The Gang of Five
The Land Before Time => LBT Fanfiction => Topic started by: novaflare on March 14, 2007, 08:44:14 PM
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Well heres what i was thinking as we all know getting a screen capture of a front on full face shot of a char in any film animated or live action is next to imposible. Normally in a project of this type id just go buy the most accurate toy i could fine preferably plastic action figure like. Then id just take mesurements etc. But sense no toys exist yet well that option is out. I can not draw at all. Any how what id need is a few views (sketches includeing the various circles etc that many people use when makeing such a char intact) Im starting with the head and face. so full frontal veiw flat and lever top down view back view left or right side view strait up under chin view would be a bonus but not needed.
Any of you intrested just reply here got this topic on watched list. Ill also be posting progress renders as i create him as im sure somehere will be intrested in how it all starts with a 3d model. So youll get to see all my mistakes in their full glory as i play with diffrent ideas :)
As chomper will be my first adventure in to 3d organic models it will be a learning experiance for me. Should be alot of fun.
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I didn't really look at the date on this, but just thought I'd chime in and say I've read it over, and I have no computer art skills so I won't be participating, but at least you don't have to wait around for a response....
Sometimes silence isn't golden.
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I didn't really look at the date on this, but just thought I'd chime in and say I've read it over, and I have no computer art skills so I won't be participating, but at least you don't have to wait around for a response....
Sometimes silence isn't golden.
Well what i need dont need to be computer art. It can be screen captures hand drawn (like my avatar) etc. Sketches are better esp with the various circles etc left in place as i can look and go oh i see what i need for the eyes snout cheaks etc.
I have a hard time looking at a single angle and intrprating the rest of the face object etc. So various angles aka concept art sketches are like gold to me. Esp when said sketches are drawn to the same scale.
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So all you need is screenshots? I could provide many screenshots for you.
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So all you need is screenshots? I could provide many screenshots for you.
yep with screenies i need lots more angles to work fro but they work in a pinch. Best is always sketches or a toy/model. If it proves to difficult with screenies alone working directly in max i can always create a clay mock up lay agrid out on it and do it that way. Basically these are the basic angles needed.
Head on face shot the more level the haed the better side view right or left dont matter much top down and a good perspective shot. closer to 3/4 above and to one side (45 deg angle) above and front and from one side front.
Bonus is top back side back 45s.
I pretty much got a rear side 45 with my current avatar. As well as good 3/4 face
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Okay I'll try to fetch the right screenshots. I usually take a lot, though, so the right ones will probably be somewhere in the bunch. ^^;
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Yeah Kacie has all the films I think so she'd be the one for those. I've got 1, 4, and 9...so no Chomper.
Good luck.
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Yeah Kacie has all the films I think so she'd be the one for those. I've got 1, 4, and 9...so no Chomper.
Good luck.
Ive got em all to but my cid card blows chunks when it comes to tryign to do a screen cap of a dvd. Im only missign 11 and 12 on dvd. Got a avi i ripped from a friends dvdd of 11 but the quality is on the low side so it dont work well in full screen and again my vid card is not good for movies.
I got heaps of screen shots of number 1 but i just had to find a section and hit the hot key for atis file player a bunch of times then like always comp goes boom :)
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Forgot to ask you, what age do you need Chomper to be? A hatchling or how old he is in Land Before Time 5 and the TV series? When he can talk?
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Forgot to ask you, what age do you need Chomper to be? A hatchling or how old he is in Land Before Time 5 and the TV series? When he can talk?
5/series age as thats where im gona base all my models from. Depending on how they turn out i might even give animating them a shot heh.
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this is likely to end up scrapped once i get the screenies DarkHououmon is workign on getting but do to the extreamly complex nature of cera i decided to put her on the back burner for now and pratice a bit with chomper based on the old wind up toy from lbt 2
http://i19.ebayimg.com/06/i/08/89/d8/78_1_b.JPG (http://i19.ebayimg.com/06/i/08/89/d8/78_1_b.JPG) this is what i got so far
http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/main..._serialNumber=1 (http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=74&g2_serialNumber=1)
Basically it is pratice but as you can see the eyes bit and cheek bit is pretty much the same. Redoing the jaw and i could prob come fairly close to recreating the toy in 3d max. The eye part is nothing more than a cylander that has been scaled and had many verts moved around. The cheeks/skin at the jaw joint started out as sphere that i then pinched in and scale in various ways. At this point its me trying to figure out what base objects to use and of corse i may use lofting etc as well. The finale version of chomper will need textured and i suck at that so i might try to get one of the many awesome 2d artists here to help with that. Its not as hard as you may thing. Basically ill create a uvw map apply to chomper and render it with color blocks so you can see where each area of the map ends up on the model and a blank one that you can then color in with your fave program :)
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heh well heres a sneak peek need to do some more to the are between the eyes its to sharp a point need to all but make it blend in with the forhead
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chomperheadstart.jpg)
like i said a sneak peek :)
Idshow more but heh he has no nose and well its just a little creapy looking heh
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now hes got a nose heh
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chomperheadstart2.jpg)
Still got to smooth out where his eyes are.
