The Gang of Five
The Land Before Time => General Land Before Time => Topic started by: Littlefoot1616 on February 27, 2005, 11:24:18 AM
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'Sup peeps!
I've not too long seen LBT 11 (via the web thanks to Threehorn) and I then when on to read Arvens section where he reviewed the movie. I'm not gonna get personal with the matter but I personally liked it. Quality was a bit iffy now and again but that's web connections for you! :rolleyes: In light of what was said and what has been said about the previous LBT sequels, I've been constantly wondering, particularly to those who DIDN'T like the recent flicks:
1. What makes you dislike them some much? - Was it going into the film with a negative view that just carried all the way through prior to not liking the one before it? Is it the plot? Animation? voices? What did it that switched you off?
2. If what you see is not doing for you, what DO you want to see?
As a LBT fan I'm kinda let down by what's been said recently. Of course everyone's entitled to their opinion but all I've heard so far is complaint and moaning and no reasons why. There must be something that kicks it off. Originality lost? Lack of story? Poor editting? As a fan, what elements do you think are needed to restore the faith and love we all had for the very first one? The channels open if you wish to speak into it...
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I too have just seen LBT 11 (so that just leaves me with 8 & 10), and overall, I personally think it was a good movie too.
It's kind of hard to try and compare it to the original, simply because the plots in both movies are too different. The original was about a group of young dinosaurs separated from their families and they have to overcome their predjudices to find the Great Valley. The LBT 11 sequel was made to teach how much damage is made when somebody tells a lie (and I've known to a degree of that damage through experience... :bang ), plus a little side moral about Cera trying to cope with change when Tria comes into the picture, like a child trying to deal with a stepparent.
The only things that I wasn't too happy with LBT 11 (and perhaps a few later films) was that they were trying to incorporate CG animation into it. The only other thing that turned my head away was the adults singing (but it's no too different from other movies :p )
That's pretty much all I had to say about this for now. Feel free to disagree.
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Hi!
I haven't seen LBT 11 yet, but I'm a notorious critic of LBT 10. I would be extremely disappointed by another movie of the same level.
Of course everyone's entitled to their opinion but all I've heard so far is complaint and moaning and no reasons why.
Quite frankly, I do take this statement somewhat awry. <_<
Not because of different opinions (I can't emphasize often enough that I appreciate opinions different from my own) but because it shows that my messages are obviously not being read. I have given page long accounts on WHY I dislike LBT 10 and parts of other recent LBT movies. I have given long lists of reasons for my disapproval of the movie. Being told that no reasons were given is thus pretty hard to swallow for me, the much the more as I never got any response attempting to disprove any of my points. I don't think that there is anything I would be more grateful for than anybodies successful attempt to make me think higher of LBT 10.
I have very frequently pointed out what I dissapprove about LBT 10 and some other recent LBT movies, but here we go again:
First and most important the "realism" of the stories. Of course "realism" is a term to be handled with care if we are talking of stories about talking dinosaurs, yet I'm talking of the realism refering to things that would have worked out in the original movie and the first few sequels and things that would not.
The explanation for Bron's absence in all the previous LBT sequels and Littlefoot's mother or grandparents never mentioning him is absolutely unsatisfactory! Not only is there a number of general discrepancies (which I pointed out in another thread about Bron) but also direct contradictions to earlier movies.
Another thing about the realism is what I'd like to call the "taming down of the sharpteeth". Just take a look at the sharptooth from the original movie or the sequels 2, 5, 6 or 9 and you'll know what I mean. Young dinosaur kids aren't supposed to crawl under a sharptooth's foot in order to trip it (like Shorty did). If a dinosaur kid did this not the sharptooth would trip, but the kid would be squeezed! Sharpteeth ought not to fall down immediately if a few pebbles are thrown in front of their feet or if a big snowball is rolled at them. They made things far too easy for themselves! Reading about sharpteeth being tickled in LBT 11 is to me the most disturbing thing I've yet read about LBT 11.
I'm in no mood to write down the countless other unrealistic elements about which I have written before. You can find them in other threads and respond to them if you see any good explanation for any of the discrepancies I presented there.
Next we have the animation. Of course others may think differently, but I consider it a very stupid effect to turn the sky, the landscape and (in LBT 10) even the characters red in case of danger. It really seems quite exaggerated and almost ridiculous to me, especially with the landscape and everything turning normal within an instant once the danger is over.
3D effects and photorealistic stuff can be fitted into LBT very well. They did a very good job for example with the photorealistic water in the 9th movie. However sometime they force the stuff into the movies no matter how good or bad it fits. In LBT 10 for example we have photorealistic tree branches and skies which really don't seem to fit at all to the rest of the normally drawn landscapes.
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To exceed the level of quality of the first movie.
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But is that all it is Malte?! Realism?! I know you're not one for fantasy but it's very tempting to say "It's a cartoon for pete's sake!" Very few movies are out there to be taken literally, especially cartoons! There is supposed to be a certain amount of SURrealism otherwise they should have shot it in real time rather than animating it. Also, why just #10?! One flick that's under par in your opinion and you can't look to it anymore! That's what I don't understand! I heard from a special guest director at my uni who came to speak to us about tv/film production and he said: "In order to be successful in the industry, you gotta make 10 crap movies/episodes before your first good one". Obviously this is a professional's quotation to put the idea of working in the industry into scope and there are exceptions. And yet again, my question was not answered. I just got a post full of whining about what's WRONG and not what you think should have been done instead. I never said I was attempting to changes people's views on any particular LBT movie they feel was not up to standard. Im not pinpointing this on Malte, but so far you've been my key example.
