The Gang of Five
The forum will have some maintenance done in the next couple of months. We have also made a decision concerning AI art in the art section.


Please see this post for more details.

WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:

WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
Thanks, guys.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


Nick22

  • Administrator
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 41626
    • View Profile
well, the kudos are well-deserved.
Winner of these:


Runner up for these:




WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
Next part is coming soon, guys. Hit a bit of a book related snag when it came to a minor character's name. I'm having to basically reread an earlier part the blasted book again looking for his scene.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


Kor

  • The Circle
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 30087
    • View Profile
Some character names can be hard to keep track of and remember.  

& I think I read there is at least 1 elf from I think the first age, or from the hidden elf city or kingdom, at least if I remember correctly, who died in the first or second age and appears in the lord of the rings that Tolkein decided was sent back to middle earth either before the istari did or with them.


Nick22

  • Administrator
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 41626
    • View Profile
indeed and the characer may only appear in the books briefly...
Winner of these:


Runner up for these:




WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
That's exactly the problem...the character in question is the douche hobbit Saruman was bribing to convince the other residents of the Shire that all was well in Middle earth and that there were not any wars brewing.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


Kor

  • The Circle
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 30087
    • View Profile

WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
That, and I'm double checking the conversation between him, Sam, Frodo, and the Gaffer.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


Nick22

  • Administrator
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 41626
    • View Profile
Oh lets see, its the hobbit wormtoungue kills.. I think his name is Billl
Winner of these:


Runner up for these:





WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
I found him (Bill) about the same time I checked back here. Work will now continue. Thank you both, all the same. I've gotta as far as Gandalf discovering Sam at the window. I may post it here as is, because there was a ton to discuss where Gandalf was telling Frodo all.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


Nick22

  • Administrator
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 41626
    • View Profile
good I got the name right... :) keep up the good work...
Winner of these:


Runner up for these:




WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
Slight Update: I've decided that I'm also going to begin posting this on "Essays" section on FictionPress.Net while continuing to post it here, as I've had a friend of who has been coming here to read it as well inform me that the white letters on black is hard on his eyes when reading long term.
So to anybody who agrees with him, "WeirdRaptor's The Lord of the Rings Adaptation Face-Off: Jackson vs Baskhi vs Rankin-Bass" will also be available on FictionPress.Net in the Essay section.

http://www.fictionpress.com/
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
Part Ninteen: The Game Attempts-Part Seventeen:

Cutting away from the wraith practically pulling Jack Bauer tactics on hapless hobbits, the audience finds itself at the Green Dragon, a popular pub among the hobbits as established by Tolkien.

Now, there were two different ways the different cuts did this. In Original Theatrical Edition, it just cuts to the pub where Frodo, Sam, the Old Gaffer, Bill, and some other hobbits are gossiping about current affairs in Middle earth. In the Extended Edition, the sequence begins with Merry and Pippin singing a drinking song at a table (or in Pippin’s case, on the table).

I have to say I that I do lean a bit towards the theatrical edition with this one. While Jackson and company made good use of Mood Whiplash to keep the audience on its toes earlier, the darker atmosphere of going from the wraiths to the hobbits talking about the growing darkness in distant lands keeps the tension on as needed at this point. The reason for this is because we are at the doorstep of the first of many turning points in the story. Cutting from the wraiths search for the Ring and then going to a crowd of hobbits enjoying drink and song is a bit of a tension breaker, though that also has an advantage which I shortly cover. In the end, I will admit that it’s a nice little sequence and Billy and Dom’s classically trained voices mesh well. I can take it or leave it.

Anyway, moving onto the conversation between the hobbits: the old gaffer and some of his chums are shaking their heads at the disturbing rumors of battles and gathering armies in distant lands that they’ve been hearing about even as far as out as the Shire. Both in the book and in this film, this was a good way to show how bad the situation was growing in Middle earth. If even the hobbits in spite of their isolationists ways are getting wind of the greater struggle of good (Gondor; Rohan) and evil (Mordor; Isengard), then it must be bad. AND IT IS, as we soon learn.

