enter the pub and Inn and Frodo calls for the owner of the establishment, Barliman Butterbur. Before I go further, if you feel like this guy stepped in from another, more cheesy fantasy flick, then you’re not alone. What follows may be the most triumphant example of bit actor overacting, ever. I honestly love watching this guy. Message Board caption sections could fill an entire forum’s worth with screenshots of this guy and what the users of that chatroom would come up with would be brilliant. He needs to get his own show, “Cheers With Butterbur”.

   As he greets the hobbits, he excessively nods his head and his vocal patterns shoot from even, but enthusiastic to Brian Blessed levels, like so : “GOOD EVENING, LITTLE MASTERS. We have. Some. Nice. Hobbit sized. Rooms. Availabllle. ALLLWAYSS happy to cater the little folks, Mr. uh…” All the while he matches the tone with equally over the top facial expressions, hamming it up gloriously.

   Of course, Frodo introduces himself as “Underhill”, and tells Butterbur they’re there to see Gandalf.

   After a moment of exaggerated thinking, Butterbur suddenly and briefly looks like someone prodded him with a hot poker while he lets out this gem: “OOOH, YYYESSS. I remember. Elderly chap. Big, gray bear. Pointy hat. Not seen him for six months.”

   Some ominous music kicks in as Frodo’s face falls at the sound of this news in a good bit of acting from Wood. The four hobbits huddle together as Merry asks “What now”.

   Cut to some shots of the hoodlums who infest the Prancing Pony before the camera settles on the hobbits sitting around a table uncomfortably. Then Merry sits down with an enormous mug, “a pint”. Cue a humorous bit with Pippin declaring that he’s getting one then runs with Sam calling after him that he’s already had about half of one by then. A combo of witty writing and the natural comedic timing of all the actors involved have made this a popular bit from this movie.

   It’s about at this point that Sam points out Strider sitting in the corner, staring at Frodo. Here, we get our first look at the ranger. Viggo Mortensen’s nonchalant posture and his casual pipe smoking really convey Aragorn’s prowess here. It also brings what a good eye Sam has to light, since I know I would never have noticed Aragorn had I been in the hobbit’s place.

   Some faintly ominous music picks up here as Frodo inquires to Butterbur who “that man in the corner” is. With acting much more subdued than before, the large ham tells him that Aragorn is a ranger, a member of a mysterious group of men that “wanders the wilds”, and that he’s only known as “Strider” to the people of Bree.

   Then, things get weird. For some reason known only to them, Jackson and co. had this idea about Frodo playing with the Ring in his hands and that causing him to go into some kind of weird trance. Here, Wood’s druggie face rears its addicted head again as Jackson starts using low angle shots, showcasing the patrons of the Prancing Pony sensing the evil and taking an interest in the young hobbit. The shots with the villagers are effective in setting the tone. Unfortunately, Wood’s “that some good shit man” face ruins it.

   During this sequence, we hear the voice of the Ring calling Frodo, drawing him in, but this is interrupted by Pippin’s loud voice shouting, “Baggins?”, as he drunkenly spills the beans on Frodo. Another problem I have with this adaptation is why oh why did they make Pippin rock stupid? Admittedly, he was getting a bit too loose-lipped in the book, but he was stopped before he said too much, and he certainly didn’t loudly announce that Frodo was a Baggins to the whole pub.

   Anyway, Frodo springs up from his seat and runs to Pippin to shut him up. He grabs his idiot cousin but ends up slipping on the boot of one of the men at the bar and falls flat on his back. Here, we get a cool effect as the Ring deliberately sabotages Frodo by slipping onto his finger after he accidentally lets it fly into the air upon impact.

   Thus he disappears in front of the entire Prancing Pony, and the extras give a well-acted gasp in shock. Frodo, meanwhile, is now in the shadow realm, which is much as it is described in the original book. You can see the regular world under all the black fog-like effects. Frodo looks around wearing an expression that’s a mix of amazement and fright all in one.

   Then he hears a noise behind him and sees The Eye of Sauron. It utters with a terrifying voice: “I see you. There is no life in the void. Only death.” This is intercut with the Ringwraiths sensing the Ring being used and making a beeline for Bree.

   Frodo scoots away from the Eye until he’s under a table and takes the Ring off. The world returns to normal. He looks around and breathes a sigh of relief at this.

   He’s then suddenly grabbed by Aragorn, who chides him on his carelessness and drags him upstairs. Unlike the Bakshi-Strider, he’s really coming off the rugged, badass ranger here. He shoves Frodo into the Inn room and puts out the lights… In any other movie, that might sound dirty. Obvious juvenile humor aside, he begins questioning Frodo about any “trinkets” he carries. Frodo unconvincingly says he’s able to disappear into thin without help. Thankfully, that was supposed to sound stupid.

   Aragorn reacts with the appropriate incredulousness as he snarks about his own ability to remain unseen as a ranger, but the ability to just vanish is something different entirely. Frodo finally just asks what the man wants and who he is to which Aragorn answers by asking if Frodo is afraid. The Baggins of course says yes to but he gets a “not enough” as a retort before Sam, Merry, and Pippin burst into the room.

   I love this bit. Sam’s front and center with his arms raised like a boxer while Merry and Pippin are hanging back holding a chair and a candle stand. Sam shouts without a hint of fear, “Release him, or I’ll have you, Longshanks!” Now there’s the Sam we all know and love!

   Aragorn commends Sam on his courage, but warns the group that the wraiths are coming. So, how does this handling of the hobbits’ first meeting with Aragorn hold up? Well, for the life of me, I don’t why Jackson and co. also left out the letter, I’d have to check the creators’ commentary for the appropriate scene, but the gist was that they were still trying to keep the tension on enough that the hobbits just didn’t have any other choice than to trust Aragorn, that and he supposed to be ambiguous as to where his alliance laid at this point (that they were selling glass drinking mugs with Aragornës image at McDonald’s at the time and that TV Guide had an issue featuring an exclusive interview with Viggo Mortensen out earlier 2001 both kind of spoiled which side he’s on for the uninitiated, though. Heh, I still own the mug and even dug up that issue of TV Guide to double check my sources. Wow, Becker was still on the air).

   We cut back to the Gate Keeper, perhaps taking time off of tormenting The Spoony One, as he hears a horse snort just outside the gate. He opens the little viewing slop and his eyes go wide with terror just as the Wraiths knock it over on him and then ride their horses over him. Relax, though, I’m sure this happens at least once a week. He’ll be fine.

   The wraiths (there are four of them, by the way, and this is the only time there is ever an even number of them together in the entire movie. Seriously, count them next time you watch.) gather in the square just outside the Prancing Pony and enter the establishment. As they walk, they basically move as if they were gliding across the ground with predatory prowess, instead of walking. This shows the true inhumanity of these abominations. As they make their way through the main room of the Inn, we see a very much awake Butterbur hiding behind the front bar silently weeping and visibly praying for them not to notice. The actor does an excellent job in showing the poor Innkeeper’s sheer terror and his presence in this scene brings up an interesting implication. The entire town probably knows the wraiths are here, but they’re all just hiding in their homes.

   Now, Bree, as well as many other places, all had problems or dealings with the wraiths beforehand as you find out once we reach the Council of Elrond, and this is a good way of showing it. Butterbur fearfully hiding out of sight gives more the idea that wraiths might have been this little burg more than just a little trouble, though. This, however, takes it a step further and suggests we might have seen several fresh graves had we seen more of the town during the daylight.

   The wraiths enter the room the hobbits had bought for themselves and each steps next to a bed and stabs the forms that look like little hobbit bodies. This is intercut with shots of Samwise sleeping and then reacting when the wraiths begin stabbing the pillows. But then Jackson finally cuts the tension with a butter knife and shows the hobbits all spooning on one bed and the wraiths discover four empty beds and then take the woods, likely thinking their quarry has moved on.

   Frodo asks Aragorn what the wraiths are and Aragorn explains their backstory. Mortensen’s dark and quiet line delivery adds to the nightmare fuel incarnate that these things already are, and I am finally past this part of the story! Yeeeeeah! :cheers  :celebrate  :^.^:

To be continued…
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 12, 2011, 10:00:22 PM
Great job Wr.. keep up the good work..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 12, 2011, 10:51:18 PM
Fantastic and fun read, thanks for all the work you put into this.  I look forward to when you have time to do the next one.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 13, 2011, 08:30:49 PM
Thanks guys. Hey, what are your thoughts of the talking animals that will be in The Hobbit? Weta Workshop made the talking animals in the Narnia films, and they'll make the ones for this film.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 13, 2011, 08:40:54 PM
the talking animals are necessary, like the giant spiders in Mirkwood and the trolls near Rivendell (where bilbo Gandalf and Thorin find their swords-  Sting Glamdring and Orchrist, respectively) It will be interesting to see the animals are portrayed.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 13, 2011, 09:32:00 PM
It sounds interesting.  I do wonder what they'll do and how well they'll be done.  Though I've not seen the Narnia films.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 13, 2011, 10:11:50 PM
Finally, people not calling me a twelve year old over this. Yep. Can't do without them.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 13, 2011, 11:36:35 PM
I guess most of that will be around the Beorn scene, or however you spell his name?   been a while since I read the book.  As I recall Tolkein glossed over but mentioned that Bilbo & Gandalf had some adventures on the way back to his home, with Beorn being with them part of the way.  Doubt they'd have those scenes in the movie.  I don't recall the details since I've not read the book in quite a while.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 14, 2011, 12:12:12 AM
Plus the eagles. Can't forget them. Though, I wonder if Jackson will deliberately make the animals speaking sound non-human.
He may try to go for a modified parate sound for the sound of Gwaihir speaking.
As for Beorn speaking in bear form, you just need a guy with a very deep, gravelly voice. I vote Clancy Brown.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 14, 2011, 12:54:28 AM
Hopefully they'll pick an actor with a cool sounding deep voice instead of an annoying one.  

Not sure how I'd handle the eagles.  Keep the human voices or make them a bit non human.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 14, 2011, 01:36:49 AM
That would be Clancy Brown with the cool, deep voice. He was the voice of the Viking Leader of the pilot episode of Gargoyles and Lex Luthor on Superman: The Animated Series.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 14, 2011, 10:09:03 AM
i'd just have them speaking. perhaps try and sneak in a voice from the 77 film among them  as a nod (assuming any of those people are still alive). theres also the wArgs, who were not speaking in the trilogy but were in the Hobbit. having Gandalf throwing magically enhanced pinecones would be a cool sense. not sure if he'll include the singing parts by the goblins..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 14, 2011, 10:38:17 AM
I'd guess not since I don't recall any singing in the LOTR movies I've seen, though I've not seen the 3rd one and it's been a while since I saw the first 2 parts.  

Not sure if they had the "where there's a whip, there's a way" song that was in the 2nd or 3rd book, forgot which.  

several versions on youtube.  I found one at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdXQJS3Yv0Y (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdXQJS3Yv0Y)

The hobbit had lots of songs in it also, like the one the dwarves sang at Bilbo's house.
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gv1qnPAiSI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gv1qnPAiSI)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 18, 2011, 04:02:04 PM
Alright, I have the next part of the paper mapped out. It will begin with the hobbits on the road with Aragorn, obviously picking up right where we left off, and it will end at the confrontation at the Ford of Bruinen with the Ringwraiths being swept away and Frodo passing out.

Then part after next will cover all the scenes in Rivendell.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 27, 2011, 02:26:17 AM
thats great Wr. hopefully you can have it up soon..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 27, 2011, 02:31:01 AM
That sounds great, and you do very good work.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 27, 2011, 06:28:02 PM
Thanks. I hope i can get it out soon.

Fellowship Paper Parts Outline:

Next: Strider and Hobbits slumming it ont he road.
After: Rivendell
Then: Fellowship on the Road, ending with them entering Moria.
Then: Fellowship in Moria, ending with them entering Lothlorien.
Then: The Fellowship is taken to Lady Galadriel, ends when they leave.
Then: Fellowship on the river, will probably end with the end of the movie.

Six or seven (probably six) more parts of Fellowship, then I can begin writing about The Two Towers. Fair warning, some of the creative decisions Jackson made in TTT have been known to bring on levels of rage in me almost on par with what Bakshi did. However, he later made up for it in The Return of the King.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 27, 2011, 07:40:49 PM
thats fine WR. TTT is widely conbsidered the weakest of the trilogy, although it did get six Oscar nominations.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 28, 2011, 12:34:40 AM
Sounds like a good outline.  

It makes sense that the middle of a trilogy is often pretty weak.  Though that does not have to be so.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 28, 2011, 09:05:41 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2m2x8qJcGQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2m2x8qJcGQ) Has anyone seen this?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 28, 2011, 09:54:12 PM
looks really cool.. i'm really excited for the film..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 28, 2011, 10:10:22 PM
the LOTR geek isn me is pumped for the film to be made, seeing the sets , hearing the score and see Sir Ian complain about his nose :)  i can't wait for December 2012. its going to be EPIC. then of course Wr we can expect you to pick it apart like you;'ve done so well to date on the trilogy.. :)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 28, 2011, 11:22:58 PM
Thanks for the link.  Just watched it.  It was neat.  Think I"ll download it so I can watch it at my leasure again in the future.  I do wonder if these will be extras on the dvd/blu-ray or not.   I also wonder if the movie will come out on dvd & blu-ray or just blu-ray.  I also assume he'll do like before and put out the theatrical version, them a certain number of months later put out the extended version.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 29, 2011, 01:01:01 AM
I'm hoping they won't have to release an extended version. The Hobbit is short enough that they literally just put what was written on film without leaving anything important out. One two hour and forty-five minute-to-three hour movie would be enough to cover the stuff the book, easily.

This is why the White Council business worries me. They have a full movie aleady sitting there in front of them. Bilbo finds the Ring. Nothing about the Necromancer can top that and hope Jackson realizes it. My worse fear about this is something from Bilbo's story getting swept under the carpet to make room for things that never occurred in the book.

Of course, this is an entirely biased opinion. The Hobbit was the very first book without big letters compromising a few sentences put to a picture on every page that I ever read. Tolkien was my very, very first real literary experience, ever. Needless to say, I'm very particular about how well it gets adapted.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 29, 2011, 11:30:50 AM
I think with just what's in the hobbit there should be enough for 2 feature length movies.  Though I guess Jackson may want to show what Gandalf was doing when he kept leaving the group.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 29, 2011, 02:51:27 PM
That'd be fine, but this is Bilbo's story. Not Gandalf's.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 29, 2011, 04:17:59 PM
True.   To tell Gandalf's story would be different.  Though Tolkien did not write that sort of story.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 29, 2011, 08:06:59 PM
filling in on Gandalf's business is one thing, but i think thety will try to be faithful to the book, and leave most of "added stuff" out. i understand that things have to be changed from book to screen to some degree, but this is ultimately about Bilbo and the dwarves. Elronds role in the book, for instance is small, he offers them sanctuary and discovers the rune letters on the map.. thats pretty much it.. as for the Battle of 5 armies, in the book only Fili Kili and Thorin were killed, in the 77 film, only 6 survived. I'd prefer them to follow the book in this regard..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 29, 2011, 10:14:59 PM
I'm not sure, it sounded to me like they plan on adding the White Council stuff and some of what they were up to.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 29, 2011, 10:55:55 PM
yes , some of that is imo necessaryu, but it shouldn't overwhelm what Biblo and the others are doing
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 29, 2011, 11:02:34 PM
True.  They should be the true focus.  

Looks like folks are looking forward to the movie, with the fanmade trailers that some have made.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 29, 2011, 11:29:53 PM
Yep, they're including the entie campaign to get the Necromancer/Sauron out of Mirkwood.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 29, 2011, 11:46:38 PM
alkthough to be honest, i think that will be really cool..its something only hinted at in the book, to see it come to life will be special. its after the necromancer is driven off that Gandalf returns to check on Bibllbo and Company and comes in just as Bilbo admits to taking the Arkenstone and trading it to Bard
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 29, 2011, 11:54:03 PM
It could be interesting.  And the general audience may find it annoying to have Gandalf keep leaving and not show them what he's doing.  Plus the fans would like to see that I'm sure.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 30, 2011, 12:58:52 AM
we have to remember this was written before LOTR, so gandalf going off is a plot device, forcing the dwarves and bilbo to rise to challenges on thier own.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 30, 2011, 01:54:51 AM
True, but the general public won't look at it from that point of view.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 30, 2011, 03:17:44 AM
Will they? Gandalf running off and disappearing has never made anyone I've ever met complain. Would general audiences really react so differently, since Gandalf is supposed to be mysterious? Oh well, I guess it's going to be a non-issue, since we're going to see where he goes, at least when he disappears at Mirkwood, anyway.


Another concern is how they'lll portray Sauron. A huge part of why he's so frikkin scary is that we have no idea what he looks like or is capable of behind the walls of his stone fortress. Just how off-screen will they be able to keep him if he's less powerful and doesn't have hundreds of thousands of orcs to fight behind.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 30, 2011, 10:51:52 AM
True, but according to Tolkien, if I recall correctly, after the fall of Numenor he could no longer take either a pleasing or a physical shape, I forgot which.   Maybe a pleasing shape could be it, but it's been a while since I read that.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 30, 2011, 11:45:01 AM
tolkien doesn't mention anything about the necromancers appearance, and doesn'y say much about dol guldur except having gandalf snoop around and saying what a dangerous and tricky piece of work it was. it is never said whether he meets sauron face to face, but eventually he does find out who is he is. the dwarves however are pissing thierpants scared aboiut him reveaing that he went to dol guldur. the only other mention of the Necromancer is when Thorin mentions going after hin and gandalf rebukes Thorin saying that his powers far outstrip all the powers of all the dwarves left in middle Earth , even if they could all be united against him, it would be a losing battle.at best the battle of Dol Guldur should be inconclusive, because sauron had long prepared against their assault, and had made plans to leave to bar Radur.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 30, 2011, 09:39:31 PM
If written, acted, directed, well it could be interesting to see that part of the events that do not appear in the hobbit book.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on May 03, 2011, 01:50:21 AM
I'm up the hobbits being attacked by the wraiths at Weathertop. It shouldn't too much longer before I churn this out. I know not to hurry, but I still don't see this taking too much longer. I should have this out before the 9th, easily.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on May 03, 2011, 11:53:09 AM
Sounds like you're making progress and you always do a great job.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on May 04, 2011, 12:00:27 AM
no rush. WR, just post when you are able..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on May 16, 2011, 11:13:25 PM
Have you seen the photo of Mckellan as Gandalf sporting shades? My inner geek rejoiced when I saw it..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on May 17, 2011, 03:22:23 AM
The Game Attempts: Part Twenty Three-Part Twenty One:
   We continue with the hobbits, now joined by Strider, on the road on their way to Rivendell, which is explained in this scene. The hobbits whisper amongst themselves about whether or not they should trust this new party member, but Frodo is insistent that they have no choice. Aragorn finally tells them where’s leading when Sam asks, showing he heard every word they said, including Merry uttering “he seems foul enough”. The look on the Brandybuck’s face is priceless.

   What follows is a montage of them following with a few short exchanges interlaces throughout, only unlike the Bakshi version, there are actual landscapes and actors who know what they’re doing present. They manage a humorous moment where the hobbits’ eating practices baffle Strider and then the group stumbling through a bog. Here, we get a helicopter shot of them in the bog. Sam is leading Bill the Pony. They skipped the scene where they got him, but anyone with any level of deduction can figure out they bought him in Bree, so it’s not a problem.

   The problem with Bill’s presence in the helicopter shot mentioned is that he’s two guys in a suit, and looks like two guys in a suit. I can why that was cut, since if I noticed it on the DVD, it would have looked like a joke in theaters.

   Later, we get a short scene of the group bedded down for the night. Strider walks through their little camp with a deer he killed slung over his shoulders. He sets it down and presumably butchers it for eating later. Instead of that delightful scene, we instead get an exchange in which Frodo listening to Strider sing the “Lay of Luthien”, an elf maiden who gave her love to Beren, a mortal man. He sings it wistfully and a sad and longing expression on his face. Now this scene, I don’t know why they cut it. It shows how much more Strider is than just a ranger even before the scene on Weathertop and its foreshadowing a huge part of his story is so nicely woven in this scene. Yeah, I get that his true allegiance is still supposed to be in question since the uninitiated aren’t yet supposed to know who he is (again, that you could buy a mug with his face on it at the time kind of gives away his hero status. Twilight fans could put these puzzle pieces together! Oh yeah, I went there). But then again, I’m biased and any scene of Viggo fluently speaking or singing Elvish is cool by me with that sexy voice of his. Did I just type that?

   Frodo, awakened by the singing, asks Strider about the woman of the sing, and the ranger explain it as briefly as he can, obviously not wanting to talk about it or think about the implications concerning Arwen at the moment. This is just about the only scene where it is confirms that Frodo knows elvish, so there's another reason why this should have been in the theatrical cut.

   Then we cut to Saruman in his oh so pleasant little Isengard tower. And by pleasant, I mean you’d have to be insane to want to live in this horrible place. The entire place is pitch-black, it’s designed to look like one wrong step and you’d be impaled on a sharp edge, and it has to be cold as hell in there.

   The fallen wizard is using the Palintir to converse with Sauron, who commands him to build an army, one worthy of Mordor. To cut Saruman sitting in his office wrapped in a blanket, giving credence to my theory that it’s very cold in there, when some goblins arrive. They ask what they are to do.

   Cut to them pulling down all the trees surrounding Isengard. The trees make extra groaning sounds apart from the sound of wood being pulled from the ground, indicating their status as living trees from Fangorn forest. And this is the exact moment Saruman seals his own doom, but more on that later in The Two Towers.

   We cut to Gandalf, who awakens on the roof of Isengard. He overhears the tree’s groaning and walks over to the edge and sees the entire wood being torn down. He leans against one of the four points on the roof and shivers in the cold.

