The Gang of Five
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Some questions about "The Stone of Cold Fire"

I love Jelly Otter

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That movie probably would be among my all time favourites as the last to use the "classic" LBT coloring style & confusing plot.
Exactly the plot.  So at the end those 2 Rainbow Faces turns out to be aliens in a disguise of dinosaurs.  Yet that blue meteor in the beginning of the film - could it have been them flying on their ship & landing there on the peak? If it was not that then I'm agree with Littlefoot that that meteor was different & why / how come then?
If I'm on the right way, then those Rainbow Faces said it could have been a "stone of cold fire" with some "magical powers" as a random example they made up to show that folks don't know much about the world rather than what they see.  Some lie that Pterano bought into to release his dreams of being a leader & etc.  Also, Rainbow Faces were helping the kids to rescue Ducky, right? And they were sorta teleporting from one place to another secretly, which made the kids confused how they were so fast? And if the mysterious stone was just an ordinary (blue) meteor, why did it explode as if it was a bomb when those flyers were hitting it with rocks?  Or... if it was Rainbow Faces's space ship on which they flew in to the Valley, that would mean they secretly replaced it with a blue meteor before it was found, so they flew on it back from the valley in the end...?
Would someone be kind enough & take the time to sort out these things for me? :)


Malte279

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Quote
That movie probably would be among my all time favourites as the last to use the "classic" LBT coloring style & confusing plot.
Interesting view and a very good post to start a discussion :yes  
Personally I had quite the opposite impression of LBT 7 being the second time that there was a very serious breach in the style and plot of LBT.
The first breach would have been between the original and the first sequel with the later changing the setting and style entirely (sharptooth leafeater relationship, songs etc.). One could argue that LBT 5 too brought about some change (being the first to be directed by Charles Grosvenor and also his (in my opinion not so positive habbit to turn everything red in case of danger)), but I think it was LBT 7 that really introduced some major breaches of style and story.
One of the breaches in terms of style was the CGI in the opening sequence of LBT 7. I'm not sure if it was the first time CGI was used in LBT, but in any case it looked to me like the most obvious case till then on the one hand creating a more three dimensional impression but also looking a bit "artificial" to me. Further style changes in terms of appearance were such details as green-colored Lava and space imagery other than in the introduction. One may argue though that this space views during the song "Beyond the Mysterious Beyond" (I like that one) was sort of the continuation of another change in style which had been introduced by Grosvenor, namely using the songs for some somewhat more "surreal" images or elements (previous examples can be found in "Big Water", "Friends for Dinner", "Lone Dinosaur" and "On your own").
In terms of story I was in a rather split mind about LBT 7. It introduced the very interesting character of Pterano and I just loved the fact that for the first time (other than the alusion to Littlefoot's mother in the song "Always there" they acknowledged the events of the first movie in one of the sequels). On the other hand I really disliked that kind of Star Trek style LBT crossover posed by the Rainbowfaces. Personally I would have prefered if they had kept them more mysterious. In case of LBT 6 it was left to the audience to decide whether or not to believe in Doc as the Lone Dinosaur while the end of LBT 7 not only rammed the idea of aliens from outer space down the throat of the audience but also left Littlefoot oddly uncaring about it.
Furthermore I would have loved for the writers of LBT 7 to care a little more about many details. The whole thing about the Stone of Cold fire seems to be like a loose end (Littlefoot sees a stone that is utterly different from a regular flying rock they all go to find it and it just turns out to be a regular flying rock?). Then there are the odd motivations of the rainbowfaces who on the one hand seem to instigate the dinosaurs to act (the whole basis for the song "Beyond the Mysterious Beyond"), then they seem to quarrel about whether or not it is okay to help them thereby disobeying what seem to be "Starfleet orders" of some sort, and then after they help the kids (with using the volcano as an elevator uncomfortably pushing the boundaries of "LBT realism" up to that point) they end up telling Littlefoot that they had pretty much known all along that there hadn't been such a thing as the "Stone of Cold Fire" (after THEY had actually been the only ones to bring it up and to know about what it was at all (none of the other dinosaurs ever seems to have heard of it at all)).
Also the writers didn't seem to care much about making the actions of the adults realistic. For examply if only Littlefoot saw that stone and just told his grandparents about it, how come it caused so much of a stir as to result in some kind of Great Valley gathering? How did the word spread and what on earther was that "word" to cause so much concern on the one hand, while on the other hand all of the adults were utterly convinced that there was absolutely nothing unusual to begin with?
Pterano's actions were similarly strange. For example how come he was making his plots right amidst sleeping dinosaurs and plotting so loudly that anyone with not too solid a sleep would have woken up and heard it? And also why on earth did he kidnap Ducky? What did he want to accomplish by abducting her? Had he just left her there the experience had shown that most likely nobody would have cared while kidnapping her was the only way to make sure that the other grown up dinosaurs would do something rather than just shrugging it off just like Littlefoot's story. But even so, what they did was holding a very, very, veeeery long conference before deciding that sending two other flyers after them might be a good idea.
LBT 7 could have been great, in my opinion it was not because some interesting ideas were combined with way too little concern about fundamental plotpoints as well as details.


