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WeirdRaptor

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WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
« Reply #520 on: July 31, 2012, 03:42:40 AM »
I don't understand the half that like it. You could read The Hobbit in a single afternoon. It's not a thick or deep book. And on top of that, they're telling Bilbo's story as far as the dwarves escaping Mirkwood by the end of the first film. Which means all that's left for Bilbo in films two and three is Smaug and The Five Armies. That's it. He will officially become a supporting character in his own story. ...Getting mad again just thinking about it. Time to go vent elsewhere again.

They keep claiming utter nonsense like "Jackson can tell a more complete version of Bilbo's tale now!" No, he could have done that in one movie. This is just adding in garbage that has no business being in The Hobbit.

Kor

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WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
« Reply #521 on: July 31, 2012, 10:53:49 AM »
They are also likely adding in what Gandalf was doing when he was away from the group, meeting of the white council and their dealing with the Necromancer.  Though I do wonder if the reason may be pressure from the studios who want 3 rather then 2 movies considering how popular the lord of the rings are.

WeirdRaptor

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« Reply #522 on: July 31, 2012, 08:52:31 PM »
That I'm willing to tolerate, but there's not much to The White Council's story. I mean, they meet up, talk, and go kick The Necromancer's behind. That's literally it. I don't see the reason for three films out of this.

Kor

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« Reply #523 on: July 31, 2012, 09:05:02 PM »
You forgot the bit about the white council saying, lets' go beat up the necromancer, Sarumon saying, no, since he wants the wait for the 1 ring to reveal itself so he can grab and claim it, later on Gandolf saying I found proof that the Necromancer is Sauron, the rest of the council, except Sarumon saying, let's go beat him up.  Sarumon saying, fine whatever.   sauron shrugging and going back to Mordor.  

They may also show more of Deagol and Smeagol, Gandolf meeting with the Dwarves and talking them into going to get their kingdom back from the dragon.  

I don't remember the details but there was a bit about Gandalf meeting with the dwarves before the hobbit starts, in the book Unfinished Tales.  I think Tolkein's son said his father had intended that story to be a chapter in the Lord of the rings, forgot which book, where I think Frodo asks Gandalf how he happened to pick Bilbo or somesuch and Gandalf tells the story.  But I think his son said his father cut the chapter due to it making the book to long or something.  Don't remember the details, been decades since I read it.

Nick22

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WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
« Reply #524 on: July 31, 2012, 09:57:57 PM »
i don't like stretching it into a trilogy eother
 just leave it at 2 and add the extra stuff in externded editions like the trilogy. i tend to think this is the studio wanting to milk it for all its worth, and more or less forcing jackson to agree to it. 2 imo was enough.  will i go see it/ yeah, although perhaps with not as much fanboy glee.   anyway wr at least you are venting elsewhere.. just focus on completing your paper i'm sure you'll dissect to death the hobbit 'trilogy' ;later.
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WeirdRaptor

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« Reply #525 on: August 01, 2012, 01:05:35 PM »
On it, sit.

Kor

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« Reply #526 on: August 01, 2012, 03:07:45 PM »
& having the Book and Rankin & Bass animated versions to compare it to.

WeirdRaptor

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« Reply #527 on: October 24, 2012, 12:15:10 AM »
Alright, I'm beginning work on this again, for real this time. This long absence was 1/4-Writer's Block, 1/4-Work Scheduling, 1/4-Exhaustion, and 1/4-Not Wanting To Overwatch the LotR films.

Kor

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« Reply #528 on: October 24, 2012, 12:50:23 AM »
No hurry, just work at your own pace and as life lets you.  Better it be a fun hobby then a thing you have to do, sort of thing.

Nick22

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« Reply #529 on: October 24, 2012, 12:01:19 PM »
good news wr. looking forward to it
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WeirdRaptor

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« Reply #530 on: June 03, 2015, 02:30:45 AM »
I am going to begin work on this again. Don't expect it to come uber quickly, though. I gotta get back into the swings of things first.

Kor

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« Reply #531 on: June 03, 2015, 03:35:10 AM »
No hurry, take your time. Go at your own pace.

WeirdRaptor

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« Reply #532 on: June 03, 2015, 05:25:27 PM »
I will. First, I have to be in the mood watch LotR again. I'm not going to sit through them without being in the right mindset. As much as I love those films, they are an endeavor to take on sometimes.

Nick22

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« Reply #533 on: June 03, 2015, 05:58:51 PM »
you were midway through the two towers when you left off.
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WeirdRaptor

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« Reply #534 on: June 07, 2015, 11:31:44 PM »
Quote from: WeirdRaptor,Apr 19 2012 on  03:21 PM
Alright, after a lot of hard work and struggling, I finally managed to get this off my computer. It is going into the shop and hopefully the guys who work there can get the rest off it so I can post it through another computer, enjoy:

The Game Attempts: Peter Jackson’s The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers:

So here we are at The Two Towers. Filmed at the same time as Fellowship, but edited throughout the year 2002 whereas Fellowship was edited in 2001. I was absolutely psyched going to see this after the cinematic triumph that was Fellowship, and this film could have been just as much a lyrical achievement. If not the mountain of unnecessary changes, the absolute mutilation of Faramir and Treebeard’s character, Jackson deciding to spend WAY too much time trying to make us sympathize with Gollum, and the worst crime of all: cutting Eomer out of most of the movie. Seriously, what the hell?