   This sequence is short but informative. There’s really not much to say other than it’s very well done.

   Then he cut back to Strider and the hobbits as they arrive at Weathertop. The hill wide shot is a combo of an actual hill and a CGI inserting the watch tower part of it, but that’s it. Looking at it in the theaters, I would have told you it was real.

   The group sets up camp on the side of the hill below the top. Strider is off to check out the surrounding area and gives the hobbits swords to defend themselves with. It’s a reasonable substitute explanation for how the hobbits got armed since they skipped the Wights.

   Later, we Frodo resting when he overhears his friends laughing amongst themselves and sees the fire glow everywhere and he rolls over abruptly and see the numbskulls cooking food over an open fire. Shocked at their stupidity, he stamps the food out ignoring their announcement about “tomatoes and nice crispy bacon” because fires are like freakin’ bulleyes in the dark. The camera cuts to a wide shot of Weathertop to show us just how far out the fire is showing and how far Pippin’s complaint rings out.

   Then we hear the shriek of a Ringwraith. The hobbits crowd around the edge of the little hollow to see, and sure enough, five wraiths are riding up to the abandoned watch tower. They race up the top and stand in the middle with their backs to each other and their little swords drawn. The camera pans around them as they look frightfully in all directions in a borderline panicked state. All four of the hobbits’ acting is spot on. You can sense their fear.

   Then the single creepiest moment of the film happens. Frodo turns to look at one of the many entrances leading into the center of the watch tower. Almost as if just appearing from the darkness, one of the wraiths emerged, like moving as if it were floating on air. The effect put my heart in my throat. The wraiths soundlessly all move closer to the little hobbits and pull their swords and begin their slow advance.

   Samwise musters up enough courage to verbally rebuke them and attacks them. He only manages to get a few sword swings in before the wraith he’s fighting backhands into him a wall. Merry and Pippin then move in front of Frodo, but are pulled aside. Not a brave as Sam’s attempt, but they still get props for having the guts to just step between the Nazgul and their prey.

   Now it’s Frodo standing alone. The central wraith, which also backhanded Samwise advances on him. Now, I know Frodo had the nerve to try to attack the wraith in the book, whereas here he just tries to run for it trips over his own feet. I don’t which is better, honestly. Attacking the wraith did him no good in the book, but he totally fails at just running for it here. Eh, there’s a reason neither book or film Frodo is my favorite character amongst the cast. He’s less competent than just about everyone else and duller than everyone else. At least in the books, though, he had negotiating skills.

   Anyway, Frodo stupidly pulls the Ring out (facepalm) and immediately the wraith later revealed to be the Witch King is upon him. Frodo tries to scoot away (get up and run you idiot!) before scooting himself into a corner, Wood does his druggie face again before slipping on the Ring. There he sees the wraiths in their true form: The twisted forms of once men. The effect is excellent. The wraiths’ true forms are costumes, while the swirling shadow world is CGI. The Witch King reaches for the Ring and the Ring reaches for it in return. Frodo pulls his hand back and gets stabbed for his troubles.

   Then we hear a battle cry as Strider enters the scene with carrying in one hand, his sword, and a flaming torch in the other. Frodo pulls off the Ring, but it pains him to do so now that he’s turning into a wraith. I have to say I buy that completely, considering the nature of the Ring and the wraiths. Sam regains consciousness and runs over to his master. Frodo calls pathetically out to him while Sam begins tending to him, a worried expression upon his face. Astin’s acting here is perfect. This is the first of many moments where I was touched by Sam’s devotion to Frodo.

   Strider meanwhile single-handedly fends off the wraiths by setting their robes on fire. They all run off screaming like little girls. Given what they just did, the audience feels immense satisfaction in their sight. Finally, it’s down to Strider and one wraith. Of course, this is the now famous shot of him throwing the torch right into the camera (another angle that get a 3D effect in theaters these days) and the light-source lands squarely in the remaining wraith’s hood. It runs off screaming. This had pretty much everyone in the theater I was in going “…badass.”
   Anyone else recall that Strider of the Bakshi film that was tripped up by the wraiths and by pretty much every other enemy and how he’d just barely break even in all his fights? Yeah, I’m applying Kainic Acid to my brain to try to forget him, too.

   Sam calls over to the ranger and informs him that something’s wrong with Frodo. Strider identifies the blade that pierced Frodo and tell the hobbits that he will need elvish medicine, and soon.

   The film cuts to a shot of Strider carrying Frodo through the woods. Everyone except for the Ring bearer is carrying a torch. Frodo begins calling out to Gandalf’s name. The film then segways back Isengard.

   The camera pans over the ruined and gutted grounds of Isengard as the orcs work on the machines that create the Urak-Hai. Boy, am I glad Jackson had the good taste to leave out how to create a half-orc, which is what you get by (barf!) crossbreeding a man and an orc. Instead, we get straightforward (thank God) genetic engineering. Before getting a close look at the creation of the manmade monstrosities Saruman ill loose unleash, we head on up to the roof of the tower where he find Gandalf. He’s looking like he’s in pretty bad shape.

   An odd moth flutters over to him and he causes it in his hands and whispers a message to it before setting it free again. Then the camera roller-coasters down into the depths on the pits the orcs have constructed for Saruman at last. The sets are intricate, each piece of equipment at least appears to serve some purpose, and the model builders, as always, really, outdid themselves.

   We get some shots of the orcs building the gear which the Urak-Hai will use before we cut to the mud pit which has several odd pulsating sacks which some orcs are prodding with sticks. One apparently must be finished as the orcs pull back the sack, revealing Lurtz, the head Urak-Hai of the first film. The first thing the hideous beast of a half-man-half-orc-thingy does is grab an orc and straggle he/she/it to death.

   Saruman oversees the operation and stops some other orcs from stopping Lurtz from killing. All the whole the corrupted white wizard wears the expression of a first time mother as he watches as Lurtz is born and then kills first thing. The set-up, the atmosphere, the build-up, and the payoff are all creepy like no one else’s business. It perfectly illustrates how far from grace Saruman was fallen and how horrible the abominations he has created are.

   Then we go back to Frodo and company. Frodo drifts back into consciousness and finds himself face-to-face with a giant stone finger pointing directly to him. He looks around and finds himself in the, ah, stiff company of Bilbo’s trolls. The troll look amazing, by the way They’re frozen in an unmistakable position which indicates the argument they were having right before Gandalf’s ploy finally paid off.

   Sam appears b y Frodo’s side to check on him. Frodo can only squeak and moan in response to him. I have no idea why the filmmakers decided that Frodo would be unable to even talk while suffering from the Morgal blade. Yeah, it hurt in the book, but he was still even able to crack jokes at Sam’s expense for crying out loud. Sam feels his employer’s forehead and announces that he’s going cold.

   Strider announces that Frodo needs King’s Soil, which will help to slow the poisons, and he calls on Sam’s aid. He cut to a quick shot of Sam frantically searching for some amongst the brush while Aragorn scans the land in a more analytical fashion. HE finds some and bends, pulls out a knife, and prepares to cut some up.

   Then a blade is suddenly at his throat. We hear a woman’s voice light-heartedly scold him for being off-guard. He looks back up at the person with a faintly amused expression.

   Head’s up, I know I’m not being overtly detailed right now, but I find something the warrants heavy commenting, I’ll do so.

   We cut back to an ailing Frodo As something lights up in the dead of night. He looks over and sees Arwen in her true. A shining figure of beauty in white. She speaks to him in flawless elvish and tells him that she is here to help. He coughs and loses consciousness again.  He is officially The Load.

   Now, on Glorfindel and Arwen: While I will admit that the loss of Glor’ is a shame, you just can’t have a character pop up to give Frodo a horse, then show up at the Council of Elrond, and then just vanish from the story. If you have a highly superfluous character like Glorfindel, you write him out with someone who will appear later. In this Arwen, who had absolutely nothing to do in the books at all, because Tolkien did not know how to write female characters, for the most part. Eowyn is far enough removed from a typical girl that she’s the exception and Galadriel was written to be mostly business-like. In fact, most people who just read the books once or twice will be hard pressed to remember Aragorn had a love interest, because she does nothing but show up in two wordless cameos. Here, we get to see her and see her in action, and see a bit of why Aragorn is in love with this woman so deeply.

   Sorry, hardcore Tolkien fans who insist that Glorfindel was indispensible, but he is very, very dispensable. In fact, I have a harder time remembering he exists than I ever did Arwen.

   Back to the film, Aragorn and Arwen tend to Frodo. Aragorn chews up the weed and then applies the now germ-covered paste he’s chewed it into onto the wound. Why couldn’t they have just cut to a boiling pot containing it and then Aragorn applies a rag he’s dipped in it to the wound? Anyway, Arwen comments that Frodo will not last long as the ranger hoists the hobbit onto the horse she brought.

   Arwen insists on riding instead, and after a short argument, she wins out. Sam criticizes Strider for just letting the two go, but the man just wordlessly watches with a concerned look on his face. I like how this shows how much faith Aragorn has in Arwen ability to get Frodo and herself there, alive and well.

   We cut to daylight as Arwen bears Frodo to Rivendell at full gallop. She passes through some trees and we get a glimpse of the wraiths riding up along-side her before they are fully revealed once in the clear. The music picks up and Arwen guides her horse away from them and an all out chase in which all nine end up on the elf and hobbits’ tails breaks out. The choreography and horseback stunts are amazing. I can’t even imagine getting a horse to do some of things witnessed here.

   Finally, the chase comes to the ford, where Arwen makes her stand. A wraith I assume to be the Witch King demands that she give up the “Halfling”. She draws her sword and tells them to bring it. The wraiths pull their cursed blades and start across the river. Arwen calls up Elrond’s protection of Rivendell and a tidel wave in the shape of horses appears and washes away the wraiths. I would comment more, but it all happens almost exactly like it did in the book and looks great.

   At this point, Frodo really slips off into wraithyland. Arwen lays him out on the ground to try to snap him out of it to no avail. He slips into a very deep sleep. He hugs him closely and lets loose some tears. Then things get kind of trippy as the screen goes light with images of a falling Frodo next to an image of a chanting Elrond play against the faint background of the camera pointed straight up at the ceiling in Rivendell. The effect isn’t bad, and it illustrates what the world probably looked like to Frodo in his haze. Finally, we cut to a lit image of him in bed asking where he is. And there is where we leave off.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on May 17, 2011, 09:05:50 AM
Great work as usual WR. Nice job..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on May 17, 2011, 09:33:04 PM
A very good job and a great read, thanks.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on May 22, 2011, 01:50:23 PM
looking forward to the next chapter WR...
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on June 19, 2011, 07:58:24 PM
So wjhen will the next chapter be up?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 19, 2011, 09:06:36 PM
I'm not sure. I got busy. I've been working on it when I can, but I should have it done before too much longer.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on June 19, 2011, 09:11:06 PM
thats fine. we'll be waiting when you get finished. What are you thoughts on how the Hobbit is progressing? They have titles for both parts now.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on June 19, 2011, 09:46:24 PM
Go at your own pace, there is no need to hurry, especially if you are busy.  

What will the titles be?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 20, 2011, 01:23:03 AM
The First one is "An Unexpected Party".
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on June 20, 2011, 02:27:13 AM
Sounds like a good title.   Was that one of the chapters of the book, or close to that?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 15, 2011, 06:31:44 PM
yes it was the first chapter as i recall..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on July 15, 2011, 07:20:14 PM
Looking forward to the next chapter as well.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 21, 2011, 02:13:44 AM
I'm getting to work on this again, at last.

In other news:

Peter Jackson Vlog (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z76SyenXyTo&feature=related)

Peter Jackson Vlog 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TxDfsRlBCs&feature=feedu)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 21, 2011, 07:41:18 AM
You know, I was going to make this update longer, but what the heck, I'll just put what I have finished:

The Game Attempts-Part Twenty Four-Part Twenty Two:

   Frodo wakes up in Rivendell, and at first, it looks like there’s a heavenly glow over him. This was probably to show the Elven influence that saved him, and it works. He asks where he is, and we hear Gandalf warmly answer “that [he] is in the house of Elrond, and it is [whatever] O’Clock in the morning, if [he] wants to know”. Frodo bolts upright and stares at the wizard by his bedside.

   The key difference between Bakshi and Jackson’s Gandalf is that Sir Ian isn’t looming over Frodo menacingly. He’s sitting by his bedside like a beloved old grandpa figure, which is much, much more in line with Gandalf. He’s also speaking quietly and practically glowing with grandpa-ish warmth. Behaving, you know, like someone would at the bedside of someone in a hospital bed.

   Frodo asks why he failed to meet them, and Gandalf uncomfortably explains that Saruman is turned to evil and madness. He cut to a flashback where the corrupted White Wizard is torturing Gandalf some more to try to make him submit. We catch a quick look at the moth Gandalf had summon the Lord of the Eagles, and the gray wizard departs on his back after leaving Saruman with one final bit of advice that Sauron does not sure power and will cast him aside when he is no longer of any value to him.

   That fits with Gandalf’s character; as even in the book, he never gave up on Saruman until he was…well, dead. This also illustrates how far Saruman was fallen, and how much he is his own enemy. In the books, it makes a point of telling us that Saruman is out to get the Ring for himself, these films leave a bit more ambiguous, though (not necessarily a bad thing). Either way, he’s a mad wizard serving the wrong side.

   We cut back to the present to a sad looking Gandalf, looking faintly tormented by the betrayal. Frodo asks him what’s bothering him, but the wizard assures him all is well…well, as well as he can be given the present circumstances. Then, Sam rushes into the room and runs to Frodo’s bedside, happy to see him awake. He grabs Frodo’s hand, but only because Ian McKellan wanted to promote the idea that they were gay, not because Sam wanted to check to see if the natural bodily warmth had returned to his hand, like in the book. I kid you not.

   Gandalf announces that Frodo’s recovery are part and partial to the healing arts of Lord Elrond. Then the elf lord in question, and single most miscast actor in the entire saga, steps into view.

   “Ah, Mr. Anderson,” Agent Smith says. "Do robotic sheep dream of electric sex?”

   Alright, no, he doesn’t say that. On Weaving? Is there another actor in this entire trilogy, save Elijah Wood, who was more miscast? One reason Hugo Weaving is so miscast is because he doesn’t look elvish even in the slightest. Yes, I get that Elrond is half-elven, but he chose to live as a elf. That, and he’s frikkin Agent Smith. Role association like no one else’s business! When you see Hugo Weaving in anything, you see Agent Smith. It’s that simple. It’s kind of like whenever you see Jim Varney, you see Ernest P. Worell…only with more dignity in Weaving's case.

   After Frodo has been properly greeted and introduced to Rivendell, we cut to a short montage of Frodo and Sam exploring the haven’s sites, and they eventually come across some familiar looking faces in Merry and Pippin. The cousins greet their kin with much vigor and hugs. Then Frodo spots someone else a little ways away. He recognizes his uncle Bilbo and rushes over to him.

   Bilbo gets up and greets his heir with a warm embrace. There’s not really much to say about the reunion of Bagginses, Tooks, and Brandybucks other than it was well-acted and delivered.

   Then we cut to Bilbo’s quarters at Rivendell where Frodo is sitting on his uncle’s bed and reading his memoirs, “There And Back Again: A Hobbit’s Tale”, and congratulates his uncle genuinely. One thing I notice about Wood’s performances is that he’s usually good when interacting with elements and people that are actually there. The plight of many a modern actor as blue screens becomes more and more prominently used.

   At first, Frodo is overjoyed, but then the tone turns more melancholy when he reflects on how terrible his own journey was. Bilbo comfortingly puts an arm around Frodo. Holm absolutely shines with warmth in this scene as Bilbo. Had he been just a bit longer, we might have seen his reprisal of the role in Jackson’s upcoming duo of films, but alas, but he’s the second oldest member of the cast, born 1931. He will be narrating the upcoming Hobbit movie, though.

   The camera passes far away from the two Bagginses to Elrond and Gandalf observing the two from afar. Elrond comments on Frodo’s returning health, but Gandalf reminds his old companion that the Morgol wound will be carried with the hobbit for the rest of his life. Their discussion then turns to the happenings of the world around them and to who they can still turn to as the times grow darker.

   Gandalf thinks they can leave it to humans, but Elrond recounts Isildor’s fall to the Ring, which the elf lord witnessed firsthand in retort. He calls humans weak and that there is no strength left in them, calling us divided and leadership. Tolerance: pass it on.

Rather than leave just to men, Elrond reveals that he has called all the free peoples to Rivendell to decide what to do with it. As Gandalf looks down on the entrance to the Last Home, he spies the arrival of Boromir, played by Sean Bean, actor-extraordinaire but with a special talent for dying…a lot. He’s followed up by Prince Legolas of Mirkwoof, played by Orlando Bloom, former rising star and decent actor who frankly just never got much a chance. And finally, the dwarves arrive, and we are introduced to Gimli, played by John Rhys-Davies, master actor and always welcome screen presence.

   Elrond proclaims: “They must decide now how to end it.”

   Gandalf reminds Elrond that the heir of Isildor lives, but Elrond again shoots him down (he does this a lot in these films) that “he” had turned from his roots a long time ago. On cue, we jump away to another scene with Aragorn dead center in the camera (hinthint). He overhears some footsteps and spots Boromir having a look around what I can only guess was either a shrine or a library. The walls are lined with murals of events historical to Middle-earth, one of which is the final showdown between Isildor and Sauron, which Boromir stops and has a good look at.

   He then turns and notices Aragorn watching him. The two exchange introductions, well, Boromir tells Aragorn who he is while Aragorn only reveals he is friend to Gandalf. Boromir, seeing his obvious caution, assures him that they are on the same side. He then spots the shrine of Narsil. He picks the sword up and stares in awe at it. He runs a finger over the blade and cuts himself on one of the jagged edges where it broke.

   He utters: “Still sharp.” Some are absolutely convinced that this statement is a reference to Sean Bean’s most famous role in Europe, that of Richard Sharpe, in a series he starred in over there. I’ve always had my doubts, though, considering how “still sharp” sounds like something anyone might say if they had just cut themselves with a blade they were expecting to be dulled. So take from it what you will.

   He looks over at Aragorn, and embarrassed, clumsily tries to put the sword away, but it falls onto the floor. Boromir pauses, considering giving the blade its proper respects, but then leaves without doing so, all the same. I’ve never been sure what to feel about that last bit. On one hand, it IS Narsil, on the other, it WAS wielded by Middle-earth’s biggest screw up as far as history was concerned. Can't say I'd necessarily show that a whole lot of respect if I knew the story behind it's last wielder, either.

   Aragorn instead puts it back himself and gives it a bow. He stares uneasily at it. The shot of him standing before the shrine of Narsil with the mural situated behind him perfectly is well done and works as possible symbolism on so many levels I’d have to write another paper to cover it all.

   Arwen approaches him from behind and assures Aragorn that he is only himself and not Isildor, and therefore not bound to the same doom. Yeah, the thing about Aragorn in this adaptation is that he’s terrified of becoming just like Isildor and being corrupted by the Ring and/or power in general. He knows power corrupts and he has his doubts that he can be a good king. It is a valid fear for him to have considering he's heir to the most powerful kingdom in all the land, but it is WAY to prominently displayed in these films.

   I understand that Jackson was trying to create a character arc for him, since the book Aragorn has already decided how his life was going to play out if Sauron was defeated again before we ever meet him in Bree. However, Jackson and his co-writers overdid it here and as these films go on, I’ll be able to explain further. Right now, there’s no need to get that ahead of the story. That said, they did not give us a bad Aragorn in these films, however flawed their portrayal of him was. They didn’t. This Aragorn actually had depth and I could see both the king and the ranger in him at key moments in his story. The Bakshi Aragorn, however, was just the ranger.

   We next see Aragorn and Arwen in a garden standing on a little white bridge over a creek. They stand opposite of each other and they’re handing each other’s hands. It is identical to the original cover of The Princess Bride, and it works perfectly here. The two reminisce how they first met, and Arwen pops the question to Aragorn. Yes, the woman asks the man to marry her. I’ve always found the switcheroo amusing considering how badass and manly Aragorn is meant to be.

   He, at first, objects, but she insists, saying that staying on Middle-earth with him is her choice, and that “like her heart”, she is now bound to him. Then the two kiss. Best written moment between Aragorn and Arwen, save perhaps their marriage at the end, I have to say. Brace yourselves; it’s all downhill from here as far as these two are concerned.

   The sequence with the happy couple above is very well written and shockingly subtle for a Hollywood funded movie. The two talk exactly like two people who have known and loved each other for a very long time. No more words than necessary are exchanged, because these two already know what’s going on with the other and what they’re thinking and feeling. In a few words, I wish more Hollywood romances were written like this, but alas, Hugh Grant must pay bills.

   The film then makes a transition to the Council of Elrond. Alright, here we go, the most of the single most important scenes of the entire movie. I’m quoting from Bakshi section of this paper, concerning Elrond:
“Now, Tolkien knew how important it was to make sure his readers were up to date with the current events of Middle Earth, so the first part of the council was just putting together the pieces of the world view puzzle to properly establish what Sauron was up to. Of course, no film could ever deliver this, and it has thus been shortened in all other versions”; “As stated, the main purpose of the council is to track Sauron's recent movements via testimonies given by all invited to the council who came from all over Middle-Eart to figure him out, discuss what to do with the Ring, and then chose the people who will carry out the course of action they decide upon. Tolkien took thirty-two pages in what was essentially a whole chapter out of his work to do this.”

   So how well does the Jackson version hold up? Well, Jackson’s rendition takes about six-ten minutes, depending on the Edition you’re watching and foregoes on the information sharing and just sticks with deciding on what to do with the Ring and appointing its handlers. It goes as follows, Elrond briefly introduces the purpose of the meeting and has Frodo present the Ring and lay on a pedestal in the middle of the meeting area. We get various reaction shots of the members of the council. Legolas stares, looking almost shocked while Gimli just furrows his brows in defiance at its calling.

