The Gang of Five
The Land Before Time => Land Before Time TV Series (2007) => Topic started by: Bruton the Iguanodon on October 31, 2011, 07:08:04 PM
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So, it's pretty obvious Ali went through a bit of a makeover from when a lot of us first remember seeing her in movie 4, in 1996, to when she finally made her long-delayed follow-up appearence in the 2007 TV series. So, which Ali do you like better---the new Ali or the old one? I'm curious to see how many votes TV series Ali will get...
And just so you know---original Ali for me, no question.
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The original Ali is far better. In the TV series she was way too gullible and quite stupid.
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LBT 4 ali and its not close. she was barely in the episode, and was as Belmont said far too gullible..
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I really disliked her voice in LBT 4, but the new Ali looks weird (TV Series style animation), her personality was off, and the new voice was better but not by much. In other words, original Ali.
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I think I prefer the original Ali overall.
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Original Ali. The one in the series really annoyed me for some reason.
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It is not likely for many (if any) to prefer Ali from the TV series over Ali from the 4th movie for the reasons already laid out. Ali has always been an important character for many LBT fans with the "promise" of her return being something to cling to in the times when it was uncertain whether or not there would be any further LBT movies.
One truth about her is that basically we know very, very little about her which probably made many LBT fans come up with own ideas about her life and her character. One point that I think deserves to be credited about the TV episode is that (poorly done as it was) it was a lot more plausible for Ali not to be the single longneck child in a whole herd. The presence of further longnecks in LBT 4 likely would have complicated things. It is a funny detail that we never ever saw any of the young longnecks to play with which Littlefoot's mother promised to Littlefoot in the original movie. In many sequels (the early ones in particular) it looks like Littlefoot and his grandparents are the only longnecks around and every longneck appearing is a major character for the plot. Only in later sequels did we get ocassional glimpses at longnecks in the Valley who did not play any active part.
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Original. The fake Ali that we saw in the TV series was basically a stupid and unlikable bimbo.
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I have a somewhat love/hate relationship with this character (mostly love), but I have to say I liked her much better as her original self. She did grate on my nerves when she behaved in a racist manner in the beginning and separated Littlefoot from his friends, but as the film went on and she learned to accept others, she grew onto me. Her saving Cera got her a few extra brownie points, I'll admit ;).
Her return to the series was a big disappointment. Not only was she incredibly airheaded and stereotypical, but it was as though she had learned nothing from the fourth film :slap. She was not the Ali I know, but a new character thrown into one TV episode under the false pretense of Ali. Therefore, the original Ali gets my vote :yes.
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Note: Everything said is only my opinion, not facts, whether I say it as a definite or not. It just takes away from film to add "my opinion" before every claim.
http://vimeo.com/31527512 (http://vimeo.com/31527512)
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A very interesting comment Michael and a view one can take. However, I disagree with the view that Ali didn't have any flaws in LBT 4.
Not being used to someone and therefore acting shy may not be a flaw, but in case of Ali it is not about being shy about someone for not being used to him or her. Having never ever seen or talked to Littlefoot before she introduced herself by biting his tail which doesn't exactly show a great degree of shyness about foreigners in general (come to think of it Littlefoot's reaction (especially thinking of his first contact with Shorty) could have been quite different :lol).
Ali's shyness bears a very distinct trace of racism / specism since it is not foreigners in general she fears but foreigners of other kinds (it might be compared to someone who doesn't want to get into contact with others because they have a different skin color). While one may debate the degree to which Ali personally is to be blamed for this (having grown up in a herd of longnecks only that obviously doesn't tolerate members from other species) it still remains a flaw of character.
With regard to her intention to sort of have Littlefoot for herself she is also not overly picking in her choice of methods making up excuses / lies and sort of blackmails Littlefoot into following her without the others by just rushing up. Not the attitude a character as perfect as you consider her would take.
And the whole trip too is based on a lie (or at least an intentional concealment of truth) on her part. Once again Littlefoot's reaction could have been quite different when she revealed that she has no clue where the nightflowers grow having never seen them (just imagine the flowers hadn't so distinctly lived up to their name; they might have passed them without even recognizing them).
It takes Littlefoot's being in mortal danger for Ali to leap over her shadow and talk to the others at which point the question may have to be considered why she then talked to Cera, Ducky, Petrie, and Spike rather than trying to get another grownup whose ability to clear away the rockslide might have been much more powerful. The main answer may be that it was necessary for the story so it would be kind of unfair to "blame" Ali for that, but still it remains not the action that a perfect character might take if the main point is to save Littlefoot's life.
So based on all that I cannot quite agree that Ali in LBT was a kind of Mary Sue character in special need of any additional flaws for lack of any.