As for the actual conversation, it plays much as it did in the book. Bill, the traitorous hobbit Saruman was bribing in the book, tries to insist that nothing is wrong. He brushes off the Gaffer’s talk of gathering armies “far off stories and children’s tales”. I found it odd that they even kept Bill for this scene as Jackson told us from the very beginning the Scourging of the Shire was going to be cut. In fact, it’s kind of charring considering what a negative presence he is here. He rudely brushes off the Old Gaffer and even speaks overly derogatory of Bilbo calling him “cracked” as genuine insult.
However, it’s awesome to see the Gaffer talk his insults and turn them around into light hearted banter to stop his tract, by jokingly stating that Frodo is starting to “crack”, which the Baggins in question further derails by proclaiming his pride in doing so.

   Bill finishes up with that everyone should just mind their own business and they’ll be no trouble from the outside world. So, in the book, he’s a traitor to his own people. Here, I suppose he’s just supposed to represent the worse of the hobbits’ isolationist attitude. The scene works, all in all, but considering the lack of scourging the Shire at the end, it still feels off having this nasty toad of a hobbit talking smack about Bilbo and being dismissive of the Gaffer.
   
   In the midst of the above, we get another small moment with Sam and Rosie as the gardener’s eyes drift over her, and their eyes meet. She gives him a warm look and he shyly looks away. Just like the earlier bit between the two at the party, this moment works as it is unobtrusive and quickly over with.

   After the conversation with the proverbial twit Bill, we cut ahead to later in the evening when the Inn is closing. Frodo and Sam pass by Rosie who bids each of the customers a good night as they pass. A somewhat drunken Sam is able to smile like a smitten school boy at her as he leaves. Sean Astin as Sam is just too adorable is these scenes. His pleasant mood changes when Bill bows and proclaims Rosie “sweet maiden of the golden ale” before stalking off to haunt other victims with his jackassery. Sam mutters that Bill had better ëmind who he’s sweet-talkin’. Frodo reassures that Rosie knows what an idiot he is and was just humoring him with that smile. This was another nice little bit, though more pronounced than any of the others Sam-Rosie moments. That’s probably why this particular bit was cut from the theatrical version, though it would only have added ten seconds to the running time.

   The next short scene also works as the conclusion the sequence Shire-related scenes as well. In the theater released cut, straight from Bill’s ending words, “Keep your nose out of the trouble and no trouble will come to you,”, we skip ahead to Sam and Frodo parting ways at the walk in front of Bag End.

   As Frodo walks up the stone steps to Bag End, the camera suddenly shifts to POV came watching him from one of the darkened windows as low and foreboding music kicks in. Frodo makes no notice of the opened windows as he enters and finds his home darkened with wind bustling in. He looks around with a confused look on his face, implying that he didn’t leave the windows open. Over his shoulder, we see a hand suddenly emerge from the darkness and it grips his shoulder. The moment is well played enough the both Frodo and audience jump from the sudden contact. In fact, I believe my own heart skipped a beat before they revealed that it was Gandalf, at which point relief warms over. Here, we get a more intense echo of Gandalf earlier words, “Is it secret? Is it safe?” Obviously this is in reference to the Ring.
   
   The film cuts to Frodo piling things out of a chest as Gandalf stands watch, even whirling around ready for a fight when he hears something behind him. At last Frodo comes to the envelope which contains the Ring. He exclaims and holds up only to have it snatched from his hand by Gandalf as the hobbit looks on with more confusion. Now, while the dark and ominous set-up here is very different from the book, it works. Like I said, with the fast approaching wraiths, Jackson and crew had the task of keeping the pressure as to keep the audience swept up in the excitement. They succeeded. Cinematically, it certainly works better then them quietly talking about it in the middle of the day by the fire place. Another touch I liked is that he actually had Frodo follow Gandalf’s advise and kept the Ring hidden and having never worn it. In the books, he quite stupidly kept it in his person, though on it’s chain. The deviation here actually appeals this Frodo to me more somewhat.