   In the extended edition, Boromir gets up and recounts the dreams about the Ring he and his brother had been having all the while slowly approaching it, unable to resist its draw even at this early. It was a very clever way to introduce his character flaw. Just as he is almost upon it, Elrond is about call him out, but Gandalf speaks the Black Speech at the meeting. This causes the sky to cloud over and the earth to shake. The elves of the council react as if the speech is physically harming them just hearing it.

   Elrond scolds Gandalf for this after he finishes scaring everyone, but Gandalf shoots back that the Black Speech may end up heard everywhere in Middle-earth, especially if Sauron gets the Ring. It is a very effective as a means of putting the fear of Sauron’s return to power in everyone’s minds, actually.

   Gandalf declares the Ring altogether evil, but Boromir argues this point. He makes a speech about the wars Gondor has been having against Mordor, since they’re the kingdom closest to it, and besieges the council to give Gondor “the weapon of the Enemy”. This is quickly rebuked by Aragorn, who reaffirms that no one can wield it, save Sauron, himself. Boromir snidely asks what a ranger knows of the Ring. Then Legolas suddenly stands reveals who Aragorn is to the council.

   Boromir stares incredulously at Aragorn before arrogantly declaring that Gondor has and needs no king and then takes his seat glaring daggers into the ranger. Elrond then announces that it must be destroyed. This gets varied reactions from everyone.

   It’s here that Gimli growls that they should not wait around to try, grabs his father’s axe, and tries to cleave the thing right then and there. Of course, it doesn’t work. In fact, it shatters Glion’s axe and knocks Gimli on his ass. I’ve always taken this action on Gimli’s part that he was starting to get pissed off at the Ring for trying to draw him in. Being a magical being akin to the elves, he was likely aware of when an enchanted presence of some kind was having an effect on him.

   Elrond takes this cue to instruct the council on what they must do. If you don’t know, tough, I’m not repeating it. Silence falls over the council as this news sinks in. Now Boromir takes the stage again neigh saying, though this time, he has some facts backing his logic. He quite adequately describes what a hellhole Mordor is, but then goes back into Idiotville by trying to convince the council to take different actions.

   This angers Legolas, who shoots up from his seat and reaffirms what Elrond has said. So Gimli and Boromir begin to tear into him for different reasons. Boromir: the effect the Ring is having on him. Gimli: racism, and that Legolas in a Mirkwood and his father was one of thirteen that were their captives on their way to The Lonely Mountain.

   It’s here that the council just explodes into an argument. Frodo watches helplessly as everyone butts heads over what to do with the Ring, and eventually his eyes fall upon it. Flames shine in the Ring and it consumes the image of the entire council reflected in the Ring, symbolizing the effect it was having on them all.

   Frodo knows what he must do, immediately. He swallows his courage and stands. “I will take it!” His calls get the attention of the Council. We get a close up of Gandalf when the halfling’s calls reach his eyes. He stops, and closes his eyes, collecting himself, and then turns to look at Frodo with the solemn expression of a father whose son is being sent to war. It’s tragic, but he knows in his heart that it must be done. Some real smooth acting on McKellan’s part really sells this and hearts ache for the old wizard, everywhere.

   The entire council stands in silence, staring in amazement at the simple courage of someone so small. Gandalf states that he will help Frodo for as long as he can. Then Aragorn stands and declares he, too, will help Frodo. We cut to Gandalf exchanging glances with Elrond as they both observe what happens as more members of the council are moved by Frodo’s courage. Then Legolas and Gimli volunteer, and continue to give each other unfriendly looks.

   Then Borormir declares he will help as well, if that is the will of the council. Then Samwise pops out from some bushes, and declares that Frodo’s not going anywhere without him. Elrond observes with some amusement that not even “invitation only” council will have them parted. Then Merry and Pippin come out of the woodwork, and a now slightly stunned Elrond observes as the two cousins insist on going as well.

   Pippin: “You’ll need people of intelligence on this sort of mission…quest…thing!”   

Merry: “Well, that rules you out, Pip.”

   Elrond declares them The Fellowship of the Ring. Cue Pippin asking where they’re going.

   It’s not a perfect retelling of the council, but it serves the film well and establishes many personality quirks of Boromir, Legolas, and Gimli and you get a sense of what motivates them. It also shows us what each one of the main characters is made of early on as they volunteer to go on the quest to destroy the Ring. Overall, a very worthy effort and is informative enough that the audience is not left in the dark at all. It is heads and tails above the three minute scene of Elrond dishing out orders from the Bakshi version. It maintains the spirit that this is a bunch of people of many different backgrounds, beliefs, cultures, and races coming together to fight a single, monotonous evil. In the Bakshi version, it’s basically a singular good ordering people to destroy a singular evil. That just betrays that Tolkien was about, so thank God Almighty for Jackson for bringing us this.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 21, 2011, 11:21:37 PM
great account Wr, and that vlog was really cool
 liked the glimpse at Christopher Lee at the end' Who was that strange little man?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 23, 2011, 11:22:38 PM
hopefully you'll be able to add the next part soon.. you're doing an excellent job..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on July 23, 2011, 11:23:28 PM
Looking forward to the next part also.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 24, 2011, 10:17:23 PM
Great reading and thanks for posting this.  It's always great fun to read and great for those who have seen the films since, at least to me, it brings back memories of the films and books.  

Not sure where to post this but I found on youtube the 2nd and 3rd videos of the production of the hobbit that Jackson has done.  Thought some may have an interest in them & hope it is ok to post those here.  

2 [about 10 minutes]: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqk5c_i7LQU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqk5c_i7LQU)
3 [about 13 minutes]: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t47TXEi0No0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t47TXEi0No0)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 24, 2011, 10:27:35 PM
not at all kor
 i've seen the third part, haven't seen part 2 yet.. hopefully jackson keeps majking these video blogs..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 24, 2011, 10:28:43 PM
They are cool to watch.  I found 2 by chance a few days ago when I was looking up something else on youtube.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 25, 2011, 03:34:41 PM
I'm already working on the next part.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 25, 2011, 03:55:12 PM
Nice to hear, but no need to hurry or anything.  Take your time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on July 25, 2011, 07:25:12 PM
Yeah there is no rush to finish your project. We can wait until you're fully done with it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 25, 2011, 10:02:18 PM
& there are your previous posts we can always reread.   :yes
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on July 25, 2011, 10:29:46 PM
Exactly. We can always read your recent chapters.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 06, 2011, 02:35:48 AM
So whenever you get time Wr, you can post your story. also any Hobbit news will be appreciated
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 06, 2011, 03:30:26 AM
I don't have any news, but I have pics of Martin Freeman as Bilbo:

(http://images.hitfix.com/photos/802799/Martin-Freeman-as-Bilbo-Baggins_gallery_primary.jpg)

(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/06/24/article-2007495-0CB4FC4B00000578-12_634x506.jpg)

The dwarves:

Oin and Gloin:

(http://www.pajiba.com/assets_c/2011/07/pajibaoingloin-thumb-450x562-27055.jpg)

Thorin:

(http://www.artsyfartsyshops.com/hobbit/thorin2.jpg)

Fili and Kili:

(http://www.upcoming-movies.com/movie-news-images/the-hobbit-movie-image-dwarves-4.jpg)

Balin and Dwalin:

(http://www-movieline-com.vimg.net/images/hobbit-dwarves-again-630.jpg)

Bifer, Bofer, and Bomber:

(http://i.movie.as/p/55840.jpg)

Dori, Nori, and Ori:

(http://www.moviegno.me/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/hobbit-dwarves-look.jpg)

Ian McKellen as Gandalf:

(http://www.newsinfilm.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/hobbit-gandalf-mckellen.jpg)

Freeman as Bilbo looks spot on. I'm not too keen on some of the dwarf designs, but at least they're trying like no one else's business to make sure we can't get them confused for one other. McKellen looks great, as always.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on August 06, 2011, 05:49:07 AM
Thus movie seems pretty good. I might see the movie when it comes out.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 06, 2011, 04:19:54 PM
It does seem to be pretty good so far.   One change is they are having Radgast the brown in the hobbit movies.  I don't recall him being in the hobbit, though it's been a long time since I"ve read the book.  I recall him being mentioned around the time when Galdalf is first talking to Beorn I think it is.  Or whatever that guy's name is who can turn into a bear.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 06, 2011, 07:29:47 PM
He isn't in the Hobbit, but he had a seat in on the White Council, which Elrond, Galadriel, Gandalf, Saruman, and others will also be attending to oust the Necromancer.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 06, 2011, 09:11:49 PM
That was my thinking.  That the roughly 1/3 or half the movie may be the white council and what they were doing, including Gandalf while he was away from the dwarves and Bilbo.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 07, 2011, 10:58:27 PM
Radagast is mentioned in the bok as Gandalf's cousin. Ans Beorn says hes not a bad sort as wizards go..and did I mention I'm pumped to see these films. Since they can give James earl Jones an honorary Oscar for his work, shouldn't they give a few to Serkis and Lee for thier accomplishments? Serkis really took motion capture to a new level with Gollum and lee only has been acting for over 60+ years and played everyone from Dracula to Sherlock holmes.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 07, 2011, 11:01:49 PM
Hear hear! Almost finished with the next part. I'll end with them entering Moria.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 07, 2011, 11:18:12 PM
and is thorn holding Orchrist/ I think he is/ in the book the three elvish swords are glamdring (gandalf's) orschist(Thorin0 and Sting. The golcins called the first two beater and biter and hated them both.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 07, 2011, 11:23:17 PM
As I recall Sting wasn't named till Bilbo was using it to fight the giant spiders of Mirkwood.  

Which I've read some debate if they are decedents of the maia who was in spider form who poisoned the 2 trees, forgot her name (or his name).  Some have also debated if Shelob was a descendant also.

------------------

Sounds good WeirdRaptor, no need to hurry.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 07, 2011, 11:48:35 PM
Ungoliath, you are refering to Kor. she did indeed poison to the twin Tres on Lorgoths order
 Shelob was a descendant of hers..Tolkiens mentions it at the end of the Two Towers and sh e was relasted to ungoliath
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 08, 2011, 12:12:52 AM
ok, I wasn't sure if I had read it in one of Tolkien's books or elsewhere.  I thought I had read it in a book.  It's been a long time since I've read any of Tolkien's books.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2011, 01:23:24 AM
Yep, I would bet that's Orchrist Thorin is brandishing in the photo.

Oh, believe me, guys, I'm not hurrying. Speaking of this paper, though, a friend of mine asked me if this will be extending to any video game adaptations. I told him no, because I once considered the option. Then I looked up how many exist... Oh dear, I would be an old man by the time I finished rambling about them all.

However, here's a review of the GameBoy Advance game I bought back in 2001 that I posted on Amazon.com right after I managed to complete the damn thing:

This game is an abomination and I regret every cent of the thirty dollars I spent at the Wal-Mart. I've played and beat this game through trial and (t)error, because I beat every game I bought so my purchases wouldn't go to waste.

The Story: 6/10, because it manages to faithfully follow the book even moreso than the films despite failing in every other regard. Despite this, there are so many sidequests and little extra objectives they will enforce on you that you willl forget the plot in due time.

The Graphics: 3/10, they serve their purpose, but not much else. Just look at the above video. The on-screen avatars are bland and plain and the character portraits are hideous beyond measure. Everything looks jagged. Frodo looks like a blob with a brown dot for hair. The characters never move when in cut scenes at all, so the that sucks all the life out of a great story.
On top of that, everything in the backgrounds looks identical, right up to the forests, towns, and interiors, save for Rivendell.
These look like graphics from either a later on NES game or a very early on Super NES game, but given that the Gamecube, PS2, and X-Box all have 128 bit graphics and handhelds are capable of much more than 16-Bit these days, this is just unacceptable.
Only ever play this on the Gamecube, as it's the only way everything will be big enough for you check what's going on without straining your eyes. There is NO detail put into the graphics at all.

The Sound: 2/10, you get repetitive, unobtrusive sounds and effects. The music is not memorable. Of course, that's only whenever it chooses to function, which is like only a quarter of time.

The Gameplay: 1/10, serviceable at best, unreliable and glitchy at worst. That this game was never playtested was obvious, and here's why:
The gameplay was terrible all on it's own WITHOUT the bugs, but they just make it worse. Your character, no matter who it is, moves like a turtle and there's no way to speed him up. The RPG system is useless. Your character will almost always miss your enemy whereas your enemy will almost always hit you. The battles require no strategy, other than pure determination, to win. Even the simplest battles can take 5-10 minutes to win.
Oh, and the leveling system is non-existant. You only ever level at a few set points in the game, but it barely makes a difference. You will spend this entire game under-leveled no matter what you do. In fact, I would recommend staying away from battles as much as you can, because you can't carry much money, and your supply space is also very limited. Just muscle through and take only the necessary actions if you ever want to see the end.
Want more?
All that said, this is turned based style.
-Legolas is an archer, right? Well, he almost always misses with arrows. He's better with a sword in this game.  
-As stated, when you win a battle, do not get experience. You also don't get money or items.  
-You will waste most of your healing items in a single battle and then have to go back to get more, but first you'll have to hunt up more money.
-You have two types of enemies per level. Usualy 3-5 of them in a party.
-Don't even get me started on the clunky item system and item sharing system for the party. It's too bad for words, and in this game when I say it's too bad for words...
-This game also has puzzles. PUZZLES!  The puzzles are as glitched, buggy, and frustrating as the rest of this joyless mess.

The bugs...oh God, the BUGS!

-Several times during battles, a character would walk up to an enemy and pass right through them and get stuck. I would have to reset the game. Invisible obstacles also run rampent in this game.
-Sometimes, you need to reset the game just to pick up objects.
-The game will sometimes lock up or crash without rhyme or reason at random times. It once fried my GameBoy when it did that.
-In Rivendell, and this one's a real kicker, they had this little quest for the elves took Gimli's ax and in order to progress, you had to get it back to him. Well, I had to reset the game several times because when I finally got the ax to him, the "Give" command wouldn't function right! So I ended up having to restart the game from the beginning and get back to Rivendell...three times, to get it to work. On the third try, I somehow miracled the ax into Gimli's inventory and was at last able to progress to the Mines of Moria. I wept. Then I began to laugh maniacally, but it started with tears.
-Then in Moria, I walked out of one room and got stuck when the next room appeared. I reset and it happened again. I accidentally discovered how to get past that point. I saved my game accidentally right when the room I was exiting started to fade, and then it let me move on.  Doing this might also ruin your saved game, though.
-One time, the game loaded a random encounter, but it forgot to load enemies onto the field.
-I repeat, this stupid game once ruined my GameBoy!

Length and Difficulty: 3/10 Believe or not, it's not long game. The bugs, overpowered enemies, and unfair RPG system, however, will make the experience at least four times the length than if you had been able to just get through it without them getting in your way. I am not exaggerating in the slightest. In fact, I think I'm giving it a faintly conservative estimate. If you're determined enough, you will beat the game, but it ain't worth it.

The Controls: 1/10 As responsive as a person in a coma. The gameplay is as stock and common as it comes, so you wouldn't think they could botch it. The creators evidently took that fact as a challenge and made it unresponsive and unreliable as all hell. Add on the unfair RPG system, and you get one pathetic joke of a game, and the joke's on you.

Final Verdict: 2.7 Show stopping bugs and a crappy RPG System drag an already terrible game down to the deepest pits of Hell! THis game was not fit for release, but they did it, anyway. And yet, I still feel like I have not said enough about this horrid mess.

Replayability? ...You're kidding, right? It was like my own private hell the first time. The only reason I replayed this accursed thing so many parts several times is because I can't afford to let game I purchase go to waste.

Hope that tides you over.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 08, 2011, 01:35:33 AM
so you're saying this game completely blows/ ands its gameboy which i almost never play unless i'm completely and utterly bored. the screen is really too small for me to see very well , (bad eye you know) I prefer the Gamecube or Ps3..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2011, 01:46:53 AM
Oh yeah. Unfortunately, this all happened back before I knew the rule of licensed games (they almost always suck).
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 08, 2011, 01:55:26 AM
yeah, for every game theres cheap knockoffs.. look at ET. they had about a week to make the game before the movie came out and it showed..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 08, 2011, 02:20:17 AM
I found a video on youtube that has some gameplay of the GBA 2 towers for those curious as to what the game looked like.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJH6Q-wruHY& (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJH6Q-wruHY&)

It does seem most licensed games are very bad.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2011, 02:43:01 AM
Now the LotR Two Towers and Return of the King games were acceptable, because they were simple hack and slashes. They weren't particularly ambitious, but the game programers at least did them right. In fact, I think the GBA Hobbit, TTT, and RotK games are just about the only three good Tolkien-based games ever made.
The GBA Hobbit game played basically like an old school over-the-head view Zelda game.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 08, 2011, 02:48:21 AM
you're referring to handheld games right, because i loved the ROTK for gamecube i respecially loved the minas Tirith Wall level where a fully powered gandalf could just go out in perfect mode and rack up like 40 perfects in one sitting..i think i once racked up about 500000 points in one playthough..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 08, 2011, 03:04:12 AM
I enjoyed the RTS battle for middle earth.  THough it had a few very very hard spots. I did figure how how to get through them, though not based on tips of what others said.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2011, 03:18:53 AM
Right, I was referring to the handhelds. I wanted to like the Gamecube Two Towers and Reurn of the King games, but their levels were just too long for my tastes.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 08, 2011, 03:51:37 AM
i never got past the 3rd to last level in two towers. return of the king was easier..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2011, 05:31:21 AM
The third level was the Siege of Helm's Deep, wasn't it? I would get as far as defending the door they were trying to blow down, but that's it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on August 08, 2011, 10:11:08 AM
Yeah well long levels are the best part about games. Why do you want game levels to be short? The game will end way to quick. Not good. Than you wasted 50 to 80 for the game.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 08, 2011, 11:26:45 AM
Short games can be fun, if priced proportionately, but the fun ends to soon for well written & made games.  Long games can be a lot of fun if written and made since you know you have time to explore and enjoy the world and setting.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2011, 06:12:19 PM
Quote
Yeah well long levels are the best part about games. Why do you want game levels to be short? The game will end way to quick. Not good. Than you wasted 50 to 80 for the game.
When did I say I wanted games to be short? I said the levels were too long for my tastes.
No, I like long games as long as the game doesn't make each and every area roughly the size of a Warcraft map like both the EA Lord of the Rings games did.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 08, 2011, 06:15:38 PM
yes that was it/. i could defend the door and be able to damage the attacking machine but never defeat the level..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 08, 2011, 06:28:06 PM
Called it! I was never able to get how anyone was supposed to be able to beat that.
One thing I will saya bout the EA games is that I liked the sections of Two Towers where you played as Sam.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 08, 2011, 06:53:42 PM
you were supposed to level up, unfortunately i was never able to fully level up my characters, due to never beating the game.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on August 08, 2011, 08:58:16 PM
Yeah that takes the longest time. To level up your characters. But that is the fun part. Makes the game a bit longer.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 09, 2011, 01:06:37 PM
We'll just have to agree to disagree on that one. I like long games (I'm a frikkin Zelda and Tales Series fan, for crying out loud), but I dislike each and every area being too big. I prefer games with lots of areas that are either medium length or lower end large.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 09, 2011, 06:42:46 PM
I like the games with replayabiliyty, where you have to collect stuff. but not if the game itself isn'y very good. Take Spyro Enter the Dragonfly for example
 there was virually no progression of the plot, yet i collected everything and beat the game, because i like getting everything.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 09, 2011, 06:52:53 PM
That's a good way to put it, too. Huge, but you don't need to do everything to beat the final boss.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on August 09, 2011, 08:30:13 PM
I also agree with you I love games that have a ton of replayability. Games that are worth playing over and over again.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 14, 2011, 07:52:15 AM
The Game Attempts-Part Twenty Five-Part Twenty Three:

   To open this additional, Adaptation Face-Off, we start with a scene exclusive to the Extended Edition, which features Aragorn kneeling before his mother’s grave. Elrond walks up behind him and explains that his mother knew her boy would be hunted by the legions of Sauron because of his lineage. We get another bit of Aragorn proclaiming that he has no use for the throne of Gondor, but Elrond more or less tells him the choice has been taken from him.

   This exchange plays out well enough to further portray the doubting Aragorn of the Jackson films and establishes that Aragorn was raised by Elrond. This unfortunately makes Elrond's treatment of him throughout the films all the more despicable.

   After that, we cut to Frodo and Bilbo. Bilbo is busy passing on the gear from his adventure to Erebor, The Lonely Mountain (Sting and the Mithril vest). Bilbo asks to see Frodo try the vest on, and so the younger hobbit begins undoing his shirt to, which exposes the Ring. Bilbo spots it, and immediately, it takes hold of him. He looks on it with a longing stare, and rubs his hands together with anticipation. He asks to try it on again.

   Frodo catches onto what his uncle is asking and begins buttoning his shirt up again. Bilbo’s eyes dart from Frodo to the Ring a few times and it sinks in that his nephew is not going to give to him. Then… Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the moment which gave viewers everywhere a heart attack. Bilbo’s face distorts into a monstrous vision briefly while he snarls and reaches for the Ring like an animal lashing out for meat.

   Frodo retreats several steps, and Bilbo gets a hold of himself. The older hobbit stumbles back, visibly looking horrified with himself over what he almost just did. He turns back to Frodo with a sorrowful expression. He says with a strained voice that he’s sorry about bringing all of this on Frodo’s back, and collapses into a sitting position on his bed, facing away from Frodo. He begins profusely weeping in shame. Frodo comes up behind him and puts a hand on his shoulder. Bilbo takes it.

   This scene is as close to perfection as cinema is ever going to get. Elijah Wood’s acting is spot on in this scene, and Ian Holm is, of course, brilliant. He shifts from a proud relative sending his a nephew off on a great adventure to overcoming his addiction to the Ring, to sadness over just what a task Frodo has ahead of him. Three wide and distinct tones come through and Holm carries each greatly. On top of that, you truly feel for both of them.