I'm a notorious critic of LBT 10. I would be extremely disappointed by another movie of the same level
What would you WANT to see that MAKES it the level you want it to be at?! I've read countless times the criticism of LBT 10 but that's where it was left. Rather than hunting for a problem...why not hunt for a solution?!
Please understand Malte that Im not having a dig at you personally so please dont take it that way. But I hate to see and hear (even in real life situations) people moaning just for the sake of it and when offered a solution or the chance to express what they feel can be done about it, they just turn their backs on it! If it's the realism that's a pain, what do you want to be done about it? Say WHY's it's a pain rather than WHERE is it. I'm still interested to hear other's thoughts on this...
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Hi!
It's not fantasy I'm oposing. Yet I think there is an important difference; one ought to draw a line where fantasy ends and indolence of the story tellers begin. For indolence it is if they don't bother at all to make their stories conform with the previous movies.
I think there is a tollerable amount of unrealistic story elements. In LBT 9 for example Petrie could have certainly crossed the landbreak by just flying a little higher. In movies like LBT 10, 8 and partly LBT 7 however they story tellers avoid problems by just creating a world in which a sharptooth will be defeated by a longneck kid crawling under its food. They also created an image of the world in LBT 1 which was just false. They avoided almost all the conflicts and problems that would have made a good story.
To me the land before time is not just a cartoon for Pete's sake, and because I care very much about LBT it makes me sick to see how they change it for the worse.
When I'm talking of LBT 10 in particular it is because I consider that one the worst of all. Like I said there are quite questionable elements in LBT 8 and 7 too. In LBT 8 they roll a snowball down a mountain and even though he is much closer to it Mr. Thicknose is able to step out of the way, while the sharptooth just stands there watching the snowball untill it hits him.
In LBT 7 it was the leaving of the rainbowfaces in particular that bothered me. I know that you are less demanding than I am concerning keeping non LBT like elements such as aliens or humans out of LBT.
As for your claim that I can't look at a movie anymore if there is one flick that is under par in my opinion, you will find that all the problems I have with LBT 10 makes quite long a list of flicks. You'll also find that I'm not rioting against LBT 7 and 8 even though there is more than one flick that is under par in my opinion. So I don't think that this reproach is really fustified.
If movie makers need to make crap movies in order to be successful later on I'd prefer them not to make crap LBT movies, and as Mr Grosvenor created some really good sequels already, I don't think that this is the reason for the decreasing quality of the sequels anyway.
As for how I'd like an LBT movie to be made the answer is quite simple and in a way it was given already. If all the negative points I listed about LBT 10 were avoided in a land before time sequel, I'm quite confident that it would be a pretty good one. Sometimes not even an elaborate storyline is necessary to make a good story. The plot of LBT 9 for example was actually quite simple and yet the movie itself was really good in my opinion.
If you've read my critics of LBT 10 countless times I as you say I find it a bit strange though that nevertheless you claimed that no reasons for my dislike of LBT 10 were given. And with the problems being addressed like that I really don't think that this is to be considered moaning for the sake of it. I did say WHY I have problems with the scenes I always criticize.
I'm going to quote some pessages of my earlier land before time critics and underline the parts where I made direct suggestions on how it could have been done better:
Some of the characters in a way act very different from the way one would expect them to act after seeing the previous nine movies. There are for example Littlefoot's grandparents, and the whole thing about the dream that makes all dinosaurs head for they don't know where. They didn't explain it long enough. From the other movies we know Littlefoot's grandparents as very careful characters (just think of any scene when there is talk about the Mysterious Beyond), yet in the movie their decision two leave the Great Valley (just two old longnecks and a kid) appears almost rashly. I'm sure these dreams were something important enough if we had been told a bit more about it. It would have been time for a "some things you see with your eyes others you see with your hard"-type of message. Maybe they could've even included something more than dreams by just making the legend Pat told a bit just a little more known.
Also when Littlefoot’s grandfather tells him that Bron is his Dad it appears almost tactless. Of course there is no use in tarrying around too much, but just telling somebody, who doesn't even know he has a Dad, in this straight from the shoulder way, that it is the very one in front of him doesn't seem to be very sensitive. Littlefoot’s grandparents didn't even try to get a word with Bron before telling Littlefoot about it.
And Cera, Ducky, Petrie and Spike too did act strange I think. The scene when Littlefoot is unsure about what to do, going with his Dad, or returning home the Great Valley, is the emotional climax of the movie. Cera's, Ducky's, Petrie's and Spike's behaviour sure is very considerate towards Littlefoot (making things not harder for him than they are) but it's much too quick much too rational. They are so close friends of Littlefoot that I would expect them to be shocked at first at the idea of him leaving. They didn't shed tears they hardly stopped smiling. They didn't make the slightest attempt to convince Littlefoot to stay with them. After all this the understanding that it is a choice Littlefoot has to make and that one mustn't try to influence him because of the own interests would have been more realistic. If I found a friend like Littlefoot, a friend with whom I have gone through many things (I suppose we would not exactly be running from sharpteeth together, but still there is enough in this world that can forge people together), if I found somebody so precious to me I sure would react more emotionally at the view to be separated again (emotionally mainly in personal grief).
