The Gang of Five
The Land Before Time => General Land Before Time => Topic started by: action9000 on April 12, 2006, 01:22:19 AM
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The CD I am referring to is this one (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000003L2M/qid=1144818536/sr=2-2/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_2/102-7265814-3301748?s=music&v=glance&n=5174).
I compared the songs on the CD to the music found on the actual LBT DVDs. Oddly enough, every song on the CD is pitched about 40 or 50 cents sharp (I know, technical talk. I'll explain this in a second :p ), with the special edition of "If We Hold On Together" being pitched nearly 1 semitone sharp!
What does this mean? The songs on the CD are played at a Higher pitch than the songs in the original films.
When I first listened to this version of IWHoT (sung by Thomas Dekker and Aria Curzon) compared to the Diana Ross version, I noticed it was faster (78 Beats Per Minute, as opposed to the Diana Ross version, which is approximately 69 BPM. I have special hardware and software to help accurately find the speed of music :P:).
After some more analysis, I realized that it is also sung *slightly* higher than the Diana Ross version. If you play along with it on a piano or keyboard, you find the notes from the original song are out of tune. For those of you who know the original song, the first 4 notes of the melody of the Diana Ross version are D, D, E, C on the musical scale. (For Future reference, '#' is a "sharp" (sounding slightly higher) symbol in standard music notation) In this CD version, this same melody conforms more closely with D#, D#, F, C#, transposing each note up one half-tone (from C to C#, for example).
At first I thought nothing of this, figuring this version of the song was simply sung in a different key (pitch transposition) from the original Diana Ross version. My questions started when I began working on the Peaceful Valley MIDI.
At first, I was working off the version of Peaceful Valley from my CD. I was tinkering with it, trying to figure out the notes. After a bit, I decided to switch from the Opening version of the song, to the Complete "End Credits" version of the song, which is Not on my CD. I ripped the music from the DVD and started working from this. What happened? All my work I had done was out of tune! The original track is slightly lower-pitched than the CD version, just like IWHoT. I had to transpose my entire midi progress down a half-tone to get it in tune with the original End Credits version!
After this discovery, I started experimenting with the other songs on the CD. Sure enough, Every other song I tested (When You're Big, You're One of Us Now, Peaceful Valley, IWHoT, Eggs) were off-key in the same matter.
I can't understand why the producers of the CD would do such a thing. Could it have been a simple recording / mastering error?
It seems to me that it was an error on whoever mastered the recordings to the CD. I think this because the version of "peaceful Valley" on the CD is EXACTLY the same as the version in the opening of LBT 2 (including Grandpa's voice over, "Littlefoot! Littlefoot! It's time to come home!" and the ambient sound effects, like it was torn right out of the original soundtrack of the film). I compared the CD version to the opening version of the DVD, and sure enough, the CD is pitched slightly higher.
This means that if you ever considered buying this CD for the purpose of learning to play the songs, Don't do that :p It'll be almost impossible, as the songs are all out of tune. The error is very subtle, but if you try to play an instrument to the music, you willl find some of the songs to be out of tune. The rest of the songs may *sound* in-tune, but compared to the original music on the DVDs / films, they are pitched higher.
I, for one, am disappointed in the lack of care taken to create this CD.
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can you send me the "If We Hold On Together" file. Not to brag, but I am good at sound analysis. My uncle checks audio distortion with iTunes and stuff like that.
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If you don't own the CD, a low quality version will have to do. If it won't, then don't worry, be like Manny and buy the CD like he did a few weeks ago! :lol:
I also actually prefer the higher-pitched version of "If We Hold on Together" found on the CD than I do the one found on the VHS sing-along tape. I like stuff like that. B)
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I wonder if there is a technical reason behind this, or if it's laziness on someone's part.
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Surprised I missed this topic when it first was posted....
Wouldn't you agree Ross' version is more of a lyrical ballad, and Curzon's version is more upbeat for the kids? That would explain the tempo change. I'm pretty sure its as simple as that.
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I"m not a techie, but would the change in tempo account for the changes that action9000 mentioned?
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I don't think any alterations between the Diana Ross version and the Anndi McAfee/Aria Curzon version should be considered because they may just be the result of "remixing." There's bound to be alterations like tempo changes.
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Anyone could easily change the pitch of a song. Could it have been done intentionally? Perhaps some sort of way so Universal couldn't sue them or something? Perhaps some sort of modified copyright protection? The new blue ray disks have copyright protection by making the sound a little out of pitch so you can find out if the copy is pirated or not (along with an array of encryption algorithms and sophisticated lock out mechanisms that I am unaware of as of yet. I don't have a blue ray player in my master computer yet.) :P:
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Anyone could easily change the pitch of a song. Could it have been done intentionally? Perhaps some sort of way so Universal couldn't sue them or something?
Umm... who was it that Universal could sue? :huh:
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Whoever made the CD. I don't think Universal is involved in this.
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Who else did the CD do you think? I looked at my CD, and I only saw copyrights from Universal Studios or Universal Music, which is just a "subdivision," anyway.
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Oh it is? There's no universal logo on the cover, which is usually where they put their logo on soundtracks....
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I see the logo(s) right on the back of the CD case.
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Okay, then it is Universals. It must just be a copyright thing. I wonder what Action used to rip the songs? Windows media player might not be able to handle it. He might have to rip it with some other sort of software like some sort of decrypting software. I don't know if they started doing this with CD's yet. I only know of blue rays.
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I used Windows Media Player to rip the tracks.
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Windows vista has some sort of music copyright thing on it. Perhaps that's the issue? I just can't believe that someone could change the pitch of the songs by accident.
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I didn't use a Vista computer to rip the tracks, and I don't think that action9000 even has a Vista computer at all.
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Making the songs a different pitch...What could be an advantage to it?
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Could it be a technician who did that since they didn't quite like the way the sounds sounded at first?
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Wouldn't you agree Ross' version is more of a lyrical ballad, and Curzon's version is more upbeat for the kids? That would explain the tempo change. I'm pretty sure its as simple as that.
I'll plagarize myself to make my point clear. No cd ripper would change the pitch.
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Quite true (unless it was the wackiest ripper I've ever seen! :blink: ).
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No cd ripper would change the pitch.
I'm not talking about the CD ripper changing the pitch, but rather an external program in windows vista or a form of encryption on the disk that prevents it from being ripped correctly.
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What does Vista have to do with any of this? :rolleyes: And, besides, what if this high-pitch thing occurs in a conventional CD player like a car player, then what? Is the computer still to blame? :rolleyes:
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Action obviously used rips. As he said, it was almost unrecognizable until he analyzed it. Leave it to microsoft. They've added tons of copyright protection to windows vista. I am not totally up to date on those methods as of yet, since I'm skipping vista and am currently awaiting the release of Microsofts next operaing system: Windows code name "Seven"
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But I didn't see anything in action9000's post to suggest he used Vista, which you seem sure he used (and, from what he's posted, I still doubt he even has a Vista computer in his possession).
Someone (possibly me) is going to have to try one of these CDs in a regular CD player and see if the problem persists.
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Action couldn't hear any difference until he analyzed it with his special equipment. I know he's not using vista. He's using XP 64. I was referring to you. Didn't you also rip the CD?
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I ripped the CD with Windows Media Player -- on Windows XP SP2.