   After this, the film cuts to the gathered Fellowship at the gate of Rivendell as Elrond bids them farewell. He gives them the deal they are not bound to go any farther with Frodo than they wish. With that, they are off. There’s a humorous moment where Frodo asks Gandalf which way to start off from, and the Fellowship proceeds to followed him.

   And here we go, perhaps the single most iconic shot of the entire saga. After a few wide shots of them traveling along their road, we cut to just off of their path as each and every one passes the camera while the Fellowship theme plays its most variant. First Gandalf, the current leader, then Legolas, then Gimli, then the hobbits, and finally Boromir and Aragorn. This symbolizes that the Fellowship is at it’s strongest right now, but listen to the theme each time it is replayed throughout the film. It never sounds this triumphant or upbeat ever again. When we hear it later, it will begin to slowly play at lower and slower beats until the final times it plays and it’s slow and depressing. The way the Fellowship theme is played symbolizes the Fellowship’s current status as it slowly begins to break throughout the film.

   Moving on, we hear Gandalf narrating that they have to travel South to get to Mordor. Here, we see the Fellowship at their first stop of the journey. Most of them are resting or keeping watch. Merry and Pippin, however, are taking sword fighting lessons from Boromir, who spars with them while Aragorn advises from the sidelines.

   Frodo and Sam also watch, Frodo looking amused and Sam looking disapproving (probably because the duo aren’t very mature as of yet). The focus turns to Gandalf and Gimli. The dwarf indirectly complains about his opinion not being asked, and then states that they should head through the Mines of Moria. In the book, it was Gandalf who wanted to go through the mines, but having him know better also works, so there’s no issue. Gandalf flat-out shoots down Gimli’s very firmly.

   Again, in the original book, it was Gandalf who wanted to go into the Mines and it was Aragorn who didn’t. Eh, either way works, but at least it doesn’t have the two bickering like bitter enemies like the Bakshi version did.

   Back with Boromir and the duo, the warrior accidentally smacks Pippin’s hand with the flat of the blade, causing the Took to drop his sword. The two then tackle Boromir to the ground and have themselves some rough-housing. While this is going on, Legolas spots something approaching from the distance.

   Aragorn tries to stop Merry and Pippin, but gets his legs taken out from under him by the two and he falls flat on his back. By this point, the something that looks like a cloud in the distance have also caught Gandalf and Gimli’s eyes. Legolas announces that they’re Carmine. Aragorn orders everyone into hiding. They pack up camp and hide under anything they can get under.

   The crows soon pass over them and make a beeline back to Isengard. Once the birds are out of sight, the Fellowship comes out. Gandalf states that the passage through the South is having an eye kept on it. So they decide to pass over the mountains. The film jumps ahead to later with the Fellowship climbing upwards. Frodo slips and tumbles down a slope they’re climbing. Aragorn catches the Frodo and rights the hobbit. However, when Frodo brushes himself off, he sees that the Ring is gone.

   He and Aragorn both look up the slope as Boromir picks it up and stares, entranced at it. “It is a strange fate to suffer so much fear and doubt over such a little thing. …Such a little thing.” He begins to reach for it with the other hand as well, almost lovingly. Aragorn calls to him, breaking the hold the Ring has over him at the moment, and orders the noble to give the Ring back to its bearer. Boromir reluctantly does and insists all is fine. He pauses when he sees that Aragorn’s hand has never left his sword hilt, so he disarmingly ruffles Frodo’s hair and goes back to climbing the slope.

   Alright, this sequence is very well done. Unlike the Bakshi version in which we were allowed to forget Boromir’s fascination with the Ring ever existed to begin with to the point where it seems to come out of nowhere at The Breaking of the Fellowship, Jackson makes sure to remind us that it has Boromir in its clutches whenever appropriate.

   As for the acting on Sean Bean’s part… It’s Sean Bean. Enough said. The man is a master actor and chameleon. The film writers’ and Bean’s acting combined turn Boromir into a three dimension, complex role, and far more sympathetic than the original book Boromir. Yes, I said it. As much as I love Tolkien’s writing, it has always bugged the hell out of me how much Boromir seemed to be a plot devise rather than a proper character.

   Jackson and co, however, decided to make him a bit more sympathetic, and Sean Bean’s acting really brings this character to life. He showcases either the very best or the very worst of humankind all in just a hour and a half of screen time. Boromir is noble, good-hearted, and loyal man, but he’s easily tempted when desperate. His land and his people are constantly under attack by Sauron, and the role of the Stewarts is beginning to fail. He feels it is up to him to save his land and his people. His chosen method, however, leaves much to be desired.

   While this is all true in the book as well, it’s not emphasized on at least where Boromir’s concerned. Bean portrays everything that makes this man tick with grace and mastery. While McKellen might have gotten the Best Supporting Actor nomination, I would go as far as to say that Bean was the best actor of the first film, being able to showcase why he can both good and bad guys all in one character.

   Back in Isengard, the crows report to Saruman the Fellowship’s whereabouts. Then Saruman turns around so that he’s facing the audience and arrogantly quips about Gandalf’s intent. Alright, the film cuts to the Fellowship trying to cross over the mountain, but as we all know, a snow storm is slowing them down almost to a dead halt. A wide off shot established them on a narrow path on the mountain. In the original book, it was the malevolent spirit of the mountain, itself, that was doing this all on its own accord. In this version, it’s Saruman awakening the spirit, and the spirit still doing the rest. I have no issue with this small change, because it gave Christopher Lee something to do and more buck per hour.

   Aragorn thinks they have to turn back. Gandalf refuses and tries casting his own spell to put the spirit back to sleep, but Saruman has the advantage and the spirit causes an avalanche. The entire Fellowship gets buried under the snow, but somehow managed to stay on the narrow walkway along the side of the mountain which they were traverse. In the theaters, I recall someone asking “okay, who did we lose?” However, all nine poke their heads out of the snow and Boromir insist on taking the path through Rohan and to Gondor. Aragorn argues against that, stating that Rohan takes them too close to Isengard.

   So Gimli again insist that they go under the mountain, through the mines. Gandalf looks like he doesn’t know what to do anymore and you can tell by the look on his face that he knows any path they take at this point is going to lead them into a lot of danger. So he decides to let the Frodo decide their road, since he’s the ring-bearer and it’s dangerous no matter what they do at this point.

   Frodo, after having heard all the arguments (unlike in the Bakshi version where he had absolutely nothing to go on and was not supplied with any information), decides their path is through the mines. Gandalf looks displeased with this decision, but does not protest. Cut to Saruman confidently chuckling to himself about how he’s blocked their path over the mountain and to the South. He knows now they’ll either go through Rohan or the Mines and he’s made preparations for when they exit one or the other (as seen later).

   The film jumps ahead to their arrival at the mines. Gandalf calls Frodo to his side. He inquires if Frodo has felt The Ring’s power growing, to which he receives a ëyes’. He then proceeds to give the hobbit some advice. He tells him that the way ahead is very, very perilous, and that evil will try to claim It, and from both within and without the Fellowship. Frodo asks who he supposed to trust. Gandalf answers that he will just have to be discerning and to learn his own limits. He then tells the frightened Baggins that that there are many forces in this world and some of which still go untested.

   In this version, Gandalf knows that a Balrog sleeps in the darkness of Moria, somehow, and he knows they might encounter it. As such, he knows that he might not be able to protect Frodo much longer, and he’s trying like crazy to prepare the poor lad if the worse happens. Knowing this, combined with some smooth acting on both actors’ parts, makes this scene heart-rending, because this is an Extended Cut scene. In other words, you’ve already, at least, seen the film.

   Cut to Gimli gasping in awe. He announces that they’ve arrived at the entrance to Moria. The film cuts to them searching the stone wall of the mountain for the door. Gimli brags about the magical camouflaging abilities dwarf doors have. Gandalf points out that their own masters can’t even find them if they forget the trick to using them. Legolas gives a snide comment about how typical that is. Gimli just groans in respond, but says nothing. It least the racism is going both ways in this version, whereas in the Bakshi version, it was jut Legolas bitching about dwarves and Gimli just taking it.

   Finally, Gandalf finds the door, and explains that it lights up in the moonlight. After a bit, the moon comes out the door glows in the dark. Gandalf translates the inscription above, “Speak Friend, and Enter.” Merry asks what that means. Gandalf answers that the riddle is simple, “if you are a friend, just say the password and the doors will open.”

   In the book, it was Pippin that said that last line, not Gandalf. Not a big deal, because the old wizard didn’t realize the inscription was a double meaning for a long time, anyway. Gandalf commences in trying out various passwords on the door, and unlike the Bakshi version, he’s not just repeating the same word over and over, he’s actually trying out different dwarven and elven words and phrases.

   Cut to later, and he’s still hard to work. He finally just sits down and thinks. Merry and Pippin are throwing stones at the surface of the lake by the bank they’re standing upon. Aragorns tops them and instructs them not to do that.

   Frodo looks thoughtfully at the door, and then it dawns on him. He gets up and mutters that the words are a riddle. While this is going on, riddles have begun to appear all over the surface of the water, which the other seven fellowship members watch very intently. Gandalf finally says “Mellon”, and sure enough, the elvish word for friend open the door and the riddle quickly enter, the ones who saw the breaks on the surface of the lake doing so with her eyes over their shoulders the entire time.

   Gimli begins bragging about the greatness of dwarven culture again once they’re inside, speaking of the forges and food. Gandalf lights up the entrance by lighting up the end of his staff with magic. Then Boromir spots the corpses of the dwarves and calls it a tomb.

   Hmm. Gimli gets uppity about his people and then verbally gets his ass handed to him again. This is not the last time this is going to happen, as Jackson and co pretty much designated him to be the saga butt monkey. Boromir then orders everyone out of the mines.

The hobbits slowly back out, and Frodo is suddenly grabbed by something. Merry and Pippin rush to his aid, but Sam stops to call for Aragorn, and then draws his sword hacks away at the tentacle until it lets up like the up and coming badass that he is. Frodo is momentarily freed from its clutches, but then a whole bunch of tentacles punch at the other three hobbits, knocking them back and Frodo and is grabbed and hoisted up into the air above the water’s surface.

The tentacles are well done and creepy, and the entire build up and pay off of the Watcher in the Water is very well executed. Now comes another slight divergence from the book that is also a non-issue. Whereas the tentacles of the beast were the only part of it came out of the water. Here, its Cthulhu-like face also breaks the surface while its tendrils search Frodo’s pockets for the Ring.

By the time, the full-sized portions of the Fellowship have come back out of the Mines. Legolas shoots one of its tentacles away from Frodo while Aragorn and Boromir run into the water and begin cutting tentacles. Boromir makes the save by cutting the right appendage and catching Frodo up in his arms. Then he and Aragorn turn tail and run for it.

Its here I have some slight confusion. Boromir calls Legalas’s name, and Aragorn also shouts something. When I first say this, I thought Aragorn said: “Aim for its eye.”

Then Legolas proceeds to do that, which stops the Watcher slightly while the Fellowship rushes into the caves. The Watcher lifts itself out of the water and rips the ceiling above them apart, caving in the entrance and trapping them inside. I’m glad that Jackson went with the more brutal route of forcing the Fellowship through the mines. Having the Watcher just shut the doors wouldn’t have made for good cinema. Like I said before, in the book Tolkien can make it just closing them inside sound evil and horrifying, but that’s not something transcends well to screen.
Once inside and behind the huge rock pile, Gandalf utters now that the choice has been made for them: passing through Moria. Then he says the single most damning words anyone can ever say in an adventure story: “Let us hope that our presence will go unnoticed.” Keep dreaming.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 14, 2011, 01:04:36 PM
Very interesting, and it reminded me of certain things I've forgotten since I last saw the movie.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 14, 2011, 01:26:32 PM
I don;t havce the extended edition, but this bit of the book always creeped me. The Watcher in the water isn't seen in the book, but it helped devastate the Dwarves colony, including taking Oin (one of the 10 surviving dwarves from the Quest for Erebor). The Company was likely the first group to pass through moria since the colony failed, about 20 years worth of time . in the book Gandalf entered moria friom the easr, entering from the west was something he had not done previously.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 14, 2011, 07:12:40 PM
The mines of moria were likely long silent, and there was added sadness for those who read or knew of the characters from the hobbit to hear what had happened.

I do have the extended versions of all 3 movies.  Got the dvd's used from amazon for a good price.  Forgot the price but it was a decent one.  I got them separately I think.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 15, 2011, 10:39:50 PM
Thanks for the input, guys. I've already started on the next part. Not sure when it'll get done. The next bit will the entirety of their trek through the Mines, ending when they enter Lothlorien.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 15, 2011, 10:45:49 PM
Sounds good.  I'm looking forward to that, but no need to hurry.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on August 20, 2011, 01:14:09 AM
looking forward to it WR>.. :)  we're getting close to the end of fellowship correct?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on August 20, 2011, 01:31:45 AM
Great looking forward to it as well man.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 28, 2011, 08:29:50 AM
I've almost got it done, its coming, guys.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on September 03, 2011, 06:34:40 PM
Alright, in case you don't alreayd know, I'm not going to be updating this for a couple of months. I got in trouble again, my own fault, entirely. I hope to see you guys again soon. I will have at least one update upon my return. See you all soon, but not goodbye forever.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on September 03, 2011, 10:25:49 PM
good luck with the stuff working out for you.  We'll still be here when you return.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 03, 2011, 09:34:02 PM
Alright, I'm back. The next part is done, except that I have to proofread it. It'll be on Saturday. I have to work to do tomorrow, but I will finish up in the evening.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 03, 2011, 10:00:23 PM
Sounds good.  We can wait till you are satisfied before you post it, good luck.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 03, 2011, 10:54:16 PM
The entry is not that big. It only goes to the Fellowship leaving Moria.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 10, 2011, 06:10:04 AM
I am officially giving up on The Hobbit movies that are coming up. Jackson just added Elros, Elrdon's long dead brother to the cast of characters. Yeah, that's right, we're getting a look at a character that has nothing to do with Bilbo's quest or Sauron.
It's official, Jackson doesn't give a damn about Bilbo.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 10, 2011, 12:42:04 PM
Elros would have fit better into the LOTR trilogy, especially as a flashback where Aragorn is talking to the hobbits about his heritage or something.  The only way I can see it fit into the hobbit is if either takes place while the group is in Rivendell and for some reason Elrond or Gandalf talks about Elrond and Elros, or if it's mentioned during the meeting of the white council.  Which I'd wonder why since everyone there should already knows of Elrond's past.  Unless I miss something.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 10, 2011, 02:36:36 PM
it will probably be brought up during the white council or as a flashback in rivendell..gandalf would know about Elros who i believe chose mortality, while elrond chose immortality.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on November 10, 2011, 03:06:35 PM
Well, I am not setting foot into that movie theater come 2012 until I have word-of-mouth confirmation from viewers that Bilbo is still the main character. I've waited 21 years for a live-action Hobbit movie, so I'd rather skip it than be disappointed by it.

A flashback about Elros would have to be pretty hefty if it's to be meaningful in any way. His story is a fairly complex one that would require a decent amount of screentime if it's to be anything other than fanservice for the most hardcore of Tolkien fans.
And who the hell cares about Elrond or Elros, anway. They have both got to be like among the most forgettable good guy characters in all of Tolkien's mythos.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 10, 2011, 03:56:40 PM
Bilbo is the main character WR. While discussing Elros would require a good deal of backstory, its probably going to be one of those Blink and you'll miss it scenes..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on November 10, 2011, 07:03:26 PM
As I recall, at the end if the 1st age the Valor asked Elros & Elrond if they wished to be numbered among elves or men.  Elrond choose elves, and as such his children are given the same choice at the end of the 3rd age.  I guess in their case if they go with Elrond they would be elves, if they stayed they would be humans.  Not sure what his sons choose, but I read most assume they choose to be numbered among humans.  Elrond & Elros's father had the same choice and it's said he wanted to choose to be numbered among humans, but for his wife's sake choose instead to be numbered among elves.  He's the guy, whatshisname, who has a simlaril on his brow, or somesuch, and is on the ship that sails in the sky as a  morning star to bring hope to the folks of middle earth & who's light Galadril's file (or however you spell that) she gives to Frodo has in it.

Not sure why Elros would be mentioned.  it would make more sense for him to appear in a flashback in the LOTR trilogy, as a flashback talking about Aragorn's ancestory.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on November 22, 2011, 03:09:21 AM
whenever you can post the next chapter wr you can.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 02, 2011, 05:33:58 PM
The Game Attempts-Part Twenty Six-Part Twenty Four: The Moria sequence is easily my favorite part of the entire first movie in the Jackson saga. It’s here that we really get to know Gandalf for the first time in the movie and get to see him at his best. McKellen shines in particular in this section of the movie. In the next half hour he acts out all the wisdom, authority, and power that everyone’s favorite wizard (second maybe only to Merlin) possesses.

Cue the very first real traveling montage of the Fellowship together. Had this been the Bakshi version, we’d have had about five so far skipping over things. In this case, they’re jumping over nothing too important, just shortening the trip through Moria. In the Extended Cut of the film, we do get one additional stop along the way. Gandalf tells the group what the dwarves mines in Moria: Mithril, silver steel. Hard as dragon’s scales, light as a feather. When they come across a deep pit, he shines the light of his staff down the chamber and we’re greeted with a bunch of shiny Mithril still in the walls reflecting off of the light. Unfortunately, no film can ever capture the beauty Mithril is described as being, so we have to make do with just seeing it reflect the light.

He then goes on to tell about the Mithril vest Bilbo was given, and how much it was worth. Its worth is greater than the entire Shire. Frodo suddenly looks very uncomfortable as Gandalf speaks, as is to be expected since I’m sure the hobbit’s mind had to be just blown right about now. Gimli comments on the fact that the vest was a kingly gift.

The film cuts ahead a bit to the crossroads where Gandalf got lost. The wizard stops in front of the three entrances and gives them each a befuddled look before he admits that he doesn’t remember which way goes where. Well, if the lackluster RPG The Lord of the Rings: The Third Age, in which you play second fellowship following the footsteps of the first one (don’t ask; it's really long and stupid story) is anything to go on, both ways lead to dead ends.

We cut to the Fellowship sitting at the cross roads while Gandalf tries to remember which way to go. We see Boromir and Aragorn making some small talk while Pippin complains about being hungry, much to Merry’s annoyance and our laughter. Frodo’s eyes boredly wander their dreary surroundings, and suddenly…!
He catches sight of an early prototype of the Gollum design and is repulsed by its overall lackluster appearance compared to the finished product in The Two Towers. He retreats over to Gandalf’s side and exclaims that Gollum has a long ways to go before eventually becoming the most believable CGI character in all of cinema (no, Cameron fans, the Na'Vi have not topped him).

“It is Gollum. He hates and loves the Ring, as he hates and loves himself, and it has brought him here. He will never be rid of his need for it.”

To this Gollum quietly mutters something quietly to himself in response. I think he might just be gurgling his usual sound, but it always sounds like “oh yeah” to my ears. Frodo claims that Bilbo should have killed him, but Gandalf shoots back that Bilbo’s pity was not a mistake, and that many that live do indeed deserve death, but some that die deserve to live. Then he challenges Frodo’s ability to give it to them justly. After Frodo wordlessly admits that he can’t (Wood conveys the quiet response in his eyes well).

Gandalf tells Frodo not to eagerly deal out judgment to others. Then he assures the hobbit that Gollum has some role left to play, but he just doesn’t know what. “The pity of Bilbo might rule the fate of many.”

Frodo then asserts that he wishes that the Ring hadn’t come to him and that Sauron hadn’t returned to power. Gandalf assures him that he’s not alone in that, but these things happen anyway, and can and will happen in anyone’s lifetime if there’s someone out there causing turmoil. Then he says the best line of the entire series; “All you have to decide to what to do with the time that is given to you.” It’s a very good thing to say to people, especially in modern times, as we have currently been hit with nigh endless hardships and the future looks very uncertain at this point, and the only thing we can do is live as best we can. As such, the moment is very poignant and moving especially to modern audiences living in these troubled times. I'm convinced these films came out at the right time and that helped their success. They're just so positive and at a time when people literally needed something like this.

Then he asserts that other forces than the will of evil are at work in this world. Bilbo was meant to have the Ring, also as Frodo was meant to have it. He says that the Ring wouldn’t have gone to someone who couldn’t make it to Mordor and the crack of Doom. This successfully cheers Frodo up somewhat and almost like a miracle, Gandalf finds the right passage when fresh air comes up from it.

Then they enter the great hall of the old kingdom of the dwarves. Great big pillars reach up into a near endless abyss with a ceiling they can barely make out it’s so high even after Gandalf risks turning the light up a little more. All are in marvel of the feat of constructive genius as they pass through it. Now this is how Moria should look. This place looks like a grand palace. It puts Bakshi’s to shame. Their trek to the other side is brought to a dead halt when Gimli spots the final resting place of Balin.

Gimli reaches the stone coffin of the dwarf lord and collapses on his knees in grief and begins a death pray for his fallen lord. This very well illustrates in what revere the dwarves have for their leaders. The rest of the fellowship enters the chamber and crowd around the coffin while Gimli begins weeping. Gandalf announces that it does indeed belong to Balin. Poor Balin. He was my favorite dwarf from The Hobbit. When we came to this part of the book, I felt my heart break. The feeling is captured here. You can sense everyone’s sadness over the issue.

Gandalf spots the corpse of a dwarf clutching a journal and picks it up and begins reading it. From it, we learn what befell the dwarves. All the while this, combined with the threatening atmosphere creates a since of urgency as Gandalf reads on and the situation becomes more dire with each passing word. Legolas tries to urge everyone to get moving again while Pippin backs into a skeleton sitting on the edge of a well for Valor knows what reason.