SkyColor-TreeSweets

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I think that since the farwalker herd leader said that the rainbow faces had joined up with the herd some time ago the blue stone that Littlefoot had just seen the other night could not have been their spaceship. Perhaps it was a meteorite with unusual properties (and unexplained, but hey, that fits in with the theme of not knowing everything there is to know in this movie right?) which is why it exploded and was blue and all, but was not a spaceship at all.

The rainbow faces liked to encourage dinos to gain new knowledge. They probably just made up the idea of the Stone of Cold Fire to intrigue the others for precisely this purpose, so that some of them would try to investigate.


SkyColor-TreeSweets

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LBT 7 is my favorite sequel for a number of reasons but I can definitely see where it does not "feel" like an LBT movie. Still, I was never that bothered by the presence of aliens in this one as much as I was by a plot element in LBT 10- the one with all the longnecks having the dreams telling them to go to the crater valley in order to catch the sun on their heads to stop the end of the world. :blink: Whaaa? For me, that, and not the aliens, was when the series jumped the shark, and that's a big reason why LBT 10 is my least favorite.
I think it's because no one has ever proven that aliens (and possibly ghosts, depending on your interpretation of certain events in the original and LBT 6) do not exist, and plenty of people believe that they do exist, and sometimes we even have valid reasons to think so. If aliens could exist now, they could certainly believably exist in the LBT dinosaur's time. We do however, know that having prophetic dreams and catching the sun on a carbon based lifeform's face (not that i believe that actually happened in LBT 10) is impossible, so that one was for me, too much in the realm of fantasy and thus the most unacceptable LBT plot element.


jansenov

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I agree with both of Skycolor's posts, but I would add if we were to really ponder on the behaviour of advanced aliens the way the rainbowfaces behaved was not it. Realistically, aliens would attempt to gather as much data as possible from afar, since it is energetically and temporaly more efficient than travelling.

And if it is capable of interstellar travel, then it already has the technological toolkit to completely harness the energy of its homestar, which means it is, or is on the way to become, billions of times stronger than mankind is now. Building vast telescope arrays with unparalleled sensitivity would be a trivial matter for such a civilisation. From light years away it would have better images of the Earth's surface in the entire electromagnetic spectrum than we have now from our satellites just hanging above the surface. There is also the issue about how much Earth's biosphere would even interest such aliens, because it is likely that their understanding of the interactions of DNA and proteins would be complete, that means, they could have a faithful simulation of Earth's ecosystem on a computer. Just to make sure, they could send a probe to Earth once or twice. In any case, they would save the data, and just completely ignore Earth (maybe dedicate a tiny portion of their observational capability to it), until the time comes when the Sun becomes a candidate for the civilisation's expansion and survival.

These depressingly (from our perspective) silent and powerful aliens would be nothing like the rainbowfaces, who are really human teenagers having fun with a completely clueless population.

