The One True Bad thing about Force Awakens

Chomper98 · **on:** July 15, 2016, 01:36:00 AM

Granted, I like Force Awakens a lot more now, but after rewatching the originals, it made me kind of sad. Why? Because it seemed like the Rebels fought so hard, sacrificed so much, and were on the run so long to defeat the empire, and it just comes back after they defeat it.
I don't know, it just made the ending of Return of the Jedi mean a lot less to me. I mean, it was like Episode 7 was saying "This isn't peace, this is an armistice for thirty years". And it was.
I mean, the First Order stomps out of freaking nowhere, and annihilates the Republic in one stroke, completely destroying everything the Rebels fought for. Granted, it did give sympathy to the Resistance and their plight, but it seemingly simply discarded all the blood, sweat and tears the rebels lost in their gallant fight against the empire.
That is in my opinion the only true bad thing about Episode 7. It just seemed like the whole original trilogy could have ended with an Imperial victory, and you'd have basically the same Episode 7.

WeirdRaptor · **Reply #1 on:** July 23, 2016, 02:24:09 PM

Why? The books about what happened after Return did the exact same thing. It makes no sense for all those millions of those officers and loyalists to just stop fighting because the two big guys at the top died. If anything, The Emperor and Vader might be seen as inspirations.

ADFan185 · **Reply #2 on:** July 23, 2016, 02:51:52 PM

I still need to See the movie one day.

F-14 Ace · **Reply #3 on:** July 24, 2016, 05:06:55 AM

The Expanded Universe was much, much worse. The war with the Empire raged on for at least another decade. The freaking Emperor actually came back because it turns out he had a contingency plan in case Vader betrayed him, and the heroes had to beat him all over again. Finally the Republic and the Empire agreed to stop fighting, and the Empire never even fully went away. The Republic let them have their own little corner of the galaxy because they were sick of fighting. Of course, then the Yuuzhan Vong showed up around roughly the same time period that The Force Awakens takes place and wrecked the galaxy so bad that the Republic was completely decimated and was replaced with the Galactic Alliance when the war was over. And the Jedi have been wiped out at least twice since Return of the Jedi ended. If you've read the EU, you can see that the new movies are actually taking inspiration from it despite the EU no longer being considered canon. Oh, and several major characters from the movies died too. Oh, and Han and Leia also had a son who went to the Dark Side. Ya know, like in the movie.

Chomper98 · **Reply #4 on:** July 24, 2016, 04:23:25 PM

I know that, I loved the expanded universe, but still, and this was a complaint I had about the EU to, sorry I hadn't made that clear. I just find it quite depressing that the First Order, like the Yuuzhan Vong, Thrawn, and the returned Emperor, destroyed the republic. Though hopefully the new Republic fleet bounces back and joins with the resistance against the First Order. That couldn't have been the only fleet they had.
Again, sorry about not making it clear about my complaint. I should have titled it why the rebels shouldn't really be celebrating as much in episode 6.

Chomper98 · **Reply #5 on:** July 24, 2016, 04:25:07 PM

Quote from: WeirdRaptor,Jul 23 2016 on 01:24 PM

Why? The books about what happened after Return did the exact same thing. It makes no sense for all those millions of those officers and loyalists to just stop fighting because the two big guys at the top died. If anything, The Emperor and Vader might be seen as inspirations.

While you're right about the Emperor being an inspiration, Vader was actually really hated by the Imperial loyalists because he betrayed Palpatine. One of his surviving officers, General Veers, actually got demoted to captain because he served under Vader.

F-14 Ace · **Reply #6 on:** July 24, 2016, 07:39:17 PM

I don't think things are quite as bleak for the Republic as people are making it sound. The Yuuzhan Vong destroyed the Republic because they devastated a massive portion of the galaxy. All the First Order did was blow up one system. Granted, it was their capital, but still, the Republic should still exist. Blowing up one star system wouldn't destroy the Republic any more than dropping a nuke on Washington DC would destroy the United States. Sure, there are gonna be huge chain of command problems, but the Republic as a whole should still exist and be able to recover.

Also, keep in mind that the First Order isn't doing so hot either. They just lost their big superweapon and we don't know if they have any more or not. My guess is that Starkiller Base was most likely an old Imperial superweapon that was already in development when the war ended and the First Order just finished it.

What I find puzzling is where does the First Order get their stuff from? I could understand if they were using old Imperial tech but the Resurgent class star destroyer they were using is stated to be twice the size of an old Imperial star destroyer and far more powerful. The First Order is basically a terrorist organization, not an intergalactic governing body. They don't have the resources that the Empire had so how the heck did they get a bunch of brand new top-of-the-line star destroyers?. It's not like they can just place an order with a shipyard. Is there a super villain Amazon.com or something?

Chomper98 · **Reply #7 on:** August 12, 2016, 01:13:52 AM

Quote from: F-14 Ace,Jul 24 2016 on 06:39 PM

What I find puzzling is where does the First Order get their stuff from? I could understand if they were using old Imperial tech but the Resurgent class star destroyer they were using is stated to be twice the size of an old Imperial star destroyer and far more powerful. The First Order is basically a terrorist organization, not an intergalactic governing body. They don't have the resources that the Empire had so how the heck did they get a bunch of brand new top-of-the-line star destroyers?. It's not like they can just place an order with a shipyard. Is there a super villain Amazon.com or something?

In universe explanation, the First Order grew unchecked between the Battle of Endor and the Destruction of Hosnian Prime. Look at how Germany recovered in the twenty years after World War I and conquered Europe to the point of threatening Moscow, conquering Paris, and terrorizing England.
Out of universe explanation is simple. We want our big bads to look like big bads, and the new big bad has to be better then the last one.

ADFan185 · **Reply #8 on:** August 12, 2016, 08:56:17 AM

You know I need to sit down one night and watch it sucks I have a busy life.

WeirdRaptor · **Reply #9 on:** August 13, 2016, 01:54:29 AM

Quote from: Chomper98,Jul 24 2016 on 03:25 PM

Quote from: WeirdRaptor,Jul 23 2016 on 01:24 PM
Why? The books about what happened after Return did the exact same thing. It makes no sense for all those millions of those officers and loyalists to just stop fighting because the two big guys at the top died. If anything, The Emperor and Vader might be seen as inspirations.
While you're right about the Emperor being an inspiration, Vader was actually really hated by the Imperial loyalists because he betrayed Palpatine. One of his surviving officers, General Veers, actually got demoted to captain because he served under Vader.

I couldn't exactly remember every little thing about the Expanded Universe, you know, but what I said remains true in both the EU and the new film.

Anyway, I didn't wonder for one instant why the First Order was able to attain power the way they did. Space is big and it's not hard for those with the know-how and drive to it, just like Jabba the Hut and the Separatists did.