Fanfictions

[Serris]

I would say that modern weapons are pretty much mandatory due to the technothriller slant.

However, I would assume that the dinosaurs will have Human allies. That is not to say that they would be dependent on their allies to do the fighting. I can think of PLENTY of ways for the LBT dinosaurs to stand a chance against them.

Also, will these dinosaurs be using weapons (slings, stone tipped spears, knives, clubs etc.) like they do in Twilight Valley?

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On a side note, Dima, maybe you should make another topic about this so we can brainstorm without clogging this topic up.

[Dima02]

ignore post (if someone knows how to delete this, please do it).

[Malte279]

I am barely to be seen in fanfiction threads anymore and writers have taken offense in my refusal to read fanfictions but frankly there isn't too much to be found without so much gore that we must call for human intervention in order to provide the weapons of mass destruction to make the massacre look "plausible"

Once upon this same earth
beneath the same sun
long before you
before the axe and the Elephant as well
before the Wolf, the Bison, the Whale,
before the Mammoth, and the Metal Storm
in the time of the dinosaurs...

 

[DarkHououmon]

Once upon this same earth
beneath the same sun
long before you
before the axe and the Elephant as well
before the Wolf, the Bison, the Whale,
before the Mammoth, and the Metal Storm
in the time of the dinosaurs...
 

What was the purpose of writing that?

[Dima02]

ignore post (if anyone knows how to delete this, please do)

[Serris]

Ruby, using her hands and fast speed, throws grenades. Etc.

One thing that should be kept in mind is that some dinosaurs may not want to handle modern weapons because they have never seen them before.

When you mentioned traditional weapons, do you mean things like rocks, sticks, dirt and the like or are you thinking of Twilight Valley styled weapons?

I ask because Twilight Valley weapons are designed to kill, not stun. Thought the blowguns that are used by some of the dinosaurs carry poison darts that are more or less designed to leave the target asleep or paralyzed when hit. But then again, a fair number of dart poisons are designed to kill even in small doses.

[Caustizer]

On the topic of modern weapons, it would make sense for the LBT dinosaurs to use them in a war type setting, but only if they design them themselves.  In my mind the brand of society that a group of intelligent leaf-eaters can create is far different from the human one.

A few things we don't know:

- Would leaf-eaters have the same perpensity towards greed and dominance humans do?

- Killing comes somewhat natural to humans because we are omnivores, and have for thousands of years hunted to eat.  Would it be that in a leaf-eater society, offenses such as murder and violence would be uncommon because it is against their nature?

- The first sign of danger often causes leaf-eaters to run, or if they are cornered fight as best they can.  Would this mean that a futuristic leaf-eater society tends more towards defense in it's policies and military applications?

A lot of these factors came into play when I was designing the VDF for my fanfiction LBT: Future Wars.

It's an interesting thing to note that the VDF (Valley Defense Force, the primary leaf-eater army) is Communism at it's best ideologically, where every race is assigned a place within society and nobody is left behind.

Claw on the other hand (the Sharptooth faction) is Capitialism at it's worst, where it is a sharptooth-eat-sharptooth world and only the strong survive to prosper.  Claw will use the most hienous and horrible weapons in battle as long as it means they win in the end, and often it's soldiers are in it purely to be fed from day to day.

An interesting way to view things for sure.

Caustizer.

[jedi472]

I am barely to be seen in fanfiction threads anymore and writers have taken offense in my refusal to read fanfictions but frankly there isn't too much to be found without so much gore that we must call for human intervention in order to provide the weapons of mass destruction to make the massacre look "plausible"

Once upon this same earth
beneath the same sun
long before you
before the axe and the Elephant as well
before the Wolf, the Bison, the Whale,
before the Mammoth, and the Metal Storm
in the time of the dinosaurs...

 

Malte, I never used to agree with you when it came to LBT fanfics, but honestly I'm really starting to see your point. Pretty much every single LBT fic I've seen written in the last year or so, with one or two exceptions, is at least partially based in straight-up warfare. I understand conflict is essential to the very nature of storytelling, but things are just getting ridiculous. I'm not going to name names or anything, mostly because the same criticism could no doubt be used against me, but I think this still needs to be said.

I want to start by saying that I don't believe LBT war fics are an inherently bad idea (hence the Star Wars crossover in my sig   ) The gore levels have been getting extreme as of late, but this factor alone would not be enough for me to just dismiss these stories without a second thought. The real problem I've noticed is one that has been steadily plaguing the fanfiction world ever since it's creation: the utter lack of character development and dynamics.

We've all seen it: the OCs that just pop up out of nowhere and completely run the story off the rails, varying levels of uncharacteristic actions by the Gang of Five, ect. The characters are no longer portrayed as people, but as mere objects, being used as personality-less weapons of continual destruction. The GOF are no longer treasured, dynamic individuals; instead, they appear as rage-filled berserkers with a Terminator-like drive to kill anyone designated as "the enemy", often in the most gruesome fashion possible.