And I would say the longneck beliefs in LBT 10 are just the creeping-in of New Age into a work about dinosaurs, which has happened before, for example in Dinotopia, and was brought to its extreme in the game Lost Eden. I think it is because dinosaurs, being our age's equivalent of creatures of medieval bestiaries, attract the same mystical elaboration beings from those bestiaries once attracted (in alchemy, astrology, geography etc.).


DarkHououmon

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Quote from: jansenov,Aug 6 2014 on  02:02 AM
I agree with both of Skycolor's posts, but I would add if we were to really ponder on the behaviour of advanced aliens the way the rainbowfaces behaved was not it. Realistically, aliens would attempt to gather as much data as possible from afar, since it is energetically and temporaly more efficient than travelling.
There is the possibility, if they really were advanced aliens, that they were banished from their homeworld and, on their way to find a new world, they wound up crash-landing on earth. Like, maybe they were struck by a passing meteor or something and they had to make an emergency landing. The streak across the sky with the stone of cold fire (if that was their ship) could have been the ship falling through due to damage. Then they could have taken on the forms of rainbow faces so that the dinosaurs didn't freak out at the presence of some unknown creature and blended with the dinosaurs while their ship was being repaired. Then by the end, they were able to fix their ship and leave.


I love Jelly Otter

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I sorta like how in this 7th film just like in the 6th there's no clear edge between what's a coincidence & what really has some valid connection.
I have seen the movie only 2 times with once being in English, so either I have missed some details that made the rest unclear for me or I'd rather leave it to experts here that make this discussion pretty interesting. Besides, pretty much agreed with everyone on here with their points made.
If Rainbowfaces joined the herd of farwalkers "some time ago" then sure they have no relation to the blue meteorite. If you say it was a some unique blue stone - then why it was "falling" not like a real meteorite but was actually flying or landing as if it was indeed a spaceship? Why would Rainbowfaces go on secretly following the the kids in their search for the stone - they could have left them right after making their point "if you're in doubt about it, then go investigate & see if you were right".
What's confusing kinda is why Pterano & Co kept Ducky with themselves even when all already knew what happened?  Unless they used Ducky to make sure others won't try to interfere in their business...

As for the 3D in the beginning of the movie & other following movies - never liked it myself when the moving background or part of the background makes the characters look even more flat 2D still. Background in 8-13 is beautiful no doubt unless it's some rotating ground or falling rock or such - makes me feel like this is not the LBT I knew from long ago.


jansenov

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@DarkHououmon: As good an explanation of the LBT rainbowfaces as any other. ;)


SkyColor-TreeSweets

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@ Jansenov: Yes it is interesting to ponder on the motives and characters of the rainbowfaces. I actually had never thought about them being teenagers just messing with the clueless earth creatures before. That's a new idea.

I thought perhaps they were aliens who were trying to help the inhabitants of another planet advance for whatever reason. I don't know if that would be is realistic or not  <_< for beings from another planet to just be that altruistic, but that was how I interpreted why they came to earth and encouraged the dinos to try to look "beyond the mysterious beyond" and to seek new knowledge and enlighten themselves.

 I saw it as them acting kind of like "teachers" or "helpers" of the earthlings from outer space. They wanted to teach and help the dinos and that was why they went along on the adventure with gang, watching over them them from afar, making sure they saw the "investigation" of  the blue stone to the end, and making sure they got help when needed, which is why they taught them about using steam to build a makeshift elevator in with a rock in the volcano. However, they can't teach them too much because "that would be telling", making it too easy for the earthlings, and the rainbowfaces wanted them to learn and discover things for themselves.


jansenov

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^Well the knowledge they handed over to the Earthlings is somewhat random, not anything like teaching a subject systematically, which means the knowledge is unlikely to stay.And if they wanted to motivate the dinosaurs to explore the world, there would have been better ways to do it. The way LBT 7 turned out makes it seems like the rainbowfaces were just fooling around. Remember we are talking about geniuses (relative to Earthlings) here, so their pranks can be quite sophisticated.