The Gang of Five
Beyond the Mysterious Beyond => The Party Room => Topic started by: f-22 "raptor" ace on June 16, 2008, 10:46:03 PM
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If start trek invaded the star wars universe who would win?
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I'd have to say Star Wars. Massively outnumbered, the Trek universe is, though they do have a technological advantage.
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I'd have to say Star Wars. Massively outnumbered, the Trek universe is, though they do have a technological advantage.
Yeah the second death star could pwn every ship in star fleet.
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Then again, ST seems to have better weapons ranges...Though, yeah, anything that tried to get close to a Death Star would be vaporised. However, the fire delay on that thing would be rather hard to manage.
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I'm a Trekkie myself, but I'd to say that nothing in Star Trek (except maybe massive amounts of Borg) could defeat the Force.
there's a really good Youtube video showing one possible scenario, though here it seems the Empire is the one invading: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNxhrPaaCA4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNxhrPaaCA4) If you go back though the comments, there's this same debate going on, as it's been for the last three years on this video.
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In the Star Wars universe, they have had space travel for thousands of years. The same can't be said for Star Trek. I think Boba Fett alone could pwn the Enterprise. Plus Darth Vader could strangle the entire deck crew with one glance.
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Well, actually, Data would probably survive a Force strangle. But I don't see what he's gonna do all on his own.
Just one question: If vader could do something like that, why didn't he ever do it in the movies? Why didn't he just Force-choke every Rebel pilot who flew in range?
Also, your arguement about Star Wars having space travel much longer: that doesn't neccesarily make it better. The reason America thrived over other nations was because it started off further ahead than Britain and France were when they started off. In France and Britain's beginnings, there was little but swords, stone, and castles: America, starting off with cotton gins and guns, quickly outscoped them. China, who's newest form of government got to start off with cell phones and space travel, is slowly outshining the United States.
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If he had done that then the movies would have been shorter then they were.
Overall the star wars people seem to have greater power with the jedi and sith added in, though depending on the era things could be different. If during the original movies there are only 4 known force users. If set in the old republic era there are many jedi and the sith have their own empire. After the 6th movie there eventually will be more jedi and I don't know how many sith / dark jedi.
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Are you kidding me? Star Trek would definitely win. In star wars, their shields are so weak that they don't even bother to mention percentages before they just die outright. :rolleyes: Besides, if you've looked at the intro to star wars it says: "A long time ago in a galaxy far far away". My guess is that in star wars they just use primitive things such as standard lasers, which have no effect on the shields from star trek. Before you go ranting about the death star, a primitive laser can destroy a planet if it's strong enough, but that doesn't mean that it is capable of going through multi-phasic shielding, which is more than standard on most star fleet vessels. I have personally seen EVERY SINGLE star trek and star wars movie/episode (excluding DS9 because it really sucked. All they do is sit on a space station -_- ). A shield is formed using many CO2N3 molecules, stretching them around a central axis and charging them with a certain amount of power, depending on how powerful you want the shield in question to be. In star wars, the charge operates on a single frequency that is in the MHZ range. In star trek, they operate on a multitude of frequencies, all of which are in the THZ range. This makes their shielding impervious to laser fire, whereas the shields in star wars are not. This leads me to conclude that most of the weapons used in star wars are simple lasers. To be honest, the death star probably only has around 5 times the mass of the Enterprise in TNG.
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Star Wars :rolleyes: . That's a lot more interesting to be, plus they have....
DA FORCE!
Ohh, maxi big, 'da force :P: !