I was not too fond of the solar eclipse because they made it somewhat unrealistic. They showed the moon as a black circle long before it even came in front of the sun and the colouring of the sky too appeared almost as if a solar eclipse the way it is is not spectacular enough. I experienced a solar eclipse in august 1999 and memorized my impressions. It was amazing. The eclipse could be felt before one saw it. The air became chilly. There was no sudden shadow falling whose edge one could see, but the light became twilight and finally darkness when the moon moved before the sun...
As for the animation they have the habit to tinge the sky red almost always when there is danger since LBT 5. I didn't like this, but it's not too bad. However, this habit had a "tragic" climax in LBT 10 that gave me a real shudder. Not only the sky, but also the landscape, my goodness, even the characters turned red! I really hated that! (I guess this is clear enough to be understood as a suggestion to keep this red tinging in case of danger out of the LBT movies)
Unlike most other people I do not like the new 3D animation very much, at least not all of it. There are elements created by the computer which fit very well to the hand-drawn characters or landscapes. The water in LBT 9 for example looked great. However, much of the photo realistic pictures to me looks almost as if it had been taken from a different movie and just "inserted" into LBT (the mossy tree-branch Littlefoot climbs up for example).
What probably upset me most was the way they showed past events. They didn't seem to mind what happened in LBT 1 at all! Where were Bron and Littlefoot's mother (whom they did not even bother to make similar to the way she looked in LBT 1?) in a lush green place! Are they implying that all the leafs died all of a sudden once Bron left? He didn't seem to have heard about the Great Valley ever before (otherwise he would have known that it was the purpose of his wife). And even if he did not know about the Great Valley before he left (which presupposes that Littlefoot's mother and his grandparents had very suddenly made up their mind to go there and not bother any longer about Bron) he sure could have heard about it elsewhere (LBT one quote of Littlefoot: "My mother said its were all the herds were going). The LAND before time has changed a lot since the first movie, and of course I see the necessity of revising the point that the Great Valley was the last lush and green place in the world (I don't think it would have been possible to write many good stories if they were always bound to the Valley), but meanwhile it has been almost totally de-enchanted. They really seem to forget how the LBT characters came to the Great Valley in the first place. People who try to make it a continuous story seem to be a dying out species... (Here too it is quite easy to conclude how I'd rather have it.)
Also the realism of the story was partly very poor. Shorty tripped a grownup sharptooth by crawling under its foot while it was walking backwards. Just remember the sharptooth in LBT one. What do you think would have happened if a longneck had crawled under its foot? That’s right! And that is why young longnecks should not deliberately crawl under a sharptooth's foot. And when the thing with the stones, I really don't think that any of the LBT characters is strong enough to kick or hurl a stone, large enough to do more than bothering a sharptooth, over such far a distance. And a sharptooth tripling about a few little stones thrown in front of his feet, really that must be either extremely smooth and slippery stones or an extremely clumsy sharptooth. The sharpteeth in LBT 10 were for my opinion almost reduced to a ridiculous entertainment for the young dinosaurs. Just compare these sharpteeth with the one in the original movie, or (if we don't want to look back that far) with the swimming sharptooth in LBT 9. When Bron fought one of the sharpteeth the sharpteeth bit him in one leg, but Bron didn't seem to receive any wound or anything. They could have made something really great and emotional of that scene (think about it, Littlefoot saw his mother being killed by sharptooth and now he sees his newly found Dad fighting with and being wounded by a sharptooth!) They could have really shown a bit more emotion from Littlefoot, but his reaction was nothing different from several similar scenes throughout the other sequels (in LBT 2 and 6 for example).
And generally we learned very, very little about Bron. I would have a hard time if I was given the task to write a characterization of him that consists of more than general phrases (he is brave, he is strong, he is nice... etc.). Of all the new characters in the movie Bron seems to be the most colourless one to me. (Again, stating the problem here makes the solution rather self-evident)
Looking at this I really think that it is unfair to claim that I wouldn't make any suggestions on how they should do it! This text certainly isn't mere whining!
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Ok, if I had a choice, I wouldn't even make a sequel because most every sequel to any film I've ever seen I've hated. The lone exception is Shrek 2 where I liked the sequel more than the first film. Why do I hate them? Because with films I feel that if you're going to tell a story, tell me something I haven't heard before. With sequels they continue on something that I have already seen.
Personally, I don't want to see any more LBT films; they can't make a sequel I will enjoy. Know why? These films are made for people that are 13 years my junior. Age is a big one. Indeed, I do love animation, but I'm into alot of the more dark/exotic animated films that you just can't watch and say "Ok, that was fun," without thinking about them or having some type of emotional feel. My last two films that I bought were Animal Farm (1954) and All Dogs Go to Heaven, and neither of these animated films are just something you can "enjoy". There are deeper meanings to both of these films, and that's what I like pondering over. An LBT film can never do that because they will miss their target audience by miles instead of inches.
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Ok, if I had a choice, I wouldn't even make a sequel because most every sequel to any film I've ever seen I've hated.
I do not agree with that. Much as I love the original movie I seriously doubt that the original movie by itself would have done to capture me as much as LBT as a whole did. In my opinion there are some really very good sequels, and I still hope that there will be more good sequels without elements such as those which I considered shortcomings of the sequels 7, 8 and 10.
I do agree that there could be a little more gloom, a little more stuff to think about in the LBT movies. Too much of it however doesn't suit LBT well either. There is a good deal of gloomy elements in the LBT story I'm writing right now and also in most of the stories I'm planing on.
Anyway, I definitely DON'T share your implied hatred of the sequels! I would seriously miss most of the sequels.