The situation of the war fic is one that draws in many a fanfic writer; it provides a conflict that appears to have wide-spread consequences, making it an instant gravity generator for the story. It is indeed a very fun and exciting tool in a writer's arsenal, but the gravity of the scenario can also, without guidance, act as a black hole, swallowing the characters, plot, and anything else that truly drives the story. People are failing to realize that, while the situation might create a story, it's the characters who react to it, and the characters alone who can bring it to it's final conclusion.

My point is that character development is often kicked to the curb, and this is why many stories out there are really suffering quality-wise. I realize this issue applies to me as well, which was one of the reasons I began attempting to rewrite my story. I just felt like this needed to be said.

[Dima02]

^ I definitely understand what both of you are saying, and I agree with you guys. However, there's not going to be any gruesome scenes or anything like that. It's mainly a techno-thriller, and the war aspect of it is very light. Also, please take note of the fact that this story is being written by a 13-year-old. It's that age where you get all sorts of crazy ideas and try them out. <_<

I'm sorry if I offended any of you guys. I'm removing all my previous posts to save space. Once again, sorry if I offended any of you guys.  

There will be a separate topic for my fanfiction. Malte, if you can delete my previous posts, please do so in order to save space.

[jedi472]

^ I definitely understand what both of you are saying, and I agree with you guys. However, there's not going to be any gruesome scenes or anything like that. It's mainly a techno-thriller, and the war aspect of it is very light. Also, please take note of the fact that this story is being written by a 13-year-old. It's that age where you get all sorts of crazy ideas and try them out. <_<

I'm sorry if I offended any of you guys. I'm removing all my previous posts to save space. Once again, sorry if I offended any of you guys.   

No, wait! Dima02, you've done nothing wrong. I was simply stating my opinion. I haven't even READ your fic, anyways, so how do I know it's bad? Don't worry about it; I started writing when I was thirteen, too! The best thing to do is to put your stuff out there, trust me!

Dammit, I really screwed this up, didn't I?

[Dima02]

^ I definitely understand what both of you are saying, and I agree with you guys. However, there's not going to be any gruesome scenes or anything like that. It's mainly a techno-thriller, and the war aspect of it is very light. Also, please take note of the fact that this story is being written by a 13-year-old. It's that age where you get all sorts of crazy ideas and try them out. <_<

I'm sorry if I offended any of you guys. I'm removing all my previous posts to save space. Once again, sorry if I offended any of you guys.   

No, wait! Dima02, you've done nothing wrong. I was simply stating my opinion. I haven't even READ your fic, anyways, so how do I know it's bad? Don't worry about it; I started writing when I was thirteen, too! The best thing to do is to put your stuff out there, trust me!

A little late, but it was mostly done in order to save space. Thanks for the encouragement though. I'm already halfway done chapter 1. I'll start a new topic for this.

[DarkHououmon]

Why would you need to save space?

[Serris]

My point is that character development is often kicked to the curb, and this is why many stories out there are really suffering quality-wise. I realize this issue applies to me as well, which was one of the reasons I began attempting to rewrite my story. I just felt like this needed to be said.

That is the reason why so many characters appear (and disappear/die) in Twilight Valley; I need to keep their numbers down so I can do some character development and I am attempting to give each character their own personality. So far, it is working but the characters, even in a war story have their own thoughts, emotions and feelings.

That is why I am taking care to make each character as unique as possible. But there are snags but no writer is perfect.

[jedi472]

My point is that character development is often kicked to the curb, and this is why many stories out there are really suffering quality-wise. I realize this issue applies to me as well, which was one of the reasons I began attempting to rewrite my story. I just felt like this needed to be said.

That is the reason why so many characters appear (and disappear/die) in Twilight Valley; I need to keep their numbers down so I can do some character development and I am attempting to give each character their own personality. So far, it is working but the characters, even in a war story have their own thoughts, emotions and feelings.

That is why I am taking care to make each character as unique as possible. But there are snags but no writer is perfect.

It should be noted, however, that in the process of killing off all those characters, you diminish the amount of empathy the audience has for the cast as a whole. In my opinion, killings of major or minor characters should be done sparingly in order to increase the emotional contrast and impact of the event. Just a thought.

[Serris]

Bear in mind that most of the casualties are actually nameless background "redshirts". Some named characters do die, though but not very often.

[jedi472]

True, but I've noticed you still have the issue of tons and tons of characters. My advice would be to use lots of perspectives, with each character getting a scene or two to shine.

[Malte279]

There will be a separate topic for my fanfiction. Malte, if you can delete my previous posts, please do so in order to save space.

I have never said anything to that effect nor am I going to delete any posts or stories.