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Are you kidding me? Star Trek would definitely win. In star wars, their shields are so weak that they don't even bother to mention percentages before they just die outright. :rolleyes: Besides, if you've looked at the intro to star wars it says: "A long time ago in a galaxy far far away". My guess is that in star wars they just use primitive things such as standard lasers, which have no effect on the shields from star trek. Before you go ranting about the death star, a primitive laser can destroy a planet if it's strong enough, but that doesn't mean that it is capable of going through multi-phasic shielding, which is more than standard on most star fleet vessels. I have personally seen EVERY SINGLE star trek and star wars movie/episode (excluding DS9 because it really sucked. All they do is sit on a space station -_- ). A shield is formed using many CO2N3 molecules, stretching them around a central axis and charging them with a certain amount of power, depending on how powerful you want the shield in question to be. In star wars, the charge operates on a single frequency that is in the MHZ range. In star trek, they operate on a multitude of frequencies, all of which are in the THZ range. This makes their shielding impervious to laser fire, whereas the shields in star wars are not. This leads me to conclude that most of the weapons used in star wars are simple lasers. To be honest, the death star probably only has around 5 times the mass of the Enterprise in TNG.
Uhh the Borg use lasers and they were able to destroy vessels with the same type of shielding. plus the force is a great thing to have on your side.
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link to debate site http://www.mrpoesmorgue.com/usvsd/usvsd.html (http://www.mrpoesmorgue.com/usvsd/usvsd.html)
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Ok guys, they already solved this. It was tough, but using power and energy outputs from The Essential Cross-sections:Episode II, and estimations of a turbolaser shot's power from a scene in the Empire strikes back, they finally found the answer.
Star Wars wins, hands down.
In addition to being vastly outnumbered, the power levels of a Star Wars starfighter's energy generator and sheid generator are far greater than most ST vessels that are vastly more immense than said starfighter. The energy output only increases with the size of the ship. Furthermore, even in the 24-th century, a Federation starship such as the Enterprise E could survive, at best, about five turbolaser shots before their shields collapsed.
Another example of SW superiority is the overexaggerated use of the transporter in a fictional SW-ST battle. The transporter can only beam soldiers over when the shields are sown, and due to the apparent ineffectiveness of ST weapons on the more powerful shields of SW ships, I doubt it would be that useful.
Now I know Trekkies out there are still unbelieving, but what I think everyone should learn from this is that they are two different universes that were never meant to coexist, and certainly not meant to fight each other.
Oh yeah, and to the guy who said DS9 sucks, I believe that it would be the most-equipped series to ever fight a faction from Star Wars, if the fight ever occured.
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Yeah Bigger ships=bigger guns.
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Star wars totally. Trek is ournumbered, Vader could kick Kirk's butt, and Boba Fett would disintegrate everyone else. Plus Chuck Norris would be on Star Wars's side. Phasers wouldn't work either because NOTHING phases Chuck Norris. However, I've noticed the newer Star Wars books have become more Trekish. the Yuuzan Vong are a complete ripoff of the Borg and the Jedi don't kick enough @$$. That is why I hated the New Jedi Order series and every series after it.
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In addition to being vastly outnumbered, the power levels of a Star Wars starfighter's energy generator and sheid generator are far greater than most ST vessels that are vastly more immense than said starfighter. The energy output only increases with the size of the ship. Furthermore, even in the 24-th century, a Federation starship such as the Enterprise E could survive, at best, about five turbolaser shots before their shields collapsed.
Another example of SW superiority is the overexaggerated use of the transporter in a fictional SW-ST battle. The transporter can only beam soldiers over when the shields are sown, and due to the apparent ineffectiveness of ST weapons on the more powerful shields of SW ships, I doubt it would be that useful.
About energy: Yeah, I remember reading that, too. Did your site compare a battle between the Slave I and the Enterprise-D? Mine did, and I can't find out what I googled to get that site. It's was really well thought out.
About transporters: There's also the fact that transporters work correctly only about half the time. And battles/climaxes/rescue missions are generally about the time that they choose to short out on us. If they were more reliable, I coudl picture them as a serious bonus for the Star Trek side. But anything that beams the away team into nonexistance half the time is not much help.
Uhh the Borg use lasers and they were able to destroy vessels with the same type of shielding
Quite right, and since the Borg are from Star Trek, those "vessels" you speak of would be the Star Wars fleets.
Plus Chuck Norris would be on Star Wars's side
That's not fair! Fine, then we get Samus Aran. Bring it!