Alright, alright, before I go any further, I should probably point out that I do like this movie a lot. I don’t adore this middle chapter the same way I do Fellowship of the Ring and Return of the King, but I’ll happily watch it, all the same. It’s just that this film starts out strong. Realty strong. As strong as the others two movies in the saga, but then falls short under the weight of so many silly story-telling errors in the second half, each of which I have an alternative for which would have allowed key characters to retain their dignity. I’ll cover them as we go along.

Next, we have a few new faces, David Wenham as Faramir, the younger brother of Boromir, Bernard Hill as King Theoden, Karl Urban as Eomer, Mirando Otto as Eowyn, Brad Dourif as Grima Wormtongue, and the one, the only, Andy Serkis, as Gollum. Andy Serkis has the makings of a legendary character actor, as you will soon see. Now on with the movie… Karl Urban would also show he’s a powerhouse talent in due time, but not quite yet.

We begin with a helicopter shot that passes over several beautiful mountains as we begin to hear faint voices that are inaudible at first. As the POV continues on and zeroes on when on Gandalf faced off against the Balrog, we hear said confrontation before the view goes through rock and earth and we actually see it. We come in just in time to see Gandalf tell the Balrog to “go back to the Shadow”.
When it takes another step forward, Gandalf roars that it cannot pass and breaks the bridge, sending it into the pit. It drags him down, and that is where the Fellowship footage ends after a brief shot of Boromir. From here, the camera begins following after Gandalf as he plunges down into the darkness below. He falls over to his sword and grabs it in midair before catching up with the Balrog and continuing to attack it.

There’s not much to say other than “Gandalf beats the crap out of the Balrog while it tries to get away him from all the down to the underground river they fall into”. The entire sequences is kickass. The visuals and choreography is extremely well done, Ian McKellen is acting as if he really is falling and battling a raging fire demon, and overall, it’s just an awesome movie opener. The instant they hit the water, there’s a flash, and we’re suddenly with Frodo and Sam.

This is the only form of recap to the first movie this film has to offer, and I think it’s all the stronger for it. Instead of allowing the opening to get bogged down in “previously on The Lord of the Rings” nonsense, Jackson and company correctly assume you’ve seen the previous film either in theaters on DVD. And…when your film grossed over $900 million worldwide and sold so well on DVD that they actually ran out and had to restock within the first week, I would say that assumption is justified.

Frodo shoots up shouting Gandalf’s name as if he just had a nightmare. Or in this case, a vision. This awakens Sam as well, who asks what’s wrong with a concerned tone. Frodo assures him that it was just a nightmare. Then we have our title on the screen as the film cuts to later while the hobbits attempt to make their way through the labyrinth of rock and stone. This is where the first difference from Theatrical to Extended makes its appearance in The Two Towers. In the original release, the film cuts straight to Frodo and Sam wandering the rocky hills. But before that happens in the Extended version of the film, we have a sequence in which the duo descend a cliff face.

A terrified Samwise asked Mr. Frodo if he can see the bottom yet. The Baggins replies ëno’, and just tells him not to look down. Samwise preceeds not to look down, but this turns out not to be a good idea, since he loses his footing and almost falls. From his pack falls a small wooden box. He shouts for Frodo to catch it, and he does. In the process, Frodo loses his grip on the rope and begins falling. Oops. Then after falling maybe about the height of a full grown man, he hits the ground. He stands there humorously stunned for a beat before shout up to Sam that he’s reached the bottom. This whole sequence is so full of hilarious fail that borders on Merry and Pippin antics.

Sam hurries down after him. Then he stands complaining about their situation in that usual muttering, fussy Samwise way lifted directly from the books. Gotta love Astin. Frodo looks in the box that Sam deemed precious enough to save and discovers that it’s full of seasoning. Sam explains that he thought they might have roast chicken sometime. This always gets a laugh out of everyone I watch this with, including myself. In fact, Frodo himself is just barely not cracking up at Sam’s naivetÈ. This also nicely shows the contrast in Frodo and Sam’s character. Frodo being the realistic with just a garnish of optimist, and Samwise being the consummate optimist.  Then Frodo gets wistful looking at the salts and seasoning in the box, uttering that “It’s a little piece of home”, and the hobbit theme kicks as both begin looking solemnly nostalgic.