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A very interesting comment Michael and a view one can take. However, I disagree with the view that Ali didn't have any flaws in LBT 4.
Not being used to someone and therefore acting shy may not be a flaw, but in case of Ali it is not about being shy about someone for not being used to him or her. Having never ever seen or talked to Littlefoot before she introduced herself by biting his tail which doesn't exactly show a great degree of shyness about foreigners in general (come to think of it Littlefoot's reaction (especially thinking of his first contact with Shorty) could have been quite different :lol).
Ali's shyness bears a very distinct trace of racism / specism since it is not foreigners in general she fears but foreigners of other kinds (it might be compared to someone who doesn't want to get into contact with others because they have a different skin color). While one may debate the degree to which Ali personally is to be blamed for this (having grown up in a herd of longnecks only that obviously doesn't tolerate members from other species) it still remains a flaw of character.
With regard to her intention to sort of have Littlefoot for herself she is also not overly picking in her choice of methods making up excuses / lies and sort of blackmails Littlefoot into following her without the others by just rushing up. Not the attitude a character as perfect as you consider her would take.
And the whole trip too is based on a lie (or at least an intentional concealment of truth) on her part. Once again Littlefoot's reaction could have been quite different when she revealed that she has no clue where the nightflowers grow having never seen them (just imagine the flowers hadn't so distinctly lived up to their name; they might have passed them without even recognizing them).
It takes Littlefoot's being in mortal danger for Ali to leap over her shadow and talk to the others at which point the question may have to be considered why she then talked to Cera, Ducky, Petrie, and Spike rather than trying to get another grownup whose ability to clear away the rockslide might have been much more powerful. The main answer may be that it was necessary for the story so it would be kind of unfair to "blame" Ali for that, but still it remains not the action that a perfect character might take if the main point is to save Littlefoot's life.
So based on all that I cannot quite agree that Ali in LBT was a kind of Mary Sue character in special need of any additional flaws for lack of any.
In LBT4, Ali was only a bit of a Mary Sue. In the TV series she IS a Mary Sue, definately a good example of how bad you can screw up a character. The only other LBT character I can think of that got screwed up as bad would be the Old One, but she wasn't on screen for very long.
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Err... I'm not sure, but maybe my definition of Mary Sue is wrong?
I understand a Mary Sue to be an exaggeratedly perfect, flawless character (often with the habbit of finding splendid solutions to problems that nobody else seems to be capable to think of). I do not think that this can be said of either Ali character.
In a sense it is a bit of a surprise that there has hardly ever been any criticism of Ali in the fourth movie. Don't get me wrong, I like her as a character, but her actions are very far from being unimpeachable. She lied for personal gain, she did something close to blackmailing, she did exploit Littlefoot's unwillingness to quarrel with her, she acted egoistic when working to have Littlefoot all for herself...
Again, do not get me wrong. I like Ali and I also see her acts to make up for earlier mistakes. But I do not see any reason to "canonize" her and pretend that there were no flaws with her at all.
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I think I personally have to go with movie Ali. To me, she's more likable as a character, and Ali is one of my favorites. :)
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I often mix up words and phrases too. To clarify, yes, Malte279, it does mean a flawless character http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Sue (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Sue). Belmont2500 may possibly be thinking of the term Hell Sue, which means:
"A Hell-Sue, unlike a Mary-Sue, has a horrible relationship with most every character and is generally an average person, or a strong being with weaknesses like a villain of sorts; unlike a Mary-Sue which is talented, beautiful, immortal, powerful, and has a PERFECT relationship/romantic involvement with the canon. A Hell-Sue may have one or two romantic interests but the story does not revolve around it. Some Hell-Sues are killed in their stories."
That is the opposite of a Mary Sue.
Going farther back though, I do see what you're saying. I felt that her not-the-best actions were sort of with reason, sort of justified, yet I can support your stance of her being flawed as well. I've seen movies where kids would meet a new race and be frightened by skin color in all innocence, and Ali really wanted to help but might not have had the nerve if she traveled with those who frightened her, hence the excuse. Excuses can't right all wrongs though. I guess she just kept ending up in odd situations, at least for her. So her being a flawed character is something I can see as well and not argue against. Thank you for your reply.
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Thank you for your interesting and discussion provoking input :yes
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Yep, like I suspected, original movie 4 Ali all the way! Gosh, I really loved her, she was my favorite female LBT character---don't worry, Sue, you come in 2nd! ;) She was really sweet but still managed to go through changes during the film, was a really beautiful pink color that wasn't overdone, had a really cute, sweet voice, and she and Littlefoot made such a cute pair.