Not affiliated with any quote: The one thing Star Trek has against Star Wars is it's benefit of being five TV series, as opposed to Star Wars being a movie hexology. Movie timelines as a rule are connected, and follow a single storyline. A TV series by nature is composed of numerous stand alone episodes. As a result, Star Trek has an almost exponentially larger background to choose from. Also, many, many episodes involve enemies with the capabilities of eliminating entire races with just their minds (Q and Trelane are examples of such). Q alone could merely remove all existance of Star Wars having ever existed. Since it is a movie series, Star Wars could not afford to allow such deus ex machinas to exist. While usage of such characters would be quite a copout by the Star Trek universe, it is still an obvious solution to the problem of overall inferiority.
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The problem with the transporters is Gene made them to quickly get the cast to the scene where the plot would happen, but the drawback is if you want to have some tension and not have the cast able to just transport to safety you 'have' to have it break down. The same with space battles and other things. If it were me I"d have not used that but used another system.
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http://www.st-minutiae.com/misc/comparison...rison_large.png (http://www.st-minutiae.com/misc/comparison/comparison_large.png) As you can see SW ships are far larger than ST ships so SW ships have more fire power and are larger and ST ships are smaller.
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You didn't answer my question. How would Star Wars compensate for Q erasing their very existence?
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A sith or jedi would pwn Q.
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Could a Sith or Jedi pwn God? Because Q has all the capabilities of Yahweh himself, including immortality, invulnerability and the ability to alter timelines. How would a Jedi or a Sith beat that?
(BTW I love how we just pick this back up completely ignoring the 4-month gap in the middle :lol )
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Jedi and sith can return to guide people after they die Q can't do that (I know I just thought it would be cool to get this topic active again :DD )
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I know I just thought it would be cool to get this topic active again :DD
Agreed. I love sci fi in all forms, and this is one of the funnest questions to banter about. Hopefully lots of other people join in.
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yeah
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Lightspeed is better I found a parody vid on youtube based on Trekkie assumption that it took 5 days for the Rebel fleet to reach Endor in "Return Of The Jedi"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNxSTNZNbTo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNxSTNZNbTo)
(Warning this has some cussing)
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The Last Bastion is another good SW VS ST vid on youtube.
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Here's part one of the ultimate star wars vs star trek movie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYzd6eu9GtU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYzd6eu9GtU) the other parts are in the related videos thread.
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If Q was ever brought into the fight, I'm not sure SW would have a chance. Only some mystical Force power could possibly work on him. But consider this: do Q's powers work only in his universe, or would they transcend with him? Is Q even capable of leaving the universe?
Same goes for SW: is the Force even a factor in the ST universe? Does the ST universe have the vaunted hyperspace tunnels, giving SW ships a tremendous advantage in speed?
And if these two universes ever collided, on whose turf would it be?
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And if these two universes ever collided, on whose turf would it be?
it would be some netural galaxy.
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A tale of two galaxies on youtube will answer your question jedi472.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Li_JhI3xABM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Li_JhI3xABM) yes the force works in the st universe
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I actually think jedi472's idea was a good one. Have the battle take place Force- and Q-free. That way, it's only fleet against fleet, technology against technology, blaster against phaser. In my opinion, that'd be the best (if not only) way to make it a fair fight.
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hmm, wonder what would happen if the Death Star met contact?
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I actually think jedi472's idea was a good one. Have the battle take place Force- and Q-free. That way, it's only fleet against fleet, technology against technology, blaster against phaser. In my opinion, that'd be the best (if not only) way to make it a fair fight.
Yes, I agree. That would be the most fair. Maybe some bad guys vs bad guys, Romulans and / or Klingons vs the empire. For one type of battle.
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Now, I don't really know the firepower of the Klingon fleet, but an imperial fleet of Star Destroyers would make a very hard punch. Plus, if you think about the support ships, Victory-class destroyers, Nebulon B-frigates, Tartan patrol cruisers, accelrator cruisers, and the early Reublic assault cruiser and a lot of other types, that only adds to the firepower. And don't forget the thounsands, and thounsands of TIE fighters.