My main point, which I think jedi472 understood, is the ever increasing amount of a kind of violence in LBT stories that just doesn't belong into the setting of the land before time. In ever more stories (or rather it would be correct to say that in ever less stories this was not the case as the ever more ones are the absolute rule rather than the exception) there is not much left of a plot because the only idea seems to be to get the characters as quickly as possible onto some battleground where they can kill, and maim, and slaughter, and butcher. Not much thought is given to any reasons for or consequences of all this bloodshed because bloodshed in itself seems to provide sufficient entertainment to make any further questions unnecessary.
But things are not so simple and while violence is an integral part of many stories and, mostly in the context of the natural hunter and prey kind of relationship between herbivores and sharpteeth it has been part of LBT since the first movie. But the degree it took where there are no reasons needed but where the dinosaurs start killing each other even on the large scale which require human weapons of mass destruction it is getting odd.
The consequences of violence, except for the lustful depiction of blood and gore, do not usually take much room in such stories. The focus in the media in general (not just in LBT fanfiction) is on the day of a battle and nobody bothers about the clearing up on the day after or about the scars which wars and violence cause which will never ever heal.
Judith Barsi was shot by her father. This is a tragedy that will never end because a new chapter starts or anything to that effect. None of those who knew her will ever have this loss made up for in any way. If then one reads about cute little Ducky being send on a killing spree with whatever human weapons she is thought to be able to carry, I do admit it sickens me a bit. It is why I usually stay clear of fanfiction threads. My stand on this is known and I do not believe that there will ever be a change in this view of mine's being that of a tiny minority. But sometimes I guess I have to let of steam to just remind people that there may be a different land before time, that is much closer to the ideals of the original movie and also the sequels than the kind that is based to so extreme a degree on violence.

I really think that too few are really thinking about the consequences and the aftermath of violence whether they are acts of war (of which my grandparents have told me a lot. I think I need to pick up that thread in the AM section soon) or individual acts of violence (like the murder of Judith Barsi to name just one out of millions). When I watch the land before time movies there seems to be a kind of innocent goodness about the characters (not to say that they couldn't have their vicious moments and their share of roughness at times) which I just cannot combine with the idea of them being equipped with human weapons and send out to kill as many as they can.

I am not ignorant of the fascination that weapons may hold and my shelves are bending under the weight of books many of which are dealing with human warfare. But the heartfelt appreciation for war as solely entertaining and suitable to be mixed with something that was really not made for it is something that I will probably never be able to adopt (nor try to adopt).


PS: I could not let this stand and hope not to sound like a hypocrite if I didn't mention my own story "Old Threehorns" in this context. It is true that there are elements in it which border so close to human attitudes that I would probably not write them again the way I did when I wrote them. It is true that there is something that cannot be labeled anything but a battle. But unlike most of the fanfictions I took a very long part of the story for the buildup and the explanation of how what happens later on could possibly happen. Also there are no artificial weapons of any sort (except for some stones being hurled). There are cases of dead in the story many of which are references to events preceding the main story like the Pterano incident I tried to include the consequences as well. The story has strong weaknesses and I appreciate the fact that it weakens my justification to sound the bell about this matter here, but it still is a long way from the warfare based LBT stories which make up for... almost every land before time story that is out there

[Ptyra]

While I am working on a war story myself, I gotta say that I HATE seeing human-based weapons in it. I'm much more of a "tooth vs claw" war story person when it comes to LBT.

[Serris]

I'm much more of a "tooth vs claw" war story person when it comes to LBT.

I am not. I restrict the dinosaurs to Paleolithic tech (no metal weapons/tools, no siege engines, no armor, no fortresses etc) though.

Rationale: Chimpanzees have been seen using weapons, so it was not too far of a stretch for me to give the dinosaurs Paleolithic technology.

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On the subject of violent fan fiction...

Latias&#39; Journey
Latias' Journey is a fan fiction that takes the lighthearted PokÈmon anime and turns it into an intensely violent, gory and nightmarish but yet thrilling story.

Is it against the "spirit" of the PokÈmon anime? Hell yeah. But yet, it still works.  The point I am getting at is even the most outlandish plots and ideas for a story can work if they are written well.

[DarkHououmon]

I'm more interested in "tooth and claw" battles myself. While I might decide to add primitive weapons in Heinous (still not sure if I will nor not) it will likely be severely limited as I think it's better to have dinosaurs fighting with what they have (their size, their tails, their claws, their teeth, etc) rather than having to make weapons. In a way I don't really see too much of a purpose to have dinosaurs make weapons when they can just use their size, tails, teeth, whatever they have to fight back. I understand that smaller dinosaurs may have greater difficulty but in larger numbers they could be a devastating force. Ants are an example. Tiny little animals and not much when there's only one, but united as a large mass, they can bring down much larger animals, and they don't resort to made-weapons, just their built-in weapons (jaws and stingers I think).

I'm not saying it's a bad idea overall; just that I prefer the dinosaurs to not use weapons most of the time.