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I'm going to quote Jason since he says this all the time: to each his own. ;)
As for what you said about missing the sequels, that's only because there are sequels. If there were no LBT sequels, you wouldn't be missing anything, and your opinion would be much different if we were proposing they make a sequel rather than what would be an ideal sequel after what we've seen. ;)
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Of course I couldn't in fact miss anything without it ever existing. However, to name just one of the certain effects if the sequels hadn't ever been produced, I wouldn't know any of you! From my current situation point of view this would be really quite a miss, and pointing out that I wouldn't miss you or anything without knowing that you or it exists seems a bit like hairsplitting to me.
Of course I don't know what I would've won had I used the time differently I spend in the GOF, the forums, writing emails or my stories or whatever...
I guess it's pointless to dwell on that.
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...post removed...
I had second thoughts about it. -_-
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Of course I couldn't in fact miss anything without it ever existing
Gotta side with Malte on that one. How can you possibly have a liking for something that doesn't exist or is never heard of? The whole idea, from a business perspective, was to create a sequel to LBT because it was deemed profitable and it had scope to do well...and it has! The LBT saga is one of the most successful direct-to-video feature films and it's raked in tens of millions in net profit. From a fan-based perspective (from what I can gather from what I've read) it seems to be very hit-n-miss whether people like it or not. Obviously, different people see different elements to others and some can read deeper messages than others. As Arvens has quoted me from before...EACH TO THEIR OWN! At the end of the day, it's down to the individual to decide if they like or or lump it.
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From a fan-based perspective (from what I can gather from what I've read) it seems to be very hit-n-miss whether people like it or not. Obviously, different people see different elements to others and some can read deeper messages than others. As Arvens has quoted me from before...EACH TO THEIR OWN! At the end of the day, it's down to the individual to decide if they like or or lump it.
*nods* Even with longtime fans it's hit or miss. Moneywise, so long as people who live by them buy them, then they'll keep making LBT videos.
Most of the big dissenters (the ones that won't even pick up an LBT film sequel) say that its success is the reason they've gone too far....to them, the continuation means that the quality suffers the further they try to stretch the series. That's generally what I pick out every time I see another review starting with "Another one????"
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I don't see it that way... Obviously these kind of people (without stereotyping or pinpointing this on anyone) see something slightly unusual and they immediately turn their nose up at it and very few seem interested! From there, the only thing they do is then blast it for every square inch of it's entirity. This is what I personally can't stand! "Oh! It's another LBT...when's it gonna stop!?!" People are so ready to see something fail or be killed off rather than admire it for its a). continuity and/or B). success. Some of my most favourite videos and games I own I picked up without knowing a single detail and thought "Meh...I'll give it a shot" and I adore them! I've still got them and watch/play them today from over a decade ago! I've even had games I've sold off (there's a story to me selling them but I won't go into it here) forgotten about them for numerous years and had the exact same cartridge returned to my collection again when I found it in a second hand shop!
Getting back to LBT, I don't see any areas where plot/story/animation/foley/voices etc have faultered. There are ocassions where I pick up on possible errors (eg. the biggest culprit seems to be confusion on colour segments of characters. Like, when Littlefoot is asking Mo about wanting to go home and Mo nods, one of Mo's eye patches flickers from red to purple. Check it out if you didn't notice it) Despite these little errors, none of the LBT sequels put me off watching them nor does it hinder me from wanting to obtain the next available sequel. Far from it! I'm usually waiting outside a nearest video/DVD retailer before the store's even opened to grab my copy. The thought of renting it first has NEVER crossed my mind coz I just have so much faith in the saga that I know I WONT be disappointed. Even my least favourite sequels I watch. It seems to me that people (not so much fans of LBT) don't like the sound of another LBT movie because it IS a feature film! If it was a new episode to say a television cartoon series shown on kid's TV on Saturday morning that had been transplanted to video, no one would give a monkey's! (I had to be careful with my choice of words there coz I was going to be very blatent and loose-jawed but I kept control as always! ;) ) I'm sorry but why should people get to voice their opinions when they know nothing about it! To me, that's being prejudice and an unnecessary passing unfair judgement. :angry:
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I agree with you there about the unfair judgement... only because some lost the taste of land before time doesn't mean that they have to shame it for the hell of it because they had zero interest in it now. I on the other hand love watching it no matter what others say :D
-Threehorn
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Despite the assurance that the judgement wasn't pinpointed to anyone I still feel that I need to point out some facts to make sure that I'm not secretly seen in a wrong light.
I LOVE LBT and I DO want the series to continue! I'm certainly NOT somebody to turn my nose up on a series just because many sequels have been produced of it already. I AM quite willing to let myself be proven wrong in any negative estimations towards elements in LBT. The best example for this is probably my first reaction at the sight of Mo on the cover of LBT 9 ("Help! Pokemons invading LBT!") compared to my reaction after seeing the movie (I consider LBT 9 the best of the recent sequels). Some people here will know especially well that I'm very willing to deal with stuff I'm prejudiced about trying to form an objective opinion about it.
Perhaps it is appropriate to quote some passages of my original critizism of LBT 10 (to be found in the network54 forum and the old GOF) which I didn't quote before thinking that these passages got nothing to do with the topic:
...Well, I'm always more critical about a movie the first time I watch it than I am the next times (it maybe that once the exaggerated expectations I often have, are worn of I'm in a kinder mood), but still I’m very disappointed about the movie. To me it looks like some good ideas poorly realized...
Of course I don't consider the whole movie rubbish (which you may think may be my opinion after all this), there are very good ideas, and I liked the songs “Best of Friends” and “Adventuring”; but still after watching it the first time I see it mainly as a missed chance. The plot of LBT 10 could have made it the most emotional of all the sequels; but at least for my opinion it was not.
I certainly have NOT lost interest in the land before time (if I had I wouldn't continue spending a significant percentage of my lifetime in LBT forums, writing LBT stories or gathering/creating fanart for the LBT gallery)! I think that some of the producers of LBT may have lost touch with what I may call the "gist" or the "spirit" of the earlier LBT movies. Criticizing this in an argument based manner (who has ever heard me complaining without saying WHAT I'm complaining about) is not to be considered mere slandering or "unfair judgement".
I don't mean to quarrel. But in my defense I have to say that I really can't help thinking that I showed far more readiness to deal with statements in favor of LBT 10 or elements I disapproved of, than anyone of an oppinion different of my own showed readiness to deal with the critical points of LBT 10 I pointed out.
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I guess I'm a little fidgety these days, so I took some stuff too personally feeling addressed for my critizism of LBT 10 in particular. I beg your pardon if I overreacted. :(
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OK...there seems to be a bit of confusion over what I meant here....The whole thing about me talking about people being prejudice is from a non-LBT fan's POV. I.e Someone who has no knowledge or very little knowledge of LBT and just coz they see a new sequel come up, they immediately say "It's crap coz it's another one!" My statement(s) were not aimed at anyone here or any other LBT fans. Their criticisms I accept becoz they actually know more about it and the LBT world then just looking at the front cover or just hearing about any sequel is on the way and blasting it before it's even released. Hope that clears that little misunderstanding up!
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No harm done Malte! It's all "cushdey" all everyone in my uni area says... ;)
Cant stand that flipping word! :angry:
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I was aware from the beginning what you meant Jason. Same as you Malte, so I'm not mad at anyone of course. There are those out there that do say that they've gone too far and are just flogging a dead horse. There are some sequels that I would agree with that, but the difference is I actually watched the film and made that judgment. ;)
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I think there should be an official sequel where Littlefoot is a father and has kids of his own. That way, they can still make sequels to the first movie where they are still kids.
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Maybe, maybe not, it up to the directors to choice. But I wonder what it would be like seeing the gang as adults
-Threehorn
(btw we reached past 10,000 posts in total today)
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"But I wonder what it would be like seeing the gang as adults."
Better yet, no sequels not done by Don Bluth at all. As much as I do like the sequels, I do widh that they were al more like the original. Is that asking too much?
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No idea
I think his retired.
-Threehorn
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No idea
I think his retired.
-Threehorn
He is currently working on a Dragon's Lair movie.
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Oh?
Didn't know
-Threehorn
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Much as I'd appreciate a land before time movie made by Don Bluth I'm afraid this is a vain hope. For all I read Mr. Bluth does not hold only fond memories to LBT. In fact he did have some arguments with Steven Spielberg about it. I even read members of Don Bluth's staff writing with a certain disdain about the sequels of LBT on Don Bluth's webpage. Really, I don't believe that Don Bluth is ever going to create another LBT movie on the basis provided by the sequels released so far.
I think some of us are clinging to a false hope about this much as I regret seeing it that way :(
As for Littlefoot and the others growing up, it will be a neverending merry go round among those who like the idea and those who don't (which includes me) :lol
No reason to argue about it as both views have indisputable points in their favor and in the last instance it is a matter of taste.
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Gotta double on those notions there Malte. As sad as it may seem, Don Bluth and co. do not seem to be the types for creating sequels. I think the closest thing to a sequel Bluth did was the Bartok the Magnificent which was a spin-off of Anastacia. It would be nice to see another LBT sequel from the main man himself but I dont think we will be...I'm not even sure if the franchise is still in his possession. He might have sold it off to Universal and that's why they had Smith and Grosvenor working on them instead. Also, with the whole turning into adults thing, I am very anti that idea. It's evident that the gang have grown up but I dont like the same tramline idea of having kid character turning into adults over time. So many films do it and I'm glad LBT hasnt followed the trend.
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Glad to see it as well. maybe them being in the Great Valley a safery place don't need a quick growth like the ones outside. But also they have grown up a little bit compained to hatchlings. to the gang the hatchings only go knee height of Cera, Littlefoot and Spike so there is a sign that they are bigger and older by a good amount of years.
don't know how many but it don't really matter it still great to see the gang as they are and learning so much on their advanagers.
-Threehorn
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I'm not even sure if the franchise is still in his possession. He might have sold it off to Universal and that's why they had Smith and Grosvenor working on them instead.
Don Bluth indeed doesn't possess the franchise. Almost all land before time products bear the inscription:
The land before time and related characters
are trademarks and copyrights of Universal
Studios and U-Drive Productions, Inc.
Licensed by Universal Studios Licensing LLLP.
All Rights Reserved.
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About realism in LBT:
If "sharpteeth" aren't allowed into the Great Valley, wouldn't the local ecosystem suffer? In real ecosystems, carnivores ensure that herbivores don't eat too much of the plant life. I wouldn't be surprised if the Valley foliage gets eaten up in a year or two, causing the herbivores to either starve to death or look elsewhere for food (now THAT would make a good sequel: The Land Before Time XIII: Search for a New Home)
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It appears that the permanent population of the Great Valley is relatively small while there are herds visiting the valley to just stay a few days time and again (Ali's herd in LBT 4, the farwalkers in LBT 7, the spiketails in LBT 8). Those herds seem to have a sense for when to move on not to eat away what those need who permanently live in the Great Valley. This is most obvious in case of the LBT 8 spiketails.
I don't really think that it would be a good idea to let them search for a new home to stay forever, for except for the "staying forever" matter this is basically what they did in LBT 5 and LBT 8 already. The different ways of life, of migrating herds and "valley dwellers" though could be an interesting element in a story. A story perhaps involving Ali's herd.
One thing that seems to be missing in the ecosystem of the Great Valley are scavengers. They too could make an interesting element in a story (how do the others deal with them?).
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To start, I'd make it FAR less kiddy. Something that would appeal to us as teens and young adults. I'd have the gang A LITTLE BIT older (say teens or preteens), have some promonant characters return (Pterano (duh), Dinah and Dana (I'd like to see them again), others that don't make a show in the other sequels and series), and make it REALLY intense. Plus, the fliers would be eating fish :DD
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I''d like it if they write good stories that made sense. It is possible to write for multiple age levels so young kids enjoy things as well as older kids, teens and adults. That would be nice nice I think, with some of the more serious storylines from the earlier sequels. Though every one of the sequels doesn't need to be like that.
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More action, more intricate subplots, and more characters from previous sequels would be cool.
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To start, I'd make it FAR less kiddy. Something that would appeal to us as teens and young adults. I'd have the gang A LITTLE BIT older (say teens or preteens), have some promonant characters return (Pterano (duh), Dinah and Dana (I'd like to see them again), others that don't make a show in the other sequels and series), and make it REALLY intense. Plus, the fliers would be eating fish.
Hmm. Sounds similar
My wish list:- Darker themes
- More action
- Less kiddy
- (Malte's gonna have a seizure about this...) More violence (Stop at PG-13, please)
- Pterano returning
- NO singing
- MORE super sharpteeth
- Make the gang the equivalent of 12-16 years old
- More intricate plot
- More high tension moments
My ultimate wish would be movie versions of these Land Before Time fan fics: Out of the Shadows (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2550278/1/Out_of_the_Shadows), Land Before Time: Twilight Valley (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/4044080/1/Land_Before_Time_Twilight_Valley), Star Wars: The Land Before Time: A Jedi's Destiny (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3007925/1/Star_Wars_The_Land_Before_Time_A_Jedis_Destiny), Land Before Time: War of the Worlds (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2151472/1/Land_Before_Time_War_of_the_Worlds), Time Gate X (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2663682/1/Time_Gate_X), Land Before Time: The Mysterious World (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2360239/1/Land_Before_Time_The_Mysterious_World)
The authors are, in order: Dark Hououmon, Serris, jedi472, Falcon88 (not member of this forum), Cyber Lizard, Threehorn
Ok, ok, I know that each fan fic I listed has a rating over "G" (2 are rated "R" and 3 are rated "PG-13" and only 1 is rated "PG") and the chance of a dark, gritty, violent, SF influenced and/or post-apocolyptic Land Before Time movie coming out is almost nonexistant.
*Powers up flame shield due to call for increased violence in LBT*
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I'd like to see one or two of my fanfics made into movies. one I have posted on fanfiction.net already but it only has 1 chapter u so far.
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I'd like to see my second fanfic (Which is still in the works) made into a movie. it will have Darker themes,More action,Less kiddy,More violence (Stop at PG-13, please)Make the gang the equivalent of 12-16 years old,More intricate plot,More high tension moments
these are the themes my next fanfic will have. and like most of the fanfic in the list it will have humans!
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Oh, no way hose! Absolutely no killing off any of the children, for Pete's sake :(! Like Malte, I will have a seizure if they ever come out with an LBT project beyond a PG rating. I mean, yeah, I like dark themes but not to extent of the death of any of the beloved children. If I had the opportunity to improve future LBT projects, I'd go back to basics: have the songs be more meaningful and less childish, bring back the suspense of the first four movies(I mention sequel four due to the scenes of Cera being washed down the river and Ducky getting her lights knocked out), and make the dilemmas the children face more intense and moving. I disagree with bloodshed, as the murder of Littlefoot's mother was more than I could stomach for an animated film :x. That's my two cents on what I would like to see change in the LBT franchise :yes.
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Oh, no way hose! Absolutely no killing off any of the children, for Pete's sake :(! Like Malte, I will have a seizure if they ever come out with an LBT project beyond a PG rating. I mean, yeah, I like dark themes but not to extent of the death of any of the beloved children. If I had the opportunity to improve future LBT projects, I'd go back to basics: have the songs be more meaningful and less childish, bring back the suspense of the first four movies(I mention sequel four due to the scenes of Cera being washed down the river and Ducky getting her lights knocked out), and make the dilemmas the children face more intense and moving. I disagree with bloodshed, as the murder of Littlefoot's mother was more than I could stomach for an animated film :x. That's my two cents on what I would like to see change in the LBT franchise :yes.
Yeah I agree about that with the gang. my second will defentily have moments of suspense.
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(Malte's gonna have a seizure about this...) More violence (Stop at PG-13, please)
Am I? :lol
Not really, in so far as there actually has been some violence in LBT already, especially in the original movie, but it may also escape the notice of most of us that the Pterano flashback of LBT 7 included what may have been the worst "mass killing" of dinosaurs throughout the entire series (with the possible exception of the great earthquake in the first movie). I don't think it is violence in general which I can't stand in LBT, but the kind of violence that would just not be committed by LBT dinosaurs.
They are no humans and I suppose they couldn't even understand if we tried to explain "war" to them. Even the sharpteeth are not launching some "campaign against leafeaters" but just follow the law of nature. So long they are not threatened, or have to eat there are not many causes which I think would get a dinosaur into a fight for life or death (I'm not including any brawls characters like Hyp might start in this). There are possibilities for larger conflict in LBT (especially with regard to the racism which has often been displayed) but such possibilities would have to be explained in a story. If I see LBT dinosaurs fighting I don't want to have them fight for the effect but I want to know why they fight and that must be a good explanation. Ideas about sharpteeth armies invading the Great Valley etc. really just don't make any sense.
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But they are a lot of fun to read.
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Stories about sharpteeth invasions you mean?
They may be, but would we also enjoy watching a movie that tears up the land before time (and the principles it is based on) like that?
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Holy cow, no. The reason fanfiction is so awesome is cause you can do things that the canonical sources could never ever ever do. Killing off half the main characters Gettysburg-style would be one of those.
When it comes to fanfiction, especially war-fiction, I stick to one character (usually Ducky) and pray that they make it through. But peaceful crossovers are more my style.
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Gettysburg style... totally off topic, but do you happen to be interested in history? :D
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How did you guess?
The Civil War used to be a big intrest of mine several years ago, until I read Howard Zinn, and decided that war really wasn't my thing any more. Nowadays I'm more interested in politics and public protest, a.k.a the 70s.
Do you have a favorite area of history? For a specific country, maybe?
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Yes, my focus on historical studies is that of English speaking countries and the United States in particular (I'm interested in just about any chapter of history though). My final university exam to be written in the upcoming semester will probably be about a topic related to the US Civil War. Studying history, including military history, and being a convinced pacifist don't necessary exclude each other. In the best case the studying of conflict in human history may also contribute to avoiding the repetition of the mistakes of the past and it may also help to guard against falsified pictures of history (e.g. the very common glorification or euphemism of events).
The 1970s are a particularly interesting chapter of US history and maybe especially in the light of current events in the US and the US "involvement" abroad.
I don't want to go too far off topic here as this is an LBT thread, but if ever you feel like talking about any historical topic I'm sure we would both very much enjoy such a discussion (and anyone else interested in history is of course hearty invited to join us or start such a thread) :yes
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If I were to make an LBT movie, I would make sure to add NO MORE ADDITIONAL PROTAGONISTS. At least for one of the movies. I mean, every movie there's some new guy that doesn't really do much for the story or develop the existing characters. Then at the end we never see them again. It's sorta weird. In addition, I would make sure to have a reason for the song that's sung. Three songs a movie is standard now so any less is unacceptable to the writers I guess. I don't think that should be the case. If it doesn't need three songs, don't give it three songs. What's wrong with one or two or four if the situation calls for that many? I'm not saying to cut out the songs or to turn LBT into a musical, but have some sort of quality control.
Next, don't do something stupid like you did in LBT 13. Those yellow bellies don't even look remotely like a bush. What I really hate is the fact that they show the yellow bellies in the dirt and they look like big a$$es sticking up, but when they show them again they look like bushes! Nada! Even though kids are watching the movies, they're not retarded. Keep things realistic.
I'd develop Spike's character more. He really doesn't play a big role, and I don't like that. Character development can use some improvement. Petrie and Ducky are both small so they should develop a closer relationship. Ducky and Spike are already pretty close, but that's because they live together. Littlefoot and Cera should develop a closer relationship as well. Since they're the largest of the gang and can both talk, they should have a better relationship than they do. Spike needs to have Tippy back. He needs influence from other Spiketails.
Ali should be brought back the right way. Don't make her stupid and helpless like you did in the TV series.
Other than those things, I can't really think of anything else.
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I will start on my second fanfic when my current one is done.
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Well, first of all, I'm flattered that someone believes my story is of a high enough caliber to be made into a movie, and the overall spectrum of ideas in this thread is nothing short of astounding.
On the subject of sharptooth "armies" in LBT fics, I believe that they are not armies at all, and are more like a locust swarm. They invade the Valley only for food, and quickly move on once finished. Describing them as armies simply because they come together to feed is hardly justified, especially considering they have little or no hierarchy.
As for the songs, I'd actually prefer songs written by notable artists to be played in a music video-like fashion, if only because of the degrading quality of the songs in the latest sequels.
I agree with landbeforetimelover on the "no more protagonists" issue. As most of my readers can tell you, the number of protagonists in my fic has sharply jumped, from the original gang of five to the current number of fourteen. With such a high number comes the increasing difficulty of focusing on individuals, and, while good action can sometimes make up for this, some characters do end up getting less attention.
My perfect LBT movie will probably never see production, and for now exists only as my fanfiction. With A Jedi's Destiny, I sought to give LBT a good heathy dose of action, political intrigue, and massive scale that only Star Wars could provide, while at the same time being able to put new and old characters from both universes(as well as my OC), into a host of new challenges and situations that, at least in the alternate universe my story inhabits, will change the galaxy forever.
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On the subject of sharptooth "armies" in LBT fics, I believe that they are not armies at all, and are more like a locust swarm. They invade the Valley only for food, and quickly move on once finished. Describing them as armies simply because they come together to feed is hardly justified, especially considering they have little or no hierarchy.
I have to disagree:
Twilight Valley and War of the Worlds and even Out of the Shadows are where you would be wrong, these fan fictions have TRUE sharpteeth armies. In fact if I recall, Out of the Shadows makes a reference to General Chomper (Yes, it's the same Chomper).
And yes, stories about Sharpteeth invasions are quite fun to read... I treat them the same way I would treat Tom Clancy.
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I dislike the fact it is little too unreal with the concept that they are all happy in the valley and none of the flat teeth worry about migrating herds attracting predators. Of course, it would be understandable if Redclaw chase them away or fought them. Certainly they could have hidden in the valley to wait out one.
I want to see when all the dinos become adults especially little chomper. Will he still be cute? Will he save Mister Threehorns from being eaten or replaced as the lead of threehorns? Will Chomper eat his rival or help Cera take over the valley or does he claim the valley as his own? Those caves he lives in are great to sniff and spied out the valley for prey. :wow
Maybe the gang will find a wish stone that makes their wishes come true or brings their dreams or nightmares alive. Imagine Redclaw in the valley at the same time a violent thunderstorm is going on, a volcano erupts and a earth shake. Imagine a chomper fighting him. :DD Or maybe Chomper meets a baby t-rex girl and starts to play fight king of the hill or starts fighting over a bone,valley or the flat teeth in the valley or Tricia. What if Tricia wants to play with them?
I would probably like to see Mister Three horns telling Tricia three horns should only play with three horns when he finds out she wants to play with that baby sharptooth and chomper agrees saying only sharpteeth play with other sharpteeth, you might get hurt. :nyah
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I like that invasion of sharpteeth armies.Boy, either the flood has come and they are fleeing from it or they are so hungry, they must invade the valley. :rolleyes: Of course knowing the flatteeth and Mister Threehorns, it would probably be a rumor or wild story only to scared them.
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A single large sharptooth is quite capable of hunting down leafeaters of comparable or even larger size. Unlike in case of the smaller raptors which require less food it would not be sensible for large sharpteeth to team up. It would require more mouths to be stuffed and therefore more prey to be brought down within a limited region, which before long would clear the region of any food and force the sharpteeth to move on. A single sharptooth or a very small group of sharpteeth might do for a very long time (perhaps even forever) in the same region. An "army" of sharpteeth is more likely to fall victim to starvation than sharpteeth which are more spread out.
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What about Allosaurus? It was theorized that they may have hunted in packs. (Though it's only a theory.)
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What would be interesting is for Littlefoot to actually spend a season with his father; to just give migratory life a try, with the promise that he would return to the great valley when the season was over... On the migratory path, he would probably see amazing stuff, blah blah blah, cue song sequence with montage, etc... but he would also be exposed to some uncomfortable realities of living in a migratory herd of sufficient size. Now, when he was young, Littlefoot WAS migrating to the great valley, but he wasn't so much with a herd as he was with his family... Bron's herd would be different. One can see an interesting story involving herd politics and the measures Bron has to take to lead and control the herd. What would be interesting as well would be if Bron had to fight another sauropod for leadership of the herd, and then have to explain to Littlefoot about exactly why he had to fight to maintain his leadership... something along these lines:
(Fight between Bron and rival ends in victory for Bron after fight sequence)
Bron: (some blood is visible going down his mouth where he was hit) *Pant, pant* (catches his breath after the battle)
Littlefoot: Dad! What happened! Was there a sharptooth attack! Why is that other longneck lying on the ground?! (stunned, not badly hurt and definitely not dead.)
Bron: I fought him, Littlefoot. He was... trying to... take something... Littlefoot. Something that I have and that I will one day give to you...
Littlefoot: (confused)... What could you possibly have that he would want? Were you fighting him over some food?
Bron:...(pause)... Littlefoot? Do you know why I am the leader of my herd?
Littlefoot: Is it because you can see things they can't? (shadows of Pterano)
Bron: ...No. I'm not smarter than most longnecks, and I'm not chosen by anyone to lead...
Littlefoot: So, what are you saying?
Bron: I sort of... became leader of my herd because I was simply able to protect everyone. I was the biggest, and the strongest... and as I have just proven to this member of my herd, I am still the strongest.
Littlefoot: ... But... don't they... love you... as their...? (Littlefoot mistakenly thought that others in the herd treated Bron like Littlefoot treats Bron)
Bron: I am respected by all, loved by some (more on this later), and feared by a couple of others... they need me as their leader, Littlefoot, but not all of them like me all of the time... some of them think that they can do things better than I can... Some of them want to prove it by force... I can't let that happen...
Littlefoot: But... what about... talking out your problems? In the Great Valley, the grown-ups meet in a circle to discuss things.
Bron: I know that, Littlefoot, but the Great Valley isn't here. Out here, people are less patient, and far hungrier... they don't want to talk or listen... and I have to do what I need to in order to stay a leader...
Littlefoot: I don't think I like that very much...
Bron: It's what we do out here...
Another scene could be too tricky/controversial to put into a children's movie. In the wild, Bron might be considered an alpha male. In some animal groupings today, the alpha males are the only ones who mate, or at the very least, get the "first pick" of females. While it is unknown whether such behavior was present in any dinosaurs, it is not unreasonable to assume this could happen. Now, showing something like polygamy is not exactly... kosher... to show in an American animated movie, but we might see the side-effects of it. Tippy's herd, for instance, shows him with his mother but no father. Since the stegosauruses lived in herds, it isn't unthinkable that the alpha male who led it (Tippy's herd was led by a male, after all), might be the father of at least some of the children in the herd (or child, as we only see Tippy.)
Showing Bron in that capacity would be rather tricky... but it would be both relevant to nature and definitely interesting... to see how it would be handled.
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I wanna see the Land of Mists again :exactly