So for me, it dosen't seem like the Klingons would have much of a chance, unless they've got heavey firepower and shielding.
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Now, I don't really know the firepower of the Klingon fleet, but an imperial fleet of Star Destroyers would make a very hard punch. Plus, if you think about the support ships, Victory-class destroyers, Nebulon B-frigates, Tartan patrol cruisers, accelrator cruisers, and the early Reublic assault cruiser and a lot of other types, that only adds to the firepower. And don't forget the thounsands, and thounsands of TIE fighters.
So for me, it dosen't seem like the Klingons would have much of a chance, unless they've got heavey firepower and shielding.
They had help from a jedi so that's why they won. Cause the jedi destroyed just about everything on the bridge so the star destroyer had it's shields down.
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They had help from a jedi so that's why they won. Cause the jedi destroyed just about everything on the bridge so the star destroyer had it's shields down.
¯mm, Raptor, I wasn't talking about the youtube movie, though that gives a pretty good idea of how a battle between the Klingon Imperial fleet and the Galactic Imperial Navy would be like.
I was talking more about the idea of tecnhology vs technology battle. No Force, or anything else.
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They had help from a jedi so that's why they won. Cause the jedi destroyed just about everything on the bridge so the star destroyer had it's shields down.
¯mm, Raptor, I wasn't talking about the youtube movie, though that gives a pretty good idea of how a battle between the Klingon Imperial fleet and the Galactic Imperial Navy would be like.
I was talking more about the idea of tecnhology vs technology battle. No Force, or anything else.
I thought you were talking about the movie.
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They had help from a jedi so that's why they won. Cause the jedi destroyed just about everything on the bridge so the star destroyer had it's shields down.
¯mm, Raptor, I wasn't talking about the youtube movie, though that gives a pretty good idea of how a battle between the Klingon Imperial fleet and the Galactic Imperial Navy would be like.
I was talking more about the idea of tecnhology vs technology battle. No Force, or anything else.
I thought you were talking about the movie.
I should had but it in quote, I can see
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The Apprentice himself would assassinate everybody and everything on the Enterprise alone, even without the Force. And on that subject, Lightsaber beats just about any weapon in my opinion.
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What about a fight between the Enterprise and a Imperial Star Destroyer
How would that fight, turn out in your oppinion??
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The Apprentice himself would assassinate everybody and everything on the Enterprise alone, even without the Force. And on that subject, Lightsaber beats just about any weapon in my opinion.
Yep i agree.
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Vilstrup an ISD would win since they have more firepower,fighters bombers and varius space borne and landborne vehicles,and the ISD is more of a battleship and the enterprise is more of a battlecruiser.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Star_De...tar_Dreadnought (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Star_Destroyer#Star_Dreadnought) link to all ISD's from star wars
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Super Star Destroyer!!
Good thing we ain't up against one of those
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Super Star Destroyer!!
Good thing we ain't up against one of those
Emterprise would loose if it did.
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What spaceship wouldn't. It's bloody 12 kilometers long, think about how many tubolasers it has!!
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3 to 400 I think.
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my god... like flying against the Death Star in a X-wing
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my god... like flying against the Death Star in a X-wing
Yeah but combine that with the 40 to 50 regular star destroyers that escourt it.
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"Home one... I think we've got a problem here"
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And the Borg would get royally owned if they attacked the empire as this vid shows http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CxWSCTsTEw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CxWSCTsTEw).
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One shot from the Death Star is enough to blow the Borg to peices
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One shot from the Death Star is enough to blow the Borg to peices
yep
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I think the word "pwned" get's a stronger meaning after such a battle
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yes it does.
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Reminds me.. have any of you guys seen the BSG vs Star Wars movie at youtube?
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Reminds me.. have any of you guys seen the BSG vs Star Wars movie at youtube?
I don't think I have.