TV series Ali...comes from somewhere on the other edge of the Universe, she's so different. I don't like her since she's so different from the Ali I love, but at least she didn't make my list of top least favorite characters. She doesn't even look like the original Ali. Definitely not worth waiting from December 1996 to March 2007 to see again!
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Original Ali of course! She's my favorite character who's more than 4 feet tall! (she IS taller than that, right?) She kind, shy, sweet, and is quite friendly. I like her a lot, even more than Littlefoot.
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100% chose original. I believe it too. She acted like she didn't know Littlefoot througout some of the episode. She seemed to shy at the most and didn't know much.
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I think Ali in the movie was a bit better. Her design was better and the color she was good.
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This is another "one-sided" poll. :)
Honestly, the TV series Ali is the biggest waste of character in the Land Before Time franchise. Another waste is that Guido, being an interesting character he is, appears only in one movie and one TV episode. Same with Mo.
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Yeah, I carried on with the trend and voted for the original Ali. The Ali from the TV series just sucked. She was so gullible and they really dumbed her down. :(
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I gonna follow the trend and vote for LBT 4 aka original Ali because the Ali we were shown in the TV-series isn't Ali. Heck, whoever that purple girl is it even has a different colour <_< Though it didn't stopped me liking the ep in which Ali appeared (Big Longneck Scheme?).
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The movie version of Ali was a lot better than the T.V. Series. In the movie she was more developed and had a good personality even tho at the begging of the move she didn't like the other different dinosaur types. But she got way better as time went on. The T.V. series she went way down hill and became annoying and turned into a character at the time I liked into a character that I hated. Her personality on the show was annoying and god awful.
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Only recently have I begun watching the TV series episodes. I watched four episodes today, one of them was "The Brave Longneck Scheme" and...well, you can guess my vote for this poll, for the same reasons everyone else stated.
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Yeah, it's quite obvious that the makers of the Tv-series haven't watched LBT 4 :DD :P:
Seriously, I mean the change in character isn't that bad because it's reasonable in my opinion. Rhett has changed Ali, that's a thing that is quite possible to happen. But come on... judging Ali's outward appearance, it could be a completely different girl...
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Original Ali by a wide margin. As Ducky stated I can see Ali being changed somewhat by the influence of Rhett, but come on, the new Ali of the series lacked all of the distinct character traits of the Ali from the fourth film. Its like the producers gave Ali a prefrontal lobotomy and removed most of her personality prior to the episode.
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Like any of us were going to vote for that abomination from the series.
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I was wondering which you guys thought was better, Michael Jordan's basketball career or his baseball career?
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I was wondering which you guys thought was better, Michael Jordan's basketball career or his baseball career?
:lol
Yeah this poll is about as lopsided as a poll on the question would be...
Wait a minute! Someone voted for the Ali of the TV series? :blink:
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I was wondering which you guys thought was better, Michael Jordan's basketball career or his baseball career?
:lol
Yeah this poll is about as lopsided as a poll on the question would be...
Wait a minute! Someone voted for the Ali of the TV series? :blink:
Yep, it does look like someone voted for that abomination.
I went with tradition and chose original Ali.
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I definitely choose the Ali from Journey Through The Mists. I felt it wasn't right for the writers to drastically change her personality in the TV series. Her personality was fine in the movie; they should have kept her that way.
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Original all the way. Everyone else's reasons are pretty much mine, too. The original Ali was cute, but the series Ali...I can say I've never been more disappointed in a character brought back from another part of a media tha I was with Ali...I don't plan on watching that episode again...
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I was wondering which you guys thought was better, Michael Jordan's basketball career or his baseball career?
:lol
Yeah this poll is about as lopsided as a poll on the question would be...
Wait a minute! Someone voted for the Ali of the TV series? :blink:
Yep, it does look like someone voted for that abomination.
I went with tradition and chose original Ali.
I don't think I need to say which Ali I voted for. Maybe whoever voted for Ali from the series mistakenly clicked the wrong radio button or something. I would've labeled them more clearly (i.e. Ali from LBT 4 and Ali from the TV series or something like that)
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I never actually saw a difference, but I just chose the original Ali anyway for nostalgia's sake.
By the way, who in the world picked the TV series Ali?!
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The LBT IV Ali I like far more than “The Great Logneck Scheme,” Ali. She had much more growth, going from exclusive to inclusive; “It takes all sorts.” The problem is in her return, she is essentially enslaved to herself prior to enlightenment, Rhett only wants to play with her, just as she only wanted to play with Littlefoot. Why after her realization did she not sing to Rhett, “It takes all sorts,”?! This to me is character continuity problem.