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heh guess imkind of moving along quick on him lol
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chomperheadstart3.jpg)
I took the base snout object and base cheak nd split them in half to make new objects and changed the color and gave him a bit of a smile.
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lol im scared some stats on the model so far
Summary Info for chomp2.max (at Frame 0)
Objects:
Cast Receive Motion
Name (Type) Verts Faces Shadows Shadows Blur Hidden Frozen Material (Type)
------------------------ ------------ ------------ ------------ ------------ ------------ ------------ ------------ ------------------------
Cylinder01 (Editable Mesh 169 312 Yes Yes No No No Material #6 (Standard)
Sphere02 (Editable Mesh) 240 416 Yes Yes No No No Material #6 (Standard)
Sphere01 (Editable Mesh) 482 960 Yes Yes No No No Material #18 (Standard)
Sphere03 (Editable Mesh) 482 960 Yes Yes No No No Material #15 (Standard)
Sphere06 (Editable Mesh) 114 224 Yes Yes No No No default (Std)
Cylinder02 (Editable Mesh 169 312 Yes Yes No No No Material #6 (Standard)
Sphere04 (Editable Mesh) 482 960 Yes Yes No No No Material #15 (Standard)
Sphere08 (Editable Mesh) 482 960 Yes Yes No No No Material #18 (Standard)
Box02 (Editable Mesh) 134 216 Yes Yes No No No Material #6 (Standard)
Box01 (Editable Mesh) 134 216 Yes Yes No No No Material #24 (Standard)
Object02 (Editable Mesh) 308 544 Yes Yes No No No Material #24 (Standard)
Mesh Totals:
Verts: 3196
Faces: 6080
I got another ver i applied a mesh smooth to and the totals are 35000+verts and well over 60k faces I etimate when the head is finished it will hit 70k faces and the entire model will prob break the 1 million faces mark.
Once im happpy with the head ill start on the body. Things i need to do yet add teeth inside the mouth so if i give him any open mouth pose they will be there same deal for any animations i may atempt. I need to change the shape of his eye socket and eyes add a pupil object to the eyes and add nostrils to the nose.
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probably finale update for tonight
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chomperhead.jpg)
As you can see ive chaned the eyes a fair bit and redid the jaw colors as well as went to the more gray purple of the series vs the blue purple of the films. Thanks to action for takinga screen capture of the lonely journey.
Things to do add proper nostrils create a plane to add to the inside of the mouse tounge palet and teeth of corse andd thats another oh i dont know 10 or 12 hours work just on his head heh.
Hours yesterday about 3 to 4 then another 3 this morning and another 4 in the after noon total time for head 10 to 11 hours.
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wow that amazing!
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wow that amazing!
Ty still got alot more to do before i put the head aside (even then it wont be finished will still be mesh smoothing and general clean up left.)The cheeks for lack of a beter term will be totally redone thats what ill be doing tomorow also the main portion of his skull is a 32 segment sphere ill be changing that to a 64 segment one that will allow for me to blend it in with the rest a good bit better.
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Well this was a darn plesent suprise. This morning i woke up with a idea or 2 for chompers body so figured may as well try one or 2 of them well first one i tried ended up um well you tell me :)
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chompbodyrun1.jpg)
Some times 3d art just works this way you think something will be insanely hard to the point of getting annoyed and flat out angry at it and it ends up being flat out easy other times you thing somethign will be oh thats simple and turns out to be crazy hard. In this case it was flat out simple. I started with a simple 64 segment sphere scaled ununiformly on y to make it egg shaped then i moved the part that was to become his tail strait down. Rotated this section them moved on x y to aling it. After that i just needed to rotate some verts in the tail to round out the curve a bit. Flattened it out a bit front to back etc. Then i detached a section by selecting verts (thats why theres a zigzag i didnt aling the verts (it was just a test i can reattach and smooth that all out a good bit) colored the 2 sections in chompers coloration patern and got to this point. At this point the body is basically done just needs tweaked this way and that. will re do the cheek/lip area at the back of the jaw in a short bit here.