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Star Wars
Simply because I know much more about The Millenium Falcon than the Enterprise.
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Well, Star wars! Just compare!
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I don't think I have.
Star Wars vs. Battlestar Galactica (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxX0DKE3oqw)
or, many ISD's against a lot of BS's
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The BSG VS SW vid was alright.
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Great CGI
Those guys should try and make a ST vs. SW movie
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Or we could try to make one.
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Sorry, I'm not that good with CGI.. infact I've never worked with it
But, yeah, it would be nice if we could
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But, yeah, it would be nice if we could
Yeah it would
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I am again bringing this topic back.
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again this topic comes back to the fist page of the party room.
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I 'm not really sure how well, this idea could work.. how could you get.. say Spock and Han Solo to get to really dislike each other?
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I think Han and Kirk would get along, see who could bed the most women of various sentient species, and he and Scotty would see who could out drink the other.
I think Ben would think Spock would make a fine jedi based on his self control, discipline & being touch range telepaths & a few vulcan abilities could show vulcans are force sensitive and teach him a bit. or Luke if he's when he's the head of his own jedi academy.
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Well, They could get along as you have shown Kor, the trick here is create opposition, you see that is crossover games Street Figher vs Dc Universe. marvel vs. Dc, etc..
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sesame street vs electric company (a show likely only have heard of, let alone watched.)
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Actually I've seen electric company a few times, nt as good as sesame street though
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Obvious since we all see who won.
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Well, that wasn't a given when it came out in 1969 Kor, a show doesn't go on the air and become a classic overnight..
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After watching St Nemisis it seems that the ST universe has better sensors than the SW universe but still in terms of overall fire power the SW universe is king.
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Man, this topic is back? Wow.
About the ST sensors. I have observed that Star Wars seems to have very detailed sensors in some of the books and movies, i.e. the Executor being able to determine the existence of a small shield on Hoth outside the system, and yet be completely opposite in other works, (How could you not see the Death Star wasn't a moon?) I think the whole sensor thing is more or less the fault of the writers rather than the universe.
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Yeah, the writing in Star Wars has always seemed to be not that great. Yes the imagination and detail can be wonderful, but its plotholes like that that drive me nuts..
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The reason Star Wars would win against Star Trek in a space battle is evident just by looking at the names of the franchises. Star Wars is all about fighting, explosions, good must destroy evil, etc. Star Trek has always been about exploration and finding peaceful solutions to problems. It's intellectual as opposed to carnal.
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The reason Star Wars would win against Star Trek in a space battle is evident just by looking at the names of the franchises. Star Wars is all about fighting, explosions, good must destroy evil, etc. Star Trek has always been about exploration and finding peaceful solutions to problems. It's intellectual as opposed to carnal.
Yeah I'd have to agree virtually all ST ships are built primarly for exploration while all SW ships are built for war.
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Yeah I'd have to agree virtually all ST ships are built primarly for exploration while all SW ships are built for war.
That's not a surprise, as most of the exploration was done long time ago...
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The federation also has a disadvantage they really have no one man fighters and their ground forces would be wiped out since the have little armored vehicles.
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which is why the idea of ST vs SW really doesn't work..
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True but then there's space battles between the bigger ships.
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i guess you can have the characters fight each other, with blasters and stun guns and the like, but them the question becomes how do you do that...
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Making it a fair fight is the hard part though.
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Yeah, is why this is one of those "great in thoery, not so hot in practice" ideas..
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Yeah but there are still some great Star Trek VS Star Wars videos on youtube.
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*Bump*
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I'm bringing this topic back since I recently found a site that has essays on star trek in star wars battles and star wars in star trek battles http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/Battles.html (http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Essays/Battles.html). It also compares the tactics of the two universes http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Tactic...al-Tactics.html (http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Tactics/Naval-Tactics.html).
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Honestly,I think they're both good.
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After watching Sfdebris's review ot the TNG episode Tapestry in which Q claims that he is God, I have to think that if Star Trek and Star Wars ever went to war the Q would not get involved.