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SOPA/PIPA/ACTA

Mumbling

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Hey gang!

For English I'm doing this thing called an 'interactive oral' in which we have to talk for at least 5 minutes per person and engage the class in a discussion of some form. We've decided to do a political debate on the whole SOPA/PIPA/ACTA thing, in the form of the US Senate voting. We have 1 chairman, and 3 others in our group will either be pro, against or uncertain about the bills.

Now what I'd love to hear from you are arguments. We've thought of several ourselves, of course, but I know there are some creative souls on this board ;) Mind you, we'll also need arguments for the bill to actually pass, if we can think of any at all.

So.. Let me hear your arguments :D


Belmont2500

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SOPA/PIPA/ACTA is rubbish your honor, thank you.
 

 


LBTLover1

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Note: I am NOT for the passing of the bill, but I do have an argument for passing it.

Since many companies are making new material for the owners to view, the widespread movies are increasing.  These pieces of film take alot to make (in the millions), plus salaries.  Since these movies take alot of money to make, they need to rely on others buying their products.  Pirating has been a recent idea for years.  Because of pirating, people can watch movies for free and the companies cannot make a profit.  If they can't make a profit, they lose money.  If they lose money, they can't make many films.  If they can't make many films, then we have nothing to enjoy for others and ourselves.  This goes in a complete cycle and can either spiral up or down.


Nick22

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Obviously I am m against these bills, as they are poorly written and don'yt adress the cause of piracy,. Bills can be written to adress copyright, and companies can set upwbsites where you can watch old movies and t shows for a fee, or order the film on dvd or video. there are many ways fo companies to make money
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WeirdRaptor

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I am  not for passing these laws, nor am I worried about them ever passing. They're stupid, and congress has shot each and every one of them down.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


jansenov

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How wide is the scope of your debate? ACTA is about much more than copyright; it covers many categories that fall under intellectual property, like trademarks, geographical indications, industrial designs, patents, layouts of integrated circuits and protection of undisclosed information.

I assume that you plan to focus on the copyright issue, but I decided that it is best to ask and be sure.



Mumbling

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Yes, jansenov, we're focussing mostly on censorship by the government.

Thanks LBTlover1, that's exactly what we're looking for.

To all the others: I'm not asking for your opinion, I know these bills won't pass and that everyone is against them. I'm asking for arguments. Thanks :)


WeirdRaptor

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I'm not sure we can say anything that hasn't already been said.
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The Friendly Sharptooth

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Argument for: Try putting this in a personal perspective. How would you feel if you spent a lot of money having a song made, one person buys it, then he or she shares it for free on the internet for anyone to get? Would you enjoy that at all? When something is marketed, regardless of any slogan, it is about making a profit. No matter how hard you want the freedom to share what you want, it is not so easy to accept if you were the one having your hard work shared for free. A lot of companies donate proceeds to helpful organizations. This comment can be very real, “An sour kitchen on the verge of being shut down was almost saved by a popular band who wrote a 24 song CD and offered to donate all the money it made to help the organization. However, one person bought it, posted it on youtube, and no one bought it after that.” Sharing free material harms the economy, something in shambles right now. Is free entertainment worth your community?

Are you a parent? Do you want your child exposed to harmful sites on the internet? If you answered yes then no, wouldn’t you want it censored? You can’t watch your child everywhere. Sooner or later he or she’ll get on a friend’s computer and look up inappropriate material. However, if the internet is censored, there can be an increased feeling of security with looking up sites like youtube and vimeo. A filtered world is a safe world. Have we become so reliant on the internet that making it less broad would do is harm? So it blocks harmful material we want to watch… Sounds more like a personal problem than a dire situation. People got along just fine before the internet so restricting it is not dampening our world. The internet is a luxury only, so we should appreciate it no matter how little we can do on it.

Argument against: This is a free country. We have freedom of speech and the right to watch what we want. When someone buys a song or movie, it is therefore his or her property and so he or she has the right to share it. People share movies with plenty of people offline, so what’s so bad about doing it online? Is lending a movie to 100 people truly worse than posting a link 10 people watch? If parents are worried about what their children might find online, they should simply be forbidden to use outside computers or without parent supervision. Putting candy on a shelf is not a crime, just when a child comes and steals it. We have rights in this country to share our opinions about things like the government. Are they saying it’s okay offline but a taboo on the internet? This act is actually restricting something that cannot be restricted because it can be done outside of the web, so it’s a waste of their time. One can buy a song and make 1,000,000 copies and give them to people. This act won’t restrict what they don’t like, simply remove one way of sharing it. It’s needless consumption of manpower to sustain such a law, and if it passes, can we really call this country free again?


I don't have an opinion of it myself, just stating both sides impartially.