And just as Gandalf says “they are coming”, Pippin stupidly twists the arrow in the corpse, causing it’s head to fall off into the well, banging all the way down, followed by the body, which snags a chain attached a bucket. So everyone else stands in shocked silence as the dwarven skeletal remains fall down the well, alerting every orc in Moria to their presence and possibly some undiscovered tribes in Africa as well. Gandalf slams the book shut and scolds Piippin, shouting, “Fool of a Took. Throw yourself in next time, and rid us of your stupidity!”

Pippin can only stand there is silence, knowing he’s just cocked it up royally. Not even a full beat after Gandalf has scolded him, the “drums in the deep” which the journal spoke of begin. At once, the battle cries of the orcs can be heard echoing through the halls. Legolas verbally identifies them while Boromir runs to the entrance of the burial chamber and nearly gets struck by a pair of arrows. He glances out into the open space where the orcs approach from. Aragorn runs up next to him and they close the double wooden doors and then bar them.
“They have a cave troll,” Boromir announces wearily.

After the door as secured as well as they can get it, the Fellowship backs up into the main burial chamber, weapons at the ready. The audience can feel the tension and fear kicking in, because one, the dwarven corpses paired with the fact that no one wants to see any of this fellowship bite it makes this entire sequence effective.
The goblins crowd around the old wooden door and begin hacking at it while Legolas and Aragorn stand with their bows and arrows at the ready. The instant cracked big enough open up, the two begin skillfully shooting into them, killing a goblin each time. Finally, the big double doors swing open and the goblins charge in.

The goblins are met with superior skill and are easily vanquished by the numbers, which is how it’s done. No more Aragorn having trouble one-on-one-ing a goblin like in Bakshi’s version. During this fight, and especially in the Extended Edition, the film showcases the Fellowship watching each other’s backs and saving each other’s hides multiple times. Such as Sam narrowly avoiding getting stepped on by the troll that’s led into the chamber when Aragorn and Boromir pull on it’s chain leash, forcefully backing it away from Sam.

Then Aragorn saves Boromir when he’s knocked senseless by the troll. Then Legolas saves Gimli from the troll by distracting it with arrow shots (yeah, it’s mostly Fellowship members saving each other from the troll). Then the troll turns its attention to Legolas who saves himself from it running up its chain leash and onto its back after it gets caught on a stone pillar and firing shots into troll’s head. Yeah, Legolas is portrayed as the supreme badass of the group. Not that that’s unfitting…

Eventually the troll sets its sights on Frodo, and begins spamming his email with flame baiting remark… Wait, wrong kind of troll. It raises its giant club and brings it down at Frodo, Merry, and Pippin. The dynamic duo duck behind one pillar, and Frodo behind another. Frodo scurries over to the other side of it to hide from sight just as the troll peeks around the corner, and then does so again when the troll peeks around the other side.

Then Frodo gets the chance to something else incredibly stupid. Instead of just sliding over to the other side, he goes around one corner and stays there. Then, of course, the troll jumps around the roars at him. Frodo slips (again) and starts trying to crawl away instead of trying to run away. Frodo does not  have good escapability. The troll grabs him and drags him closer and is about to smash with its club when Aragorn jumps in and sticks it with a spear he took from a goblin. The troll backhands him away and he’s knocked out.

While Frodo tries to wake him, the troll pulls the spear out and then finally Frodo tries to run for it, but is blocked and knocked against the wall. The troll stabs Frodo and seemingly kills him as his friends and comrads stare in horror. Then Merry and Pippin become enraged and hop into its back and begin stabbing it relentlessly while Gandalf, Sam, and Boromir begin hacking and slashing like crazy to get closer to it. Oddly, Boromir never gets close again. Then once the goblins’ numbers have waned Gandalf, Gimli, and Legolas begin ganging up on the troll. It manages to drag Merry off its back and knock Gimli back.

Then one well placed stab by Pippin allows Legolas to land an arrow in either its throat or mouth, I’ve never been able to tell. Either way, the troll finally gets banned from the forum… Damn it! It finally dies. The Fellowship goes over to Frodo to loot his corpse, er, make sure he is in fact an ex-person. Aragorn turns him over and they discover that he is still alive. Aragorn mutters that the troll’s spear would have skewered a boar, and thus a hobbit should have been run clean through.

Frodo unbuttons the first few his shirt to reveal… He’s Superman! (It was either this or a striptease joke, folks.) No, he’s wearing the Mithril vest Bilbo gave him, and as such, the enchanted silver saved him from even the impact of the blow killing him. Gimli comments that Frodo is full of surprises and they begin running the hell out of the chamber and into the main hall of pillars.

The fight scene in Balin’s burial chamber: well, it was well-paced, choreographed, and very intense. The possibility of Frodo’s death lacked in impact because of the scene where Bilbo gave the vest to him, but the film couldn’t very well do without it. Overall, it was great and another testament of what makes the Jackson films great.

In masse, the goblins begin pouring like a wave out of each and every crack and crevice, filling the great hall and surrounding our heroes, and the effect is truly chilling. The goblins form a circle around the Fellowship and are about to kill then, when suddenly, a great fiery light shines in the darkness, indicating the approach of the Balrog. On cue, the goblins flee in terror and most of the Fellowship stare on cautiously while Gandalf wears a “oh man this is gonna suck” expression.
Gandalf informs the group as to what it is, and says they need to run. This abomination is beyond their ability to contend. When Gandalf’s afraid, you know things have gotten bad. Period. He orders the Fellowship to run for it, and the audience feels the urgency. The huge, unseen presence giving off that unholy fiery glow is definitely intimidating, and it fast approaches. Completely unlike the slow moving…thing, from Bakshi’s version.

The Fellowship begins descending a flight of stairs out in a open void, basically, in a large chamber. There are no safety railings, so any tripping will result in a plunge to certain doom. In the book, it was just a tunnel with stairs they ran through, but this works better on camera. At once, goblins begin raining arrows down on the Fellowship as they make for the exit. Then they come to the infamous crack on the stairwell.

First Legolas jumps across, and then like a bunch of idiots, they don’t toss the Ring Bearer over next. This is a great film, I will repeat that again, but this one scene when looked at objectively, falls flat. Instead of the all-important Ring Bearer, Frodo, being tossed across next, Gandalf makes the jump. Then Boromir carries Merry and Pippin across as some of the steps collapse.

Then Aragorn tosses Sam across instead of tossing Frodo. Gah! This scene always drives me nuts. Then Gimli stupidly jumps across and almost falls to his death because of his vanity, and has to be pulled up by the beard. Then more stairs give out and now the uncrowned king and the all-important ring bearer are trapped on the other side. Then part of the stone ceiling breaks loose and destroys a section of staircase above them, and the tall, thin tower the stairs are built on begins to collapse.

The moment is intense enough that you don’t think about the stupidity of not making sure Frodo got across the gap first, but while writing this, I sure am. Anyway, Aragorn and Frodo lean forward and the section of stairs tumbles into the part down below where the rest of the Fellowship waits. They jump onto safe ground and descend the rest of the steps. Personally, I always thought Gandalf’s magic should have made the save here, but whatever.

Then once they’re at ground level again, Gandalf stops and makes sure everyone is still there and running for the bridge. Then, from a flaming crack in the earth behind him, the Balrog finally emerges. It chases them to the bridge, which they have to cross single file. Now the Balrog looks very big and dangerous, like a demon made out of volcanic rock, and as such, the audience feels the need for the Fellowship to escape and escape quickly. The entire sequence looks great, and the bridge is exactly how it was in the book. The Fellowship being forced to go one at a time just ups the tension, and Tolkien definitely knew this.

Gandalf stops halfway across the bridge and turns to face the Balrog. With a defiant glare, he shouts with an authoritative tone: “You cannot pass.” The Fellowship meanwhile watches in awe, able to do nothing for their comrade. Gandalf proclaims his power to the Balrog and raises his staff above his head and it forms a protective barrier around him.

The Balrog brings its flaming sword down on Gandalf, but the barrier holds and it retreats a step while Gandalf again orders it back. Then it brings out its whip and defiantly steps onto the bridge. Gandalf then shouts at full volume (and we see what McKellen’s lungs are capable of) that it will not pass and slams his staff into the bridge. The creature steps back again and takes a long look at what Gandalf must have done. After a moment, it looks as if nothing happened as the result of Gandalf pounding the bridge, so the Balrog rushes onto it. Then it of course collapses.

Gandalf turns around to walk away, but the whip catches his leg and he is pulled into the abyss. He manages to grab onto the bridge with his fingers and holds on for a moment. While Boromir holds Frodo back from attempting to help the wizard, Gandalf and the young Baggins’s eyes meet.

“Run, you fools,” Gandalf orders, and let go, falling into the abyss. When he does so, take a good look. He holds his body straight and stiff with his arms outstretched on either side, resembling a cross. To this day, I am not completely sure if this was intentional or not. I can only comment on what I’ve observed in these films overall. Jackson keeps the Christian symbolism in these books very much intact, and often times, they’re a lot less subtle than Tolkien ever made them. Given that Gandalf is a wise mentor figure and that this is a scene in which he makes a sacrifice of his own life and comes back more powerful than ever later, the only conclusion I can draw is that it was very intentional.

Back to Gandalf’s “death” here. McKellen’s wonderful performance paired with Jackson, Boyens, and Walsh’s sharp writing made him a profoundly likeable character. McKellen captures the heart and soul of Gandalf perfectly. His ability to snark like no one else’s business, his temper, and his grandfatherly ability to comfort an motivate others are kept intact. So even to readers who know what happens, seeing him go in such a dramatic fashion in truly heart-breaking. That paired with the slow motion, the sad music, and the great acting of everyone playing the remaining Fellowship members make this scene truly tear jerking. This film was the first I’ve ever, ever cried at a movie. And I repeat, this was in the full knowledge that he’s coming back.

The best acting on part of the other actors in this scene definitely come from Mortensen, Astin, and Boyd. An absolutely inconsolable Pippin collapsed on his side was very compelling, as were Sean Astin’s own crying (Astin had a talent for moving the audience to tears in this saga), and Mortensen as the shocked, but then stoic Aragorn was very sad, too. The film has given every indication that Aragorn and Gandalf are close, so you know that there’s a war raging inside Aragorn underneath the surface.

Wood’s single shell shocked tear at the end is truly chilling, by the way.

Yet inspite of the sorrow, Aragorn is insistent that they have to press on and the other big folk are made to get the hobbits up. As a final note, that also brings to note how much it would have to suck to be a soldier in war who just lost a buddy, yet there’s no time to grieve. The mission comes first. Yeah, as if this scene couldn’t get more depressing. Tolkien was genius for deciding to lay it on thick whenever someone died (and took from his own experiences during World War I while writing about death), and everyone who worked on these movies were, too, for being able to duplicate the effect.

The Fellowship then races for Lothlorien before night falls and the countryside is swarming with orcs.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 02, 2011, 11:55:00 PM
A great post, thanks again.  It was a great read.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 03, 2011, 12:31:21 AM
Thanks. Next part will just cover Lothlorien (not that'll make it any shorter). I was hoping that laying on the snark more heavily would be accepted.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on December 03, 2011, 12:34:16 AM
Its Fly You fools, there have been more than one time I've been asked what Gandalf says before he is dragged into the abyss. Its Fly you fools. Gandalfs "You shall not pass" has become an iconic catchphrase..and he well deserved the Oscar nomination he got for this film. Frankly, he should have wom imo.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 03, 2011, 12:40:23 AM
Oops.

I totally agree. But of course he didn't win because it's a fantasy movie and Hollywood has yet to realize that films of all genres are of equal important, not just arthouse or "important" films based on real life stories.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on December 16, 2011, 03:56:18 AM
Just did a bunch of work on the paper. Should be up before too long.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on December 16, 2011, 01:28:06 PM
Sounds good.  We'll enjoy reading it when you put it up, but only once you are happy with it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 02, 2012, 07:18:28 AM
Has everyone seen this yet?

Hobbit Trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PSXjr1gbjc)
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on January 02, 2012, 12:47:45 PM
I've seen it a time or 2.  Looks very interesting.  Though I hear Frodo and some others are in it from the LOTR.  I guess as framing devices in Frodo's case.  Though no reason Legolas couldn't be around also.  Being an elf he could be several thousand years old.  Elrond's children, who are half elven till they make their choice which to be numbered among, are several thousand years old I think, by the time of the LOTR.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 03, 2012, 02:12:18 AM
i'm really looking forward to the film..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2012, 06:59:09 PM
The Game Attempts-art Twenty-Seven-Twenty-Five:

The Fellowship enters Lothlorien Forest at a jogging pace. Now, in this shot, the child or midget body doubles for the hobbits are especially obvious and easily the worst shot that uses them in the entire movie. I seriously wish they had just used green screen effects to actually insert Wood and the others, because it’s painfully obvious that the small people are not them.

The forest, by contrast, looks spectacular. Of course, this is because the crew used a real forest where they just to insert the silver and gold leaves of Lothlorien into as a shooting location. The natural forest really helps the scene by giving it a raw feel which helps sell the credibility of this fantastical location. Everyone begins making their way through the forest, but not with relaxed looks. There is a definite air of danger in this scene.

Then Frodo suddenly begins receiving messages from Galadriel, “You are on the footsteps of peril,” ; “You bring great evil here, Ring Bearer.” Frodo wears an expression that reads “oh great, another voice in my head” that’s almost comical.
Enter Gimli talking about the “witch of the wood” as if she were an Oz witch and that the hobbits need to be careful, else they will fall under her gaze. Then Gimli begins boasting about how finely tuned his senses are, and ends up staring down an arrowhead in a perfectly timed moment of hilarity. The rest of the Fellowship also find themselves in similar circumstances with Legolas being the only one with his weapon up and ready. Then Haldir comes out and announces that Gimli breathed so hard they could have sniped him in the dead of night. Gimli growls defiantly at that.

Then Haldir takes one good look at Frodo and announces that the party will go no further that day. In the theatrical cut, the film immediately jumps to Lothlorien, but in this extended cut, it instead jumps to a treetop hideout the Fellowship spends the night in. Aragorn and Haldir heatedly speak in elvish about Frodo. Gimli, fed up with being left out of the conversation, demands that the conversation be in a tongue everyone can understand. Haldir shoots back that the elves have not had dealings with the dwarves since the dark times.
Gimli then utters in dwarven that he will spit on Haldir’s grave (foreshadowing!). Haldir stiffens and walks away. Aragorn reprimands Gimli for this.

On Craig Parker as Haldir: he’s a perfect fit, and I think it’s a crime that of the two actors to play elves that did both expensive stunt work and had speaking lines, that Orlando Bloom is the only one to end up with a decent career. Seriously, after The Lord of the Rings, Bloom got Pirates of the Caribbean and Shakespeare, and Craig Parker gets…Power Rangers.  Whereas Marton Csokas, who plays Celeborn, just stands there expositing at the Fellowship later has appeared in numerous major productions since the LotR films. Parker obviously needs a new agent.

Anyway, Frodo glances around the treetop lookout spot at the other Fellowship members. Each give him a stare, knowing that all of this is about him. Then he begins imagining that they’re turning against him, though the moment is so subtle that you could easily just miss it. Jackson assumed his viewers of being geniuses here. Some catch it, some don’t.

Finally, Boromir speaks up and tells Frodo that what happened to Gandalf is not his fault, and that he should not carry any guilt over it. This statement is deeper than one might expect of Boromir and this little moment displays the hidden depths of the character. That through the Ring working him over combined with the overall stress of the situation, he still manages to have the sense to put a comrade’s heart at ease over their unfortunate circumstances. Sean Bean carries the line with a  weight that showcases just how many times Boromir has had this kind of thing happen to friends in the war against Sauron. This is yet another example as to why the extended cuts are superior. Scenes like this show us what really makes Boromir tick whereas this is missing the theatrical release.

Haldir then announces that they all must follow him. Cut ahead to the Fellowship following him through the woods. The elf captain stops and announced that they have arrived at the home of Lord Celeborn and Lady Galadriel. The film then cuts to the elven sanctuary Caras Galadhon, and it is exactly as Tolkien described.

The entire city glows with an otherworldly life as tall white buildings reach as high as the treetops, but have been cleverly built around the trees and thus weave here and there in total harmony with nature. Lothlorien is supposed to be the greatest haven of the elves, and that is showcased here, all the while retaining the mystery and intrigue that has been built up about it to this point.

The Fellowship is led up a long spiral staircase to be presented before the Lord and Lady of the Wood. Elvish singing fills the ears of the audience all the while this is happening. Then at last the Fellowship stands in the courtyard/platform before the throne of Lorien as the rulers descend the staircase to greet the Fellowship. Then Lady Galadriel herself comes into focus.

Each of the members reacts a little differently to this. Frodo stares ahead blandly, Sam seems apprehensive, Merry, Pippin, Gimli, and Boromir are in awe, Legolas seems neutral, and Aragorn just seems uncomfortable. Then Celeborn inquires where Gandalf is.

Galadriel then chimes in that the wizard has fallen, having seen into the minds of the Fellowship. That, and she’s also a seer. Legolas then cuts in with some snobby dialogue that was supposed to be Celeborn’s. He refers to Gandalf’s decision to go into Moria as “needless” (?!) and even seems to put the blame on Gimli, even though it was Frodo who decided to take them through the Mines. Galadriel then responds that none of Gandalf’s acts were meaningless.

Gimli turns his eyes downcast as Legolas cuts loose with this, but Galadriel tells the dwarf not to feel guilty, because it wasn’t his fault and that people all over are losing those dear to them in these troubled times. I love this about Galadriel. She completely lacks any form of racism or superiority. And she has good reason to lack any of those.

I always found it a bit bothersome that they gave Legolas this dialogue and made him seem more snobby than he actually is. That dialogue chiding Gandalf and the Fellowship were all Celeborn’s lines, since he was the one harsh one who didn’t let any of the mistakes that they made slide. Anyway, Galadriel continues on that the quest is at a delicate stage, and that it cannot afford to falter now.

She warns them against allowing the quest to get sidetracked by anyone or anything and then looks right at Boromir. He visibly reacts to her mental powers informing him of the fall of Gondor and he looks away, almost in tears. Then she states that there is still hope “while company is true”. When these exact words are said, the camera is focused dead-center on Samwise. I always liked that little nod.
She looks at Boromir again, and who is silently begging for some kind of hope and not get seeing it. This is important to his character. Boromir is proud, curt, and bit jerky, yet an overall loving leader of his people. The thought of his people and realm being brought to ruin strikes terror and heartbreak into him, and it is unfortunately also the hole in his moral armor.

Galadriel then tells them that they can stay and rest for a while and while she is saying this, she looks right at Frodo and mentally tells him in the creepiest tone she could muster, “Welcome, Frodo Baggins. One who has seen the Eye!” This is topped off with a creepy close-up of her eyes. I get that Galadriel was always an odd duck, but man Jackson and co ramp up the discomfort with their initial portrayal of her. I’m not complaining, mind you. It’s infinitely better than Bakshi’s hippy. Galadriel isn’t just a wise motherly figure. She was a wild one in her youth and did many bad things that left their mark on her. The reason she lacks any form of superiority in her attitude towards humans or dwarves is because she saw firsthand just how bad elves can go (having been one, herself).

The scene where the Fellowship is answering for what happened in Moria is near perfect, with the sole exception of Legolas’s inexplicable insensitivity. It portrays the sternness of Celeborn and the mystery of Galadriel perfectly.

We next see the Fellowship resting along the river that runs through Caras Galadhon. Elves sing a mournful song about Gandalf’s passing, as Legolas explains to the others. Merry asks for a translation, to which Legolas replies that he himself is still too grieved to sing it, himself. All the while, Legolas maintains his usual stoic posture. In other words, his normal mood is skin deep and he just might have broken down in front of the whole lot of them had he joined in the chorus. Nice touch.

Now in the theatrical version, this cut right to a scene with Aragorn and Boromir, but the extended version lets this present scene go on for a bit longer. Sam comments that he bets those songs don’t mention Gandalf’s fireworks which he thinks warrant a mention. Then he stands up for a recites a poem he made up right on the spot. This is a nod at one of Sam’s tendency’s from the book that just didn’t make it into the films for the most part. Frankly I wonder why they bothered cutting this, since it takes up about two minutes, tops.

“The finest rockets you’ve ever seen.
They burst into stars of blue and green.
And when they come down…
No, that doesn’t do them any justice.”


With that, Sam sinks back to the ground, pouting that he couldn't come up with a rhyme to do them more ustice. Aragorn, while this was going on, elbowed Gimli for snoring too loudly while he was trying to listen to Sam’s poem. Hey, looks like you have at least one fan, Sam. I am so glad the crew decided to put little moments like this back into the film in the extended cuts, since they really seemed to have a thing against letting them go over three hours with the sole exception of The Return of the King. Though why is still a good question, since if audiences are willing to sit through banal snorefests like Dances with Wolves and Titanic, sitting through an action packed epic should not a problem.

Aragorn then spots Boromir sitting away from the others, by himself. He goes over to him and tells him to relax, nothing bad can happen to them inside Lothlorien. Boromir replies that he will find no peace of mind within that place. He recounts what Galadriel told to him to Aragorn, and says he just doesn’t see what hope Gondor has. Aragorn sits down next to him, and remains silent.
The warrior then continues on, speaking of his father, Denethur, who he refers to as “a great man”. Perhaps in the books…  Eh, I’ll get to this saga’s portrayal of Denethur when we get to him. Anyway, Boromir asks if Aragorn has ever seen the White City. Aragorn concurs that he has and Boromir goes on to further describe in loving detail, speaking of the beautiful powers and the banners caught on the morning breeze.

He turns to Aragorn and assures him that their path will take them there someday, and Aragorn will be accepted as their king. I rather like this moment. It shows that Boromir is satisfied with Aragorn’s place as king and has accepted him. Knowing what happens to Boromir later though also makes this scene all the sadder when he starts talking about their triumphant return.