Frodo goes over to the rope, pointing out that they cannot leave it for someone to find, but Samwise skeptically responds that no one is going to follow them down into that pit of rocks. While this exchange happens, the camera pans around in a circle facing Sam like he’s the radius point until it comes to Frodo’s face. Just as Sam finishing speaking, Frodo gets a faintly worried look on his face, thinking of Gollum.  Sam mourns leaving the rope behind, because Lady Galadriel gave it to him. Real elvish rope. Sam pulls on the rope, but mentions that it won’t come free easily, because it’s one of his knots. On cue, it comes free and falls down to them. Frodo light-heartedly jests “Real elvish rope” and leaves it at that.

Now, I feel this version of the scene is an improvement over the original from the book. Most of the time, the book is better than any of the films made from it, hands down, with a handful of exceptions found in Jackson’s adaptation. Originally, Frodo teases Sam about it a lot more and more meanly, calling it a miracle that it didn’t come loose while they were climbing down. Sam however retorts that it must have come when its master called, and the book then says as much. Here, it’s Frodo implying that the rope is enchanted while Sam looks on with a faintly doofy expression.

Now we finally come to the first theatrical footage after a good few minutes of added material. They ascend to the top of a tall hill and see Mordor in the distance. Sam: “Mordor. Just the one place in the world we’re trying to get to, is the one place we don’t want to be, is just the one place we can’t get to. Let’s face it, Mr. Frodo. We’re lost. I don’t think Gandalf meant for us to come this way.”
Frodo responds that Gandalf didn’t’ mean for a lot to happen, but it did anyway. Then Frodo is hit with a vision of the Eye of Sauron and falls to his knees, blotching his chest. Sam becomes concerned, and correctly guesses that the Ring is growing heavier. He calls for them to take a break. He sets his pack down and pulls out the lembas bread.

Frodo asks how much of their food remains, to which Sam shows him piles and piles of lembas bread. He breaks off two peaces, throws one to Frodo and takes the other for himself. They eat and comment on the elvish food, the food going into their stomachs obviously making them feel a bit better.

The two hobbits continue to explore the rocky terrain, trying to find a way out. As time goes on, the two come to the conclusion that they are lost once they find themselves passing through areas they’ve already seen. Frodo confirms this when he spots some unique rocks formations they’ve already passed. However, Samwise notes that the smell is new, like a bog or something. Frodo reveals that they’re not alone. We get a few glimpses of Gollum here and there, but not a full look until we finally come to the ambush. The film shows the two “asleep” at the foot of a cliff. Now we finally get out look at Gollum as he climbs down the hill like a little monkey might.

The CGI model for Gollum is truly a stunning achievement in movie special effects. Now some people piss and moan about how Gollum should have been a made in a costume, so which I say: bullshit. Gollum is an inhumanly skinny creature that crawls and runs around on all fours like animal, as seen in this scene, is able to accomplish what a human cannot be climbing facedown down a cliff face. There is no way a costume or animatronic puppet could have cut it. Gollum needs real, organic movement which old fashioned movie magic just cannot deal.
Here’s the thing: I’ve been doing a lot of research about why past adaptations of LotR were scraped. Wanna know one of the chief reasons why? Gollum. Trying to figure out how to bring this creature to the screen in a way that displayed his prowess is usually the point where things start to fall apart, because apparently even filmmakers like John Boorman, Stanley Kubrick, Ron Howard, Jim Henson, Steven Spielberg, and George Lucas were at a loss of how to put him on-screen. These books only became successfully translated when the CGI technology made it possible. So suck on that, traditionists who think that CGI is the poison that is killing film.

The artistry that went into making him look real of breath-taking, the motion capture of Andy Serkis’s performance is exceptional, and then there’s Andy Serkis, himself. The man is a phenomenal actor. I don’t think there will ever be a better actor for the role of Gollum. As a challenge to anyone who think that it could have been a man in a costume, I give you this challenge: find me a better actor for it than Andy Serkis. I dare you.

Back to the scene, Gollum descends the cliff face, ranting and raving about “thieving Bagginses” and his “precious”. Just as he reaches the two hobbits, they spring their trap, but soon find themselves being the ones getting pummeled as Gollum goes absolutely ballistic on them. Eventually, they wrestle him under control at blade point after a very brutal, intense fight scene that frankly couldn’t look more realistic it tried. If there’s one thing Jackson does well, he will make you believe that two hobbits and weird imp creature just beat the crap out of each other.
I'm just making sure the previous update is on the last page of the topic. I've watched through all of Two Towers again as a refresher. I'm gearing up to start watching speciic sections to go over multiple times so I can write this. The next part should be up in a few weeks or so.

WeirdRaptor

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Re: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
« Reply #535 on: June 28, 2018, 09:18:07 PM »
I will at least be attempting to make time for this.

WeirdRaptor

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Re: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
« Reply #536 on: June 28, 2018, 09:23:38 PM »
Alright, I know exactly where to start watching Two Towers again. Right after they Gollum. Extended Edition, right?

Nick22

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Re: WeirdRaptor's Lord of the Rings Adapt. Face-Off:
« Reply #537 on: June 28, 2018, 10:45:56 PM »
Correct, WR.  the EEs dont really make the changes for  TTT that they do for ROTk
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