WeirdRaptor

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The argument for: Protecting children from inappropriate material? Cool. Okay.

The argument against: It won't work. Try again. Just like every other law that tries to do a parents' job for them, this one is destined to fail because no law can replace proper parenting.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


jansenov

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Here's what I would propose as arguments in a discussion about ACTA.

Pro ACTA:

Private property is an efficient way of dealing with scarcity of resources in a society with virtually unlimited wants. Information is a unique resource, since it can be multiplied without limit, so in theory it cannot be scarce.

Yet, creating new information requires motivation, and one way to motivate people to innovate is to limit the spread of information, by introducing intellectual property rights. This way people can make profit by renting or selling the right to use the information they create, and use the revenue to innovate further.

Economists still haven't determined conclusively whether piracy and counterfeiting damages the economy or not, yet there is a growing body of evidence that those activities indeed hurt the economy.

An OECD study about IPRs (intellectual property rights), technology transfers and FDIs (foreign direct investments), indicates that a 1%  increase in level of IPR results in a 0,5% increase in FDI for developed countries, and a 1,7% increase for developing ones.

Another OECD study shows that, globally, piracy and counterfeiting caused a loss of over 250 billion USD to rightholders in 2007 alone, not including pirated and counterfeit goods distributed over the Internet.

The INTA (European Parliament Commitee on International Trade) study on ACTA brings additonal statistics from pages 36 to 44.

These studies confirm that the existing international legal framework, specifically the TRIPS (Agreement on Trade-related Aspects on Intellectual Property Rights), failed to adress the issue of copyright infringement.

Therefore it is necessary, in the face of the growing competition, both fair and unfair, posed by the fast-growing and increasingly innovative economies of Brazil, India and China, to forge a new agreement that expands on TRIPS, that will improve the protection of innovative capacities of developed countries. As developed economies lose their advantage in commodities production and manufacturing, innovation will become increasingly important to creating jobs and sustaining growth in those economies.

Contra ACTA:

Article 1.1.  ACTA states that "nothing in this agreement shall derogate from any international obligation of a Party with respect to any other Party under existing agreements to which both Parties are party". Yet, there are provisions in ACTA which are incompatible with WTO (World Trade Organistion) agreements, TRIPS in particular. Also, in case of the European Union, there are provisions that are incompatible with EU law.

One such provision can be found under the 2nd clause of Article 2.X. It concerns the intellectual property right-holders's right on obtaining information on third parties. Under Article 47 of TRIPS it was optional for parties to the agreement to provide its judicial authorities with the authority, unless this would be out of proportion to the infringement, to order the infringer to provide information on third parties who were involved in production and distribution of infringing goods and services and the channels of their distribution.

Under Article 2.x. of ACTA providing such authority to judicial bodies becomes mandatory, and the principle of proportionality is abandoned.
In ACTA there are no provisions guaranteeing against the misuse of acquired information.

Another troublesome article is Article 23 of ACTA which defines commercial scale activities as "activities for direct or indirect economic or commercial advantage". Interpreted literally, this would mean that a single copy for private or educational use in class could be branded a commercial scale activity. This seems to contradict the conclusions of the 2009 WTO Panel in China, which defines commercial scale infringement as "counterfeiting or piracy carried on at the magnitude or extent of typical or usual commercial activity with respect to a given product in a given market".

To be continued...











vonboy

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Yes, I don't feel that this is going to be effective. Trying to control and block the internet in this way isn't going to work. The Government just doesn't have the needed resources to do this, and like members above said, hackers can still get around this quiet easily. I might liken it to the Prohibition laws. That law didn't work because the Government couldn't handle it. No matter what they tried, people still thought of ways to get around it, such as bootlegging. This law actually raised the crime rate because people had to resort to under handed ways of getting their booze. I feel if this internet bill passed, it would be just as ineffective as that bill.

For my suggestion for a counter bill to this, I say we look to what the government has done for other forms of media. For movies and video games, they made rating boards. Agencies that give media ratings for how appropriate they are for certain ages. I feel doing something along these lines for the internet might work. There can be a website ratings board that gives websites ratings on the kind of content they have. This will help parents decide what is best for their children, but it will still put the ultimate responsibility of keeping them away from these sites to those parents, where it should be.

Hows does that idea sound?
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WeirdRaptor

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That would be splendid, and hell, hardly anything would have to be done, since a lot of websites do that anyway.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


The Friendly Sharptooth

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"The argument for: Protecting children from inappropriate material? Cool. Okay.

The argument against: It won't work. Try again. Just like every other law that tries to do a parents' job for them, this one is destined to fail because no law can replace proper parenting."

Are you talking to me, or is that an independent post?


WeirdRaptor

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Independent post.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf