The Gang of Five
Beyond the Mysterious Beyond => Hobbies and Recreation => Gamers Zone => Topic started by: pokeplayer984 on March 11, 2012, 11:02:41 AM
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http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/121/1217257p1.html (http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/121/1217257p1.html)
Sorry Microsoft, but if this is what you are planning to do, consider me NOT being a customer for your next model. It's my choice to buy something used and you have no right trying to stop me. (Not to mention punishing me for it.)
I know why you are doing this, but this is NOT the way to go about fixing the problem. There's better solutions.
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Yes, like making games that people DON'T want to trade in after playing them. They should try making the value of games longer, so less copies will be sold back. You know, add things like multiplayer, single player that's built in such a way that you want to play it again, ect.
I firmly believe people should be able to sell theri games in they want to. I mean, they own it. I know the corporation DON'T want you to actually own it, and want to tell you what you can do with it, but that's just a bunch of cow cookies!
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wow, that's stupid.
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I know if I was someone who had and played games on the x-box this would make me decide not to get one. I wonder if other consoles will do something similar.
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I'd be suprised if this turns out to be true. Wouldn't Microsoft know how much money they could lose by doing this?
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I'd rather read a an article confirming it's true than one that's talking about it as a rumor. Otherwise, nothing to discuss. It's a rumor.
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This is a dumb idea.
I save a lot of money by buying used games. And besides, once you buy a game, the disc or whatever is out of the company's hands.
I think that some gaming companies want to exercise too much control over their games. I mean, one time use install keys?
I have had to reinstall some games at least three times because of assorted hardware failures. If these one time use install keys become popular, I will not be pleased. Really, why should I buy another copy of a game just because my computer broke?
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Jimquisition made a video about used games. I think he makes some good points.
Used Games Have A Right To Exist (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/4720-Used-Games-Have-A-Right-To-Exist)
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Meh. I guess I won't be buying as many games as I use to. <_<
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Well then, I guess I won't be buying an Xbox and if the other corporations decide to pull the same shit, I guess I won't game anymore except on PC. Screw 'em.
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What would happen if car companies took steps to make used cars illegal? What if bookstores took steps to make selling used books illegal?
The right to re-sell property that you no longer want is a constitutional right in my mind.
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http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive...used-games.aspx (http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2012/02/06/volition-developer-dreams-of-a-future-without-used-games.aspx)
This should shed more light. It's a developer related issue. Not all developers, but some. Basically, they make no profit off of used games and it hurts them financially. While I agree, getting rid of the used game market is not the answer. A console that implements a feature that refuses to play used games will probably get a lot of love from developers. Of course, if no one buys the console. it doesn't matter. MS would be moronic to do that, especially after the success of the 360.
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http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive...used-games.aspx (http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2012/02/06/volition-developer-dreams-of-a-future-without-used-games.aspx)
This should shed more light. It's a developer related issue. Not all developers, but some. Basically, they make no profit off of used games and it hurts them financially.
I don't really agree. Used games do not hurt the developers financially.
What people who side with gaming companies on the "problems of used games" seem to forget is this: a used game had to have been sold new at one time. To put that into perspective, think about it this way.
Let's say a gaming company sells a game for about $60 for a new copy. Let's say a game store, like Gamestop, sells used ones for around $20. Let's say that a Gamestop store sells around a thousand copies of that used game in a single year. Multiply $60 by a thousand and you get $60,000. And it's even more if you include tax. That is the profit the gaming company had already made selling the game.
But there are more Gamestops around, so let's up the anty. Let's say in a year, a million used copies are sold, which means a million games previously bought new. That adds up to around $60 million (again more if you include tax) already made on that game.
And the numbers just keep adding up.
So you cannot tell me that used games hurt them financially. As far as I can tell, they don't. And what if someone buys a game they don't like? If they can't sell it or return it, what are they supposed to do? Just let it sit there collecting dust? Throw it out? Is it really smarter to do that than to give it to someone else who would enjoy it?
And also, gaming industries are the ones who drive people to buy used games anyway. Let's compare DVDs and video games.
When you go into a store for a DVD, you can expect them to be around $20. That's usually what new ones are sold at. Special edition ones are a little pricier, at most I think it's $30. It's very easy for someone to buy a new movie because they are cheap and affordable. It is easy for someone to buy a new movie rather than a used one.
But go into a store to buy a game and it's a whole other ballpark. A new game's price is, on average, $60. That's the price I normally see. Maybe $50, sometimes as high as $70. Not everyone carries around this much money or can afford it. Some games are cheaper in the store, but they're usually games like Bejeweled.
In that case, used games are crucial in order to get a wider audience. Used games are the only resort some people have to owning a game that they like. It makes sense. Think about it, when you charge so much for a game, you should expect people to find cheaper ways of getting it.
I know it can be harder to make a game, but I seriously cannot see any justification in selling games for around $60. That seems a bit much to me, and it alienates gamers and turns away potential customers, even more so than new DVDs do. Not everyone can buy new DVDs, but I think it's safe to say that there are more poorer people who can buy a new DVD than they can a new game.
What game developers would need to do if they want to increase profit is to either make new games more worthwhile to play without alienating people who buy used games or treating them like criminals, or they should lower their price of new games to around $30 at least. Reducing the price would result in more profit because more people can buy it.
To provide an example, let's say in a month, a store sells around 200 new games, each costing around $60. That's $12,000 profit for game developers in that month. Let's say the price of new games gets reduced, and say that the price of new games becomes $30, as suggested above. A lower price means a wider audience; more people can afford it. So let's say in a month, the number of new games the store sells increases to 600 because of the new lower price. That $12,000 gets upped to $18,000 in a month. That's an extra $6,000 in the pockets of developers.
Used games don't cause nearly as much harm as people tend to think. And if gaming companies are suffering from it, somehow, then they are more to blame than the used games because they alienate people from buying new games with high prices. If they want to turn the tides without causing an uproar from their customers, I feel the best solution is decreasing the price of new games so that more people can buy them. Or if they don't want to do that, then make the new games more worthwhile without treating used games like they're pure evil.
I apologize if I offended anyone.
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A loss is a loss no matter how small the amount.
However, refusing used games is not a smart way to cover them.
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A loss is a loss no matter how small the amount.
However, refusing used games is not a smart way to cover them.
But that shouldn't matter.
The problem is EVERY other industry has to deal with used products, but they seem just fine with it. From appliences, to vehicles, to movies, books, comics, ect. They all have people reselling their old things and buying new (or newer) things. The orignal creators/manufactores get none of that money, but they don't try to force people to buy new. Yes, they use marketing to try to convinse people to buy their stuff new, but they never made it impossible for the second/third/whatever owners to use what they just bought. Why does the video game industry feel so entitled to forcing people to buy their products new? I'd really love to know that.
EDIT: Fixed some stuff. (Aww, come on! I just woke up. :lol )
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You know, that is a good point, Vonboy. I never hear of any strong agenda against used computers, used couches, used refrigerators, used baseball bats, used gloves, etc. So why is it that we're only seeing this "anti-used" mindset from the gaming industry? Do they really think that they are somehow superior to everyone else and deserve even more money?
I'm not saying they don't work hard. I'm sure they do. But so do people who make those things I just mentioned, and others. Yet they aren't so adamant about stopping the sale of used items. It seems largely just the gaming company that's doing it.
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Why does the video game industry feel so entitled to forcing people to buy their products new?
So why is it that we're only seeing this "anti-used" mindset from the gaming industry? Do they really think that they are somehow superior to everyone else and deserve even more money?
Very good questions that only the gaming industry could answer. I'm sure they wouldn't be taking the risk if it was just greed. Perhaps there's trouble within the gaming industry they aren't sharing, which, if there is, they should just say so us gamers can have a better understanding of why they try and push this. It's unlikely, but possible.
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^Oh don't worry. I'm sure they'll make up some sort of bullshit excuse as to why they have to be so greedy but in the end it's just a narcissist trying to get more than he deserves. Nothing more, nothing less.
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I think it might have to do with Gamestop and how they've made it a business to buy and sell used games, but that's probably stretching it. I don't have much of an answer myself, sadly.
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Haven't thought of that. What if Gamestop flat out refuses to sell next box games in protest? Microsoft would lose a lot of bisness.
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I think it might have to do with Gamestop and how they've made it a business to buy and sell used games, but that's probably stretching it. I don't have much of an answer myself, sadly.
Gamestop doesn't have much choice. They can only make good profit on selling used games because of how expensive the new ones are. This doesn't mean they can't sell new games. It just means that used games are where most of their profit seems to come from because there's nowhere else they can get it. How can they make any kind of profit and stand on their own two feet if the new games are just too expensive for the average user to buy? Gamestop seems to rely more on used game because of this. If gaming companies made the games cheaper, this wouldn't be as big of an issue.
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Looks like Microsoft isn't the only one with the "Used Games Ban" Technology Rumor going on. Sony also has the rumor of no used games for their next model. On top of that, Backwards Compatibility Ban as well.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/...ng-in-Late-2013 (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/116541-Rumor-Next-PlayStation-Coming-in-Late-2013)
*sighs* If all of this turns out to be true, looks like I'm a strict Nintendo fan for the next generation. I won't miss Sony and Microsoft at all in the gaming area. :)
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And what if Nintendo jumps in the same boat?
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^Give up on consoles completely? If something becomes too expensive for you, then you will give up on it eventually, either willingly or because you're broke.
The console makers are trying their luck apparently. If it the iniative to ban used games doesn't meet much opposition, they will make extra money. If it does meet opposition, at least they will find out how far they can go.
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I still hope this used game ban is a rumor...
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And what if Nintendo jumps in the same boat?
Looks like Nintendo won't be banning used games. http://wiiudaily.com/2012/06/nintendo-wont...ed-games-wii-u/ (http://wiiudaily.com/2012/06/nintendo-wont-ban-used-games-wii-u/)
I also disagree with banning used games. If the rumors are true then i'll will be only sticking with Nintendo.
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You know, I hope they all ban used games. That would make the computer gaming industry EXPLODE. You can't ban anything on a computer. No matter what they do to try and stop you, there's always a way around it. I already build a ton of custom computers so people can pirate movies and stuff. If people can't buy used games anymore, they'll just pirate 'em. They're too fucking expensive, that's the problem! I hope if these corporations do ban used games their sales tank and they're forced to either abandon the gaming industry or make used games available again.
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I'm not surprised that Nintendo chose to NOT take the Used Game Ban route. They've been in the gaming industry for more than 25 years now. They know people have played used games since Atari. They know it's impossible to stop people from getting used games, so why bother?
25 years? Yeah, they must be doing SOMETHING right. ;)