If you got a account on my gallery site you can see the full progresion of chomper (all posted here as well) in a ordered manner. link is in my sig here you need not use any real information just a username and pass word. Email addy is not needed. Once there with a account click on my personal gallery.
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Simply amazing what you can do with a computer these days. :) I'm surprised you got all that done in so little time.
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Simply amazing what you can do with a computer these days. :) I'm surprised you got all that done in so little time.
Well so little when you think in terms of days its only 3 or 4 days time frame. corse ive spent upwards of well uh 6 to 7 hours a day hehe oddly the body went crazy fast over all i do have suprisingly little time in it compaired to some of my models. The helmet i did for rubies took me on the order of 90 hours. Found my old log file from a plug in for max that tells how many hours a given user has in a project. at any rate got another update going in to another post heh.
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well he grew some arms :)
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chompwitharms.jpg)
The arms are currently the same shape and dont have a elbow join but with a bone i should not need a joint. At the moment they have the pivot in the shoulder so i can pose them that much.
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heheh chomper tends bar!
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chomparmshands.jpg)
Ok not really i just put the block there to hide the fact he has no legs yet i didnt want to be distracted by that when i was checking my work to this point. As you can see i added fingures to his arms to make his hand i simply flattened the end of his arm and widened it just a tiny bit.
I want hounest comments at this point (ignore his current cheeks and the weird shadow on his nose i may have to remake the entire snout cause of that flaw.) Basically other than what i pointed out i want to know if any thing looks off or odd.
At some point in a model you really need a fresh set of eyes to point weirdness out as you start to fail to see various thing. It is sort of like the painting a light blue wall snow white after a while all you see is white and end up with this big light blue splotch heh.
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How accurate and 3-D can the program you're using get? Are we to expect a blocky picture or will his body take on a more rounded shape once you've got all the major body parts complete? I think we have to know what to expect out of the program before we can really give constructive criticism...for all I know I could tell you to do something the program cannot render. :blink:
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How accurate and 3-D can the program you're using get? Are we to expect a blocky picture or will his body take on a more rounded shape once you've got all the major body parts complete? I think we have to know what to expect out of the program before we can really give constructive criticism...for all I know I could tell you to do something the program cannot render. :blink:
more accurate that my comp can currently handle. The body etc has had no smoothign done at all yet. Also thes are mor draft type renders. He will look some oen polygonal untill i can find some one to make a texture for me for him as well i just suck at textureing. As is hes colored in sections any shadow shadeing etc is just because of litghing. At the moment hes about 6500 to 7500 polys when mesh smoothed at this point he would be 65k to 70k maybe even 100k polys. Soon as i get done with my morning sesion on him ill do a quick and dirty mesh smooth along with a more properly set up render.
At any rate max 2.5 can get in to crazy high poly counts and take it just fine. Till i can get this model to my main comp and worked ona bit there i wotn even get close to the finished counts and detail potential.
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Woa, novaflare...this is certainly the best of your work that I've seen so far. :) I'm not sure how much proper criticism I could give since I'm horrible with most everything computer-made and wouldn't know where to start. :huh: Looking great though, it's interesting to see the process thus far and I'm really curious to see how this evolves. :yes
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Woa, novaflare...this is certainly the best of your work that I've seen so far. :) I'm not sure how much proper criticism I could give since I'm horrible with most everything computer-made and wouldn't know where to start. :huh: Looking great though, it's interesting to see the process thus far and I'm really curious to see how this evolves. :yes
Im working on his legs today mostly. Removed the old cheeks from his jaws goign to rework that tomorow and i got rid of the odd shadow and the sharp line on his nose. Also did soem minor reworking on his arms seperated in to 2 parts for arm one for hand added a small sphere for elbow (mostly to keep the hole from opening up when his arms are strait also did same for his wrist. Then i set up groups for his arms so i can rotate entire arm at shoulder or his lower arm and hand or just his hand. I could at this point do a simple animation of a wave or some such.
On the agenda for secound sesion today finish legs and create feet set up pivots in each part group them etc. Tomorow ill start the day off rounding out his torso giving him a belly buldge and work on defining his chest a bit. After that its mostly clean up and deviding polys to get more verts to work with to smooth him out. Some skewing to get rid of the current mostly perfect symetry so he takes on a more natural apearance. Then im gona need to find some one to create a proper texturemap for him. I may be able to get away with simplly cutting up various screen caps of him kacie sent and the one action sent me.