   The wizard rushes over to the Baggins’s roaring fireplace and tosses it in. Frodo apprehensively asks what on Middle earth the old spirit is doing, but holds himself back from doing anything, obviously showing a great deal of trust for Gandalf. Gandalf cautiously reaches into the fire with tongs rather than his bare hands. Honestly, how could Bakshi screw this up? Anyone with even rudimentary knowledge of fire places knows about tongs! Anyway, he pulls the Ring out and tells the hobbit to hold out his hand. Frodo gives a classic “What?!” look, but the wizard assures him that the Ring will not burn him. So the Baggins reluctantly holds his palm out and even flinches as Gandalf plops onto his opened hand. Let’s face it, if someone had just tossed a metal object into a fire and then told you it was still cool to the touch of bare skin: would you believe them? Gandalf then quickly rushes past the hobbit and keeps his back to the Ring. I love how they’re obviously showing him taking steps not to fall under its power. The performances in these films truly are something else. He asks if Frodo sees anything. Of course, it at first looks plain, and we get another moment of great acting from McKellen as Gandalf starts to look relieved like, “Whew, dodged that bullet”. But then, after a moment, the markings appear, which Frodo confirms to be some form elvish which he can’t read. Gandalf solemnly and resignedly sighs and turns to face the hobbit, and recites what the poem inscribed loosely translates, ëfor he will not utter the black speech here’. “One Ring to rule them all. One Ring to find them. One Ring to bring them and in the darkness bind them!”

   Well, Jackson and company, again you succeed at keeping your audience enthralled and at the edge of their seats. This sequence was and is very effective. Nothing is overblown, it’s all low-key and the subtle implications put into both performances lit up the screen and made us buy what was being told with absolutely success. This is how you do a movie.

Note: Jiminey....my Word program reads this at 53,000 words and 119 pages thus far!
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


Nick22

  • Administrator
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 41626
    • View Profile
Great job WR, and you're not nearly done even after 119 pages, to do the stories justice, as you have so far will likely take 200-250 pages.. since we havent covered 2-3rds of the story yey :)
Winner of these:


Runner up for these:




Kor

  • The Circle
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 30087
    • View Profile
Very Interesting read indeed.  I look forward to more, no hurry.  Post at your own rate of speed & when you can.


WeirdRaptor

  • Cera
  • *
    • Posts: 4766
    • View Profile
    • Knowhere: A Geek Culture Fan Forum
Thank you both. Again, I greatly appreciate the support.

Hey, here's a bit of an odd update to top this post off. You know how we all thought Bakshi, Rankin-Bass, and Jackson were the only ones who made adaptations you could both watch and listen to? Well, from Finland, allow me to present Hobbit:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Koj0V7G46fs&feature=related

This is part one of the first episode of an just-for-FInnish-TV Mini-Series that's (somewhat) an adaptation of LotR. I said I would recap and compare each movie/TV rendition, so it looks like the scope of the paper just made its way to obscure European TV. I will not be reorganizing what I have so far, though. While I am trying to keep this chronilogical as each successive rendition made by American studios is influenced by its predecessors in some way, this... Honestly, this is completely unconnected to anyone else's try at Tolkien's work. I think I can afford to just add this on after I've covered all three of the Jackson films.
Then I sum up each adaptation's strengths and weaknesses and give a final verdict and then I'll have finished this paper at long last. That's still going to be quite a while, though.

EDIT: Don't miss Samurai Boromir.
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you." -Gandalf


Kor

  • The Circle
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 30087
    • View Profile
Interesting.  I've never heard of that version and watched the video link you gave.


Nick22

  • Administrator
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 41626
    • View Profile
thankfully you're not covering every version of LOTR :)
Winner of these:


Runner up for these:




Kor

  • The Circle
  • The Gang of Five
  • *
    • Posts: 30087
    • View Profile
Then it would take quite a while I think and be even larger then you can imagine.