Later, we see the Fellowship sleeping peacefully. Frodo suddenly wakes up, reckoned by Galadriel. He sees her wandering through the trees and follows her. He steps by Sam, who in the book accompanies him and should have here. He slowly pursuers the elf queen and finally finds himself at the Mirror of Galadriel. She asks him if he will look into it. He inquires about what images he will see.

“Things that were, things that are, and something that have not yet come to pass.”

Galadriel empties a pitcher she filled with water into it, and Frodo steps up to stare into it. He sees his companions from earlier giving him weary looks, but then it switches to even more unhappy imagery. He sees The Shire, and then he sees it ravaged by goblins and hobbits slaughtered by the hundreds. This culminates in a shot of a bunch of hobbits being led, single file, with interconnecting bonds. He sees Sam in the line being whipped by a goblin. Finally, a shot of the ruined Shire enters the screen and the Eye of Sauron appears. The Ring works its way out of Frodo’s shirt and tries to lean in closer. Frodo pulls himself away and falls to the earth below.

Galadriel gives him a sideways state and says she knows what he saw. She also warns him that the Fellowship is breaking and Boromir will make an attempt to take the Ring. She does so telepathically. Frodo then responds with his thoughts that he would give her the Ring if she asked. She is astonished and glad that he offers it freely. She lustfully reaches for it, and outstretches her arms and then…HOLY COW!

Suddenly she undergoes a terrifying transformation into a glowing blue phantasm and starts speaking with the Voice of the Legion! I remember all too well that children that had no business being at a PG-13 movie anyway were crying out of pure terror at this part. I didn’t blame them. This…startling display comes out of nowhere and dear lord is it creepy. At least Ian Holm’s brief crap-your-pants moment was just an instant long. This one keeps up for a whole speech about how Galadriel would take Sauron’s place at supreme ruler of Middle-earth.

She then reverts to her original form and Backs away from the Ring. She then explains that she passed the test. She will remain as plain old, creepy Galadriel and will pass into the West. This scene does a good job in portraying that the elves (especially Galadriel) can be very dangerous.

Frodo whines that he knows what must be done, but is terrified out of his wits to go alone. He also explains he cannot carry the burden alone. Galadriel explains that to carry a ring of power is to be alone. She holds our Nenya, the Ring of Adamant. She then tells him one of the iconic lines of the saga: “Even the smallest person can change the course of the future.” He, looking somewhat comforted, puts the Ring back around his neck.

With the sole exception of the absence of Sam, this scene was near perfect. It showed the full consequences of the quest failing, we now see fully where Frodo's resolve lies, and we get to scream in terror at Galadriel. Still, it should have included Sam.

Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 25, 2012, 07:21:31 PM
Nice Work Wr. It shows that even the wise have thier weaknesses, as e saw in the early parts of the Fellowship where Gandalf refuses to take the ring, and here we see its affect on gladriel, who quite possibly has seen ever more than Gandalf himself..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2012, 07:34:50 PM
Yep.

And the darker side of Tolkien's evles is one of the reasons I never understood why the tropes "Elves Are Just Better" and "Can't Argue With Elves" they're always right became so popular.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 25, 2012, 07:41:37 PM
appearances are all people see, they don't see the inside, of what happens when immortals (which is what elves by and large are) are tempted by power. it changes them..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2012, 07:43:07 PM
In other words, the same thing that ruined vampires in Twilight.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 25, 2012, 07:48:18 PM
there is no comparison WR. twilights ' vaspires' are not the real vampires of myths who are aristocratics monsters interested in humans only as walking feedbags. they are not interested in mating with them  or having half-vampires with them(ala blade0 they are only interested in the 'blood donations'
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 25, 2012, 08:13:15 PM
I know. It's still people just seeing "pretty people" and not looking any deeper than that, even if Twilight did butcher vampires much worse than elves have been butchered by modern fantasy.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on January 25, 2012, 11:03:31 PM
Likely she has seen a lot, being older then the sun and moon, having dweled in Valinor during the age of the 2 trees.  & She likely did see the kinslaying, though I think I recall Tolkein saying in a letter, or somewhere, that she and her people took no part in the kinslaying, though they did leave Valinor with Feanor and the others & went to middle earth.  So I guess she has seen a lot in the ages she's been around.  

Though he's older then the world where middle earth is, Gandalf likely may not have seen as much as Galadriel has.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 26, 2012, 01:44:52 AM
Oh, Galadriel didn't just see the Kinslaying. She WAS one of the kinslayers.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 27, 2012, 09:50:52 PM
Someone sings all 27 verses of Far Over The Misty Mountains Old. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ME5urFBf0kk&feature=channel_video_title)

Oh, and happy 3000th post to me.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on January 27, 2012, 10:38:10 PM
Congrats on the 3000th post & thanks for the link.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on January 27, 2012, 10:38:48 PM
Congrats on 3000 Wr! you are about 1/11th of the way to my toytal :lol:
 I knew that Galadriel was ancient, although i'm not sure whether it means shes just a very ancient elf, or whether she is a maiar, like Gandalf. Gandalf , remember as olorin spent countless years in valinor.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on January 27, 2012, 10:56:00 PM
My memory of The Silmarillion is foggy, but I think she's just an elf.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on January 27, 2012, 11:12:01 PM
She's an elf of the Noldor type.  She's one of those that accepted the Valor invitation go to Valinor, during the age of the 2 trees, long before the sun & moon existed.  She may have actually seen Ungaliath (or whatever her name is) poison the 2 trees and Faenor's speech and Melkor's doings.  She was among the Noldor who went with Faenor and his sons to middle earth, against the Valar's wishes & commands.  

I think there are only 1 type of elf held, in general higher regard by most elves.  Not sure if Noldor is a family or group.  The highest held ones are those who went to Valinor and only left once, that is when they came over with the Valar at the end of the first age to do war with Melkor and his forces.  The end of which ended the first age and Elros & Elrond had to choose if they wishes to be numbered among elves or humans.

Now Elrond had some Maia blood.  His grand or great grand mother is a Maia.  Forgot which one.  I'd have to look that one up, and the elf she was married to was a king, forgot what country he was a king of.

I guess I tend to ramble on.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 14, 2012, 06:09:02 PM
Get this, apparently there's a controversy over the casting of The Hobbit. Yes, you see, Jackson has cast a bunch of names that are household names in the comedy genre in England and now there's this big stirring amongst the Brits that they won't be able to immerse themselves in the movie because they'll recognize these people. Yeah, no never mind that Freeman is the perfect Bilbo.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 14, 2012, 06:35:28 PM
A pretty stupid attitude overall.  Just because someone has done a lot of comedy stuff doesn't mean they can't be good at acting in other things or other sorts of acting, and vice versa also.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 14, 2012, 11:05:44 PM
I think these people need to remember that Jackson actually got a good performance out of Jack Black for once, and that so no small accomplishment.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 14, 2012, 11:22:32 PM
Maybe someday they may think differently once they've seen the first part of the hobbit.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 23, 2012, 09:36:29 PM
Alright, sorry about the wait, guys, but the next part is coming.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on February 23, 2012, 10:51:11 PM
It's ok, take all the time you need.  We'll still be here.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 23, 2012, 11:13:16 PM
I know. I always feel bad for making you guys wait, and work isn't helping me get any free time to write. Heck, most of the time I'm posting here when I have a free minute while upstairs crunching the numbers at work,

By the way, the bistro is doing fine.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on February 24, 2012, 12:53:01 AM
Jack Black is actually a pretty good actor. sure hes no Robin williams, but still.. as for the paper, take the time as you need it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on February 24, 2012, 02:47:56 AM
True, but he's still below Billy Connolly's level. Which is why I have every confidence in the casting.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 11, 2012, 01:52:11 AM
The Game Attempts: Part Twenty-Eight-Thirty:

Cut to Isengard, where we see Lurtz standing at attention before Saruman as the wizard gives him a delightful pep talk:

“Do you know how the orcs first came into being? They were elves once. Taken by the dark powers…tortured, and then mutilated. A ruined and terrible flaw of life!”
Or…maybe not. Seriously, Saruman, you suck at pep talks.

“And now…perfected!” Perfect in your ruination…wait, that came out wrong.
Anyway, Saruman sends Lurtz off to lead the Uruk-Hai to be armored and we get a short montage of all that weaponry that the orcs have been making put to use. Also, the Uruks smear the image of the White Hand all over each other snarling and roaring all the way in very disturbing fashion. Then Saruman orders the Uruk-Hai to hunt down the Fellowship and kill every non-Hobbit member. The Lurtz then march out of Isengard at running speed.

Back with the Fellowship: Alright, here’s another point where the theatrical and extended cuts are different. In the theatrical addition, only Frodo receives his gift whereas they skip all the others.
In the extended cut, they all get their gifts, except for Boromir, though he is noticeably seen wearing the chain belt he was given, regardless. Merry and Pippin get daggers where Sam gets a rope (though he also asks for a “nice, shining” dagger light-heartedly). In the original book, he already had rope, but was given a box of Lothlorien which would be used later to restore The Shire after the Scourging of the Shire. However, it was cut, so I can see why Sam got a different gift.
 Legolas gets a new bow, Aragorn gets a new hunting knife from Celeborn (along with news that they are being hunted), and Gimli gets three strands of Galadriel’s hair, though we are told about this by the smitten Gimli. Naturally, it’d be one hell of a feat for Jackson and co to even show it.

Then we get the scene from the theatrical cut where Frodo is given the Veil of Galadriel, which lights up the world is unnatural dark places. By the way, this is explained in a few, sufficient lines of dialogue which either Bakshi or Rankin-Bass could have included easily, but just didn’t. Then we get Legoolas and an absolutely smitten Gimli having an exchange on their boat. When Gimli vows that nothing else in this world shall be beautiful else it be given to him by her, Legolas asks what she gave him. Gimli admits what he asked for with the look of a love-struck schoolboy in his eyes. The flashback we get a shy and stuttering Gimli is also absolutely adorable. Oh, bless John Rhys-Davies and his ability to bring any character to life.

The extended cut also adds a short exchange between Aragorn and Galadriel. She takes notice of Arwen’s engagement necklace and utters that she has no greater gift to give than what Aragorn’s already received. He replies that he’s have her cross the seas to the Valor. Galadriel replies that is her decision. Ugh. It’s one thing to insert Aragorn and Arwen’s love story into the tale where the audience can actually see it. It’s another to over blow the angst. I mean, it's not Aragorn and Arwen are mature adults and not love-struck youths, oh wait.

Right as the Fellowship is about to get going on the river on the elvish boats, we get a quick scene with Legolas, Merry, and Pippin. Legolas shows them the Lembas Bread and explains it’s qualities. Orlando Bloom jokingly calls this his Lembas bread commercial. The scene ends with the revelation that Merry and Pippin have eaten more than enough of it and they both seen to be legitimately worried that they’re going to die. This little bit is humorous.

Finally, with all that out of the way, the Fellowship is on their way. We get a quick scene of the Urak-Hai running at full speed, tracking the Fellowship, intercut with our heroes’ progress on the river. At one point, Lurtz looks around as if he’s sensing something, and then we cut to Legolas doing the same thing. Nice touch, since both elves and orcs were once the same, I like this little shot of the two sensing each other, since elves can do that. Orcs can’t, but Urak-Hai are a bit more evolved than them. This just reminds me why I love the attention to detail in the Jackson films.

Here is where the Theatrical Version and Extended Cut are different again. In the EE version, there is additional scene with Boromir while they’re still on the river before they get to the Argonath. The version that was shown in theaters on the other hand just have a quick montage of the Fellowship on the river, have Aragorn show the hobbits the statues, and then they come to shore where the final confrontation of the movie takes place.

Alright, the additional Boromir scene: It’s night, and the Fellowship has made camp on a bank alongside the river by some big rocks that hide them from view of the river. Boromir watches as a wood seemingly moves with a mind of its own and pulls up to the opposite bank.

Aragorn identifies their pursuer as Gollum, and that he had hoped to lose the creeper on the river, but alas Gollum is one smart stalker. Boromir voices concern that Gollum may alert the goblin’s that patrol the rivers at night. Once again, he tries to convince Aragorn to take them to Gondor where they can resupply and set out from a place of safety.

Aragorn rolls his eyes and rightly points out that there is no place of strength enough to protect them and turns away. Boromir grabs him and angrily points out that Aragorn is afraid of himself and his own people. He asks why the ranger was so quick to trust the elves and not the men of Gondor. Then he starts ranting about Gondor’s hardships again and accuses Aragorn of hiding the shadows (which in this adaptation is 100% correct).

Aragorn remains silent, allowing Boromir to get it out of his system before firmly reinforcing that they will not be taking the Ring to Gondor, and then leaves the noble to his thoughts. Frodo, meanwhile, was listening to this entire conversation, looking deeply troubled be it. Can anyone really blame him? Another thing on Frodo’s end is that he rejected some help from Sam in an attempt to distance himself from the Fellowship while in preparation to strike out on his own.
My thoughts: I have no problems with this scene. It’s near perfect, and actually helps build up Boromir’s final meltdown even more. It also does a good job of showing that Frodo is bracing himself for what he knows he must do. The only problem is that it also brings back to attention that Jackson overplayed the self-doubting angle of Aragorn’s character.

The next scene has Boromir miserably glowering at Aragorn, who does not dignify the glare with a response as the Fellowship paddles along. Then they arrive at the Argonath, and Aragorn identifies the two giant statues to Frodo, and he explains that he has long wanted to see them. The statues look great on film, and that they’re both giant miniatures inserted into the scene instead of just CGI probably helps with that. One bit of detail I like is that there are birds nesting in these statues and several are seen either landing on them or taking off of them.

The Fellowship go ashore just past and here is where we will be leaving off, as the next part of this paper will be the final part that covers The Fellowship of the Ring, and the section after this will cover The Two Towers. See you all next time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 11, 2012, 03:06:10 AM
Very interesting read, thanks for posting it.   :yes
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 11, 2012, 03:27:21 AM
You're welcome. I can't believe I'm almost done with Fellowship.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 11, 2012, 03:47:15 AM
and then you still have 2 more films to go. nice work as always WR.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 11, 2012, 03:50:58 AM
Don't forget that Finnish "Hobbitts" mini-series I have to do, too.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 11, 2012, 02:26:06 PM
I had forgotten about that.  Will it be hard for you to do you think?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 11, 2012, 03:49:03 PM
Nah, I'll just have to read more subtitles. That's all.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 11, 2012, 10:32:49 PM
That is good.  It'll be interesting to read when you add that one in, but no hurry, just go at a pace comfortable to you and as you have time.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 15, 2012, 01:20:26 AM
The Game Attempts: Final Fellowship Entry:

I…I can’t believe we made it. After everything else, we are finally are the end of the Fellowship section. About time, too. Alright, confession time. When I write these, I like to have the part of the movie I’m writing about on-hand to make sure I get it right. Well, seeing the same dang thing too many times can cause burn outs, which contributed to the long periods of no updates, but I think I’ve figured out a new system for writing the Two Towers segments.

The Fellowship pulls up onto the shore at Parth Galen. They set up a makeswift camp and Aragorn announces that they will camp there for the day and wait until nightfall to cross the river towards Mordor. That makes no sense as goblins are night creatures, but whatever. A minor but noticeable film flub. Gimli has a few complaints and points out that this route will take them through a maze of sharp rocks that many have gotten lost in, followed by the Dead Marshes. From his tone, I always got the impression that he was more annoyed as how laid back Aragorn seemed about taking this route than just that they were going to go down it. Whether I’m reading into it right or wrong, Rhys-Davies is just fun to watch get pissy.

Aragorn rebukes him calmly and casually and suggests he rest up instead of complaining. Gimli just pouts and growls in response. Pippin, who was listening in on this, understandably looks worried. Legolas, meanwhile, is staring intently into the forest, sensing the approaching Uruk-Hai. He goes up to Aragorn and urges them to leave, but his suggestion is refused. Yes, because not listening to Legolas when he says to haul rear hasn’t come back to bite you before. He didn’t want to hang around in Balin’s burial chamber either, and now he wants to get off that shore.

Merry walks up the fire they’ve built and drops some wood to next to it. He looks around, and realizes that Frodo isn’t around, and asks where his cousin had gone to. Sam, who was resting against a rock, sits up looking worried. Aragorn scans the camp when he realized that someone else is gone, too, and the camera pans in close to Boromir’s discarded shield.

This is a nice little scene that shows the tensions rising between the different members as the stress builds and the Ring keeps working them all over. It also sets up where Frodo and Sam will be heading the next part. Also, it establishes that the journey is only going to become more difficult and that fact is weighing heavily on the minds of the Fellowship members who know their geography. Putting Pippin in the exchange between Aragorn and Gimli also reminds us that this will be especially hard on the hobbits. Though I have to ponder why they changed the reason the Fellowship was waiting around at Galen Parth’s shores.

In the book, it was because the Fellowship knew they had reached a crossroads that would decide who went with Frodo all the way to Mordor and who wouldn’t and what route they would take there. Boromir had already announced that he was going home to Gondor no matter what the Fellowship’s decision to continue to help his people. So Frodo decided he wanted to be alone to think about it for an hour. Was that really too difficult for them to deliver? Here, it just looks like the Fellowship carelessly just let Frodo wander off by himself, and then also let Boromir tramp after him. Did they not notice the less than subtle figure of Boromir departing for the woods? In an otherwise great cinematic success, this alternation is just unnecessary and creates more problems than needed.

In the woods, Frodo aimlessly walks around looking at ruined Gondorian architecture in a depressed faze. Sad but calm string music plays to this, further setting the mood. He knows this is where he must part with the others and go off alone, and Wood actually does a good job of looking very haunted by this. He glances over at Boromir in dull surprise when he suddenly shows up with a pile of firewood in his arms.

“None of us should wander alone. You least of all, so much depends on you,” Boromir says in a happy tone that’s just a might forced. I just love this performance from Sean Bean. Boromir’s gruff and to-the-point character traits are clearly outlined throughout the film, so in this scene where he’s attempting to butter Frodo up, you can tell he’s not being himself the instant he starts talking.
And also, because we are never allowed to forget Boromir's growing obsession with the Ring and his care and worry for his oppressed people, this scene has been built up so it has weight and payoff.

Frodo doesn’t reply as Boromir nears. Boromir then states that he knows Frodo has been suffering, and that it’s been no secret that he does. Then he adds, “Are you sure do not suffer needlessly.” It is at this exact moment than the sad, but otherwise calm music abruptly ends. After a beat, during which Frodo looks cautiously up at Boromir, more off-putting, almost threatening music starts to set in, but very subtly at this point. Throughout the scene, it builds in intensity as the exchange goes on.

Boromir then begins to babble about how there are others ways that they go in a subtly desperate tone, and all the while avoiding directly identifying the Ring. He starts insisting that “but to destroy what hope we have, can’t you see that is madness.” He starts to slowly approach Frodo who also slowly backs away. Frodo solemnly tells him off, and straight up tells Boromir that what he says sounds good, but only to the side of him that’s scared.
Boromir then loses composer for just a brief second, and he outright snarls while throwing the wood to the ground.

“I ask only for the strength to defend my people! If you could lend me the Ring…”

Sean Bean’s acting in this scene is stunning and dare I say, perfect. The way he portrays Boromir’s despairing over the state of his people turning to madness is inspired and the progression flawless.

Frodo backs away from him quickly by several paces, refusing. At this point, the music has built up from subtly off-putting to outright threatening as Boromir rapidly begins to break down. Boromir’s demeanor has undergone a very frightening change. The last remnants of his faÁade break when Frodo tells him that he is out of sorts, which is thefinal push to make his attitudemgo from forced pleasantness to just barely holding himself back from charging Frodo to take the Ring from him by force. When he speaks, his already uneven tone begins cracking, rising from “straining to sound normal”-to-almost yelling:

“What chance do you think you have. They will find you. They will take the Ring,…”

Then at this point, he loses control over his voice, and begins shouting: “…And you will beg for death before the end!”

Frodo wordlessly turns away from him and walks away, ending the “discussion” right then and there. Boromir watches him go, scowling murderously, and then the last of his self-control when he lets “FOOL!” fly past his lips and he begins stomping after the hobbit. Frodo begins to run from him, but Boromir catches up to him and bears him to the ground, pinning him. He grabs at the Ring, demanding it with the voice of a maniac, trying to loosen the hobbits’ grasp on it. Then Frodo slips the Ring on. It stuns Boromir long enough for Frodo to knock him away and then run for it. Some people think Frodo punched him, I think he kicked him.

With that, the last strands of Boromir’s sanity are lost, and what follows can only be described as the rantings of a lunatic as the bile words almost seem to just spill out of Boromir’s mouth like a waterfall: “I see your mind. YOU WOULD TAKE THE RING TO SAURON! YOU WOULD BETRAY US! Well, you go to your death, and THE DEATH US ALL! CURSE YOU, and all the Halflings…”

Boromir is cut off when he trips and falls almost as if through Divine intervention (that being the book’s description and the film seems to follow suit) and he lands facedown very hard. He slowly gets up, quieting muttering Frodo’s name in tears at the realization that he…well, was taken by the Ring’s allure and acted like a psychopath. The grief and shame he experiences are visibly overwhelming to him, which Sean Bean again delivers perfectly.

We cut back to Frodo sprinting away from him in the Shadow Realm of the Ring. Boromir’s apologetic pleas can just barely be heard, but Frodo pays them no heed as he climbs a set of stairs onto a  stone throne.

So, to recap: The Fall of Boromir scene. Perfect. Bean and Wood were at the top of their game in their delivery of the scene, but especially the former. No complaints. Bean is usually a very under-stated performer, but when he emotes: DAY-AMN!

Frodo begins seeing things from far away, as is the nature of the throne he’s sitting on. Like in the book, the Sight shows him the land of Mordor and brings him up to the Eye of Sauron. However, they skipped a bit, since in the book, he also got to see Gondor, which made him feel hopeful. Anyway, Frodo hastily backs away from the All-Seeing Eye while trying to take the Ring off and ends up falling to the ground a good story below becoming visible halfway down the fall. Ow.

When he lands, he looks around confused. He is interrupted by the arrival of Aragorn. Frodo stutters out that the Ring has driven Boromir mad, and then Aragorn angrily demands to know where the Ring is. This comes off more as Aragorn’s stress getting to him rather than any anger towards Frodo, but in light of what just happened, the Baggins runs several paces away from him, telling the Ranger to stay away.

Aragorn pursues him, and holds up his arms in a surrendering fashion to show he means no harm. He tries to calm Frodo down by restating his vow, but he is informed that there may be one person he cannot protect the hobbit from: himself. Frodo asks if he would destroy the Ring or take it. He opens his palm and shows the Ranger the cursed trinket.

Cue the ominous elvish chanting as the Ring begins speaking to Aragorn, tempting him. Aragorn slowly starts to step forward towards it. Frodo gasps in horror as he thinks he is about to behold the Ring break the mind of another one of his friends. Aragorn’s movements are slow and his usually steady hands tremble. The entire scene is tense, especially considering what just happened a few minutes ago.

Finally, when Strider’s hands are just inches away from taking it, he regains control and instead closes Frodo’s hand around it and the music dies, breaking the tension. Aragorn looks on Frodo with an understanding look, and acknowledges that he can accompany the hobbit no further. Frodo tells him to look after Sam. Mortensen's delivery was excellent.

Suddenly, Aragorn leaps back and draws his sword. Frodo pulls out Sting, which is glowing. Aragorn turns to face down the approaching enemy and tells Frodo to run. After the second time being told, the hobbit complies and rushes off into the woods. Aragorn rounds the corner and before him is the Uruk army.

Lurtz growls at him as the Uruks change. Aragorn raises his sword in front of him in a quick, quiet prayer and then commences with the asskicking. He nimbly side steps the first swing at him and jabs he thing in the back before unleashing a series of swings, stabs, and slices, effectively stopping their advance single-handedly. Now this is how Aragorn is supposed to fight. Outdone by a single orcish captain? Really, Bakshi? Lurtz orders the other Uruks to hunt down the Halflings while Aragorn fends them off at the front.

Eventually, the Ranger is overrun and he retreats up the steps of the very platform Frodo had just been on, fighting off Uruks every step of the way. The choreography is excellent and you can see the tactics Aragorn is using to stay alive. The Uruks are playing checkers. Aragorn is playing chess. With him at the top of the staircase, they can only come at him a few at a time and are easily defeated by his superior swordsmanship.

When a mob of Uruks pass underneath, Aragorn shouts out a battle cry “Elendil” and jumps down at them. That guy doing all the stunts, by the way? Viggo Mortensen. Yeah, he lost half a tooth landing on those guys. The tumble stops the their advance again and Aragorn continues to sword fight them off in a lying down position. Legolas and Gimli finally arrive to back him, Legolas performing inhuman feats of archery and Gimli just thwacking the hell out of every Uruk in his path.

Aragorn explains that they’ve come for Frodo and he dashes off after the ones that got past them into the woods and almost immediately finds on tangle with. We cut briefly to Sam looking for Frodo, and then looks around alarmed when he hears the struggling. Frodo, meanwhile, trips and falls (again) and crawls over to a hiding place behind a tree. Thankfully, the Uruk-Hai are as stupid as ordinary orcs and run right past him. After the coast is clear, Merry and Pippin poke their heads out of nearby brush and beckon Frodo over to them.

He looks mournfully their way and just shakes his head know. Merry looks perplexed, but then realization hits him. Pippin incredulously asks what Frodo thinks he’s doing.

Merry: “He’s leaving’.”

Pippin jumps out of their hiding spot, ignoring Merry’s attempts to stop him. Merry ends up following him out and stopping him before he reaches Frodo. The two cousins look further up the hill and see the approaching Uruks. Then Merry turns to Frodo and tells him to run. They stat shouting and drawing the Uruks to them. They run off the big lumbering oxen in hot pursuit.
An excellent little scene that shows how brave and understanding Mery and even Pippin can be in a pinch.

Frodo then sneaks off towards the river bank. Merry and Pippin continue to lead the Uruks off. Pippin happily exclaims that it’s working. Merry just impatiently tells him to keep running. A short, humorous moment. We get some more footage of the Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli fighting off Uruk-Hai, and then back to Merry and Pippin.

They finally find themselves cornered, and an Uruk with an ax approaches them, ready to kill. Ho boy, would this guy have been in trouble later. Thankfully, Boromir rushes up and grabs the ax. He proceeds to kick the Uruk where the sun doesn’t shine and then buries the ax in his back. Merry and Pippin stab some Uruks that try to grab them and clearly under-estimated them. Boromir puts a throwing knife into one’s throat. Nice shot.

Meanwhile, an Uruk has Aragorn pinned against a tree and is trying to strangle him. He has a hold of the Ranger’s sword arm, so yeah. Legolas, meanwhile, is sniping down Uruks charging right at him before they can reach in inhumanly rapid succession. Gotta love the details. Finally, Legalos gets a shot at the Uruk’s back and he releases Aragorn. Then they hear the Horn of Gondor blowing, and realize that Boromir calls for aid. Unfortunately, this also calls all the Uruk-Hai to him, and they rush down the countryside as one towards the sound of the horn.

The camera pans overhead of the charging Uruks all the way back to Boromir, Merry, and Pippin without cutting. Nice. Boromir continues to stupidly call the Uruks to him (also something I thought was dumb of him in the book, too) and bids the hobbits to run for it. They do run, maybe a couple of paces, and then turn right around again and start throwing well-aimed rocks at the Uruks, which knocks them senseless. Boromir is now fighting off waves of them with about as much skill as I’d expect from Aragorn. Yeah… That could have been a nasty fight if it came down to that.

Lurtz struts into view and instead of engaging Boromir, takes out bow and arrow and takes aim. In the theatrical cut, he pretty straight forwardly just shoots Boromir almost right away. In the Extended Cut, you get additional fighting, but that’s it, so jumping ahead to Boromir becoming a pin-cushion…

Lurtz fires the first shot, and unlike most movies featuring bows and arrows, Weta workshop knows how they actually functioned and had Bean fit with a shirt that went on under the tunic and armor that had the fake arrows on there pretty solidly, so they didn’t wobble around like they just barely punctured the skin, giving off a better “lethal” look to the imbedded arrow in Boromir.

Boromir rasps out a pained whoosh and collapses onto his knees. Merry and Pippin cease throwing rocks and stare in horror as another one of their comrades has been struck fatally by the enemy. The formerly intense battle music stops quickly and silence sets in.

Boromir then gets back up and begins downing Uruks once more now in slow motion, and somber music fitting of a warrior taking his last stand begins playing. He is struck with another arrow, and this time the sound of bolt striking and piercing his flesh is more pronounced and always makes me flinch. He moans painfully and collapses. He notices that Merry and Pippin are still here, instead of running. They stare at him in shock. For a third time, Boromir finds his strength, knowing his dying, but he will defend the hobbits as long as the ability to do so.

He takes down about three or four more Uruks before being pierced with the third and final arrow. His strength gone, he falls for the third and final time, never get up again. Merry and Pippin draw their swords and angrily slash at the Uruks, but they are picked up and hailed away. As they go, they try desperately to get free and return to Boromir’s side, to help him. As if this scene wasn't heart-breaking enough.

Then the Uruks just run past Boromir as if he were nothing, the ultimate insult to a warrior. Lurtz steps up to him with a gloating sneer on his face as he takes aim one final time. He does so standing right in front of Boromir. I never heard more booing at a character than I did in the theater in 2001. The man of Gondor looks up at his opponent, and just as Lurtz is about to fire one last arrow off, Aragorn leaps at him, knocking them both to the ground.

They both tumble on the ground and get up quickly. It’s Aragorn’s long sword against Lurtz’s short sword and shield. Aragorn jumps and him and tries to drive his blade into him, but Lurtz’s superior strength allows him to effortlessly throw the man several feet away into a tree. Aragorn is stunned and Lurtz hurls his shield at him, pinning the Ranger against the tree by his neck. The shield looks as if it were deisnged to do this with the bottom having a space big enough to fit a human neck with sharp points on either side of it. The Uruk leader rushes up ready to cleeve off the uncrowned king’s head, but the latter is just quick enough in escape.

Aragorn punches Lurtz in the stomach and gets back-handed and sent hand-over-heel across the ground again. Lurtz charges him and slices at him from above, but Aragorn is quick to roll out of the way and then stab the Uruk in the leg with the knife Celeborn gave him. Lurtz punches him in the face and then drags him to his feet and head-butts him before punching him away again. Aragorn crawls over to his sword while Lurtz pulls the short blade out of his leg.

In the extended cut, Lurtz sickly licks the blade, disgusting Aragorn before throwing at him. Bu the ranger is quick and knocks it out of the air with a swing of his sword. Lurtz growls in frustration and comes at Aragorn with everything he’s got. The two lock blades, but Aragorn’s superior swordsmanship skills win out and Lurtz ends up down one arm and with a blade stuck in his gut. Lurtz’s mistake is obvious. He should have held onto his shield longer. Again, the Uruk was playing checkers and Aragorn was playing chess.

Defiant to the end, Lurtz grips the Ranger’s blade and draws it in and menacingly growls at him. He probably meant to get Aragorn in close to kill him, or maybe not. Either way, Aragorn yanks the sword out and finally just decapitates the vexing thug once and for all.

Aragorn rushes over to Boromir’s side. The first thing the fallen warrior does is tell him that the Uruks took Merry and Pippin, and then asks where Frodo is. Aragorn gives Boromir a look, and then:

“I let Frodo go.”

“Then you did what I could not. I tried to take the Ring from him,” Boromir confesses.
“The Ring is beyond our reach now,” Aragorn replies evenly.

Boromir begs for forgiveness and admits that he was blind to the Ring’s influence on him. He thinks he’s failed them, but Aragorn is quick to quell that fear, stating that he reclaimed his honor in trying to save Merry and Pippin. Boromir looks as though he’s about to cry. When Aragorn tires to pull an arrow out, Boromir tell shim to leaves, and then mutters:

“It is over! The world of men will fall, and all will come to darkness, and my city to ruin.”

“I don’t know what strength is in my blood, but I will not let the White City fall, nor our people fail,” Aragorn vows.

Boromir visibly sheds a tear at his king finally acknowledging the people of Gondor as his own, and smiles. Then he looks upon his lord one more time and says:

“I would have followed you, my brother. My captain. My king.”

Then Boromir quietly passes away and leaves our world forever. Even writing this now, I’m almost in tears. I don’t cry at movies. Never before. I cried twice at The Fellowship of the Ring. Once for Gandalf, even though I knew he was coming back, and once for Boromir, a desperate man at the end of his rope who made a bad choice.

Aragorn utters a little prayer for Boromir, and sadly laments that the people of Gondor will look for his return, but he will not. Then Aragorn stands up and sheds tears for his follow comrade, his face caught the glow of sunlight shining through the trees. It’s a beautiful image. Legolas and Gimli arrive and see what has befallen of their comrade. Legolas looks on with sad confusion, still unused to mortal lives just extinguishing around him, and Gimli sadly hangs his head, knowing they’ve lost another good soul to this fight.

I have no complaints about any of this. The fight choreography and stunt was fantastic, the acting was top notch, and again, Sean Bean did a great job in capturing Boromir, humanizing him and making him relatable, and that’s what sells the tragedy of his death.

Frodo stands alone on the river bank, with his arm held out in front, bearing the Ring. Tears adorn his face and not for the last time. He looks drained and scared. We hear his thoughts:

“I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.”

Then, he recalls what Gandalf said to him:

“So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All you have to decide to what to do with the time that is given to you.” We get a quick flashback of Gandalf’s warm, smiling face as he says, bathed in gold heavenly light, as if from beyond the grave. This gives Frodo the courage to try once more. He grasps the Ring and pockets it, and marches out to the elven boats. He pushes one out and starts rowing across.

Suddenly, Sam emerges from the tree line calling after him and stopping at the river bank. Frodo ignores him and keeps going, but Sam is persistent and wades in after his dear master. Frodo tells Sam his intent:

“I’m going to Mordor alone.”

“Of course you are! And I’m comin’ with you!”

By this point, Sam is almost up to his neck, and Frodo tries to call him off, but he won’t hear any of it and wades right into the deep and unsuccessfully tries to swim out to the boat and sinks beneath the surface. There we get a long sequence of Sam almost drowning until finally Frodo’s hand breaks through the surface and he hauls his companion onto the boat. Frodo chastises Sam for being reckless, to which our favorite gardener answers:

“I made a promise, Mr. Frodo. A promise! Don’t you lose him, Samwise Gamgee and I don’t mean to. I don’t mean to.” Astin’s driven and stirring performance warms the heart as the two embrace. The film fades to the two of them rowing away to the opposite shore, towards Mordor.

The film then fades to Boromir set adrift on the boat, bearing him back home. Aragorn pulls on the gauntlets that once belonged to their felled companion, since they officially belong to heir of Gondor. He glances across the body of water towards the retreating forms of the hobbits as they vanish into the trees.

Legolas begins to push a boat out onto the river, urging the other two follow suit. He stops when he realizes that Gimli and Aragorn aren’t following him and he looks back at them with a puzzled look.

“We’re not following them?”

Aragorn announces Frodo’s errand is beyond their ability to aid. Gimli mutters that the Fellowship has been broken and the two look to Strider for instruction on what to do next. He places a hand on each of their shoulders.

“Not if we hold true to each other. We will abandon Merry and Pippin to torment and death. Let us hunt some orc.”

The elf and dwarf exchange looks and Gimli lets out an enthused “YES!” and laughs heartily as he follows Aragorn, and is followed by Legolas, off to save Frodo’s silly cousins.

The music then picks up on a happy note they run off and continues on when we meet up with Frodo and Sam again. They step onto the top of a high rocky ridge, overlooking the land from a high point. They can see Mordor in the distance. Frodo comments melancholically that they will probably never see the others again, but Sam optimistically says that they may.

Frodo looks at Sam fondly.

“Sam, I’m you’re with me.”

Sam smiles and nods his head in response, the wordless reply being the most powerful in this instance. With that, the two hobbits march forward, towards the Land of the Black Shadow. Fade to black.

Peter Jackson’s The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring Conclusion:

How does Peter Jackson’s rendition of The Lord of the Rings hold up and how well did it adapt the epic work to the big screen? Today, March 2012, it still holds up very well, keeping up with the most recent advances in technology with no problem, and most agree that it’s still good by today’s standards. Heavens know it was certainly the best 2001 had to offer, since the first Harry Potter movie’s effects certainly all looked like effects. In contrast, the philosophy of creating the effects for LotR, whether on-set or CGI, was “make it look real”. So, from a technical standpoint, it does just fine. The productions values were just great, and New Zealand was the perfect untouched backdrop for Middle-earth.

Story wise: Well, to sum it up, really good, but flawed. Overall, most of the choices and small alternations the team made were wise ones in adapting the saga to screen with just a few noticeable screw ups that only really stand out as screw ups because the rest of the film is really, really awesome.

At the time this film came out, no one thought it could be done and most people familiar with the book looked on with cynical or at least skeptical eyes, due to the disappointments of previous adaptations. However, the trailers were really well designed and made the film look damn good. So we gave it chance and were mostly satisfied with what we got. An insane amount of work, care, and creativity went into this and it shows. Oh yeah, and it was made known to the public at every given opportunity that this was the first of three, so very few were taken off guard when the story was unfinished at the end of this.

The film goes along at an even pace in both the theatrical and extended release of the film, so the audience is never bored. The charm and personality of all the characters were largely preserved, though Jackson did tend accentuate certain aspects of their character of others at times. Such as Frodo’s vulnerable side being given most of the focus over his intellectual traits. Most of the characters in terms of looks also look like they stepped right out of the book, with exceptions (looking at you, Weaving).

No important plot details were omitted and Jackson knew to keep explanations brief when need be, so the story was never confusing or full of holes. Unlike Bakshi, Jackson and his team did not go into this just assuming that everyone had read the book or do so recently, instead taking the time to properly introduce and explain. You know, like competent story-tellers!

Howard Shore’s score captures the essence of the story and enhances every scene it’s in, effectively earning him the respect and fame he now has.

The acting typically ranged from good to excellent, with exceptions (look at you, Wood). The result of these elements coming together, well, resulted in a huge hit movie that hass been hailed as a modern classic since it’s release.

Tolkien's themes of love, friendship, loyalty, and courage are preserved and there for anyone to see through the actions of the Hero characters.

Now, it is time to move onto Peter Jackson’s The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 16, 2012, 01:35:18 AM
Just now starting to watch through Two Towers beginning the process of taking notes of things to remember. Will have an outline of things I want to say soon.
The next part will given the opening with Frodo and Sam and cut off right when the film switches over to The Three Hunters.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on March 16, 2012, 09:11:44 PM
Not going to take some time off to relax and do other stuff for a bit before you start on the next part, now that you've reached the end of the fellowship of the ring?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on March 16, 2012, 09:51:25 PM
a very stronmg summation, although i would give it a stronger praise thatn 'good but flawed' yes there is no such thing as a perfect film, but the fellowship to me sat the time, far outshone all the previous attempts. 11 years has not chasnged my opinion on that. if jackson had run out of money ala bakahi after fellowship, this film would have been the best telling of the first lotr chapter, and its not close..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on March 17, 2012, 01:03:28 AM
Oh, don't get me wrong. It's a really great film. I was just describing the scriptwriting by itself. By itself, the script is really good, but the rest of the production, whether the set designs, customes, acting, directing and what not is what brings it up to greatness.

At this point, I'm just organizing notes of things to say.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 09, 2012, 09:22:01 PM
Huh. My computer isn't letting me copypaste large bodies of text right now. Well crap.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 10, 2012, 12:03:16 AM
Your computer or this web site?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 10, 2012, 02:01:26 AM
My computer. I'm running Scandisc right now.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on April 10, 2012, 08:31:13 AM
That isn't good I hope it's fixed soon. And why did you leave EquestriaForums?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Petrie85 on April 10, 2012, 08:31:30 AM
That isn't good I hope it's fixed soon. And why did you leave EquestriaForums?
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 11, 2012, 12:20:12 AM
Disagreements.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on April 19, 2012, 04:21:07 PM
Alright, after a lot of hard work and struggling, I finally managed to get this off my computer. It is going into the shop and hopefully the guys who work there can get the rest off it so I can post it through another computer, enjoy:

The Game Attempts: Peter Jackson’s The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers:

So here we are at The Two Towers. Filmed at the same time as Fellowship, but edited throughout the year 2002 whereas Fellowship was edited in 2001. I was absolutely psyched going to see this after the cinematic triumph that was Fellowship, and this film could have been just as much a lyrical achievement. If not the mountain of unnecessary changes, the absolute mutilation of Faramir and Treebeard’s character, Jackson deciding to spend WAY too much time trying to make us sympathize with Gollum, and the worst crime of all: cutting Eomer out of most of the movie. Seriously, what the hell?

Alright, alright, before I go any further, I should probably point out that I do like this movie a lot. I don’t adore this middle chapter the same way I do Fellowship of the Ring and Return of the King, but I’ll happily watch it, all the same. It’s just that this film starts out strong. Realty strong. As strong as the others two movies in the saga, but then falls short under the weight of so many silly story-telling errors in the second half, each of which I have an alternative for which would have allowed key characters to retain their dignity. I’ll cover them as we go along.

Next, we have a few new faces, David Wenham as Faramir, the younger brother of Boromir, Bernard Hill as King Theoden, Karl Urban as Eomer, Mirando Otto as Eowyn, Brad Dourif as Grima Wormtongue, and the one, the only, Andy Serkis, as Gollum. Andy Serkis has the makings of a legendary character actor, as you will soon see. Now on with the movie… Karl Urban would also show he’s a powerhouse talent in due time, but not quite yet.

We begin with a helicopter shot that passes over several beautiful mountains as we begin to hear faint voices that are inaudible at first. As the POV continues on and zeroes on when on Gandalf faced off against the Balrog, we hear said confrontation before the view goes through rock and earth and we actually see it. We come in just in time to see Gandalf tell the Balrog to “go back to the Shadow”.
When it takes another step forward, Gandalf roars that it cannot pass and breaks the bridge, sending it into the pit. It drags him down, and that is where the Fellowship footage ends after a brief shot of Boromir. From here, the camera begins following after Gandalf as he plunges down into the darkness below. He falls over to his sword and grabs it in midair before catching up with the Balrog and continuing to attack it.

There’s not much to say other than “Gandalf beats the crap out of the Balrog while it tries to get away him from all the down to the underground river they fall into”. The entire sequences is kickass. The visuals and choreography is extremely well done, Ian McKellen is acting as if he really is falling and battling a raging fire demon, and overall, it’s just an awesome movie opener. The instant they hit the water, there’s a flash, and we’re suddenly with Frodo and Sam.

This is the only form of recap to the first movie this film has to offer, and I think it’s all the stronger for it. Instead of allowing the opening to get bogged down in “previously on The Lord of the Rings” nonsense, Jackson and company correctly assume you’ve seen the previous film either in theaters on DVD. And…when your film grossed over $900 million worldwide and sold so well on DVD that they actually ran out and had to restock within the first week, I would say that assumption is justified.

Frodo shoots up shouting Gandalf’s name as if he just had a nightmare. Or in this case, a vision. This awakens Sam as well, who asks what’s wrong with a concerned tone. Frodo assures him that it was just a nightmare. Then we have our title on the screen as the film cuts to later while the hobbits attempt to make their way through the labyrinth of rock and stone. This is where the first difference from Theatrical to Extended makes its appearance in The Two Towers. In the original release, the film cuts straight to Frodo and Sam wandering the rocky hills. But before that happens in the Extended version of the film, we have a sequence in which the duo descend a cliff face.

A terrified Samwise asked Mr. Frodo if he can see the bottom yet. The Baggins replies ëno’, and just tells him not to look down. Samwise preceeds not to look down, but this turns out not to be a good idea, since he loses his footing and almost falls. From his pack falls a small wooden box. He shouts for Frodo to catch it, and he does. In the process, Frodo loses his grip on the rope and begins falling. Oops. Then after falling maybe about the height of a full grown man, he hits the ground. He stands there humorously stunned for a beat before shout up to Sam that he’s reached the bottom. This whole sequence is so full of hilarious fail that borders on Merry and Pippin antics.

Sam hurries down after him. Then he stands complaining about their situation in that usual muttering, fussy Samwise way lifted directly from the books. Gotta love Astin. Frodo looks in the box that Sam deemed precious enough to save and discovers that it’s full of seasoning. Sam explains that he thought they might have roast chicken sometime. This always gets a laugh out of everyone I watch this with, including myself. In fact, Frodo himself is just barely not cracking up at Sam’s naivetÈ. This also nicely shows the contrast in Frodo and Sam’s character. Frodo being the realistic with just a garnish of optimist, and Samwise being the consummate optimist.  Then Frodo gets wistful looking at the salts and seasoning in the box, uttering that “It’s a little piece of home”, and the hobbit theme kicks as both begin looking solemnly nostalgic.

Frodo goes over to the rope, pointing out that they cannot leave it for someone to find, but Samwise skeptically responds that no one is going to follow them down into that pit of rocks. While this exchange happens, the camera pans around in a circle facing Sam like he’s the radius point until it comes to Frodo’s face. Just as Sam finishing speaking, Frodo gets a faintly worried look on his face, thinking of Gollum.  Sam mourns leaving the rope behind, because Lady Galadriel gave it to him. Real elvish rope. Sam pulls on the rope, but mentions that it won’t come free easily, because it’s one of his knots. On cue, it comes free and falls down to them. Frodo light-heartedly jests “Real elvish rope” and leaves it at that.

Now, I feel this version of the scene is an improvement over the original from the book. Most of the time, the book is better than any of the films made from it, hands down, with a handful of exceptions found in Jackson’s adaptation. Originally, Frodo teases Sam about it a lot more and more meanly, calling it a miracle that it didn’t come loose while they were climbing down. Sam however retorts that it must have come when its master called, and the book then says as much. Here, it’s Frodo implying that the rope is enchanted while Sam looks on with a faintly doofy expression.

Now we finally come to the first theatrical footage after a good few minutes of added material. They ascend to the top of a tall hill and see Mordor in the distance. Sam: “Mordor. Just the one place in the world we’re trying to get to, is the one place we don’t want to be, is just the one place we can’t get to. Let’s face it, Mr. Frodo. We’re lost. I don’t think Gandalf meant for us to come this way.”
Frodo responds that Gandalf didn’t’ mean for a lot to happen, but it did anyway. Then Frodo is hit with a vision of the Eye of Sauron and falls to his knees, blotching his chest. Sam becomes concerned, and correctly guesses that the Ring is growing heavier. He calls for them to take a break. He sets his pack down and pulls out the lembas bread.

Frodo asks how much of their food remains, to which Sam shows him piles and piles of lembas bread. He breaks off two peaces, throws one to Frodo and takes the other for himself. They eat and comment on the elvish food, the food going into their stomachs obviously making them feel a bit better.

The two hobbits continue to explore the rocky terrain, trying to find a way out. As time goes on, the two come to the conclusion that they are lost once they find themselves passing through areas they’ve already seen. Frodo confirms this when he spots some unique rocks formations they’ve already passed. However, Samwise notes that the smell is new, like a bog or something. Frodo reveals that they’re not alone. We get a few glimpses of Gollum here and there, but not a full look until we finally come to the ambush. The film shows the two “asleep” at the foot of a cliff. Now we finally get out look at Gollum as he climbs down the hill like a little monkey might.

The CGI model for Gollum is truly a stunning achievement in movie special effects. Now some people piss and moan about how Gollum should have been a made in a costume, so which I say: bullshit. Gollum is an inhumanly skinny creature that crawls and runs around on all fours like animal, as seen in this scene, is able to accomplish what a human cannot be climbing facedown down a cliff face. There is no way a costume or animatronic puppet could have cut it. Gollum needs real, organic movement which old fashioned movie magic just cannot deal.
Here’s the thing: I’ve been doing a lot of research about why past adaptations of LotR were scraped. Wanna know one of the chief reasons why? Gollum. Trying to figure out how to bring this creature to the screen in a way that displayed his prowess is usually the point where things start to fall apart, because apparently even filmmakers like John Boorman, Stanley Kubrick, Ron Howard, Jim Henson, Steven Spielberg, and George Lucas were at a loss of how to put him on-screen. These books only became successfully translated when the CGI technology made it possible. So suck on that, traditionists who think that CGI is the poison that is killing film.

The artistry that went into making him look real of breath-taking, the motion capture of Andy Serkis’s performance is exceptional, and then there’s Andy Serkis, himself. The man is a phenomenal actor. I don’t think there will ever be a better actor for the role of Gollum. As a challenge to anyone who think that it could have been a man in a costume, I give you this challenge: find me a better actor for it than Andy Serkis. I dare you.

Back to the scene, Gollum descends the cliff face, ranting and raving about “thieving Bagginses” and his “precious”. Just as he reaches the two hobbits, they spring their trap, but soon find themselves being the ones getting pummeled as Gollum goes absolutely ballistic on them. Eventually, they wrestle him under control at blade point after a very brutal, intense fight scene that frankly couldn’t look more realistic it tried. If there’s one thing Jackson does well, he will make you believe that two hobbits and weird imp creature just beat the crap out of each other.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on April 19, 2012, 07:18:41 PM
gollum was a milestone in cGI animation, harry potters dooby or other cgis like Scooby Doo cannot hold a candle top gollum. gollum is a complex character, not inheritantly evil, just corrupted. as an aside, i often wonder what would have happened to him, if he had survived at mount doom, and say, had the ring knocked into the mountain while fighting with sam? I wonder if the Fellowship would have spared him for instance..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on April 20, 2012, 12:01:05 AM
I recall he looked good in cgi, making him cgi was a good idea instead of any other method.  

I wonder also what would have happened to him if things were a little different.  The ring could have fallen into the magma while he was fighting with Frodo also.  

If he had survived I would if he would have been spared and maybe gone/taken to Valinor like Bilbo, Frodo, and later Sam were.  I read Tolkien said the influence of the ring was removed from them and they lived the rest of their natural lives there in Valinor.

I wonder if they lived long enough for Legolas and Gimli's arrival in Valinor.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on May 07, 2012, 07:52:59 PM
Bilbo likely would have died shortly after reaching valinor he was after all 131- no hobbit had ever lived longer than him..I think the fater for Gollum would have been the same. as he had lived many times beyond the lifespan of his kind..
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on May 07, 2012, 10:13:25 PM
Very likely, either that or the Valar may extend his life a bit, so he has the number of years he would have had had he not found the 1 ring.  Not sure if they would have done that or not.  either way Frodo and Sam would live the longest of the ring bearers.  With Gimi also living a very long time.  Wonder on his reaction on meeting Aulae, or however you spell his name.

I'd have to look it up, but Gollum was very very old, hundreds of years.  Not sure if he hit a thousand or not.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 19, 2012, 05:57:46 PM
he was over 500 years old at least..
 WR when will you be getting up the next chapter in this paper
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 20, 2012, 02:57:03 AM
Not sure. I haven't had time in a while.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 23, 2012, 10:21:31 PM
Beginning work again, no promises when it'll be updated, though.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 23, 2012, 10:55:10 PM
No hurry.  You are very busy I bet.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 31, 2012, 03:32:09 AM
This just in. The Hobbit will be a trilogy.

This also just in. I got all the truly nasty things I have to say about this attrocity of cinema off my chest elsewhere.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 31, 2012, 03:37:34 AM
I've read some comments on another forum.  It seemed pretty mixed.  About half hated the idea and half really liked it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 31, 2012, 03:42:40 AM
I don't understand the half that like it. You could read The Hobbit in a single afternoon. It's not a thick or deep book. And on top of that, they're telling Bilbo's story as far as the dwarves escaping Mirkwood by the end of the first film. Which means all that's left for Bilbo in films two and three is Smaug and The Five Armies. That's it. He will officially become a supporting character in his own story. ...Getting mad again just thinking about it. Time to go vent elsewhere again.

They keep claiming utter nonsense like "Jackson can tell a more complete version of Bilbo's tale now!" No, he could have done that in one movie. This is just adding in garbage that has no business being in The Hobbit.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 31, 2012, 10:53:49 AM
They are also likely adding in what Gandalf was doing when he was away from the group, meeting of the white council and their dealing with the Necromancer.  Though I do wonder if the reason may be pressure from the studios who want 3 rather then 2 movies considering how popular the lord of the rings are.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on July 31, 2012, 08:52:31 PM
That I'm willing to tolerate, but there's not much to The White Council's story. I mean, they meet up, talk, and go kick The Necromancer's behind. That's literally it. I don't see the reason for three films out of this.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on July 31, 2012, 09:05:02 PM
You forgot the bit about the white council saying, lets' go beat up the necromancer, Sarumon saying, no, since he wants the wait for the 1 ring to reveal itself so he can grab and claim it, later on Gandolf saying I found proof that the Necromancer is Sauron, the rest of the council, except Sarumon saying, let's go beat him up.  Sarumon saying, fine whatever.   sauron shrugging and going back to Mordor.  

They may also show more of Deagol and Smeagol, Gandolf meeting with the Dwarves and talking them into going to get their kingdom back from the dragon.  

I don't remember the details but there was a bit about Gandalf meeting with the dwarves before the hobbit starts, in the book Unfinished Tales.  I think Tolkein's son said his father had intended that story to be a chapter in the Lord of the rings, forgot which book, where I think Frodo asks Gandalf how he happened to pick Bilbo or somesuch and Gandalf tells the story.  But I think his son said his father cut the chapter due to it making the book to long or something.  Don't remember the details, been decades since I read it.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on July 31, 2012, 09:57:57 PM
i don't like stretching it into a trilogy eother
 just leave it at 2 and add the extra stuff in externded editions like the trilogy. i tend to think this is the studio wanting to milk it for all its worth, and more or less forcing jackson to agree to it. 2 imo was enough.  will i go see it/ yeah, although perhaps with not as much fanboy glee.   anyway wr at least you are venting elsewhere.. just focus on completing your paper i'm sure you'll dissect to death the hobbit 'trilogy' ;later.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on August 01, 2012, 01:05:35 PM
On it, sit.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on August 01, 2012, 03:07:45 PM
& having the Book and Rankin & Bass animated versions to compare it to.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on October 24, 2012, 12:15:10 AM
Alright, I'm beginning work on this again, for real this time. This long absence was 1/4-Writer's Block, 1/4-Work Scheduling, 1/4-Exhaustion, and 1/4-Not Wanting To Overwatch the LotR films.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on October 24, 2012, 12:50:23 AM
No hurry, just work at your own pace and as life lets you.  Better it be a fun hobby then a thing you have to do, sort of thing.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on October 24, 2012, 12:01:19 PM
good news wr. looking forward to it
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 03, 2015, 02:30:45 AM
I am going to begin work on this again. Don't expect it to come uber quickly, though. I gotta get back into the swings of things first.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Kor on June 03, 2015, 03:35:10 AM
No hurry, take your time. Go at your own pace.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 03, 2015, 05:25:27 PM
I will. First, I have to be in the mood watch LotR again. I'm not going to sit through them without being in the right mindset. As much as I love those films, they are an endeavor to take on sometimes.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on June 03, 2015, 05:58:51 PM
you were midway through the two towers when you left off.
Title: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 07, 2015, 11:31:44 PM
Quote from: WeirdRaptor,Apr 19 2012 on  03:21 PM
Alright, after a lot of hard work and struggling, I finally managed to get this off my computer. It is going into the shop and hopefully the guys who work there can get the rest off it so I can post it through another computer, enjoy:

The Game Attempts: Peter Jackson’s The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers:

So here we are at The Two Towers. Filmed at the same time as Fellowship, but edited throughout the year 2002 whereas Fellowship was edited in 2001. I was absolutely psyched going to see this after the cinematic triumph that was Fellowship, and this film could have been just as much a lyrical achievement. If not the mountain of unnecessary changes, the absolute mutilation of Faramir and Treebeard’s character, Jackson deciding to spend WAY too much time trying to make us sympathize with Gollum, and the worst crime of all: cutting Eomer out of most of the movie. Seriously, what the hell?

Alright, alright, before I go any further, I should probably point out that I do like this movie a lot. I don’t adore this middle chapter the same way I do Fellowship of the Ring and Return of the King, but I’ll happily watch it, all the same. It’s just that this film starts out strong. Realty strong. As strong as the others two movies in the saga, but then falls short under the weight of so many silly story-telling errors in the second half, each of which I have an alternative for which would have allowed key characters to retain their dignity. I’ll cover them as we go along.

Next, we have a few new faces, David Wenham as Faramir, the younger brother of Boromir, Bernard Hill as King Theoden, Karl Urban as Eomer, Mirando Otto as Eowyn, Brad Dourif as Grima Wormtongue, and the one, the only, Andy Serkis, as Gollum. Andy Serkis has the makings of a legendary character actor, as you will soon see. Now on with the movie… Karl Urban would also show he’s a powerhouse talent in due time, but not quite yet.

We begin with a helicopter shot that passes over several beautiful mountains as we begin to hear faint voices that are inaudible at first. As the POV continues on and zeroes on when on Gandalf faced off against the Balrog, we hear said confrontation before the view goes through rock and earth and we actually see it. We come in just in time to see Gandalf tell the Balrog to “go back to the Shadow”.
When it takes another step forward, Gandalf roars that it cannot pass and breaks the bridge, sending it into the pit. It drags him down, and that is where the Fellowship footage ends after a brief shot of Boromir. From here, the camera begins following after Gandalf as he plunges down into the darkness below. He falls over to his sword and grabs it in midair before catching up with the Balrog and continuing to attack it.

There’s not much to say other than “Gandalf beats the crap out of the Balrog while it tries to get away him from all the down to the underground river they fall into”. The entire sequences is kickass. The visuals and choreography is extremely well done, Ian McKellen is acting as if he really is falling and battling a raging fire demon, and overall, it’s just an awesome movie opener. The instant they hit the water, there’s a flash, and we’re suddenly with Frodo and Sam.

This is the only form of recap to the first movie this film has to offer, and I think it’s all the stronger for it. Instead of allowing the opening to get bogged down in “previously on The Lord of the Rings” nonsense, Jackson and company correctly assume you’ve seen the previous film either in theaters on DVD. And…when your film grossed over $900 million worldwide and sold so well on DVD that they actually ran out and had to restock within the first week, I would say that assumption is justified.

Frodo shoots up shouting Gandalf’s name as if he just had a nightmare. Or in this case, a vision. This awakens Sam as well, who asks what’s wrong with a concerned tone. Frodo assures him that it was just a nightmare. Then we have our title on the screen as the film cuts to later while the hobbits attempt to make their way through the labyrinth of rock and stone. This is where the first difference from Theatrical to Extended makes its appearance in The Two Towers. In the original release, the film cuts straight to Frodo and Sam wandering the rocky hills. But before that happens in the Extended version of the film, we have a sequence in which the duo descend a cliff face.

A terrified Samwise asked Mr. Frodo if he can see the bottom yet. The Baggins replies ëno’, and just tells him not to look down. Samwise preceeds not to look down, but this turns out not to be a good idea, since he loses his footing and almost falls. From his pack falls a small wooden box. He shouts for Frodo to catch it, and he does. In the process, Frodo loses his grip on the rope and begins falling. Oops. Then after falling maybe about the height of a full grown man, he hits the ground. He stands there humorously stunned for a beat before shout up to Sam that he’s reached the bottom. This whole sequence is so full of hilarious fail that borders on Merry and Pippin antics.

Sam hurries down after him. Then he stands complaining about their situation in that usual muttering, fussy Samwise way lifted directly from the books. Gotta love Astin. Frodo looks in the box that Sam deemed precious enough to save and discovers that it’s full of seasoning. Sam explains that he thought they might have roast chicken sometime. This always gets a laugh out of everyone I watch this with, including myself. In fact, Frodo himself is just barely not cracking up at Sam’s naivetÈ. This also nicely shows the contrast in Frodo and Sam’s character. Frodo being the realistic with just a garnish of optimist, and Samwise being the consummate optimist.  Then Frodo gets wistful looking at the salts and seasoning in the box, uttering that “It’s a little piece of home”, and the hobbit theme kicks as both begin looking solemnly nostalgic.

Frodo goes over to the rope, pointing out that they cannot leave it for someone to find, but Samwise skeptically responds that no one is going to follow them down into that pit of rocks. While this exchange happens, the camera pans around in a circle facing Sam like he’s the radius point until it comes to Frodo’s face. Just as Sam finishing speaking, Frodo gets a faintly worried look on his face, thinking of Gollum.  Sam mourns leaving the rope behind, because Lady Galadriel gave it to him. Real elvish rope. Sam pulls on the rope, but mentions that it won’t come free easily, because it’s one of his knots. On cue, it comes free and falls down to them. Frodo light-heartedly jests “Real elvish rope” and leaves it at that.

Now, I feel this version of the scene is an improvement over the original from the book. Most of the time, the book is better than any of the films made from it, hands down, with a handful of exceptions found in Jackson’s adaptation. Originally, Frodo teases Sam about it a lot more and more meanly, calling it a miracle that it didn’t come loose while they were climbing down. Sam however retorts that it must have come when its master called, and the book then says as much. Here, it’s Frodo implying that the rope is enchanted while Sam looks on with a faintly doofy expression.

Now we finally come to the first theatrical footage after a good few minutes of added material. They ascend to the top of a tall hill and see Mordor in the distance. Sam: “Mordor. Just the one place in the world we’re trying to get to, is the one place we don’t want to be, is just the one place we can’t get to. Let’s face it, Mr. Frodo. We’re lost. I don’t think Gandalf meant for us to come this way.”
Frodo responds that Gandalf didn’t’ mean for a lot to happen, but it did anyway. Then Frodo is hit with a vision of the Eye of Sauron and falls to his knees, blotching his chest. Sam becomes concerned, and correctly guesses that the Ring is growing heavier. He calls for them to take a break. He sets his pack down and pulls out the lembas bread.

Frodo asks how much of their food remains, to which Sam shows him piles and piles of lembas bread. He breaks off two peaces, throws one to Frodo and takes the other for himself. They eat and comment on the elvish food, the food going into their stomachs obviously making them feel a bit better.

The two hobbits continue to explore the rocky terrain, trying to find a way out. As time goes on, the two come to the conclusion that they are lost once they find themselves passing through areas they’ve already seen. Frodo confirms this when he spots some unique rocks formations they’ve already passed. However, Samwise notes that the smell is new, like a bog or something. Frodo reveals that they’re not alone. We get a few glimpses of Gollum here and there, but not a full look until we finally come to the ambush. The film shows the two “asleep” at the foot of a cliff. Now we finally get out look at Gollum as he climbs down the hill like a little monkey might.

The CGI model for Gollum is truly a stunning achievement in movie special effects. Now some people piss and moan about how Gollum should have been a made in a costume, so which I say: bullshit. Gollum is an inhumanly skinny creature that crawls and runs around on all fours like animal, as seen in this scene, is able to accomplish what a human cannot be climbing facedown down a cliff face. There is no way a costume or animatronic puppet could have cut it. Gollum needs real, organic movement which old fashioned movie magic just cannot deal.
Here’s the thing: I’ve been doing a lot of research about why past adaptations of LotR were scraped. Wanna know one of the chief reasons why? Gollum. Trying to figure out how to bring this creature to the screen in a way that displayed his prowess is usually the point where things start to fall apart, because apparently even filmmakers like John Boorman, Stanley Kubrick, Ron Howard, Jim Henson, Steven Spielberg, and George Lucas were at a loss of how to put him on-screen. These books only became successfully translated when the CGI technology made it possible. So suck on that, traditionists who think that CGI is the poison that is killing film.

The artistry that went into making him look real of breath-taking, the motion capture of Andy Serkis’s performance is exceptional, and then there’s Andy Serkis, himself. The man is a phenomenal actor. I don’t think there will ever be a better actor for the role of Gollum. As a challenge to anyone who think that it could have been a man in a costume, I give you this challenge: find me a better actor for it than Andy Serkis. I dare you.

Back to the scene, Gollum descends the cliff face, ranting and raving about “thieving Bagginses” and his “precious”. Just as he reaches the two hobbits, they spring their trap, but soon find themselves being the ones getting pummeled as Gollum goes absolutely ballistic on them. Eventually, they wrestle him under control at blade point after a very brutal, intense fight scene that frankly couldn’t look more realistic it tried. If there’s one thing Jackson does well, he will make you believe that two hobbits and weird imp creature just beat the crap out of each other.
I'm just making sure the previous update is on the last page of the topic. I've watched through all of Two Towers again as a refresher. I'm gearing up to start watching speciic sections to go over multiple times so I can write this. The next part should be up in a few weeks or so.
Title: Re: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 28, 2018, 09:18:07 PM
I will at least be attempting to make time for this.
Title: Re: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: WeirdRaptor on June 28, 2018, 09:23:38 PM
Alright, I know exactly where to start watching Two Towers again. Right after they Gollum. Extended Edition, right?
Title: Re: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
Post by: Nick22 on June 28, 2018, 10:45:56 PM
Correct, WR.  the EEs dont really make the changes for  TTT that they do for ROTk