Not the perfect option but if i cant find a textureing person then it will do as a close 2nd best.
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only update for to day prob but as you can see ive refined his body and started on his legs. Other things to note ive redone his ssnout a bit as well as his head. Added some bulk to his arms in general as they were to peg like. comments welcome as always
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chomplegsbodtwk.jpg)
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Very nice job. Chomper is getting ever better and better. I'm very curious for the final Chomper and all the possibilities the program you are using is offering for him.
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Very nice job. Chomper is getting ever better and better. I'm very curious for the final Chomper and all the possibilities the program you are using is offering for him.
With plugins i can do pretty nearly any thing with max 2.5 up to some complex animations (my skills in animation dont exist yet though). Animation is something i want to learn by doing with chomper.
Now ill need to at some point import in to max 8.0 when i get main comp up and running then there is no limits
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just chomper in wireframe
(http://lbft.spellbound-guild.com/lbft/g2data/albums/novaflare/chompwireframe.jpg)
just did a qoute on my post to make iteasyer to add the images of chomper in wireframe hehe
So for those who might wonder what he looks like under the surface here is is
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just a update to explain the lack of new updates to the chomper renders. Got a new job yesterday so all my time has been spent working on him in the mornings and has cut down on time to make renders of the progres.
Things ive added or changed
Finally got the ey problem figured out. His eyes have a shape more like the ones in my forum acatard here instead of the really horrid round spheres heh. I still need to blend them in to the head though. Also redid the head a bit moving verts split it down the middle and reatached the 2 halfs. Added benifit besides the smoothign it out a bit it also skewed the symetry enough to looks more natural. If i had made a before and after render of the head youd see a diffrence but not know where what or how big and that was the goal. So all in all friday the 13th turned out to be my lucky day lol
I am off work tomorow so ill have more time to spend in max and will have some new renders up tomorow. I plan on making his feet tomorow maybe some blending and general smoothing out of the eyes gettign them to be less angular and more curved up to the eye peak. Once i got his feet inplace ill render front and side veiws as well as perspective.
Things to do after feet and eyes.
I need to make him some new and more proper hands his current are not what i want they just dont look right and never will only option remove and replace.
After that ill need to wait to do things like make him animateable vs just poseable. My laptop wont even handle mxax 4.0 so will need to get him on the main comp and loaded in to max 8. At this point ill need to redo some work on him as hes going to get a bit messed up when i load him in to max 8. Cant be helped and undestood that it would happen from day one. Thats just how things go when working with programs like 3d max. I mostly expect some areas where faces are flipped or are rendering as faeted body parts not where they should be etc. That will be about 8 hours of work to correct. It will how ever be worth it. Max 8 can do some fantastic things as per rendering and animation that max 2.5 just can not do.
There object were done in max 8.0 in 2005 by me (i have them for sale there but if one of you has a use for them let me know and ill email em to you) http://www.turbosquid.com/Search/Index.cfm...blExternal=TRUE (http://www.turbosquid.com/Search/Index.cfm?FuseAction=ProcessSmartSearch&istIncAuthor=xnovaflarex%20&blAuthorExact=y&intMediaType=-1&stgBoolean=l&blExternal=TRUE)
Looks carefully at the black blades on the mace and the brass rings around them and note the refectiongs of them in each other as well as the wood handles reflection.
That is not somethign you can do in early max versions. Ill be able to make chompers eyes slightly glossy or give his skin a more textured look in the render useing bump mapping.
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Ok im going nuts here chompers head is all wrong and i need to remake it. Unfortunatly screen shots with any angle to them at all are not helping. What im gona need to do his head is strait on shots from right or left, top down, and strait on from frount and back. They can be ruff sketches or screen shots or full color art.
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unfortunatly i think that chomper will be put on hold untill i can get him moved over to my main computer and my main computer is back in shape for running things like max etc. Simply put the laptop at this point just can not handle the model. The model is just to high in poly count and even old max 2.5 is choking on this junker. Max 2.5 just does not have the tools that i need to do what i need to do. I cant for example get the accuracy i need to position verts right. I have a couple more things i want to try but i think it will end up being to much for this laptop to handle.
I could probably do it on the main comp even in its current state but that would require me to go off line untill the project was done or try to change every thing over when i want to go online.
Ill still need various views of chomper Best would be large scale sketches (basically line drawings) with his mouth open eyes are something that will be very important. The way im thinking of doing this is to place the various views in the sketches as view port bgs then moving verts around to match the outline.
Views needed front on, top down, side Ither side will work. Back i sort of need but can live with out perspective would be a big huge bonus.